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  #1  
Old 10-22-2012, 09:18 AM
richardpale richardpale is offline
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renegotiating deal?

I ordered a 650i grand coupe a couple weeks ago and I thought I was getting a deal. I found this site and noticed that the average person is paying about three thousand dollars less than what I paid and I am also paying a higher money factor.

Is it wrong to renegotiate a deal I already agreed on? Another $3000 off a $115,000 car isn't going to make or break the deal for me. But it does put a little bad taste in my mouth that I gave in too easily and didn't know about the money factor.

I am going to say something either way, but if you guys were in this situation if you would go back and try hard to get the deal a lot of people are getting? Or just try to make the difference up on my next car lease with them?

Last edited by richardpale; 10-22-2012 at 10:06 AM.
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  #2  
Old 10-22-2012, 09:33 AM
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miamiboyca miamiboyca is offline
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Have you signed the papers? To me everything is negotiable until you sign the papers.

That being said - how much of a deposit did you put and in what state are you purchasing?
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  #3  
Old 10-22-2012, 09:42 AM
richardpale richardpale is offline
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nothing was signed. I put a $1000 deposit but they never did charge my credit card, I am in Louisiana.

There is nothing in writing and I know I can still get out of the deal. But I am not looking to get out of the deal I just want to see if people think it is "morally" right to go back and be strong on getting the car discounted more after I found out what others are paying.

Last edited by richardpale; 10-22-2012 at 10:44 AM.
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  #4  
Old 10-22-2012, 09:46 AM
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I believe it is, if it was more like 1K, then maybe - but 3K is significant. BUT, you need to be prepared if they say no - to reorder.

For me, no brainer 3K is nothing to sneeze at.
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  #5  
Old 10-22-2012, 09:47 AM
jordanM3 jordanM3 is offline
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If you were happy with the deal before, you shouldn't let what "someone else" paid change your mind. Every deal is different, and may depend on region, what time of the month/quarter, etc. Louisana is probably a less competitive market than LA, where there are literally 15 dealers in a 20 mile radius. The GC is a great car and you'll love it.

If someone paid less than you for milk and eggs yesterday, do you care?

Plus, as any person in sales will tell you, people have a tendency to slightly.....exaggerate what kind of deal they got to others.

Last edited by jordanM3; 10-22-2012 at 09:48 AM.
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  #6  
Old 10-22-2012, 09:58 AM
djsaad1 djsaad1 is offline
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I found this site after I ordered my car too, which is also a 650 gran coupe. I didn't know I wasn't quoted the base money factor at the time, so I did end up renegotiating the money factor. After talking to a few people on this site, I know that I didn't get the best deal that I could have gotten. But on the other hand my dealer has gone far and beyond what I have expected him to with my order, so I am ok with paying them a little more on this specific deal.

Last edited by djsaad1; 10-22-2012 at 11:21 AM.
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  #7  
Old 10-22-2012, 10:49 AM
richardpale richardpale is offline
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The first thing I will talk to them about is the money factor. I am not sure I want to cancel this car over three thousand dollars, I will have to wait another month or even two and that isn't really worth it to me. I will also miss out on the incentives in December which means I will be saving even less.
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Old 10-22-2012, 10:53 AM
djsaad1 djsaad1 is offline
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That is a good point, if you were to cancel the order and order somewhere else. The car would probably come after December and you would probably lose the incentives. Those incentive could possibly be $2000+, so really you wouldn't be saving much, if anything at all.

I would just start some dialogue with your dealer, explaining them the situation and see how they react.
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Old 10-22-2012, 11:16 AM
Bob Z. Bob Z. is offline
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It never hurts to ask! Besides, the dealer may compromise with you, which would benefit you and them as well since you'd be more likely to recommend them.
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  #10  
Old 10-22-2012, 12:33 PM
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miamiboyca miamiboyca is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jordanM3 View Post

If someone paid less than you for milk and eggs yesterday, do you care?

Plus, as any person in sales will tell you, people have a tendency to slightly.....exaggerate what kind of deal they got to others.
This is a silly statement. Of course you should care what other people pay - its how you understand if you are paying market or above. Would you care if you paid $30 for eggs to find out someone was pay $6.

Sounds like you special ordered your car, which normally takes as little as 6 weeks if they grab something in production. Anything you order now from a dealer that does a sufficient amount of business will be here by December and since you are so close to PDC (in Greenville, SC) - you can order from anyone in the country.

The only thing I see as potentially unethical is to wait until the delivery to let them know. Call them now, let them know the deal I want is at X selling price and Y money factor and see what they say. They may call your bluff and they may not.

Contact a sponsor like Greg or Adrian - see what deal you should be getting.
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  #11  
Old 10-22-2012, 03:27 PM
ard ard is offline
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Originally Posted by jordanM3 View Post
If you were happy with the deal before, you shouldn't let what "someone else" paid change your mind. Every deal is different, and may depend on region, what time of the month/quarter, etc. Louisana is probably a less competitive market than LA, where there are literally 15 dealers in a 20 mile radius. The GC is a great car and you'll love it.

If someone paid less than you for milk and eggs yesterday, do you care?

Plus, as any person in sales will tell you, people have a tendency to slightly.....exaggerate what kind of deal they got to others.
Dumb.

OP, call a sponsor or PM them. See if they will give YOU the $3000 less deal (or even $2k less)...if they WILL, then you are not being influenced "by what someone else paid"...you will then be acting based on "how badly the deal is".

I'd do it in a heartbeat.

One thing I will not do is 'take turns' making one dealer beat another, and back and forth. I set a price that I think is reasonable and fair, and the closest dealer to match that gets the order. I dont try and squeeze another 50, 100, 500 once they do that.

In this case, I'd give the current dealer ONE shot at the deal. They will try and lowball you for something in the middle- but I'd be very clear that they have ONE shot at saving this, their choice.


Finally, ever ask a dealer what they sold a car for? Now THAT'S where you get exageration.

A
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  #12  
Old 10-22-2012, 03:51 PM
MonkeyCMonkeyDo MonkeyCMonkeyDo is offline
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You can afford a 115k vehicle because you DO care about 3k. As others have posted renegotiate and don't be worried about walking away. It is worth it and board sponsors are def worth using if you have to walk away.
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  #13  
Old 10-22-2012, 04:31 PM
richardpale richardpale is offline
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I talked to both my dealer and another dealer today. My dealer won't budge on the price but did say he will use the base money factor. The other dealer will give me the price I see most people here getting but really doesn't believe he will be able to get me the car before January because of the moonstone exterior color and canyon brown interior color. He says those colors will probably add another month to the order.

Now I am not sure what to do, January or February is not that much longer but I would lose on the December incentives if I do this. With the December incentives the deals will probably not be very different, so I am thinking I should probably stay with my current deal.

Any other thoughts? Do any of the dealers here think they could get me a 650i gran coupe with those individual colors before January? I would be fine with a performance center delivery.
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  #14  
Old 10-22-2012, 04:37 PM
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miamiboyca miamiboyca is offline
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I would contact Adrian Villa in Atlanta and Greg Poland and see if they have something that will meet your timeframe needs. They usually (am speaking for them.. hahaha) won't get into a bidding war on the forum. Contact them directly (email) let them know what you are looking for n regards to options, price and delivery. If they can help - they will, but you have to reach out directly.
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  #15  
Old 10-22-2012, 04:48 PM
djsaad1 djsaad1 is offline
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I ordered the full individual package and my production slot is week 48, so he is right that individual orders take longer. I am actually jealous that you could be getting your car in December considering it seems like you ordered after I did.

Last edited by djsaad1; 10-22-2012 at 04:50 PM.
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  #16  
Old 10-22-2012, 06:57 PM
thegandalf thegandalf is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miamiboyca View Post
I would contact Adrian Villa in Atlanta and Greg Poland and see if they have something that will meet your timeframe needs. They usually (am speaking for them.. hahaha) won't get into a bidding war on the forum. Contact them directly (email) let them know what you are looking for n regards to options, price and delivery. If they can help - they will, but you have to reach out directly.
+1
Adrian is great resource. If he can help you out he will. If he can't he will give it to you straight. In both cases you know you have a good deal.
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  #17  
Old 10-22-2012, 09:17 PM
ard ard is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richardpale View Post
I talked to both my dealer and another dealer today. My dealer won't budge on the price but did say he will use the base money factor. The other dealer will give me the price I see most people here getting but really doesn't believe he will be able to get me the car before January because of the moonstone exterior color and canyon brown interior color. He says those colors will probably add another month to the order.

Now I am not sure what to do, January or February is not that much longer but I would lose on the December incentives if I do this. With the December incentives the deals will probably not be very different, so I am thinking I should probably stay with my current deal.

Any other thoughts? Do any of the dealers here think they could get me a 650i gran coupe with those individual colors before January? I would be fine with a performance center delivery.
You went to your dealer with your dick in you hand AND NOT OTHER DEAL AS LEVERAGE and just whined about price???

Then the second dealer told you a COLOR would delay delivery?!?!?

You're not a negotiator, are you?

The second you tell ANYONE you (1) need to buy a car, or (2) need it by [january, december, whenever], you give up leverage. By not presenting your current dealer with a 'make it or lose it' moment, you are just continuing to project a weak buyer image. He knows he can just keep jerking you around, since you WANT it and you have not created the belief in his mind that you might walk. Your fear of losing this one deal drove you to 'just try and talk to him'... negotiate from a position of power, NOT weakness.

Pick up the phone, call a few sponsors, try not to sound like a total *****, then let your dealer match it (or mayne not)- when he doesnt, set up a pcd and be done with it.

My (harsh) two cents

A
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Old 10-22-2012, 09:43 PM
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miamiboyca miamiboyca is offline
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3K is lot of money just so they won't think your are unethical. How ethical was it for them to not give you the best market price possible?

Again - $3,000 is A LOT of money to just give away. If you don't think so - contact your local church, youth center, orphanage, etc and ask them if they would like a $3,000 donation - they will jump for joy.

Unlike ARD who can be... a little shall we say..."direct"... hehehe - you went in without all the info (we have all been there), you want to be a stand up guy (again, we all have been there) but obviously you feel like you have been taken advantage of otherwise you would not have posted. Obviously you must be successful to afford such a beautiful car, so you must understand negotiations and that nothing is final until its final.

I would go back to the dealer, and apologize because you didn't have all the info when you came in and that was your mistake. You now have all the info and they have to options, the FAIR deal you want or you walk away. The incentives are not going to get worse in Nov and December - besides you are already giving away 3K, even if you lost incentives of 3K (which you won't) at this point its also about principal. Just my 2 cents.
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Old 10-22-2012, 09:58 PM
djsaad1 djsaad1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ard View Post
You went to your dealer with your dick in you hand AND NOT OTHER DEAL AS LEVERAGE and just whined about price???

Then the second dealer told you a COLOR would delay delivery?!?!?

You're not a negotiator, are you?

The second you tell ANYONE you (1) need to buy a car, or (2) need it by [january, december, whenever], you give up leverage. By not presenting your current dealer with a 'make it or lose it' moment, you are just continuing to project a weak buyer image. He knows he can just keep jerking you around, since you WANT it and you have not created the belief in his mind that you might walk. Your fear of losing this one deal drove you to 'just try and talk to him'... negotiate from a position of power, NOT weakness.

Pick up the phone, call a few sponsors, try not to sound like a total *****, then let your dealer match it (or mayne not)- when he doesnt, set up a pcd and be done with it.

My (harsh) two cents

A

I agree with you, but the one thing he is right about is the individual order timing. Individual orders are not like standard orders. The dealer can assign you a production slot but BMWNA usually reschedules them to give them time to get it done and/or order the parts.

OP you need to find a dealer that will offer you the price you want plus give you whatever incentives that come in December even if your car arrives in January or February. That would be the best case scenario, I am just not sure you will be able to find that deal since those incentives are usually not lockable.
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Old 10-23-2012, 07:57 AM
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miamiboyca miamiboyca is offline
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I don't get this BS about additional time for "Indivudual Package". At its base its the same options that are part of other packages like M-Sports and a standard accessories. Here is what I see on the site...

Full LED Lights - An option on regular builds so seems standard.
Anthracite Alcantara Headliner - Part M-Sports
Shadowline exterior trim - M-Sport Package
Different Rims - Again part of M-Sport or standard upgrade.
Individual Door Sill Finishers
Piano Finish Black Trim - Just a different trim application

Again, I think its a beautiful addition and one that makes it unique and no doubt worth the extra money - I just am not buying this whole extra time thing. I think it smoke, and would love to see one of the forum sponsors chime in.

From a business standpoint it does not make sense to take more time to delivery something that is more profitable. Jut my 2 cents again.
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  #21  
Old 10-23-2012, 07:58 AM
ard ard is offline
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Originally Posted by djsaad1 View Post
I agree with you, but the one thing he is right about is the individual order timing. Individual orders are not like standard orders. .
I'd overlooked the distinction...individual indeed is a special beast. thx

So then it becomes 'is it worth $3k'?

.
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Old 10-23-2012, 04:53 PM
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SARAFIL SARAFIL is offline
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Originally Posted by miamiboyca View Post
I don't get this BS about additional time for "Indivudual Package". At its base its the same options that are part of other packages like M-Sports and a standard accessories. Here is what I see on the site...

Full LED Lights - An option on regular builds so seems standard.
Anthracite Alcantara Headliner - Part M-Sports
Shadowline exterior trim - M-Sport Package
Different Rims - Again part of M-Sport or standard upgrade.
Individual Door Sill Finishers
Piano Finish Black Trim - Just a different trim application

Again, I think its a beautiful addition and one that makes it unique and no doubt worth the extra money - I just am not buying this whole extra time thing. I think it smoke, and would love to see one of the forum sponsors chime in.

From a business standpoint it does not make sense to take more time to delivery something that is more profitable. Jut my 2 cents again.
It's not the options, it's the Individual paint and interior upholstery.
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  #23  
Old 10-23-2012, 10:46 PM
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It's not the options, it's the Individual paint and interior upholstery.
Still doesn't make sense. I have to assume the factory has the parts in stock and the paints prepped.
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  #24  
Old 10-24-2012, 10:30 PM
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Greg@Pacific BMW Greg@Pacific BMW is offline
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I will thrown this out........... All individual cars usually require 3-4 weeks addition time BEFORE PRODUCTION.... this text below is directly from BMW NA distribution

"once a vehicle is locked in as Individual, we cannot push it up in production. This is because the individual items are ordered according to the vehicle and these items are added at a later time in production"
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  #25  
Old 10-25-2012, 07:51 AM
djsaad1 djsaad1 is offline
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Originally Posted by Greg@Pacific BMW View Post
I will thrown this out........... All individual cars usually require 3-4 weeks addition time BEFORE PRODUCTION.... this text below is directly from BMW NA distribution

"once a vehicle is locked in as Individual, we cannot push it up in production. This is because the individual items are ordered according to the vehicle and these items are added at a later time in production"
I guess that means I am stuck with week 48. Was really hoping they would push it up a week or two so that I can have the car before the end of the year.
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