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E60 (2004 - 2010)
BMW 5-Series (E60 chassis) was first seen in the Unites States in the fall of 2003 with a 2004 Model Year designation. The E60 is now available as a 528i, 528xi, 535i, 535xi, 550i and a 535xi sports wagon! -- View the E60 Wiki

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  #1  
Old 04-08-2014, 07:22 AM
resunoiz resunoiz is offline
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on a hill, car parked with gear on can move?!?!

I noticed My 520i when parked on a hill, can move even if the 1st gear is on

(obviously can move if there is no handbrake).

I always tought that with the gear on, a car won't move and the handbrake is a security surplus. But I noticed that the car moves by little steps until I pull the handbrake. Never noticed on other cars, or almost not noticed so evidently.

Any advice? Is that abnormal?
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  #2  
Old 04-08-2014, 07:46 AM
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mpower997 mpower997 is offline
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Your question was answered yesterday http://forums.5series.net/e60-discus...n-move-137700/
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04 545i Mystical Blue* Manual*Sport*Cold weather&smokers pkg*Heated everything*Logic7*
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Old 04-08-2014, 07:51 AM
aber57 aber57 is offline
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Left in gear car will only stays still if the car doesn't apply enough force motor engine over against force of cylinder compression. An E60 is 1600 Kg minimum and that is a lot for a 2.0 litre engine to hold back. If the engine has wear and has a bit of extra ring leakage then the engine has reduced ability to keep the car still. The piston rings when cold will NEVER be a perfect seal. Cold piston rings have a considerable gap between the ends of the piston ring. When the engine warms up this gap is reduced but doesn't close up completely. When engine is running the speed of piston is fast enough that the ring leakage is not a concern but when a car is parked the slow leak of gases past ring ends lets the motor move over when the force needed is met or exceeded. If the vehicle is left in reverse or first it will hold the best due to gearing. As the gear is higher the force to hold still goes down.

Short answer: this is normal
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Old 04-08-2014, 07:59 AM
resunoiz resunoiz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpower997 View Post
Your question was answered yesterday http://forums.5series.net/e60-discus...n-move-137700/
don't know if those 2 forums are "twins", so I tried to have more opinions, seemed me legit

if not, I can remove the topic of course
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Old 04-08-2014, 08:03 AM
resunoiz resunoiz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aber57 View Post
Left in gear car will only stays still if the car doesn't apply enough force motor engine over against force of cylinder compression. An E60 is 1600 Kg minimum and that is a lot for a 2.0 litre engine to hold back. If the engine has wear and has a bit of extra ring leakage then the engine has reduced ability to keep the car still. The piston rings when cold will NEVER be a perfect seal. Cold piston rings have a considerable gap between the ends of the piston ring. When the engine warms up this gap is reduced but doesn't close up completely. When engine is running the speed of piston is fast enough that the ring leakage is not a concern but when a car is parked the slow leak of gases past ring ends lets the motor move over when the force needed is met or exceeded. If the vehicle is left in reverse or first it will hold the best due to gearing. As the gear is higher the force to hold still goes down.

Short answer: this is normal
wow, thanks to you too, similar responses than in 5series.net

can you suggest me seals to be checked? on next weeks I'll be changing the cylinder covers gasket (don't know if can be related to, but has significant leaks), but if you have to suggest me one or more engine parts/seals to check it would be appreciated
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Old 04-08-2014, 10:39 AM
aber57 aber57 is offline
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There are no seals to inspect/replace. An engine overhaul may help but NEVER relying on the part of the car that makes it move to keep it stopped is the ONLY way to avoid this.
I don't trust all the little plastic pieces, and now electric solenoids, to keep park engaged on an auto trans vehicle. I apply park brake first then place it in park position. I apply park brake and see that car is held then switch off engine and release clutch on my manual trans BMW. If you selected 3rd instead of 1st by accident you're doomed. 3rd or even 2nd has too little gearing to give the mechanical disadvantage for the engine to keep a car from rolling on even a slight grade.
Leaving a car in gear parked with no brake set is a Paris street parking method for preventing excessively damaged cars from others bumper pushing your car with too much force to get into or out of their space.
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Old 04-08-2014, 11:34 AM
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What I do when parked on inclines is pull the hand brake, take it out of drive,put it in neutral take your foot off the brake pedal,, and the parking break will take the weight of the car . You can actually feel this. Then put it in park, with no pressure on the transmission and internal gears..
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Old 04-08-2014, 05:29 PM
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boramkiv boramkiv is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H F View Post
What I do when parked on inclines is pull the hand brake, take it out of drive,put it in neutral take your foot off the brake pedal,, and the parking break will take the weight of the car . You can actually feel this. Then put it in park, with no pressure on the transmission and internal gears..
OP is probably talking about a manual transmission equipped car. Definitely a compression loss if moving in first or reverse on a hill (or a ridiculously slipping clutch, but one would know that from a roll on startup in gear).

Either way you give sound advice as it can sometimes become hard to get the car out of park once the trans lock has severe pressure from the cars weight on a hill. (Seen that before).
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Old 04-09-2014, 12:00 AM
resunoiz resunoiz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boramkiv View Post
OP is probably talking about a manual transmission equipped car. Definitely a compression loss if moving in first or reverse on a hill (or a ridiculously slipping clutch, but one would know that from a roll on startup in gear).
yes, manual transmission

Quote:
Either way you give sound advice as it can sometimes become hard to get the car out of park once the trans lock has severe pressure from the cars weight on a hill. (Seen that before).
Sorry, I don't understand a lot what you said there...
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Old 04-09-2014, 03:08 AM
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boramkiv boramkiv is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by resunoiz View Post
Sorry, I don't understand a lot what you said there...
HF was giving great advice for guys with an automatic transmission.
Basically when stopped on a steep hill, engage the parking brake first, then place the car in neutral, and then release the brake pedal. The car will slowly ease forward, next apply the brake pedal and switch the lever to park. All should be good.

When one puts the car in park, then releases the brake pedal, the car rolls forward and the weight of the car rests on the transmission park lock ring making it difficult to switch from park when it's time to go.

I rememebr a Ford Expidition a long time ago where a female did just that, and when she returned to her vehicle to leave she couldn't get it out of park. None of the guys she called from inside the store could get it out of park either. (This was back on St. Thomas where the hills are ridiculous).
We ended up having to hook up a chain behind the Ford, and pull it backwards up the hill ever so slightly just to get the weight off the transmission. She was on her way after that.
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