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Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > BMW Model Discussions > 5 Series > E60 (2004 - 2010)

E60 (2004 - 2010)
BMW 5-Series (E60 chassis) was first seen in the Unites States in the fall of 2003 with a 2004 Model Year designation. The E60 is now available as a 528i, 528xi, 535i, 535xi, 550i and a 535xi sports wagon! -- View the E60 Wiki

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  #1  
Old 01-02-2013, 01:39 PM
JoeFromPA JoeFromPA is offline
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Test drove my first 535xit today - wowser & and a trans question

First off, what an amazing all around car. Hefty, solid feeling - truly germanic. Great acceleration at mild and mid throttle positions. Comfy seats, just luxurious and sporty feeling. In addition, it handled itself incredibly well for being a 4100 pound tall vehicle. I couldn't believe the speed I was carrying comfortably on windy back roads....not even pushing it, just cruising comfortably.

Also, ours was up there in miles but the interior and exterior was amazingly held together and it drove like a bank vault.

My wife pretty much loved it for it's sportiness & spaciousness. She's not in love with the price of 08-2010 535xit's (we test drove a 85k mile CPO one at a dealership going for $25k). I'm liking 2010 models for their upgraded iDrive systems, but they are going for $30-40k.

Anyway, one of the things that struck me was how great the automatic transmission was in sport mode. I really didn't mind it at all and, frankly, I'm pretty much a dead-set manual guy.

I will almost certaintly never have an opportunity to test drive a manual 535xit locally, so I have to ask:

Does the manual transmission significantly alter the personality of the car? Does it give much more pronounced acceleration?

If the answer is no by those who have driven both...well...I might finally give up the 3rd pedal in my wife's car.
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  #2  
Old 01-02-2013, 02:03 PM
SoLucky SoLucky is offline
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Mein Auto: '08 535i
For me, manual is a must only in sportscars not big and heavy luxo sport sedans/wagons. I think you'll find that with the torque of the 3.0 twin turbo, a 535 auto will be very enjoyable. And you can always shift it manually if you want. Add a JB+ or JB4 for even more fun.

I drove my buddy's z4 sDrive35i 6spd manual w/ JB+ the other day & that was pure fun. The twin turbo in a small, much lighter package is incredible and with a modest tune even moreso!
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  #3  
Old 01-02-2013, 02:25 PM
JoeFromPA JoeFromPA is offline
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Looks like the 6-speed in these cars is very reliable, including the Throwout Bearing and Clutch on 100k+ 335s at least. how about the auto trans - any problem spots?
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  #4  
Old 01-02-2013, 02:31 PM
JoeFromPA JoeFromPA is offline
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Also, sorry to ask, but can anyone tell me whether or not I can buy a CPO or extended maintenance plan on a car NOT sold to me by BMW (but within the original warranty timeframe)
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  #5  
Old 01-02-2013, 02:32 PM
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Oceans10 Oceans10 is offline
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You gain in acceleration with an auto sport transmission because A) it shifts faster than a manual, and B) turbo boost stays on via the torque converter, so it doesn't have to spool up again while you ease the gas pedal and shift manually. Foot stays planted and the auto does the rest!
This is proven in 1/4 mile track times where the autos are faster.

Add a JB4 and you will never worry about the manual again. The car will have so much torque that it's a breeze to drive. It makes a very big difference. The car feels light, agile and you'll barely ever need to give it full throttle. It just glides around in the mid rev band. With JB4 on Map 5 it's as fast as an E39 M5, but it has much more torque so feels much less strained. You are looking at 380 ft-lbs torque to the wheels or around 450 at the crank. That's similar to an F10 550i.
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  #6  
Old 01-02-2013, 02:37 PM
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Oceans10 Oceans10 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeFromPA View Post
Looks like the 6-speed in these cars is very reliable, including the Throwout Bearing and Clutch on 100k+ 335s at least. how about the auto trans - any problem spots?
When the car hits 5 years and over 70k miles they need a mechatronik valve sleeve replacement. It costs around $15 for the part, but several hundred in labor. Then it's good for another 6-8 years as the new sleeve is an improved design. Otherwise change oil pan and tranny oil at 100k miles, that's it.
It's a phenomenal transmission used in many other high end cars, even the Maserati Quattroporte and VW Phaeton. It's virtually indestructible, save for that valve sleeve glitch I mentioned.
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  #7  
Old 01-02-2013, 03:14 PM
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z0lt3c z0lt3c is offline
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Location: Hunterdon County, NJ
 
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Mein Auto: 08 535xit
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeFromPA View Post
Also, sorry to ask, but can anyone tell me whether or not I can buy a CPO or extended maintenance plan on a car NOT sold to me by BMW (but within the original warranty timeframe)
Yes, there are various third party warranty providers. In particular, I would recommend Route 66, they are usually available through credit unions such as Pentagon Federal. The Route 66 warranty can be added at any mileage, it is not required to still be covered by the factory warranty, and coverage can be extended up to 125K miles, longer then the CPO plan. Coverage maybe more limited for out of warranty or higher mileage plans but still competitive w/ CPO limits. Figure $1500-$2500 so not cheap.

As for extended maintenance, I do not know of anyplace to get a maintenance plan other then BMW, which I believe can only be purchased by the original owner, while under factory warranty, but I maybe mistaken. In some cases the BMW maintenance plan does not comply with aftermarket warranties-- for example the Route 66 plan requires oil changes every 6000 miles while BMW maintenance plan covers them at 10K-15K intervals. I think your better off keeping maintenance out of pocket, you can always use an indy and choose your own parts to keep expenses down compared to the dealer.

BTW- 25K sounds very high with that kind of mileage. Wholesale on that vehicle is probably around 18K assuming it's an 08. Beware of the steep pricing drop-off on these vehicle as mileage gets closer to 100K (this can be a good or bad thing).

Last edited by z0lt3c; 01-02-2013 at 03:16 PM.
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  #8  
Old 01-02-2013, 05:39 PM
JoeFromPA JoeFromPA is offline
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Thanks Gents. I think the steptronic is a true surprise here and opens up alot of possibilities.

I'm looking at 2010 models right now and they seem to mostly fall between 35000-50000 miles, and about $34-40k (indy or BMW dealer) pricing. Pricey, IMHO....trying to decide the best course of action.

However, after driving the 2008 model with 85000 miles on it today, I am tremendously re-assured on how these cars will drive as the miles rack up. Darn thing drove better than my 2001 m5.
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  #9  
Old 01-02-2013, 07:44 PM
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Oceans10 Oceans10 is offline
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My car has 82k miles on it and it would embarass an e39 M5 while passengers are reading mags and sipping umbrella drinks. The E60 is much more refined.
The old M5 is a classic, wonderfully engaging, but technology moves on. It would still eat a stock 535 for breakfast though. No push-over by any means.

Be sure to get a 535i M-sport! That's the ticket.
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  #10  
Old 01-02-2013, 09:20 PM
SoCalBimmerGuy SoCalBimmerGuy is offline
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From my knowledge anyone can buy the extended warranty and or maintenance on a BMW that is still under the 4yr mark or under the 50k mark whichever comes first from a BMW dealership.
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  #11  
Old 01-03-2013, 04:36 AM
JoeFromPA JoeFromPA is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oceans10 View Post
My car has 82k miles on it and it would embarass an e39 M5 while passengers are reading mags and sipping umbrella drinks. The E60 is much more refined.
The old M5 is a classic, wonderfully engaging, but technology moves on. It would still eat a stock 535 for breakfast though. No push-over by any means.

Be sure to get a 535i M-sport! That's the ticket.
Heheh, I don't really care for the 535xit m-sport in terms of the aero kit/exterior changes. And from what I can tell, the interior changes are cosmetic. The one thing I would probably like is a smaller steering wheel, belt I felt the stock 535xit sport steering wheel was befitting of the car.

My mind can be changed, though i know adding the m-sport to the requirements is pushing my luck to find one this decade
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Old 01-03-2013, 04:41 AM
onelovechris onelovechris is offline
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Mein Auto: 2010 535i xdrive
2010 6 speed

Joe, do yourself a favor and definitely drive the 6 speed before you commit to an automatic. If you are interested I have a standard for sale in northeast Pa and would be happy to provide a test drive if you desire. I have several modifications on mine, Remus exhaust, short throw shifter, cold air intake, Cobb acess port, which is producing a conservative 400 HP. I am asking $38,000 but this includes 4 Michelin Pilot Alpine winter tires mounted on 18" BBS wheels. I have posted the car on Auto Trader if you care to see some photos. If you are interested or require additional information please call at 570-401-7765.
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  #13  
Old 01-03-2013, 05:26 AM
tmcd535ixt tmcd535ixt is offline
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Agree completely on the JB4 or some type of tune that really wakes the car up. It's completely addicting to drive. I must say I have always regretting not getting a manual though. About 75k on mine and no transmission issues at all. The only think I don't like is when in non-sport mode, it starts in 2nd (I think) and seems to want to find 3rd too quickly, it's not a big deal as it has more than enough torque to cover it, but it doesn't feel very smooth. There is also a reset feature where you can undo what the trans has learned by your driving habits. I do this every month or so and it seems to be a lot smoother afterwards.
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  #14  
Old 01-03-2013, 06:00 AM
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Oceans10 Oceans10 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmcd535ixt View Post
Agree completely on the JB4 or some type of tune that really wakes the car up. It's completely addicting to drive. I must say I have always regretting not getting a manual though. About 75k on mine and no transmission issues at all. The only think I don't like is when in non-sport mode, it starts in 2nd (I think) and seems to want to find 3rd too quickly, it's not a big deal as it has more than enough torque to cover it, but it doesn't feel very smooth. There is also a reset feature where you can undo what the trans has learned by your driving habits. I do this every month or so and it seems to be a lot smoother afterwards.
Get the new JB4 G5 ISO chip and load the latest firmware, 15C.
This is much smoother shifting and delivers more power to the lower and mid revband. Throttle response is much better as well.
It's a $150 investment and DIY swap.

The big difference is that G5 has 5 times more processing speed and double the memory. It uses that to manage the fuel algorithms, which are derived from a slew of data sources. Instead of mapping to the oem settings it creates its own, which continuously update by the milisecond. For normal driving the car feels more powerful and much better connected to the pedal. That dead feeling before boost dials up is gone. It's as if D is S to give you an idea.
When you install the new G5 board, run the car hard to red line a few times so it auto tunes. Map 5 is best option. It adjusts to octane, temperature, elevation, all sorts of factors to provide smooth power.
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  #15  
Old 01-03-2013, 07:25 AM
JoeFromPA JoeFromPA is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by onelovechris View Post
Joe, do yourself a favor and definitely drive the 6 speed before you commit to an automatic. If you are interested I have a standard for sale in northeast Pa and would be happy to provide a test drive if you desire. I have several modifications on mine, Remus exhaust, short throw shifter, cold air intake, Cobb acess port, which is producing a conservative 400 HP. I am asking $38,000 but this includes 4 Michelin Pilot Alpine winter tires mounted on 18" BBS wheels. I have posted the car on Auto Trader if you care to see some photos. If you are interested or require additional information please call at 570-401-7765.
If you see this, let me know:

1. I have an ex-girlfriend who grew up in Sugarloaf. Small world

2. I don't see your car on autotrader. I searched every 5-series wagon, 2009-2010, within 200 miles and it's not showing up. Ironically, found another manual version though in NJ...not the color combination we would want though.

You are quite a drive and your price is higher than we were looking for, but if the mileage is right, the options are right, and you've got the right warranty/maintenance stuff, it might be worth a serious talk.

I'm thinking you are right about needing to test drive a manual version before making a decision.
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  #16  
Old 01-03-2013, 08:58 AM
Baymar Baymar is offline
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Mein Auto: 535ix Sport Wagon
I have a 2010 xiT and absolutely love it - load it with people/ dogs/ cargo it does it all with grace. I have also added the JB4 and the KW Coilovers and either or both items will change the entire character of the car (for the better). In my opinion, there is nothing out there that has the power/ poise/ luxury and, of course, cargo carrying ability. I have no idea what I would or could get that would make me as happy.

Although I agree with Oceans on the automatic transmission from a performance perspective, I have always loved a clutch and I wish it did have the manual for only that reason. No other compliants.

Before I did the upgrades, I actually got the car on the track (Pocono speedway) last year and had two 20 minute high speed runs on the tri-oval there. Everything stock except the tires/ wheels - it was not embarassed out there : 10 cars in total - 2 Ferraris, 2-Corvettes, 2 new Camaros, 1 new Challenger, 1 AMG SL Mercedes and a '83 Porsche 911 Turbo....and of course my wagon! I was only passed by the Corvettes and the AMG SL - the grocery getter held her own and even managed to have a pass on the Challenger. I am taking it again this summer - albeit with a few modifications discussed earlier. Will be interesting to see how it does with a few more HP and a new suspension. I do put snows on it during the winter and with the XI - it has been absolutely unstoppable in the snow and inclement weather we get here in the NE. Like I said, it does everything.

Good luck with it, you will not regret it...
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