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E90/E91/E92/E93 (2006 - 2013)
The E9X is the 4th evolution of the BMW 3 series including a highly tuned twin turbo 335i variant pushing out 300hp and 300 ft. lbs. of torque. BMW continues to show that it sets the bar for true driving performance! -- View the E9X Wiki

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  #151  
Old 09-25-2012, 10:56 AM
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Kilgore Trout Kilgore Trout is offline
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I am not a fellow who will take his car to the track, and I'm not even particularly aggressive in around-town driving. But, for me, EPS was a major turnoff from moment one. The wheel feels absolutely dead from about the 11 0'clock to 2 0'clock positions. The overall sense is that it is fairly numb, slow to react, and kind of vague.

And, as I've said, it is still one of the best EPS systems I've driven.

EPS just doesn't belong on anything that has "fun" in it's mission statement.
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  #152  
Old 09-25-2012, 11:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris90 View Post
There is no 1 series sedan, what are you talking about? There isn't really even a rumor about one.
I said it was just a theory.

BJ
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  #153  
Old 09-25-2012, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
h

I am not about to let 1.4% of my driving dictate the other 98.6% (which I guess would qualify as "normal" driving )

The last thing I want is a race car to drive on the street. I do however want a car that is responsive to drive on the street and as much as I hated the stock suspension on my 335i I loved the steering feel and if the new F30 is a significant step backwards in that direction that would be a deal breaker for me.

At this point the 335i with its Koni FSD shocks and Conti DWS tires is exactly the car that I though I was buying in 2007. I have no illusions about a 335i being a track car or a race car and that is why mine is a convertible with an AT. Of course the fact that I have access to a track and to track cars and the fact that I have to drive my street cars on New York City's ravaged roads are major factors. If I lived where you live I would be much more willing to let the 1.4% play a larger role in the decision making process.

CA
Did you try just going to non-RFT, can you say how that felt with stock shocks?
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  #154  
Old 09-25-2012, 11:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LegendsNeverDie View Post
I stopped reading after "more nimble than the E90..." the F30 feels like a boat compared to the E90.
Don't know what to tell you, millions of people disagree.

It's like this with every new BMW introduction. Owners of the old car have their gripes about the new car, need to justify sticking with the old girl, get into heated debate. Then a funny thing happens. The lease is up, they do a test drive in a different mindframe, boom another F30 is sold.

The F30 has its drawbacks. But it's upside in other areas is a tremendous win over the E90. You'll see.

BJ
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  #155  
Old 09-25-2012, 11:15 AM
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Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
I said it was just a theory.

BJ
Well, the rest of the world does get a 1 series 5 door, but in reviews they don't really say it's significantly more fun than the F30, it's just cheaper with less rear leg room.

Fuel economy and luxury are simply now higher priorities than fun and steering feel for BMW.
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  #156  
Old 09-25-2012, 11:18 AM
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I don't really care too much about the technical differences between the E90 and F30 platforms, all I really need to know is that the F30 is hideous.

Aesthetics plays a huge roll for me in determining what cars I will consider purchasing, and the front end of the F30 removes it from ever being considered as an option. It's just ugly.
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  #157  
Old 09-25-2012, 11:24 AM
LegendsNeverDie LegendsNeverDie is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
Don't know what to tell you, millions of people disagree.

It's like this with every new BMW introduction. Owners of the old car have their gripes about the new car, need to justify sticking with the old girl, get into heated debate. Then a funny thing happens. The lease is up, they do a test drive in a different mindframe, boom another F30 is sold.

The F30 has its drawbacks. But it's upside in other areas is a tremendous win over the E90. You'll see.

BJ
"Millions" of people, really? How so? I didn't lease mine and I do not care that my car has the roundel on the hood, it means very little to me.
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  #158  
Old 09-25-2012, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris90 View Post
Did you try just going to non-RFT, can you say how that felt with stock shocks?
I have been through 4 stages with this car.

1. Stock shocks and stock RFTs. I did not have a problem for the first month/2000 miles while the car was in South Florida where I purchased it. The roads there are in very good shape.

2. Car shipped to NYC. After two weeks I was ready to either set fire to it or push it into the East River. If I was not going to be able to improve the situation I was prepared to get rid of the car regardless of how much money I lost. It was for all practical purposes undriveable on NYC roads. I replaced the Bridgestone RFTs with Pirelli P_Zero Nero M&S non RFTs. Very big improvement but the car still was not good on poor surfaces and "Pothole Explosions" remained an issue. I destroyed 5 tires and bent 5 rims with this setup.

3. Installed Koni FSD shocks. This made a huge difference. The ride quality improved by an order of magnitude and the handling improved as well. No more Pothole Explosions and the car was now much more pleasant to drive in NYC and in other areas with lousy roads. It was also more pleasant to drive on the twisties as the tires no longer bounced around on bumpy curves. The Pirellis were an improvment in that regard but the Konis made a huge differnece,

4. Installed Continental Extreme Contact DWS tires. This was a further improvement in both ride quality and handling. At this point I am satified with the way the car rides and the way that it handles. It is responsive, feels planted and the handles poor road surfaces well. It still has a fiim ride, as would be expected with a sport suspension, but the harshness and crashiness are a thing of the past.

CA
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Last edited by captainaudio; 09-25-2012 at 12:12 PM.
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  #159  
Old 09-25-2012, 11:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
I have been through 4 stages with this car.

1. Stock shocks and stock RFTs. I did not have a problem for the first month/2000 miles while the car was in South Florida where I purchased it.

2. Car shipped to NYC. After two weeks I was ready to either set fire to it or push it into the East River. If I was not going to be able to improve the situation I was prepared to get rid of the car regardless of how much money I lost. It was for all practical purposes undriveable on NYC roads. I replaced the Bridgestone RFTs with Pirelli P_Zero Nero M&S non RFTs. Very big improvement but the car still was not good on poor surfaces and "Pothole Explosions" remained an issue. I destroyed 5 tires and bent 5 rims with this setup.

3. Installed Koni FSD shocks. This made a huge difference. The ride quality improved by an order of magnitude and the handling improved as well. No more Pothole Explosions and the car was now much more pleasant to drive in NYC and in other areas with lousy roads. It was also more pleasant to drive on the twisties as the tires no longer bounced around on bumpy curves. The Pirellis were an improvment in that regard but the Konis made a huge differnece,

4. Installed Continental Extreme Contact DWS tires. This was a further improvement in both ride quality and handling. At this point I am satified with the way the car rides and the way that it handles. It is responsive, feels planted and the handles poor road surfaces well. It still has a fiim ride, as would be expected with a sport suspension, but the harshness and crashiness are a thing of the past.

CA
Thanks - I guess it's not a big deal, if I buy an E90 it'll be low miles, and I can probably sell the stock shocks for something if I need the Konis.

Of course already on my must-buy list are an LSD, Performance Exhaust and non-RFTs. The car is getting expensive.
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  #160  
Old 09-25-2012, 12:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris90 View Post
Thanks - I guess it's not a big deal, if I buy an E90 it'll be low miles, and I can probably sell the stock shocks for something if I need the Konis.

Of course already on my must-buy list are an LSD, Performance Exhaust and non-RFTs. The car is getting expensive.
If I were to do another mod (whcik is unlikely) it would be an LSD.

CA
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  #161  
Old 09-25-2012, 12:23 PM
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DSXMachina DSXMachina is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
I have been through 4 stages with this car.

[snip]
4. Installed Continental Extreme Contact DWS tires. This was a further improvement in both ride quality and handling. At this point I am satified with the way the car rides and the way that it handles. It is responsive, feels planted and the handles poor road surfaces well. It still has a fiim ride, as would be expected with a sport suspension, but the harshness and crashiness are a thing of the past.

CA
Good choice CA, I just ordered a set from TireRack to replace the worn Dunlop SP Sport Maxx* set on the Saab Aero. Great tire at a great price, probably one of the best values there is.

*Summer use only, the Conti's are year round. I have my fun in the 335 in the Summer now, no need for stickies on the Saab.

Last edited by DSXMachina; 09-25-2012 at 12:24 PM.
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  #162  
Old 09-25-2012, 12:28 PM
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DSXMachina DSXMachina is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris90 View Post
Thanks - I guess it's not a big deal, if I buy an E90 it'll be low miles, and I can probably sell the stock shocks for something if I need the Konis.

Of course already on my must-buy list are an LSD, Performance Exhaust and non-RFTs. The car is getting expensive.
Chris, have you considered just buying a good used ///M? If I were going to do as many mods to a 335 as you are considering I'd jump on the M. Depends on what you're looking for I guess.
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  #163  
Old 09-25-2012, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
If I were to do another mod (whcik is unlikely) it would be an LSD.
Typing something like this always drives me insane. First I'll type just what you did above, pronouncing the letters as letters. Then, I'll read it, with my mind converting the "LSD" to the words "Limited ....". So, I go back and change the "an" to "a". Then I read it again. This time, my mind stays on the letters. So, I go back and change "a" to "an". Rinse. Repeat. Eventually, I get frustrated, and stop using abbreviations.
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  #164  
Old 09-25-2012, 01:33 PM
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DSXMachina DSXMachina is offline
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Originally Posted by Zooks527 View Post
Typing something like this always drives me insane. First I'll type just what you did above, pronouncing the letters as letters. Then, I'll read it, with my mind converting the "LSD" to the words "Limited ....". So, I go back and change the "an" to "a". Then I read it again. This time, my mind stays on the letters. So, I go back and change "a" to "an". Rinse. Repeat. Eventually, I get frustrated, and stop using abbreviations.
Zooks, the rule is that if an abbreviation begins with a consonant, which sounds as if it were spelled beginning with a vowel, then use 'an'. So the Cap'n got it right.
Examples
A CIA team was recalled from Libya.
An FBI team was sent to Libya. (The pronunciation of 'f' is 'eff'.)
Got it?

Last edited by DSXMachina; 09-25-2012 at 01:37 PM.
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  #165  
Old 09-25-2012, 01:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Kilgore Trout View Post
I am not a fellow who will take his car to the track, and I'm not even particularly aggressive in around-town driving. But, for me, EPS was a major turnoff from moment one. The wheel feels absolutely dead from about the 11 0'clock to 2 0'clock positions. The overall sense is that it is fairly numb, slow to react, and kind of vague.

And, as I've said, it is still one of the best EPS systems I've driven.

EPS just doesn't belong on anything that has "fun" in it's mission statement.
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  #166  
Old 09-25-2012, 01:39 PM
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I will admit that when I hot a pothole mid-corner with my 328xi coupe, the back end would lose it a bit. That annoyed me.
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Quote:
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In the words of one of Bimmerfest's greatest minds:"Been there, done that"
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  #167  
Old 09-25-2012, 01:59 PM
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///M-ratedE90 ///M-ratedE90 is offline
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Originally Posted by DSXMachina View Post
Zooks, the rule is that if an abbreviation begins with a consonant, which sounds as if it were spelled beginning with a vowel, then use 'an'. So the Cap'n got it right.
Examples
A CIA team was recalled from Libya.
An FBI team was sent to Libya. (The pronunciation of 'f' is 'eff'.)
Got it?
go an eff off
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Last edited by ///M-ratedE90; 09-25-2012 at 02:01 PM.
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  #168  
Old 09-25-2012, 02:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
Don't know what to tell you, millions of people disagree.

It's like this with every new BMW introduction. Owners of the old car have their gripes about the new car, need to justify sticking with the old girl, get into heated debate. Then a funny thing happens. The lease is up, they do a test drive in a different mindframe, boom another F30 is sold.

The F30 has its drawbacks. But it's upside in other areas is a tremendous win over the E90. You'll see.

BJ
Just to be clear, I never said the F30 was an inferior car overall to the E90. I don't like the steering one bit, I have lots of complaints about the interior, and find the engine a bit gruff. But, in terms of overall vehicle dynamics, power, seating comfort, transmission performance, MPG, available features, there is no doubt that the F30 is a big upgrade (at least in my opinion).

The problem though is that the numb steering trumps all the other upgrades.
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  #169  
Old 09-25-2012, 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted by DSXMachina View Post
Chris, have you considered just buying a good used ///M? If I were going to do as many mods to a 335 as you are considering I'd jump on the M. Depends on what you're looking for I guess.
I sort of consider those out of my price range, and the maintenance and gas mileage scares me off a bit. Not that I wouldn't love to have one.
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  #170  
Old 09-25-2012, 03:24 PM
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boltjaM3s boltjaM3s is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilgore Trout View Post
Just to be clear, I never said the F30 was an inferior car overall to the E90. I don't like the steering one bit, I have lots of complaints about the interior, and find the engine a bit gruff. But, in terms of overall vehicle dynamics, power, seating comfort, transmission performance, MPG, available features, there is no doubt that the F30 is a big upgrade (at least in my opinion).

The problem though is that the numb steering trumps all the other upgrades.
Thanks for the clarification, and as an enthusiast I can see your viewpoint.

For the rest of us, the F30 is a brilliant improvement in every way to the E90. There's not a single aspect of my E90 that I miss in the F30. Not one.

BJ
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  #171  
Old 09-25-2012, 03:49 PM
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I don't understand why some people think the F30 is ugly.

Frankly I never considered any current or recent BMW (including the two I own) to be particularly beautiful but I would not describe any of the current sedans as ugly.
Generic and somewhat ordinary perhaps but definitely not ugly,

CA
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  #172  
Old 09-25-2012, 04:23 PM
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Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
2. Car shipped to NYC. After two weeks I was ready to either set fire to it or push it into the East River.
Totally off topic, but isn't the traditional method to set it afire and push it into the East River? As a Jersey boy I am not always clear on the fine points.
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  #173  
Old 09-25-2012, 04:26 PM
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captainaudio captainaudio is offline
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Totally off topic, but isn't the traditional method to set it afire and push it into the East River? As a Jersey boy I am not always clear on the fine points.
As a Jersey Boy you should know that the traditional method is to set it on fire and push it into the HUDSON river.

I made the mistake of trying to drive it into the river but the RFTs bubbled and got hung up on the stairs.



CA
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Last edited by captainaudio; 09-25-2012 at 04:29 PM.
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  #174  
Old 09-25-2012, 05:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
I don't understand why some people think the F30 is ugly.

Frankly I never considered any current or recent BMW (including the two I own) to be particularly beautiful but I would not describe any of the current sedans as ugly.
Generic and somewhat ordinary perhaps but definitely not ugly,

CA
Me either. While I'm not a big fan of the headlight assembly growing into the kidney grills, it's not THAT big of a deal. I've seen quite a few F30s now. To be honest, even with the one that almost ran over me as I was walking across a professional building driveway, I had to look twice to determine it was an F30 not an E90. Pulling along side one in traffic, the most telling demarcation is to look at the dash for the Nav screen.
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  #175  
Old 09-25-2012, 05:07 PM
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go an eff off
I like your SigPic. It looks like you've finally got parallel parking figured out.
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