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F30 / F31 / F32 / F33 (2012 - current)
The sixth generation 3 series, chassis code F30. 2013 model year 328i and 335i sedans now in production. Read the F30 frequently asked question thread for all your basic question and dive into all the details in the ultimate F30 information thread.

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  #251  
Old 09-02-2012, 11:02 PM
JoeFromPA JoeFromPA is offline
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Originally Posted by AndDown View Post
Wonder if BMW has these newer pads that will fit the previous generation bimmers? I would get all of mine changed in a heartbeat.
They are called ceramic or ceramic-compounded pads.....they've been around for a long time and you can get them for any of your vehicles. BMW doesn't make brake pads, so find out who the OE provider of pads is for each of your vehicles and buy their ceramic pads for your other vehicles. It's $120 in parts for all four wheels per vehicle and about an hour of time.
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  #252  
Old 09-02-2012, 11:20 PM
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I took a short test-drive in the 335 sport line and I'm still undecided on whether I like this car or not. For background, I have an 04 zhp, before that an e39 530, before that 99 328.

The F30 is similar in many dimensions (though shorter), and I've read where it's compared to E39. For reference, I HATED the E39. Felt like a barge next to the E46. I'm very afraid that I'll make the same mistake twice if I give my zhp to my son and buy myself an F30 M-sport.

Anyone share this concern? I've also considered the 135, but to me it seems significantly smaller than an E46 sedan even though the dimensions are not too far off.

I want a replacement damn near the same size as my E46!
Fully agree on the F30 being a bigger car. Don't try the 2012 F10 though...we got that car as a loaner from the dealer and it was basically a land yacht. I was so scared that I wouldn't be able to fit it in the garage that I left it out on the driveway.
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  #253  
Old 09-02-2012, 11:39 PM
dtc100 dtc100 is offline
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Originally Posted by jillyjellyroll View Post
Fully agree on the F30 being a bigger car. Don't try the 2012 F10 though...we got that car as a loaner from the dealer and it was basically a land yacht. I was so scared that I wouldn't be able to fit it in the garage that I left it out on the driveway.
As big as the F10 is, there isnt much rear leg room, to my surprise.
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  #254  
Old 09-03-2012, 12:11 AM
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CALWATERBOY CALWATERBOY is offline
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They are called ceramic or ceramic-compounded pads.....they've been around for a long time and you can get them for any of your vehicles. BMW doesn't make brake pads, so find out who the OE provider of pads is for each of your vehicles and buy their ceramic pads for your other vehicles. It's $120 in parts for all four wheels per vehicle and about an hour of time.
Ceramic....do they have low 'bite' until warm? Noting that E9x brakes have a very rewarding, sa-mooth power hot or cold, 'specially appreciated @ low speed.
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  #255  
Old 09-03-2012, 04:46 AM
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Wonder if BMW has these newer pads that will fit the previous generation bimmers? I would get all of mine changed in a heartbeat.
It's worth looking into as life without brake dust is a revelation.

The braking isn't as good as on the E90 as others point out, not sure if these pads are the reason.

BJ
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  #256  
Old 09-03-2012, 05:40 AM
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Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
It's worth looking into as life without brake dust is a revelation.

The braking isn't as good as on the E90 as others point out, not sure if these pads are the reason.

BJ
It's definitely the pads. I tried a high quality low dust pad on my first E46 and it completely changed the feel and braking power. After that I didn't consider absence of dust an acceptable tradeoff for what it did to the car.
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  #257  
Old 09-03-2012, 06:16 AM
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Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
I want to make sure you understand me because there's a distinction here that you're not getting. There are three types of BMW 3 Series owners:

1. Performance Enthusiasts (The BF population).
2. Luxury Buyer Desiring Sporty Tendencies (me).
3. Badge Whores (about 98% of the 3 Series on the road today).

Many times when I write I am not referring to myself as a #2 but rather on behalf of the millions of drivers who don't come to this site who are a #3. I will not deny that a portion of my motivation to buy 3 Series over the years has been for the status they bring. I live in a swanky neighborhood and I don't care if Acura, Audi, Lexus, Kia, or Cadillac made the best performing car on Earth, I couldn't be caught dead in one. I live in a BMW and Mercedes Benz world, will always drive one brand or the other.

I don't believe that any 3 Series has ever been a sportscar, I don't get the whole enthusiasm bit. Weight reduction, size reduction, rock-hard suspensions, insanely high horsepower, punchy torque, none of it makes sense to me in a country where most cars average 32 MPH in a typical week and in sheetmetal that costs $50,000. For those that truly want that kind of ride, there are hundreds of other choices that make a lot more sense.

Putting it another way, for every 1 sports enthusiast there are 10,000 badge whores who view the car as a status symbol, nothing more. The demographic shows this to be true as do the millions of drivers we see every day in base models who look like our wives and librarians. TV's, movies, hip-hop recordings, BMW is a cultural status symbol.

Me, I think I'm the only one in it for the "right" reasons. I don't want to drive recklessly for a quick thrill in Bergen County and I'm not a badge whore. I'm right in the middle. For those that are performance enthusiasts I'm sure to them your car is a dream. For those who are badge whores your car to them is dated and old. For me in the middle, I don't care either way because I'm happy with my F30 even if you think it's too big.

BJ
No, I think I get it. According to your percentages, there's badge whores, performance enthusiasts, and you, in your own self-defined category. You admit you're status conscious, live in a swanky neighborhood, your parents are badge whores, but you're not. LOL.

You can be whatever you want to be, it's a free country. But in trying to make a decision on whether I buy the F30, which I waited for b/c the E90 disappointed me, I don't think I'll listen to the feedback of someone who feels the need to put down others who are not as status conscious to have the latest new thing, in this case older generation BMW owners. Not cool, money buys you stuff, not class.

Just because someone doesn't have your views on everything doesn't mean they're wrong. I would bet 98% of people on these forums were as surprised as me with the "I don't get the whole enthusiasm bit". Then why are you on these forums?

I read that you had at least one or two E90s before this. Maybe you've never had significant seat time in an E46, and never got used to its driving dynamics. They are not perfect, but are fun to drive, and obviously a lot of people are having a hard time making the transition.

I want the F30. I want it to fix all the negatives of the E46 but still retain all that I love about it. Unfortunately I don't think that's what it was designed to do.
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  #258  
Old 09-03-2012, 06:55 AM
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boltjaM3s boltjaM3s is online now
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Originally Posted by RF330 View Post

I read that you had at least one or two E90s before this. Maybe you've never had significant seat time in an E46, and never got used to its driving dynamics. They are not perfect, but are fun to drive, and obviously a lot of people are having a hard time making the transition.

I want the F30. I want it to fix all the negatives of the E46 but still retain all that I love about it. Unfortunately I don't think that's what it was designed to do.
I've been on these forums since 2006 and if there's one thing that's consistent it's that E46 drivers are never satisfied with the current BMW 3 Series direction and they want everyone to know it. After two new generations and two LCI's one would think that they'd move onto another brand that can satisfy their needs.

I believe you are correct when you say the F30 was not designed to replace the E46. It's bigger, more luxurious, less connected to the road, and (sorry) trying to keep up with the Joneses in the competitive status-symbol luxury car segment. You don't have to take my advice on how the times have changed, but you should take BMW's. The car may be called the 3 Series, but it's not what it was in 1998 when the E46 was conceived, won't ever be again.

Good luck with your search.

BJ
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  #259  
Old 09-03-2012, 07:20 AM
RF330 RF330 is offline
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Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
I've been on these forums since 2006 and if there's one thing that's consistent it's that E46 drivers are never satisfied with the current BMW 3 Series direction and they want everyone to know it. After two new generations and two LCI's one would think that they'd move onto another brand that can satisfy their needs.

I believe you are correct when you say the F30 was not designed to replace the E46. It's bigger, more luxurious, less connected to the road, and (sorry) trying to keep up with the Joneses in the competitive status-symbol luxury car segment. You don't have to take my advice on how the times have changed, but you should take BMW's. The car may be called the 3 Series, but it's not what it was in 1998 when the E46 was conceived, won't ever be again.

Good luck with your search.

BJ
So I assume that means you haven't had a lot of time in an E46. That is fair and I can appreciate your annoyance at all of us, I really can. The problem is we haven't found another brand that isn't even farther away from what we're looking for. Your last sentence is spot on and I have to either accept where it's gone or stop looking for the closest replacement.
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  #260  
Old 09-03-2012, 07:36 AM
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So I assume that means you haven't had a lot of time in an E46. That is fair and I can appreciate your annoyance at all of us, I really can. The problem is we haven't found another brand that isn't even farther away from what we're looking for. Your last sentence is spot on and I have to either accept where it's gone or stop looking for the closest replacement.


Just got back from getting an iced decaf at Dunkin' and saw an E46 M3 Coupe in silver which looked great. It parked right next to me and didn't look that much larger than my F30. Great looking car, looked exactly like the one in the photo above.

BJ
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  #261  
Old 09-03-2012, 07:40 AM
dtc100 dtc100 is offline
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The problem is we haven't found another brand that isn't even farther away from what we're looking for. Your last sentence is spot on and I have to either accept where it's gone or stop looking for the closest replacement.
Check out the new ATS then, it is actually designed with E46 as its blueprint. How well did it do so, you can find out for yourself.

As far as the brake dust issue, it's another trade off. People complain about it, it appears the F30 now uses a different type of pads to reduce dust, the trade off is you don't have the same kind of "braking feel" as on the E90.

Good that we keep adding things to the list. Steering feel, road feel, now braking feel.
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  #262  
Old 09-03-2012, 07:45 AM
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beden1 beden1 is offline
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Check out the new ATS then, it is actually designed with E46 as its blueprint. How well did it do so, you can find out for yourself.

As far as the brake dust issue, it's another trade off. People complain about it, it appears the F30 now uses a different type of pads to reduce dust, the trade off is you don't have the same kind of "braking feel" as on the E90.
Good that we keep adding things to the list. Steering feel, road feel, now braking feel.
My 2011 335is also has very little to no brake dust with it's factory brake pads. The car was built in 4/2010 so I guess that's around the time when BMW made the change.
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  #263  
Old 09-03-2012, 07:48 AM
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Good that we keep adding things to the list. Steering feel, road feel, now braking feel.
All F30 owners know these conditions to be true. The question is why are you keeping some "list" and why the need to be in the F30 forum if you have nothing but negative, anti-BMW things to say about it?

Free country, you can be wherever you like, but you've got a bunch of guys who are in their cars under six months and we're trying to enjoy the experience here, not looking to have F30 haters point out what they don't like about our cars like this. And before you run to the obvious comeback, I voice my E46/E90 opinions here, not in their subforums.

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  #264  
Old 09-03-2012, 07:51 AM
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beden1 beden1 is offline
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Check out the new ATS then, it is actually designed with E46 as its blueprint. How well did it do so, you can find out for yourself.

As far as the brake dust issue, it's another trade off. People complain about it, it appears the F30 now uses a different type of pads to reduce dust, the trade off is you don't have the same kind of "braking feel" as on the E90.

Good that we keep adding things to the list. Steering feel, road feel, now braking feel.
I personally wouldn't go with a Cadillac after I had engine head/valve issues with my very low mileage ZO6 from an apparent (more than isolated) QC problem. GM covered under warranty, but that's why I made the switch to a Porsche after being a loyal Corvette owner.
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  #265  
Old 09-03-2012, 07:57 AM
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CALWATERBOY CALWATERBOY is offline
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Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
The braking isn't as good as on the E90 as others point out, not sure if these pads are the reason.
They are - believe they're used to improve hot op. Should be no noticable fade with ceramic, even on the track.

Track....anyone?

Too soon?
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  #266  
Old 09-03-2012, 08:00 AM
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I personally wouldn't go with a Cadillac after I had engine head/valve issues with my very low mileage ZO6 from an apparent (more than isolated) QC problem. GM covered under warranty, but that's why I made the switch to a Porsche after being a loyal Corvette owner.
Aha! How's yer handling & ride quality now?
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  #267  
Old 09-03-2012, 08:01 AM
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They are - believe they're used to improve hot op. Should be no noticable fade with ceramic, even on the track.
That's a shame but I guess it's just another not-so-subtle indicator of where BMW's priorities lie with the evolution of the 3 Series.

BJ
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  #268  
Old 09-03-2012, 08:21 AM
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Aha! How's yer handling & ride quality now?
I only have about 300 miles of seat time on my back road journeys but I'm very pleased with how the car feels and handles. I have to get used to the lighter front end with the rear engine, but it provides more true road feel than I have ever experienced.
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  #269  
Old 09-03-2012, 08:22 AM
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Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
All F30 owners know these conditions to be true. The question is why are you keeping some "list" and why the need to be in the F30 forum if you have nothing but negative, anti-BMW things to say about it?

Free country, you can be wherever you like, but you've got a bunch of guys who are in their cars under six months and we're trying to enjoy the experience here, not looking to have F30 haters point out what they don't like about our cars like this. And before you run to the obvious comeback, I voice my E46/E90 opinions here, not in their subforums.

BJ
The reason is simple BJ. He hates the fact he got an E90 and didn't wait for an F30.
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  #270  
Old 09-03-2012, 08:37 AM
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I only have about 300 miles of seat time on my back road journeys but I'm very pleased with how the car feels and handles. I have to get used to the lighter front end with the rear engine, but it provides more true road feel than I have ever experienced.
Might not have the purity and soul satisfying feel of liquid low end torque, but come time to hit a bump or turn a corner, quality will out.
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  #271  
Old 09-03-2012, 08:38 AM
RDZumbaugh RDZumbaugh is offline
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Since I was looking to get back into a sedan after my 1.5 yr mid-life crisis convertible (almost 47 yrs old), I naturally looked to the 5 series since I'd previously owned an '07 550 & '08 535. I was disappointed that they'd increased it's size but didn't do much for the rear leg room - my previous complaint. The F30's increased size saved me money - I no longer needed to buy a 5series for its size. In turn, I was able to load my F30 with every option that was important to me, I would have had to order less options on the 5er. I am completely THRILLED with my 3series. Previous 3series models were just too small for me. My F30 feels the size of my previous 5ers. Will this change the dynamics of the 3er buyer. Yep - it already has. It'll be interesting to see how the 1 series & 4 series size will fall into the line up - I think BMW has a "plan" to meet a lot more buyers wants and needs. Who knows for sure though but I'm seeing it work on me.
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  #272  
Old 09-03-2012, 09:06 AM
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Might not have the purity and soul satisfying feel of liquid low end torque, but come time to hit a bump or turn a corner, quality will out.
Aside from the raw power, the ZO6 also handled amazingly because it only weighs 3,140 lbs. My Porsche vert weighs about 100 lbs more (still about 900+ lbs. lighter than the '08 M3 vert I had).

The M3 plowed through corners. The ZO6 cuts sharply through corners with precision. The 911 GTS seems to handle as well as the ZO6 except it takes less effort because of the lighter front end (almost like it coasts through corners with as much precision)

The porsche does not appear to have understeer nor do I feel body roll. I guess the best way I can describe it, is that it feels more like a grown up 1967 MG Midget (my first car that was very light and tossable yet underpowered). I can toss the Porsche around and it has all of the power that I need to power out of the corners. Porsche has done a great job of refining the sports car without foresaking it's heritage/true sports car characteristics.
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  #273  
Old 09-03-2012, 09:10 AM
dtc100 dtc100 is offline
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Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
All F30 owners know these conditions to be true. The question is why are you keeping some "list" and why the need to be in the F30 forum if you have nothing but negative, anti-BMW things to say about it?

Free country, you can be wherever you like, but you've got a bunch of guys who are in their cars under six months and we're trying to enjoy the experience here, not looking to have F30 haters point out what they don't like about our cars like this. And before you run to the obvious comeback, I voice my E46/E90 opinions here, not in their subforums.

BJ
Not all F30 know about the different brake feel until you pointed it out for them, you attack me because you don't want to be blamed for such revelation.

There is more, you pointed out the ASS issue, so much a negative to you that you had to have the dealer disable it.

BMW does not have a good reliability record, that the whole world knows, but we are willing to take the chance, because all the "feels" we got in return. It is a sacrifice we all make, including you.

It is natural that when those "feels" are gradually removed, people should be allowed to complain, because we took the risk on the reliability front as a trade off.

I never attacked you for preaching how perfect your F30L is to you, despite the fact you already had to fix a few things.

Just don't act as if you are doing BMW any favor by attacking me. The reason BMW has been successful, is in part because it's customers do not settle for less than they claim to be.
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  #274  
Old 09-03-2012, 09:14 AM
dtc100 dtc100 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RDZumbaugh View Post
Since I was looking to get back into a sedan after my 1.5 yr mid-life crisis convertible (almost 47 yrs old), I naturally looked to the 5 series since I'd previously owned an '07 550 & '08 535. I was disappointed that they'd increased it's size but didn't do much for the rear leg room - my previous complaint. The F30's increased size saved me money - I no longer needed to buy a 5series for its size. In turn, I was able to load my F30 with every option that was important to me, I would have had to order less options on the 5er. I am completely THRILLED with my 3series. Previous 3series models were just too small for me. My F30 feels the size of my previous 5ers. Will this change the dynamics of the 3er buyer. Yep - it already has. It'll be interesting to see how the 1 series & 4 series size will fall into the line up - I think BMW has a "plan" to meet a lot more buyers wants and needs. Who knows for sure though but I'm seeing it work on me.
For someone who is considering an F10, the F30 is indeed a smart alternative. Like I said previously,and you also observed, the F10, as big as it appears, has very limited rear legroom. For the most part,people would not be able to tell F30 apart from F10. For those who can tell them apart in an instant, those are enthusiasts, who hate F10 anyway.
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  #275  
Old 09-03-2012, 09:22 AM
Elk Elk is offline
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Originally Posted by beden1 View Post
The M3 plowed through corners. The ZO6 cuts sharply through corners with precision. The 911 GTS seems to handle as well as the ZO6 except it takes less effort because of the lighter front end (almost like it coasts through corners with as much precision).
My experience is similar (Z06 owner here). I find however the Z06 remains neutral in corners through 10/10s. The Porsche can become a real handful at the limits and suddenly transition to oversteer. Until this point is reached however it is wonderfully responsive.

I'm sure with experience one becomes very good at knowing when this is about to occur and avoiding it. Additionally, Porsche has done an amazing job taming this tendency. For me it only appears when pushed to ridiculous levels on the track. Great cars.
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