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Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > BMW Model Discussions > 5 Series > E39 (1997 - 2003)

E39 (1997 - 2003)
The BMW 5-Series (E39 chassis) was introduced in the United States as a 1997 model year car and lasted until the 2004 when the E60 chassis was released. The United States saw several variations including the 525i, 528i, 530i and 540i. -- View the E39 Wiki

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  #51  
Old 12-16-2012, 09:46 AM
vavet5308 vavet5308 is offline
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You say you didn't drive it. Will it move under it's own power? I'd be tempted to drive it a short distance (2-3 miles) just to see if the noise goes away as it warms up and engages different gears. If the pump is not engaged then it's going to be an issue because the car won't move. Once you do this, raise it again (evenly from front to back) and check the fluid level again.
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  #52  
Old 12-16-2012, 10:28 AM
VA525FREAK VA525FREAK is offline
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I drove it around yard. It goes with no issues just the whining. Didn't get it too fast tho 15 mph tops.
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  #53  
Old 12-16-2012, 01:19 PM
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Fudman Fudman is offline
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The whining noise could be due to the pump but more likely due to friction if you do not have the right amount of ATF in the tranny. Verify:
1. The car is level
2. The ATF is at the proper temperature
3. Then recheck your ATF level.
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  #54  
Old 12-16-2012, 05:45 PM
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gtxragtop gtxragtop is offline
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Everything you want to know about the 5HP19 is here. http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...ighlight=5hp19
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Ever wonder why 5 series electrical issues are common and complicated.. Spend time here and you will understand why. http://www.bmw-planet.com/diagrams/r...9new/index.htm
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  #55  
Old 12-17-2012, 06:47 AM
VA525FREAK VA525FREAK is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gtxragtop View Post
Everything you want to know about the 5HP19 is here. http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...ighlight=5hp19
Not everything Does not address the sound I am getting after main front seal replacement. I have put the car up and leveled it using iphone on tranny pan and it was perfectly level. If I do not have enough fluid then I am really missing something here. I have checked it 5 times. I did the refill in drive, park, cycled through all gears, etc. Havent turned on A/C during process but still.

My symptoms include:

-No dash lights, no codes
-whining sound coming from TC area - sounds almost like a turbo but not as intense i guess. Sound was not there before
-Upon staratup where starter kicks flywheel - louder than before.
-Goes forward and reverse on own - no problem max speed 10mph roughly
-punched it once and spinned rear tires in gravel (not hard i know)
When I switch to park, reverse, drive in yard I can kind of hear the transmission engage but barely - not sure if this is normal for a car with 207k miles but you can hear it if you put your head down by shifter.
-Have not taken on a test drive due to the sound I am getting but have been driving around yard.

Maybe I am not understanding TC/transmission pump. The TC provides the pressure for the ATF through the pump right? The TC spins with the RPM's of engine and the sound is directly tied to engine RPM's so my initial thought is tranny pump is out? Maybe something in TC?

I am working on getting video on youtube so i can post
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  #56  
Old 12-17-2012, 09:11 AM
VA525FREAK VA525FREAK is offline
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OK - my buddy uploaded video for me check it out please!!!!!

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  #57  
Old 12-17-2012, 10:32 AM
Dackelone Dackelone is offline
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wow - that trans is noisey!

Are you sure you used the correct ATF ?

Last edited by Dackelone; 12-17-2012 at 10:34 AM.
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  #58  
Old 12-17-2012, 10:35 AM
VA525FREAK VA525FREAK is offline
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Last edited by VA525FREAK; 12-17-2012 at 10:42 AM.
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  #59  
Old 12-17-2012, 10:36 AM
VA525FREAK VA525FREAK is offline
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I am positive!!! Castrol import
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  #60  
Old 12-17-2012, 10:45 AM
VA525FREAK VA525FREAK is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dackelone View Post
wow - that trans is noisey!

Are you sure you used the correct ATF ?
Or do you mean that torque converter is noisey? None of that sound comes from the tranny, i can assure you that, maybe a bearing where the front seal is? Any idea what the noise indicates?
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  #61  
Old 12-17-2012, 10:54 AM
vavet5308 vavet5308 is offline
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The pump is engaging. The car wouldn't be able to move at all if it wasn't. Did the person who reinstalled the transmission fill the tc before installing it in the xmsn? I wonder if you might need to drive a little to get the air out.
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  #62  
Old 12-17-2012, 11:01 AM
VA525FREAK VA525FREAK is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vavet5308 View Post
The pump is engaging. The car wouldn't be able to move at all if it wasn't. Did the person who reinstalled the transmission fill the tc before installing it in the xmsn? I wonder if you might need to drive a little to get the air out.
The mechanic did not put any fluid in there, I put all fluids in and so far I have gotten 9 quarts in there. He told me that torque converter was drained but not sure how much?? During the fill up process I have found old fluid coming out once I had proper amount of fluid in there. I guess I will just drive it and pray that nothing major happens, I would think air in the system would be forced out during the filling process.

Side note - Does pump engage when car is in park? trying to isolate sound

Last edited by VA525FREAK; 12-17-2012 at 11:02 AM.
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  #63  
Old 12-17-2012, 11:05 AM
VA525FREAK VA525FREAK is offline
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Gonna go out on a limb here - could i have too much transmission fluid? If so, what would be the implications?
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  #64  
Old 12-17-2012, 11:05 AM
vavet5308 vavet5308 is offline
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Fluid pressure is necessary for anything to happen. Without the pump, there is no pressure. Without pressure, there is no movement.
You have movement, ergo you have an engaged pump.

My inclination would be to take it back to the guy who r&r'ed the transmission.
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  #65  
Old 12-17-2012, 12:13 PM
vavet5308 vavet5308 is offline
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Noise is definitely not normal. It's hard to say if that's a low fluid noise, a rubbing noise, a bearing noise, or what.

This is just a bad situation because the guy that R&R-ed the transmission didn't finish the job by putting fluid in it. It's easy to point the finger at him and ask him to drop the transmission again to see if there's anything not right, but that's where I lean. The wrong fluid would not make that kind of noise. The wrong fluid might cause some driveability issues and certainly some longevity issues, but it wouldn't be the cause of that noise.
It seems like you have about the right amount of fluid in there. I think the spec calls for 9.4 quarts including the TC and you say you've put in 9. The transmission was not completely disassembled, so some fluid probably remained in there. As long as you're doing the level check correctly (car level, not on ramps and temperature in the range of 30 to 50C) , I don't see how you could have too much.
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  #66  
Old 12-17-2012, 12:21 PM
VA525FREAK VA525FREAK is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vavet5308 View Post
Noise is definitely not normal. It's hard to say if that's a low fluid noise, a rubbing noise, a bearing noise, or what.

This is just a bad situation because the guy that R&R-ed the transmission didn't finish the job by putting fluid in it. It's easy to point the finger at him and ask him to drop the transmission again to see if there's anything not right, but that's where I lean. The wrong fluid would not make that kind of noise. The wrong fluid might cause some driveability issues and certainly some longevity issues, but it wouldn't be the cause of that noise.
It seems like you have about the right amount of fluid in there. I think the spec calls for 9.4 quarts including the TC and you say you've put in 9. The transmission was not completely disassembled, so some fluid probably remained in there. As long as you're doing the level check correctly (car level, not on ramps and temperature in the range of 30 to 50C) , I don't see how you could have too much.
I am not going to ask him to do any more work. I am going to drive it and hope for the best, if sound does not go away I will remove transmission myself and inspect area and see what I come up with since I have another car to drive in meantime
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  #67  
Old 12-17-2012, 02:31 PM
VA525FREAK VA525FREAK is offline
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Front seal just blew out on test drive.
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  #68  
Old 12-17-2012, 02:37 PM
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Fudman Fudman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VA525FREAK View Post
Gonna go out on a limb here - could i have too much transmission fluid? If so, what would be the implications?
Putting in too much ATF would only occur if you put it in cold (lower density = more ATF) or if you pumped it full and stuffed the plug in before ti drained out (ask me how I know). The symptoms are a change in shift pattern. 9.4 qts is normal for the 5HP19 for the M54 2.5. Replacing ATF is not rocket science. I suspect the noise is related to the tranny service.
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  #69  
Old 12-17-2012, 04:05 PM
VA525FREAK VA525FREAK is offline
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found a great link to bentley manual:

http://content.yudu.com/Library/A1py...ources/237.htm

Read the transmission section and I did everything correct, and I am confident that I used correct type and amount of fluid.

I am now faced with a decision on how to proceed. I want to remove transmission and TC and replace seals, bearings, everything that is external to transmission because I cannot rebuild a transmission (beyond my scope) but I can do all the other maintenance. I would just like to hear from others on what they suspect as a culprit, then I will let the thread die out. I want to get this car fixed and share the experience because I think it will help others. Maybe that can be done, maybe not, time will tell.

I do beleive that the transmission itself is not the faulty component and I do think the seal blew out again probably due to a bad bearing or something that will heat up/vibrate/make loud sound per above video, perhaps TC is bad. The car shifted through 3rd gear during test drive but I knew something was not right because of that loud whinning sound and when I pulled into yard I heard the fluid spilling out where seal is. If pump was bad, then car wouldn't move is my understanding. When tranny was initially looked at I was told no metal shavings were found in pan and she shifted fine during test drive (tonight).

I suspect seal was not installed correctly -or-
TC is bad -or-
TC installed incorrectly -or-
my bearings need to be replaced.

My questions I have is:

1. Can a pump be partially working, meaning can it work enough to make car go but not enough where it will heat up and cause a seal failure since pump mounts where seal is?

2. What are symptoms of a bad TC?

3. If tranny is bad, then what could be bad?
a)clutch plates - would mean tranny would slip which it does not
b)pump - discussed above, car would not move
c)blockage internal to valbe body? I could see how this could perhaps cause a seal to blow out if fluid could not flow freely through transmission, could a flush force alien particles out?

4. ****What would you do?****
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  #70  
Old 12-19-2012, 03:09 PM
VA525FREAK VA525FREAK is offline
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Pics of TC and tranny, anything else you want to see that will tell the story?
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  #71  
Old 12-24-2012, 08:09 AM
bbabin bbabin is offline
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Transmision

I changed the fluid and filter in my 2000 540i (165,000 miles) 200 miles later my transmission quit? $3500 later it's all fixed? Good luck!!! All you need to add fluid is a funnel and a long piece of rubber hose.
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  #72  
Old 12-24-2012, 09:47 AM
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Fudman Fudman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbabin View Post
I changed the fluid and filter in my 2000 540i (165,000 miles) 200 miles later my transmission quit? $3500 later it's all fixed? Good luck!!! All you need to add fluid is a funnel and a long piece of rubber hose.
Did you put enough ATF back in? You're gonna need a REALLY long piece of rubber hose to reach the fill hole while keeping the funnel above the fill hole. Better to use a cheap (<$10) pump.
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  #73  
Old 12-24-2012, 10:46 AM
bbabin bbabin is offline
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Transmission

AAMCO said that when I changed the fluid, I loosened the crap on the interior and it made the valves stick and I toasted it. It took them two tries to get it right. Over a month before it was fixed. When I picked the car up I drove it about 100 miles and it quit again? They towed it back and had to start over? They sent the valve body to NJ for rebuild and now it works good. I know now why I have never changed the tranny fluid before. Better off to just run it in my mind.
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  #74  
Old 12-24-2012, 12:37 PM
VA525FREAK VA525FREAK is offline
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More pics, removed valve body today, anything to check or do with this piece? Run compressed air thru perhaps?
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  #75  
Old 12-24-2012, 12:37 PM
VA525FREAK VA525FREAK is offline
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Posting pics of valve body soon btw but looks clean
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