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F30 / F31 / F32 / F33 (2012 - current)
The sixth generation 3 series, chassis code F30. 2013 model year 328i and 335i sedans now in production. Read the F30 frequently asked question thread for all your basic question and dive into all the details in the ultimate F30 information thread.

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  #1  
Old 09-25-2012, 11:45 AM
g37to335i g37to335i is offline
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Active Hybrid 3

Hello
I am currently in the market for a 335i. Currently I have a 2010 G37 and a 2011 X5 35i Premium. I learnt to appreciate BMW and the N55 from my experience with the X5.

I really did not want to post anything on this forum until I got the 335i but I wanted to ask your opinion on the Active Hybrid 3. I plan to take delivery around Xmas. It seems to me people are missing the point with this car. The way I look at this car is by comparing it with the S4, which weighs about the same. However with the BMW, you have 335hp from 5800-6000 rpm, the S4 peaks at 5500. The Active Hybrid also has peak TQ from 1200-5000rpm. This means the AH3 has a broader area under the graph than the S4.

I am sure most of you will point out that the S4 has AWD, this will help the S4 in curves and off the line, however this is true for the normal 335i as well but the AH3 should be in a better position once both cars are in motion.

The weight distribution of the AH3 is almost 50/50, just like the 328i, I believe (and I stand to be corrected) that a near 50/50 weight distribution leads to better handling. The AH3 also has slightly more weight at the back compared to the 335i but this should provide more traction off the line.

If I get the AHS, its got nothing to do with the fuel economy, but I think BMW engineered this car to slightly edge out the 335i in performance. As a replacement for my G37, well its a win win situation

In summary I guess I am saying the adv of the AH3 over the 335i are as follows:
More weight at the back for better traction
Near 50/50 weight distribution
More HP
Peak HP available over a broader rpm range 5800-6000
More TQ available at the same range as the 335i

Disadv
More weight


What do you guys think.

Last edited by g37to335i; 09-25-2012 at 11:55 AM.
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  #2  
Old 09-25-2012, 02:37 PM
E36toF30 E36toF30 is offline
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I think the argument for the activehybrid 3 is a very difficult one, at least from an economical and performance prospective. It's not totally clear at this point though, because I've read conflicting things about what the EPA ratings for it will be. Here's what we know right now though:

+ Yes, the activehybrid does have a better weight distribution, and that tends to provide more balanced (better) handling. However the 335i automatic is still close to ideal at 51.5% in the front.

- The activehybrid may have more power, but according to bmwusa.com, it's .1 seconds slower 0 - 60 compared to a 335i automatic, no doubt due to the extra weight..
- The activehybrid costs about $6000 more.
- More complexity = more stuff that can go wrong and need to be fixed.

So yeah, I guess we'll see once the EPA ratings really come out, but the only argument I can think of right now is being able to say that you drive a hybrid. Even if the EPA ratings turn out to be noticeably better, $6000 buys a lot of gas.

Also, on BMW's site it says that that the activehybrid 5 is rated 3 MPG better city compared to a 535i, but highway rating is the same. So yeah, that probably gives some clue as to what the ratings for the 3 will be (they use the same hybrid powertrain).

Last edited by E36toF30; 09-25-2012 at 02:39 PM.
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  #3  
Old 09-25-2012, 05:02 PM
g37to335i g37to335i is offline
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I think that 0.1s deficit will be all but eliminated at the quarter mile. It would be interesting to see the quarter mile trap speed too. There is a video of the AH3 racing an M135i on the autobahn and the two were very close. I will test drive the 335i 335 x driver and the AH3 once my dealer has all in stock. On paper the AH3 seems very appealing, certainly not for mpg, but there has to be some performance gains from the additional power source. The even weight distribution should not be overlooked, a lot of reviewers were complaining the 335i is nose heavy.

Last edited by g37to335i; 09-25-2012 at 05:03 PM.
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  #4  
Old 09-25-2012, 05:57 PM
Elk Elk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g37to335i View Post
I think that 0.1s deficit will be all but eliminated at the quarter mile.
Unlikely. 300 pounds more weight continues to require more energy to accelerate, regardless of speed.

Additionally, the hybrid has a longer final-drive ratio of 2.81 instead of the regular car's 3.15. While this is good for increased gas mileage, it is bad for acceleration.

Don't buy the hybrid if you are looking for performance.
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  #5  
Old 09-25-2012, 06:07 PM
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enigma enigma is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g37to335i View Post
I think that 0.1s deficit will be all but eliminated at the quarter mile. It would be interesting to see the quarter mile trap speed too. There is a video of the AH3 racing an M135i on the autobahn and the two were very close. I will test drive the 335i 335 x driver and the AH3 once my dealer has all in stock. On paper the AH3 seems very appealing, certainly not for mpg, but there has to be some performance gains from the additional power source. The even weight distribution should not be overlooked, a lot of reviewers were complaining the 335i is nose heavy.
Seriously? Did you put 1/4 mile speed and hybrid in the same sentence?

I think you made up your mind and are trying to justify your decision with false logic.

If you are after performance, just buy the 335i and tune it. $6k buys you a lot of tuning toys.

If I were you, I would take a hard look at the S4 since you seem to be 100% concerned about performance. You can't get an open diff with the 335i at any price point.
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  #6  
Old 09-25-2012, 06:38 PM
g37to335i g37to335i is offline
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Yes I did put 1/4 mile and hybrid in the same sentence, this is no ordinary hybrid though. The only reason I am focussing on performance is I am comparing different variants of the 335i. The S4 335i debate is a whole different thread. I have looked everywhere for the quarter mile times but none are out there. It would be interesting to hear what those who take ownership have to say

@ elk
I see your point, unfortunately all I can do is bench race at this stage since there is no test data out there for it. I have faith in this hybrid though.

Last edited by g37to335i; 09-25-2012 at 06:50 PM.
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  #7  
Old 09-25-2012, 07:08 PM
Elk Elk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g37to335i View Post
@ elk
I see your point, unfortunately all I can do is bench race at this stage since there is no test data out there for it.
Yup. But it is an amusing exercise.

I don't see the hybrid as having additional performance. In real world terms it won't fall particularly behind however.

It strikes me as a fun car to buy if one is amused by the technology.
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  #8  
Old 09-25-2012, 07:19 PM
g37to335i g37to335i is offline
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I guess that's what attracting me to this car, at its core it's a top notch sports sedan, the 335i, and it comes with some extras. Unfortunately weight is one of them.
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  #9  
Old 10-05-2012, 07:16 PM
g37to335i g37to335i is offline
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My dealer just told me to come and test drive the ah3 tomorrow. I have driven the '12 335i twice now and hopefully I can drive them back to back. Now that the option for the power pack is open and hopefully available on the ah3, this should make it more interesting.

Update

I have just been to the test drive and the ah3 has a lot of tq off the line. Without even being too aggressive on the throttle the rear tires were letting loose. Had to wait at least for a sec for full traction to kick in so u can finally go. You can really feel the additional weight at the back though. It's a feeling one can do without and takes a bit away from the 335i's driving dynamics. The one I drove was the luxury line. I will order the m sport package.

My choice is not too bad given I live in the northeast. I would have to go with the x drive or the ah3. Both are heavier that the 335i but I think with dedicated winter tires and sticky sport tires in the non winter months the ah3 should be better than the x drive. Please go ahead and try the ah3, it's worth your time. I plan to add the power pack for another 30hp getting me to 360/360 all under warranty.

Last edited by g37to335i; 10-06-2012 at 08:35 AM.
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  #10  
Old 10-06-2012, 01:26 PM
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Doesn't the AH3 have a 4500 tax rebate?
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  #11  
Old 10-06-2012, 01:30 PM
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  #12  
Old 10-06-2012, 02:02 PM
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I'm very disappointed with the AH3 city rating. I thought it was going to be considerably higher.
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Last edited by tturedraider; 10-06-2012 at 02:14 PM.
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  #13  
Old 10-06-2012, 05:05 PM
g37to335i g37to335i is offline
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Correct, the ah3 has Eco credit of 3500, this makes it a cheaper than a similarly equipped x drive and very close to the 335i.
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  #14  
Old 10-06-2012, 05:25 PM
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CALWATERBOY CALWATERBOY is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g37to335i View Post
I wanted to ask your opinion on the Active Hybrid 3.

Here it is:

A dud.

Wait for N20 hybrid w/smoothed N20; better ASS. Ha!

That might sell, unlike the gobblers BMW's presented as hybrids so far.
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  #15  
Old 10-19-2012, 12:54 PM
g37to335i g37to335i is offline
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I am ordering this by month end

Alpine white
Leather Dakota coral red/black highlight
Cold weather package
M sport line
Premium package
Tech package
HK surround system
Park distance control
Rear view camera

Selling price is in the very very low 50s after discounts/incentives/loyalty.

Still not sure if the ah3 comes with the real sport suspension when it's an m sport model.

Last edited by g37to335i; 10-19-2012 at 02:05 PM.
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  #16  
Old 10-19-2012, 08:43 PM
BmwEncinitas BmwEncinitas is offline
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Did you order yours yet?

Hello,

Have you had a chance to drive the AH3? It's an amazing car.. not alone there is a 3500 echo credit.

I just placed an order for mine..



Quote:
Originally Posted by g37to335i View Post
Hello
I am currently in the market for a 335i. Currently I have a 2010 G37 and a 2011 X5 35i Premium. I learnt to appreciate BMW and the N55 from my experience with the X5.

I really did not want to post anything on this forum until I got the 335i but I wanted to ask your opinion on the Active Hybrid 3. I plan to take delivery around Xmas. It seems to me people are missing the point with this car. The way I look at this car is by comparing it with the S4, which weighs about the same. However with the BMW, you have 335hp from 5800-6000 rpm, the S4 peaks at 5500. The Active Hybrid also has peak TQ from 1200-5000rpm. This means the AH3 has a broader area under the graph than the S4.

I am sure most of you will point out that the S4 has AWD, this will help the S4 in curves and off the line, however this is true for the normal 335i as well but the AH3 should be in a better position once both cars are in motion.

The weight distribution of the AH3 is almost 50/50, just like the 328i, I believe (and I stand to be corrected) that a near 50/50 weight distribution leads to better handling. The AH3 also has slightly more weight at the back compared to the 335i but this should provide more traction off the line.

If I get the AHS, its got nothing to do with the fuel economy, but I think BMW engineered this car to slightly edge out the 335i in performance. As a replacement for my G37, well its a win win situation

In summary I guess I am saying the adv of the AH3 over the 335i are as follows:
More weight at the back for better traction
Near 50/50 weight distribution
More HP
Peak HP available over a broader rpm range 5800-6000
More TQ available at the same range as the 335i

Disadv
More weight


What do you guys think.
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  #17  
Old 10-20-2012, 02:07 AM
g37to335i g37to335i is offline
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Yes I did, in post 9 above I describe my experience. Have you test driven it? I agree it's an amazing car that I believe is being understated by the automotive press. I have another test drive this morning, I want to do a back to back with the x drive so I can be sure this is what I want. In any case, the ah3 is cheaper after the Eco credit.
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  #18  
Old 10-20-2012, 06:35 AM
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mdsbuc mdsbuc is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g37to335i View Post
I am ordering this by month end

Alpine white
Leather Dakota coral red/black highlight
Cold weather package
M sport line
Premium package
Tech package
HK surround system
Park distance control
Rear view camera

Selling price is in the very very low 50s after discounts/incentives/loyalty.

Still not sure if the ah3 comes with the real sport suspension when it's an m sport model.
Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think that you can get the black highlights on the coral red seats in the M Sport. For me, I'd love to have the M Sport exterior and the Sport Line interior......

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  #19  
Old 10-20-2012, 08:45 AM
g37to335i g37to335i is offline
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Just test drove the ah3 and the 335i. There is no doubt the tq on the ah3 is abundant and instantaneous. I am now 100% on board for buying the car. The 335i gives nothing up to the ah3. You can certainly tell its lighter and more tossable. However the ah3 did not feel too far behind in terms of driving dynamics. It was very interesting when the car switched from engine to electric mode seamlessly.

I guess after test driving these 2, I can safely say the 335i edges the ah3 in handling, both should be close in a straight line but the extra tq and how it's delivered should give the ah3 the edge. Coming from a g37, it's a win win situation no matter which flavor of 335i I choose.
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  #20  
Old 10-20-2012, 05:11 PM
stormace stormace is offline
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What's the power pack?
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  #21  
Old 10-20-2012, 06:59 PM
g37to335i g37to335i is offline
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Power pack gives you about 30/30 more hp and tq. I believe it's dealer installed. I am thinking of adding it to the ah3 once it arrives, I still have to order it. This should get me to 360/360, that's a good proposition for a loaded sports car under 55k with all inclusive maintenance.

Last edited by g37to335i; 10-20-2012 at 07:01 PM.
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  #22  
Old 10-20-2012, 09:00 PM
BmwEncinitas BmwEncinitas is offline
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I agree with you, the press and most people misunderstand the car.... I actually work for BMW and all I do everything is driving these cars.. From personal experience I'm really happy with the performance. I also dont believe the sticker shows actual miles when the hybrid kicks in while it's coasting.

The only thing I dont like is the cost.. I obviously don't care cuz I'm leasing and as long as I keep my car during the duration of my lease I'll be ok.

Also speaking of cost, if you are leasing the AH3 is still cheaper lease wise at a 60k MSRP vs. a 335i 56k MSRP plus the echo credit will most likely increase or BMW will have some crazy deals by the time my AH3 arrives.

The only other thing I'm going back and forth with is the 19's or 18's.. Not sure if I want the road noise w/ the 19's or the look on the 18's.

Did you notice the updated nag on the ah3? The 335i will most likely get the update next month or so.

Anyhow, good luck and let me know if you have any questions?



Quote:
Originally Posted by BmwEncinitas View Post
Hello,

Have you had a chance to drive the AH3? It's an amazing car.. not alone there is a 3500 echo credit.

I just placed an order for mine..
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  #23  
Old 10-20-2012, 09:11 PM
BmwEncinitas BmwEncinitas is offline
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That's a nice build!

Yes the both the sport and M sport have the sport suspension but if I were you I would spend the extra 500 for the sport transmission. Most people think is just the paddle shifters but it's a little faster shifting too.
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  #24  
Old 10-20-2012, 11:25 PM
ayu910 ayu910 is offline
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Congratulation on the order! Canít really go wrong with either 335i or AH3. But instant boost of tq from battery is just pure fun and addicting. IMO very practical in real world day to day driving and for sure EV is going to be future. Hybrid serve as a nice interim and BMW got it fairly balance with minimal compromise to showcase the advantage of extra juice from battery pack. In the AH7 it feel like a 3rd turbo or extra 50 shots of nos, ran with stock 550i from 70+mph and the 550i look like just standing still.
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  #25  
Old 10-21-2012, 06:30 AM
g37to335i g37to335i is offline
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Thanks ayu910 and Encinitas. It's encouraging to hear from you both as owners of the hybrid tech and Encinitas has access to these cars often. Encinitas thanks for clearing up the suspension issue. Good to know its the real deal. I did not get a chance to compare the navigation, I was focused on the driving. Like you both said, the tq is just amazing, given the 335i is a tq monster already, the addition of the electric motor makes it that much more addictive to drive. My ca put on the sport display which shows tq and hp, just a tap of the gas pedal sent the tq meter to 335 instantly. I guess after 5 years in a Infiniti g35/37hp, which makes its power higher up the rev band, I got tired of NA engines, forced induction is the future. Forced induction with electric motors even better.

I saw the white red combo in person yesterday and I did not like it as much as I thought I would. I will order it with Estoril blue and black combo instead.
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