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F10 / F11 (2011 - Current)
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  #1  
Old 12-26-2014, 07:48 AM
Vitesse911 Vitesse911 is offline
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2015 535 M Sport - 704 suspension same as before?

Just picked it up and was adamant about getting the 704 (DHP felt way too artificial and ultimately think it is not about performance but comfort). Anyway, after driving it for a couple days, noticed the car feels more floaty and uncomposed than expected generally although admittedly pretty controlled through corners. But def floatier than a 2013 with 704 I also drove. In fact, feels more like a non704 or DHP car. Significantly, the front suspension height is higher than other 704s I've seen (as well as non 704s)-- I have a 3 finger gap vs 2.

Anyone else notice this on 2015s?
Sometimes I wonder if BMW changed the 704 suspension for 2015 as it doesn't feel that sporty in the end.

For reference, I've owned 5 BMWs with and without sport pkgs and various 911s so have a pretty good feel for various suspensions. I generally like my rides on the firm side.
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  #2  
Old 12-26-2014, 08:28 AM
Mbbrewer Mbbrewer is offline
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I don't think anythings changed. My 2013 with 704 suspension is pretty floaty and doesn't inspire much confidence
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  #3  
Old 12-26-2014, 08:34 AM
bmw325 bmw325 is online now
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2015 535 M Sport - 704 suspension same as before?

Just to confirm - they were both rwd (not xdrive) models that you test drove? Xdrive models don't get 704 in any configuration.

I have a 14 with 704. It's not floaty, but it's also not as tight as other bmws with sport suspensions I've driven. Would actually make a good base suspension I think.
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Old 12-26-2014, 09:02 AM
Vitesse911 Vitesse911 is offline
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Thanks for responses. All RWDs and the 2015 is rwd.
Driving the car now and I would say the floatiness increases with speed and seems to be attributable to pretty soft damping and rebound in the shocks. On the hwy, there is too much vertical movement so the car can feel unsettled. Much more so than the 2013 704 ive driven. Otw, once the suspension sets in a turn, the car is pretty composed. However, I do think if the car was lower in front, it could make a difference. Again, my car front height is higher than other cars I've seen. Dunno if this is just the new age BMW feel (real feel only in Ms) or my particular car is off. Going to bring into dealer but I know they will say it is normal.

Last edited by Vitesse911; 12-26-2014 at 12:29 PM.
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  #5  
Old 12-26-2014, 09:05 AM
bmw325 bmw325 is online now
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2015 535 M Sport - 704 suspension same as before?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vitesse911 View Post
Thanks for responses. All RWDs and the 2015 is rwd.

Driving the car now and I would say the floatiness increases with speed and seems to be attributable to pretty soft damping and rebound in the shocks. On the hwy, there is too much vertical movement so the car can feel unsettled. Much more so than the 2013 704 ive driven. Otw, once the suspension sets, the car is pretty composed. However, I do think if the car was lower in front, it could make a difference. Again, my car front height is higher than other cars I've seen. Dunno if this is just the new age BMW feel (real feel only in Ms) or my particular car is off. Going to bring into dealer but I know they will say it is normal.

If the ride height looks off there's a slight possibility they left the shipping blocks in the suspension. Happens occasionally

Btw, I see you're in NY. Where'd you find a rwd msport model to test drive? From what I've seen dealers stock xdrives exclusively
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Old 12-26-2014, 09:55 AM
Vitesse911 Vitesse911 is offline
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Originally Posted by bmw325 View Post
If the ride height looks off there's a slight possibility they left the shipping blocks in the suspension. Happens occasionally

Btw, I see you're in NY. Where'd you find a rwd msport model to test drive? From what I've seen dealers stock xdrives exclusively
Yea, am really hoping it is something like shipping blocks.
Cars were driven in Fl. Yea, dont think NE dealers have any RWDs in stock- as if no one's driven rwd cars with snow tires before
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Old 12-26-2014, 10:04 AM
bmw325 bmw325 is online now
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2015 535 M Sport - 704 suspension same as before?

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Originally Posted by Vitesse911 View Post
Yea, am really hoping it is something like shipping blocks.

Cars were driven in Fl. Yea, dont think NE dealers have any RWDs in stock- as if no one's driven rwd cars with snow tires before

I know. It's like people in the NE think awd has some sort of magical properties and you'll instantly fly off the road without it. Kind of scary actually because it's lulled people into thinking they don't need snow tires.

Did you order your car from a NE dealer? I did ED, but from what I understand dealers often resist even ordering them because they don't wAnt to be stuck with a rwd car
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  #8  
Old 12-26-2014, 12:14 PM
The X Men The X Men is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vitesse911 View Post
Yea, am really hoping it is something like shipping blocks.
Cars were driven in Fl.
If your car had shipping block, it would be much stiffer than normal, not softer.
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  #9  
Old 12-26-2014, 01:26 PM
marsb007 marsb007 is offline
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2015 535 M Sport - 704 suspension same as before?

I had a 2013 535i with the 704 suspension, and now a 2015 535d with 704 suspension. I too notice a slight difference. I feel the 2013 settings were stiffer. For example, going over speed bumps in the 2013 would be a lot worse than the 2015. The 2015 is softer and more compliant. I haven't driven it hard yet, but I feel the 2015 also has a softer steering feel. Both have M-Sport. Both had same tires (Dunlops). I prefer the 2015.

Last edited by marsb007; 12-26-2014 at 01:27 PM.
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  #10  
Old 12-26-2014, 02:12 PM
Robert A Robert A is offline
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Does your car have Dunlops by chance?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vitesse911 View Post
Just picked it up and was adamant about getting the 704 (DHP felt way too artificial and ultimately think it is not about performance but comfort). Anyway, after driving it for a couple days, noticed the car feels more floaty and uncomposed than expected generally although admittedly pretty controlled through corners. But def floatier than a 2013 with 704 I also drove. In fact, feels more like a non704 or DHP car. Significantly, the front suspension height is higher than other 704s I've seen (as well as non 704s)-- I have a 3 finger gap vs 2.

Anyone else notice this on 2015s?
Sometimes I wonder if BMW changed the 704 suspension for 2015 as it doesn't feel that sporty in the end.

For reference, I've owned 5 BMWs with and without sport pkgs and various 911s so have a pretty good feel for various suspensions. I generally like my rides on the firm side.
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  #11  
Old 12-26-2014, 02:14 PM
lindros2 lindros2 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbbrewer View Post
I don't think anythings changed. My 2013 with 704 suspension is pretty floaty and doesn't inspire much confidence
704- floaty? Are you serious?

Are you coming from a rice rocket?

Ford Focus ST?

Nissan GT-R?

Ferrari?

Otherwise 704 is anything but floaty and addresses the complaints of people (like me) who had Buick-esque suspensions on their 2011's.

And if your front ride height (wheel well gaps) is higher, then you DON'T have the 704.

This was an issue detected on early-2014's.

Run a VIN check and confirm.
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  #12  
Old 12-26-2014, 02:16 PM
lindros2 lindros2 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marsb007 View Post
I had a 2013 535i with the 704 suspension, and now a 2015 535d with 704 suspension. I too notice a slight difference. I feel the 2013 settings were stiffer. For example, going over speed bumps in the 2013 would be a lot worse than the 2015. The 2015 is softer and more compliant. I haven't driven it hard yet, but I feel the 2015 also has a softer steering feel. Both have M-Sport. Both had same tires (Dunlops). I prefer the 2015.
Hit the DSC (traction) button once and see if your steering tightens up.

Ignore the traction messages.
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  #13  
Old 12-26-2014, 02:43 PM
Vitesse911 Vitesse911 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lindros2 View Post
704- floaty? Are you serious?

Are you coming from a rice rocket?

Ford Focus ST?

Nissan GT-R?

Ferrari?

Otherwise 704 is anything but floaty and addresses the complaints of people (like me) who had Buick-esque suspensions on their 2011's.

And if your front ride height (wheel well gaps) is higher, then you DON'T have the 704.

This was an issue detected on early-2014's.

Run a VIN check and confirm.

Yes, very floaty and of course, I'm serious, and no, no rice rockets as you say (not like your past gtr which was bone jarringly awful).
And I did a VIN check to confirm (even though the window sticker clearly says m suspension), confirmed the car def has 704. I am at the dealer now and service did not see anything out of the ordinary. They mentioned that suspensions often need some miles before settling and getting lower in height. While here, I checked out other 2015 535s with 704 and they too have the same front suspension height as mine which btw is roughly the same as non 704s. Unless something comes up wrong with my car, I suspect BMW may have changed the suspension setup a bit to make it more soft- hence my post. I do find find marsb007's post interesting. 704 used to be a standalone option and now, it's apparently included in the m sport pkg. On the BMW configurator, there is no option for 704. So did BMW now make the decison that all m sports should have the firmer suspension whereas they felt before it should be an option? I would be surprised given BMW's current thinking. Anyway, unless true that my suspension needs to be broken in to become more firm, my 2015 def feels more soft than the 2013 I drove.
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  #14  
Old 12-26-2014, 02:57 PM
lindros2 lindros2 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vitesse911 View Post
Yes, very floaty and of course, I'm serious, and no, no rice rockets as you say (not like your past gtr which was bone jarringly awful).
And I did a VIN check to confirm (even though the window sticker clearly says m suspension), confirmed the car def has 704. I am at the dealer now and service did not see anything out of the ordinary. They mentioned that suspensions often need some miles before settling and getting lower in height.
Actually my GT-R was quite comfortable for a car with 20" rims, track-ready suspension, and rock-hard tires. I'm being serious and not sarcastic.

When I recently drove a couple other cars - Ford Focus ST, 2015 Subaru WRX STi, two Aston Martins, and a Mclaren MP4-12C - I couldn't believe how terrible (stiff) the suspensions were. This could also be due to how light the cars are - especially compared to my GT-R (except Astons which weigh a ton).

I really like the 2013 704 suspension. Maybe they changed it in 2014/15 - that was my fear and why I didn't trade my car in last year.

p.s. I call b/s on suspensions settling. Period.
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Old 12-26-2014, 03:01 PM
marsb007 marsb007 is offline
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If I remember correctly, thru the first 1/2 of the year in 2013, the cars had a different suspension. Then in the second 1/2, they started installing the 704 suspension as part of the Msport package.

I don't know if it was tweaked in any way during the last 2 years...

Didn't you test drive the vehicle before purchasing?
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Old 12-26-2014, 03:23 PM
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Squiddie Squiddie is offline
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The builder website still says, today, that the M-sport suspension is included in the M-sport package "as of September production". Being the people who screw up lots of things in the builder they don't mention the year but presumably that is 2014.
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Old 12-26-2014, 03:27 PM
Mbbrewer Mbbrewer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lindros2 View Post
704- floaty? Are you serious?



Are you coming from a rice rocket?



Ford Focus ST?



Nissan GT-R?



Ferrari?



Otherwise 704 is anything but floaty and addresses the complaints of people (like me) who had Buick-esque suspensions on their 2011's.



And if your front ride height (wheel well gaps) is higher, then you DON'T have the 704.



This was an issue detected on early-2014's.



Run a VIN check and confirm.

I know what I ordered on my car. I had an e60 before my f10. I actually much prefer the way my 2012 X5 handles and feels over my f10 with 704. The x5 is precise and feels planted to the road. On center feel is excellent. My f10 drifts all over the place on the highway.
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Old 12-26-2014, 03:32 PM
marsb007 marsb007 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squiddie View Post
The builder website still says, today, that the M-sport suspension is included in the M-sport package "as of September production". Being the people who screw up lots of things in the builder they don't mention the year but presumably that is 2014.

I think it was actually September 2012...
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Old 12-26-2014, 05:29 PM
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Squiddie Squiddie is offline
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Well.

It goes back to what I say about F30 variants. They all drive completely different even if on paper all the suspension and steering should be the same.
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Old 12-26-2014, 05:55 PM
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Sonicendeavor Sonicendeavor is offline
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The problem is that the 704 has been greatly overhyped and expectations often exceed it's ability to deliver. It's still a fairly soft suspension and is definitely floaty at times - just less so than the standard suspension. You'll need an aftermarket coilover suspension to meet your needs.
The difference in ride height between the standard and 704 suspensions is only 10 millimeters (1/2 finger), so with the 704 you should be at a tight three fingers in front and 2 fingers in the rear. Anything lower than that probably has aftermarket lowering springs or suspension.
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Last edited by Sonicendeavor; 12-26-2014 at 06:07 PM.
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Old 12-26-2014, 06:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonicendeavor View Post
The problem is that the 704 has been greatly overhyped and expectations often exceed it's ability to deliver. It's still a fairly soft suspension and is definitely floaty at times - just less so than the standard suspension. You'll need an aftermarket coilover suspension to meet your needs.
The difference in ride height between the standard and 704 suspensions is only 10 millimeters (1/2 finger), so with the 704 you should be at a tight three fingers in front and 2 fingers in the rear. Anything lower than that probably has aftermarket lowering springs or suspension.

It's funny...after having had both DHP and 704, I also think DHP is overhyped. I think 704 is the best factory suspension on a non-M F10.
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  #22  
Old 12-26-2014, 08:19 PM
The X Men The X Men is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lindros2 View Post
704- floaty? Are you serious?

Are you coming from a rice rocket?

Ford Focus ST?

Nissan GT-R?

Ferrari?

Otherwise 704 is anything but floaty and addresses the complaints of people (like me) who had Buick-esque suspensions on their 2011's.
Different stroke for different folks. Frankly if the 704 suspension was the standard suspension, I would not have bought the F10, it too stiff for a executive saloon. At least with the DHP, I can adjust the suspension to my mood.

Last edited by The X Men; 12-26-2014 at 08:21 PM.
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Old 12-26-2014, 08:37 PM
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Sonicendeavor Sonicendeavor is offline
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It's funny...after having had both DHP and 704, I also think DHP is overhyped. I think 704 is the best factory suspension on a non-M F10.
That's certainly up for an honest debate, and I'd be inclined to agree, but the hype around these suspensions has reached almost cult-like status as being some kind of magic bullet fix for F10 handling concerns. I feel this hype does a disservice to potential buyers by raising their expectations higher than either factory suspension can deliver.
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Old 12-26-2014, 09:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonicendeavor View Post
That's certainly up for an honest debate, and I'd be inclined to agree, but the hype around these suspensions has reached almost cult-like status as being some kind of magic bullet fix for F10 handling concerns. I feel this hype does a disservice to potential buyers by raising their expectations higher than either factory suspension can deliver.
I totally agree. The F10 is no E39 and will never be one, and the hype on all sides is absolutely out of control!!
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  #25  
Old 12-27-2014, 07:56 AM
greenhobby greenhobby is offline
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Very curious that the car you test drove feels considerably different from what you were delivered. Nothing sux like buyers remorse. Was the test drive car a 550 by any chance? They are a bit heavier in the front I believe. Hopefully the dealer is right with the suspension settling some after a few miles. (not likely, but possible).

This is one of the [many] reasons that I never buy new, only CPO's where you actually drive the thing you buy. Don't get me wrong, a brand new car is awesome, it just doesn't out weigh the case against CPO.

Hope the car works for you down the road!!
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