13 5.0 Runnig Rich, Poor milage/transmission issues - update. - Bimmerfest - BMW Forums

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X5 E70 (2007 - 2013)
E70 BMW X5 produced between 2007 and 2013. Discuss the E70 X5 with other BMW owners here.

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Old 12-23-2012, 05:03 PM
z51vette z51vette is offline
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Location: New York
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 360
Mein Auto: 13 X5 50i M-Performance
13 5.0 Runnig Rich, Poor milage/transmission issues - update.

Update on my car. Had my car at a third dealer to diagnose my rich running, poor MPGs condition along with the rough 2-1 downshift in D. The car was reprogrammed this time to address the rough downshift. They were not able to find any issues with the rich running condition nor the poor mileage. End result, the car is still engine breaking in D on 2-1 downshift, albeit not as much as before but I'm still getting 7-8 mpg around town.

Met up with Brian425 over the weekend. Picked up his set of 18's for the winter. He has a 12 5.0 which he kindly let me drive. His car does not exhibit any rough downshifting at all and his mileage is in the 12 mpg range in town. Tells me he doesn't baby it either. We were outside comparing the smell of the exhaust, and his car smells normal while mine has a pronounced gunpowder sulfur smell. His tips don't exhibit nearly as much fouling, with three times the mileage on the clock. While mine spits black soot all over my rear bumper. Is it the M-Performance tune? Doubt it, Brian has Dinan stage II on his, with 501 HP and 580 FT-LBS.

I'm running out of options here. Pay for a full independent diagnostic and hire an attorney?

Thanks Brian for holding the wheels for me and everything else!
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Old 12-23-2012, 05:29 PM
ard ard is offline
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Location: Sierra foothills, California USA
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 15,895
Mein Auto: '12 X5 35d/E39M5/996TTX50
You atty will tell you that you need a diagnosed problem. You don't really have that yet, do you? What are the fuel trims, long and shirt term, and the AFRs? O2s working right?

Actually the atty will say "you have a case here" and take your $1000 retainer FIRST, then get around to the other stuff later.

What data HAVE you been getting from the dealers?????? Have you just been asking them to investigate, or have you been demanding specific diagnostics/ data?
Keep it as simple as possible...but no simpler.
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Old 12-24-2012, 06:38 AM
Brian425 Brian425 is offline
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Location: New York City
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 332
Mein Auto: BMW X5 50i
I met up with Andre this weekend and drove his truck. There is definitely an issue with the downshifts as you come to a stop. My truck had a similar issue; but, after about 2k miles, it improved markedly. As you come to a stop light, the last downshift causes an abrupt 500-750 jump in RPM, while my truck will have a less abrupt downshift and a 250-500 increase in RPM. As far as the exhaust goes, I can only describe it as rich smelling. I've tuned many carbureted vehicles in my time and it is definitely a bit rich at idle.

Thinking about it now, it may be worth spending the money to go to a 4 wheel dyno with an air fuel ratio meter. This will allow them to graph the A/F ratio independently at all RPMs. I am sure there is a 4 wheel dyno in NYC. I know that 5 or so years ago, it was $100 to $150 for 3 runs with the A/F map. That will give you exact info on the A/F ratio through the RPM range. I am not sure; but, I would expect they could also analyze the exhaust gas at the same time. Honestly, I think it would be money well spent. From there, it would be a case of investigating the cause of anything unusual that is found.

The transmission issue is something that I think would need to be demonstrated side by side with another X5. It is clear that the final downshift from 3-2 in D is abrupt. I think by demonstrating that his truck is not acting the same as another X5 50i, he will be able to push a little harder. This could fall back into the "operating within BMW specs"; but, I would ask for a full print out of the specs and have them explain where in the specs it covers the issue described.

I understand the frustration. It is hard for both sides. When I come in and say I am getting 8 MPG, my dealer may very well think I drive it like I stole it or leave it idling for long periods. Like any issue, the key is to get the service department on your side. In my line of work, I tell people that you must be a polite and persistent pest. Sometimes getting things done at the dealer is the same.
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