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F30 / F31 / F32 / F33 (2012 - current)
The sixth generation 3 series, chassis code F30. 2013 model year 328i and 335i sedans now in production. Read the F30 frequently asked question thread for all your basic question and dive into all the details in the ultimate F30 information thread.

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  #76  
Old 01-03-2013, 06:36 AM
Michael Schott Michael Schott is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g37to335i View Post
What makes you think the ATS would dethrone the same 328i. The Motortrend guys who gave the ATS the nod clearly stated the best car wasn't there, the 328i. I am not sure this is where you want to take this
If you rank the 3 major US car magazines in how they reflect the needs of true enthusiasts, MT is 3rd. The other 2, C and D and R & T both prefer the 328 to the ATS. It's a testament to Cadillac that the ATS is as close as it is, but when you look at the sportiest version, which is the 2.0T with the MT, the powertrain of the Cadillac is well off the pace set by the BMW.
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  #77  
Old 01-03-2013, 06:43 AM
LegendsNeverDie LegendsNeverDie is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g37to335i View Post
It has not accomplished more than the G37 or G35 in their respective first years. Wait for the Q50, it still needs to overcome that hurdle and I don't see it happening, that's just my view.
How so? Who cares about the Q50, it is not out yet, the ATS is here and it has more than proven itself. Both the 2.0T and 3.6 made current or past WARD'S best engines list and the ATS chassis is fantastic. Only setback was the 6 speed manual, which is being reworked. By the time Q50 arrives Cadillac will fix the minor bugs with the ATS.

Last edited by LegendsNeverDie; 01-03-2013 at 06:46 AM.
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  #78  
Old 01-03-2013, 06:44 AM
g37to335i g37to335i is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Schott View Post
If you rank the 3 major US car magazines in how they reflect the needs of true enthusiasts, MT is 3rd. The other 2, C and D and R & T both prefer the 328 to the ATS. It's a testament to Cadillac that the ATS is as close as it is, but when you look at the sportiest version, which is the 2.0T with the MT, the powertrain of the Cadillac is well off the pace set by the BMW.
That's true, I actually like MT because at times they throw some curve balls into the mix. Not as predictable as CD. MT also prefers the 328i over the CTS 2T.
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  #79  
Old 01-03-2013, 06:48 AM
g37to335i g37to335i is offline
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Originally Posted by LegendsNeverDie View Post
How so? Who cares about the Q50, it is not out yet, the ATS is here and it has more than proven itself. Both the 2.0T and 3.6 made current or past WARD'S best engines list and the ATS chassis is fantastic. Only setback was the 6 speed manual, which is being reworked. By the time Q50 arrives Cadillac will fix the minor bugs with the ATS.
You will care after the Detroit Auto show, trust me on this
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  #80  
Old 01-03-2013, 06:51 AM
LegendsNeverDie LegendsNeverDie is offline
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Originally Posted by g37to335i View Post
You will care after the Detroit Auto show, trust me on this
Unless you know something I don't I am not so sure about that. I hope you are right because more competition is only good for the consumer.
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  #81  
Old 01-03-2013, 06:58 AM
Michael Schott Michael Schott is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LegendsNeverDie View Post
How so? Who cares about the Q50, it is not out yet, the ATS is here and it has more than proven itself. Both the 2.0T and 3.6 made current or past WARD'S best engines list and the ATS chassis is fantastic. Only setback was the 6 speed manual, which is being reworked. By the time Q50 arrives Cadillac will fix the minor bugs with the ATS.
Both the N20 and N55 made Wards list too and they said that the N20 is what other 2.0T engines wished they could be and was considerably more fuel efficient than the competition. Their comments on the 2.0T Cadillac engine had more to do with design efficiency.
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  #82  
Old 01-03-2013, 07:03 AM
g37to335i g37to335i is offline
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Originally Posted by LegendsNeverDie View Post
Unless you know something I don't I am not so sure about that. I hope you are right because more competition is only good for the consumer.
It's just gut instinct man. Those guys at Nissan have never screwed up on their cash cow, the G37. They do f up everything else though, G25, M37, FX 35/7, lol
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  #83  
Old 01-03-2013, 07:21 AM
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hufington hufington is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmw_or_audi View Post
I have been in the market for quite a while now (too long) for an A4 or a 328i. Just for the heck of it, I checked out some specs and prices for the G37 Sport 6MT, as they sometimes offer incredible discounts when a model near its end.

A car buying service promises a price of about $36K (about $6800 off MSRP, without any negotiations). I glanced over the list of standard features and they seem to have grown quite a bit since last time I checked them out:
  • Navigation
  • Backup camera & sonar
  • Xenons
  • Sport suspention
  • 12-way power seats
  • Power tilt and telescopic steering
  • High end stereo
  • Intelligent Key
  • Voice recognition
  • USB, bluetooth, XM, etc.
  • 60K B2B warranty
Oh, and 328Hp and outstanding handling, and very good reliability.

To get a similarly equipped 4-banger 328i, you are looking at about $47-48K street price.
  • Some lows of the G37 Sport: it is looking a little dated and it has never been able to compete on looks with the pretty ones, inside and outside.
  • Biggest low: awful gas mileage for the manual, partly due to a mystifying choice of a close-ratio gear box (why with such a powerful engine?)

I can't see anything that offers the same kind of bang for the buck in terms of performance and practicality. If very long commutes/mpgs are not an issue, it seems like an irresistible package for self-proclaimed enthusiasts.

Yes, yes, it is not the most refined in looks, both inside and outside, but it still is easy on the eyes and build quality and materials are very high. Yes, it is getting old and it may not be the most refined, but it is still a very well performing and yet civilized ride.

What am I missing? Maybe BJ is more right than he thinks. Is it all about the badge and the magazine fueled myths of telepathic steering, magical voodoo qualities, etc.?

What am I not seeing in the $11-12K + Tax price difference?
I have a fully loaded G37x automatic and love it for what it is.

However, the car is not even close to a 3-Series in terms of refinement. Not only the looks but also the engine, transmission, handling, and build quality.

I have driven that car for almost 3 years (and a G35x sedan for another 2)and had no reliability issues at all. But it always felt unrefined especially when you are driving really slow at 25-30mph and when you are accellerating hard from 30mph. At low speeds, the car is jerky due to the transmission. The dealer reprogrammed it three times and still not any better. When accelerating, although quick, the car never feels smooth. The coarseness comes from the engine and transmission characteristics. It is almost there at the level of a 3-series but not quite yet.

Other little issues are:

The paint is very very weak and vulnerable. Any little touch leaves an impact.
The Bose system is a disappointment. I drove a G35 previously for 2 years without one and there is not much difference between the two systems. They are just selling the brand IMHO.
The navigation, although overall a good value, is not intuitive and the database is not comprehensive enough even after 2 upgrades.
The voice command is rough and not very user friendly.
The headlights offer enough illumination for average speeds(up to 55mph) but for any faster you don't have a good road coverage and the high beams are basically the same bulbs illuminating a little higher but not any better.
The build quality is good overall, but I have had wind noise issues from the rear windows and rattles from the door and rear shelf due to subwoofers and the dealer just ignores them as they say 'loud music with a lot of bass makes them rattle so turn them down".
The steering is not as direct as a 3 series either. There is not too much response and when cornering fast, you do not get the feedback from the wheels and tires as much as you get with a BMW.

And of course the horrible gas mileage! I drive 95% in the city and averaged 13.1 mpg for the last 3 years(It is even worse than a police crown vic that I used to own a couple of years ago)! The best I have ever seen on the highway with lots of coasting at a constant 60mph and exteremely light throttle was 28mpg for a brief moment and that went down to 24-25 mpg. On average, if you do not drive like you are over 100 years old, you get 21-22 mpg only.

All in all, I truly believe the price difference is justified because of all the little engineering differences here and there that have a very big impact on the overall ownership satisfaction. There is more thought put into the BMW design and production than the Infiniti. Sometimes, you can copy the product or formula and make it better than the original. With Infiniti, I've always had the feeling that they've just copied it to the best of their abilities but never made any improvements on the formula. That's my 2 cents.
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13 BMW F10 535i RWD - 3.0 L 221 kW (300 hp) Bone stock except NAVI,PDC,Cam,Tint,Coded,HID Fogs,Debadged,Spoiler,BMS Stg1
07 BMW E64 630i - 3.0 L 200 kW (272 hp)
03 BMW E65 745i - 4.4 L V8, 242 kW (325 hp)
98 BMW E39 535i - 3.5 L 183 kW (245 hp)
95 BMW E34 540i - 4.0 L V8 210 kW (282 hp)
89 BMW E30 M3 non-cat 147 kW (200 hp)


15 MB W222 S550 4-Matic on order
10 Infiniti G37x Sedan
09 Mercedes C 350
08 Infiniti G35x Sedan
04 Mercedes CLK 350
01 Mercedes C 230

Last edited by hufington; 02-12-2013 at 07:04 AM.
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  #84  
Old 01-03-2013, 08:53 AM
dtc100 dtc100 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LegendsNeverDie View Post
Unless you know something I don't I am not so sure about that. I hope you are right because more competition is only good for the consumer.
They have kept the Q50 under the wrap so well we just have to wait and see. There is no question Nissan can build a good sports car and Q50 can benefit from such credential, whether the bean counters will allow it to happen or not is another issue.
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  #85  
Old 01-03-2013, 09:18 PM
thebmw thebmw is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
After driving them both, if you can't tell the difference than the BMW is not right for you.
+1. I had the same questions in my mind 5 years ago. After driving the G35/G37, I never looked at it again.
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  #86  
Old 02-08-2013, 02:18 PM
335is2013 335is2013 is offline
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I currently drive a 2010 G37S sedan. The lease is up in April and if Infiniti decided to provide a 6MT in their new Q50 sedan I would have stayed with Infiniti. They provide a great value in the performance space. Yeah, it's slightly rough around the edges - the shifter vibrates, the car loves to slide it's rear out with the traction control off, etc. To me, that's part of the fun. I would hardly call the G's engine "harsh." Sounds great and loves to rev.

The G37 with the sport package is a different car than 99% percent of what you see on the road (at least here in the Northeast). The G37x is soft, numb and missing the great sport seats, LSD, slick 6 speed, massive 14" brakes, etc.

I had a full day test drive of a 335is and the Infiniti has a stiffer suspension. The BMW, even with the 19" wheels, felt softer to me. They both very handle well and I couldn't push it too hard as the 335is had its summer's on and the temperatures were well below 40. Regardless, that sweet, intoxicating exhaust note and torquey power delivery sold me on the 335is. Ordered one yesterday and got the build number so hopefully it won't be a long 6-8 weeks!

However, for those of you cross-shopping Infiniti to 328's I'd consider the Infiniti if you're OK with getting an end of life body style. Doesn't bother me, which is why I'm getting the outgoing 335is...
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  #87  
Old 02-08-2013, 04:06 PM
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SD Z4MR SD Z4MR is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 335is2013 View Post
Regardless, that sweet, intoxicating exhaust note and torquey power delivery sold me on the 335is. Ordered one yesterday and got the build number so hopefully it won't be a long 6-8 weeks!
Congrats! I hope you enjoy your 335is as much as we enjoy ours! What color combination did you order?
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  #88  
Old 02-08-2013, 04:11 PM
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vst335is vst335is is offline
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Congrats!
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  #89  
Old 02-08-2013, 04:14 PM
PK2348 PK2348 is offline
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They are really cheap now, a friend leased one a month ago for his wife, g37x fully loaded, zero down 320 a month. I used to own 2006 g35x sedan. E90 was definately better, but not so sure about f30, but i am comparing to a base 328 xdrive. 335 sport should feel much better and tighter
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  #90  
Old 02-08-2013, 10:11 PM
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07 E63650i 07 E63650i is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reytran View Post
If you comparing the price at 47-48k, its the price the manual G Coupe IPL - 348hp.

My personal opinion about G coupe.
Pros:
Interior: I dont know why people complain about interior. My 09 650i interior completely outdated compare to infiniti EX and FX (same year). I always wanna pursuade my fiance to get an infiniti SUV with beige interior.
Exhaust note: my 08 G37S with sport muffler (its an original factory option) sounds amazing. You can hear the down gear sound with the stock muffler. My 650i with sport package factory exhaust note cant compare with the G coupe. (Not anymore after I installed the M6 Eisenmann Race)
Sounds: bose all the way with ipod connection and touch screen as original equipment.
Mod: its always fun if you are into mod a japanese car.


Cons:
Handling, you definitely need an after market swaybar (hotkisch or smth i forgot), lower spring and throw in some spacers.
Steering. I've had 08 G37S before, its sucked. Too light for me, I can tell its no feeling. My cousin Honda Accord coupe has way better handling feel. I get bored of driving it after a year.
Trunk space: that coupe has smaller trunk space then my cabrio. 1 golf bag, full.
Exterior: She doesnt have sexy back. Seriously.

Conclusion, for me, if between 328i and G37S, I would definitely go for the G. I like big coupe. About redesign, there are tons of G35 never looks outdated, it was released in 2002. I know infiniti is not bmw. But 328i is not M3 either. A full option G37S coupe compare to base 328i at the same priceprice.
+1

As a former owner of a 2003 G35 sedan, there IS a difference in the way an Infiniti feels compared to a BMW. Don't get me wrong, Infinitis are better in terms of pricing and long term reliability. But other than that, from my experience, there is no other car that can match that unmistakeable BMW feel.
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  #91  
Old 02-08-2013, 11:03 PM
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reytran reytran is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LegendsNeverDie View Post
And how do you know this? Very unlikely.
After reading this,

http://www.infinitiusa.com/all-new-q50/?next=Home_Page.PFA.Button.Q50_Micro

I believe it will be the biggest competitor to BMW from the East. The C- Class has 2 more year for the new generation. The A4 is as always, only pretty from the outside (I actually own one haha).

I test drive the ATS and not much impression. Hope the new Q50 steering wheels setting will give driver more feeling. However, I never think Q50 can dethrone 335i, maybe more power than 328i but never for the handling --- it's my BMW bias.
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  #92  
Old 02-09-2013, 06:08 AM
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LarryboysUDM LarryboysUDM is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmw_or_audi View Post
I have been in the market for quite a while now (too long) for an A4 or a 328i. Just for the heck of it, I checked out some specs and prices for the G37 Sport 6MT, as they sometimes offer incredible discounts when a model near its end.

A car buying service promises a price of about $36K (about $6800 off MSRP, without any negotiations). I glanced over the list of standard features and they seem to have grown quite a bit since last time I checked them out:
  • Navigation
  • Backup camera & sonar
  • Xenons
  • Sport suspention
  • 12-way power seats
  • Power tilt and telescopic steering
  • High end stereo
  • Intelligent Key
  • Voice recognition
  • USB, bluetooth, XM, etc.
  • 60K B2B warranty
Oh, and 328Hp and outstanding handling, and very good reliability.

To get a similarly equipped 4-banger 328i, you are looking at about $47-48K street price.
  • Some lows of the G37 Sport: it is looking a little dated and it has never been able to compete on looks with the pretty ones, inside and outside.
  • Biggest low: awful gas mileage for the manual, partly due to a mystifying choice of a close-ratio gear box (why with such a powerful engine?)

I can't see anything that offers the same kind of bang for the buck in terms of performance and practicality. If very long commutes/mpgs are not an issue, it seems like an irresistible package for self-proclaimed enthusiasts.

Yes, yes, it is not the most refined in looks, both inside and outside, but it still is easy on the eyes and build quality and materials are very high. Yes, it is getting old and it may not be the most refined, but it is still a very well performing and yet civilized ride.

What am I missing? Maybe BJ is more right than he thinks. Is it all about the badge and the magazine fueled myths of telepathic steering, magical voodoo qualities, etc.?

What am I not seeing in the $11-12K + Tax price difference?
$15K is the cost of all the BMW intangibles. Followers say it's well worth it. To the average Joe it's not. If you want to get the spirit of a BMW with $ to party/spend, order a no line 328 or 335 with DHP and manual. Good luck.
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Last edited by LarryboysUDM; 02-09-2013 at 06:09 AM. Reason: typo
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  #93  
Old 02-11-2013, 12:03 AM
smashhell smashhell is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hufington View Post
I have a fully loaded G37x automatic and love it for what it is.

However, the car is not even close to a 3-Series in terms of refinement. Not only the looks but also the engine, transmission, handling, and build quality.

I have driven that car for almost 3 years and had no reliability issues at all. But it always felt unrefined especially when you are driving really slow at 25-30mph and when you are accellerating hard from 30mph. At low speeds, the car is jerky due to the transmission. The dealer reprogrammed it three times and still not any better. When accelerating, although quick, the car never feels smooth. The coarseness comes from the engine and transmission characteristics. It is almost there at the level of a 3-series but not quite yet.

Other little issues are:

The paint is very very weak and vulnerable. Any little touch leaves an impact.
The Bose system is a disappointment. I drove a G35 previously for 2 years without one and there is not much difference between the two systems. They are just selling the brand IMHO.
The navigation, although overall a good value, is not intuitive and the database is not comprehensive enough even after 2 upgrades.
The voice command is rough and not very user friendly.
The headlights offer enough illumination for average speeds(up to 55mph) but for any faster you don't have a good road coverage and the high beams are basically the same bulbs illuminating a little higher but not any better.
The build quality is good overall, but I have had wind noise issues from the rear windows and rattles from the door and rear shelf due to subwoofers and the dealer just ignores them as they say 'loud music with a lot of bass makes them rattle so turn them down".
The steering is not as direct as a 3 series either. There is not too much response and when cornering fast, you do not get the feedback from the wheels and tires as much as you get with a BMW.

All in all, I truly believe the price difference is justified because of all the little engineering differences here and there that have a very big impact on the overall ownership satisfaction. There is more thought put into the BMW design and production than the Infiniti. Sometimes, you can copy the product or formula and make it better than the original. With Infiniti, I;ve always had the feeling that they've just copied it to the best of their abilities but never mad any improvements on the formula. That's my 2 cents.
OMG you reminded me that the weak paint used to drive me crazy in my old G37.
Every little thing scratches the paint. Even washing the car myself with extreme caution still leaves tons of marks on the car.
And It was white too, can't imagine having a black Infiniti. :/
So glad I don't have to deal with that anymore.
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  #94  
Old 02-11-2013, 05:27 AM
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hufington hufington is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smashhell View Post
OMG you reminded me that the weak paint used to drive me crazy in my old G37.
Every little thing scratches the paint. Even washing the car myself with extreme caution still leaves tons of marks on the car.
And It was white too, can't imagine having a black Infiniti. :/
So glad I don't have to deal with that anymore.
Lol. Even a falling leaf can scratch the paint. It is crazy.
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13 BMW F10 535i RWD - 3.0 L 221 kW (300 hp) Bone stock except NAVI,PDC,Cam,Tint,Coded,HID Fogs,Debadged,Spoiler,BMS Stg1
07 BMW E64 630i - 3.0 L 200 kW (272 hp)
03 BMW E65 745i - 4.4 L V8, 242 kW (325 hp)
98 BMW E39 535i - 3.5 L 183 kW (245 hp)
95 BMW E34 540i - 4.0 L V8 210 kW (282 hp)
89 BMW E30 M3 non-cat 147 kW (200 hp)


15 MB W222 S550 4-Matic on order
10 Infiniti G37x Sedan
09 Mercedes C 350
08 Infiniti G35x Sedan
04 Mercedes CLK 350
01 Mercedes C 230
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  #95  
Old 02-12-2013, 12:34 AM
bmw_or_audi bmw_or_audi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 335is2013 View Post
I currently drive a 2010 G37S sedan. The lease is up in April and if Infiniti decided to provide a 6MT in their new Q50 sedan I would have stayed with Infiniti.
They claim something like less than 1% of cars sold were manuals.
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  #96  
Old 02-12-2013, 07:14 AM
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hufington hufington is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g37to335i View Post
You will care after the Detroit Auto show, trust me on this
I was looking forward to the Q50 and I was ready to buy one right away to replace my 2010 G37 but it is a disappointment!
The design is way too generic, looks like any other midsize sedan (especially Mazda). I was hoping to see new engine choices in it, like a smaller displacement turbo - like they have been working on together with Mercedes. And, particularly I was expecting a better transmission after 5 years of the current one. Nope. They just stuffed the same G37 engine and the same transmission, suspension, airconditioning, etc. into the Q50.
Big mistake. Sure, people will still buy them, because they are relatively cheaper than BMW, Audi, Lexus, etc. and people will still love them because of all the standard equipment they get for the price, but there is no positive progress in terms of driving pleasure.
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13 BMW F10 535i RWD - 3.0 L 221 kW (300 hp) Bone stock except NAVI,PDC,Cam,Tint,Coded,HID Fogs,Debadged,Spoiler,BMS Stg1
07 BMW E64 630i - 3.0 L 200 kW (272 hp)
03 BMW E65 745i - 4.4 L V8, 242 kW (325 hp)
98 BMW E39 535i - 3.5 L 183 kW (245 hp)
95 BMW E34 540i - 4.0 L V8 210 kW (282 hp)
89 BMW E30 M3 non-cat 147 kW (200 hp)


15 MB W222 S550 4-Matic on order
10 Infiniti G37x Sedan
09 Mercedes C 350
08 Infiniti G35x Sedan
04 Mercedes CLK 350
01 Mercedes C 230
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  #97  
Old 02-12-2013, 02:15 PM
volnedan volnedan is offline
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Location: Metro Detroit
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 37
Mein Auto: Infiniti G37S 6MT
I currently drive a 2012 Infiniti G37 6MT and I would advise against getting one right now. I've had an 08 G35 6MT and a 2010 G37 7AT, which are all pretty much the same car. That's more than just long in the tooth after almost 6 years.

To me, the lack of a 6MT at the 2014 Q50 launch is where I draw the line. I had the auto for about a year and missed having a manual so much I dumped it on swapalease and got into a fantastic deal for my current car.

Infinitis will always fall back on the value, which is usually $10k less than 3-series when similarly equipped. For some, $10k isn't a lot of money and is worth it. To me, it's not. However, with the 320i coming out, I may find myself getting into the BMW family for the first time when my lease ends later this year.
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  #98  
Old 02-12-2013, 02:47 PM
sr5959 sr5959 is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Seattle
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 1,272
Mein Auto: 328i F30
Quote:
Originally Posted by smashhell View Post
OMG you reminded me that the weak paint used to drive me crazy in my old G37.
Every little thing scratches the paint. Even washing the car myself with extreme caution still leaves tons of marks on the car.
And It was white too, can't imagine having a black Infiniti. :/
So glad I don't have to deal with that anymore.
My F30 is AW and I find the paint to be very thin as well.
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