Interesting...320i and GTI lease

Was just messing around to see how cheap I could lease a somewhat "barebones" car that doesn't completely repulse me and isn't slower than sh*t. Came up with a base GTI 4 door/DSG vs a 320i with sport, BMW assist and leather. The 320i has the advantage of being eligible for ED, BMWCCA rebate and BMW loyalty.

Given those discounts, I come up with a pretax lease price of $272 (acq fee down). Assumed $500 over invoice. For the GTI I came up with 310. the GTI has paddle shifters not available on a 320 as well as sat radio. It has a slightly more power and is slightly faster but of course the BMW is RWD and better balanced. THat price diff is enough to pay for a quick ED trip and/or add some goodies to the BMW (premium pkg, chip, etc). Of course, several comparisons I've read have already put the GTI ahead of the F30 in fun to drive but neither of these things are sports cars by any definition.

If my wife could drive stick that would open up some other interesting possiblities like the 128i, Focus ST and FRS/BRZ. Still wouldn't be surprised if the above 2 beat them in cheap leasing. ACtually, I bet I could find some pretty cheap leases on a Cadillac ATS too if I looked. And if BMW ever offers decent lease deals on the upcoming 228i that will be a slam dunk that woudl be hard to turn down.

PRetty incredible huh?

Somone is going to say you cant compare them cause they're in different "classes". The "class" i'm defining here is "daily drivers that i might find acceptable with atleast a level of performance/features/comfort equal to my old 2001 325i". And I know, I know ....you can't possibly compare a BMW to anything else cause its made with magic fairy dust-- just an interesing observation. THough in this case its able to make a case purely on lease price alone!

I would think ED would affect the price and monthly of the 320.

Do not get caught up on that 180hp rating of the 320. It will be underrated just like the 328 and 335. Drive both, its that simple.

Originally Posted by raleedy

I would think ED would affect the price and monthly of the 320.

For sure...the number I quoted assumed ED.

Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen

Do not get caught up on that 180hp rating of the 320. It will be underrated just like the 328 and 335. Drive both, its that simple.

Yep and it can be easily tuned to 328 levels and beyond

If you add options, the math quickly changes. Try it with leather, xenons, premium stereo, moonroof, and navigation. How many people actually buy a completely bare-bones car, particularly when you're in BMW territory?

Originally Posted by bmw325

Yep and it can be easily tuned to 328 levels and beyond

Yep.

But the GTI is a bit underrated with great tuning potential. Loved my APR tune.

Did not enjoy the reliability though. Only reason I dropped the car for the 328.

Originally Posted by iamthewalrus

If you add options, the math quickly changes. Try it with leather, xenons, premium stereo, moonroof, and navigation. How many people actually buy a completely bare-bones car, particularly when you're in BMW territory?

True that would add about 6k to the bmws msrp. Then again, adding all those features to the gti adds about 4-5k as well. Will try out the numbers for more loaded versions later on. But for the lease price there's no harm in getting a bmw without all the bells and whistles. You can go all out and get a loaded 335 for 55k for example.

GTI platform is like 10 years old, wait for the Mk7 next spring.

As the current owner of an F30 and avowed Audi/VW hater (build quality is even worse than BMW), I certainly miss the feel of a light, nimble wagon. If I had to do it over... probably still go F30 but mostly because I desperately missed RWD.

ED creates a pricing distortion, especially on shorter term leases, because of the discount. To compare properly, you have to factor in the cost of your trip.
and the loss of use.

Originally Posted by bmw325

Was just messing around to see how cheap I could lease a somewhat "barebones" car that doesn't completely repulse me and isn't slower than sh*t. Came up with a base GTI 4 door/DSG vs a 320i with sport, BMW assist and leather. The 320i has the advantage of being eligible for ED, BMWCCA rebate and BMW loyalty.

Given those discounts, I come up with a pretax lease price of $272 (acq fee down). Assumed $500 over invoice. For the GTI I came up with 310. the GTI has paddle shifters not available on a 320 as well as sat radio. It has a slightly more power and is slightly faster but of course the BMW is RWD and better balanced. THat price diff is enough to pay for a quick ED trip and/or add some goodies to the BMW (premium pkg, chip, etc). Of course, several comparisons I've read have already put the GTI ahead of the F30 in fun to drive but neither of these things are sports cars by any definition.

If my wife could drive stick that would open up some other interesting possiblities like the 128i, Focus ST and FRS/BRZ. Still wouldn't be surprised if the above 2 beat them in cheap leasing. ACtually, I bet I could find some pretty cheap leases on a Cadillac ATS too if I looked. And if BMW ever offers decent lease deals on the upcoming 228i that will be a slam dunk that woudl be hard to turn down.

PRetty incredible huh?

Somone is going to say you cant compare them cause they're in different "classes". The "class" i'm defining here is "daily drivers that i might find acceptable with atleast a level of performance/features/comfort equal to my old 2001 325i". And I know, I know ....you can't possibly compare a BMW to anything else cause its made with magic fairy dust-- just an interesing observation. THough in this case its able to make a case purely on lease price alone!

Originally Posted by brkf

As the current owner of an F30 and avowed Audi/VW hater (build quality is even worse than BMW), I certainly miss the feel of a light, nimble wagon. If I had to do it over... probably still go F30 but mostly because I desperately missed RWD.

Yeah that's my concern as well. I actially prefer the looks/size/interior of the gti but vw quality scares me. They seem to still have problems with what is now basically a 10 year old platform. A horrific Jetta rental I had a few months ago did nothing to change my mind on that front.

Of course BMW residuals are much higher than nearly any other brands which tilts leases in BMW's favor. The GTI is a terrific car for the money. I'd want the Autobahn version which is closer to $30K but gives you leather, nav, etc. I'm thinking VW may have some great deals soon, as sometime next year the Mark 7 will come here.

Another interesting comparison would be the Ford Focus ST which loaded is less than the VW and is sportier and faster. A bit more of a boy racer car though but the Recaro seats in the ST2 and ST3 versions are awesome.

The BMW Leases are surprisingly low have to admit.. My Coworker felt stupid when he found out his mazda 3 2.5 GT costs the same per month as mine. I paid $500 more down, but still. We both pay ~$450 per month and mine is quicker, better on gas, a lot more comfy

Originally Posted by Robert A

ED creates a pricing distortion, especially on shorter term leases, because of the discount. To compare properly, you have to factor in the cost of your trip.
and the loss of use.

Only if you weren't already planning for/budgeting for a European vacation.

-MrB

Originally Posted by scarboy6693

The BMW Leases are surprisingly low have to admit.. My Coworker felt stupid when he found out his mazda 3 2.5 GT costs the same per month as mine. I paid $500 more down, but still. We both pay ~$450 per month and mine is quicker, better on gas, a lot more comfy

His $450/month is a 0% 60 month finance loan, not a lease. It's not surprising they'd be the same.

Originally Posted by bmw325

Yeah that's my concern as well. I actially prefer the looks/size/interior of the gti but vw quality scares me. They seem to still have problems with what is now basically a 10 year old platform. A horrific Jetta rental I had a few months ago did nothing to change my mind on that front.

If it's the current Jetta, it's not built on the Golf/GTI platform. The US-spec Jetta is a US-only design built in Mexico and sharing little with the current Golf. It's one of my big disappointments with the Jetta, but it appears to be selling well in the US...

If you go to the Autobahn spec and compare that to a 320 (xenons, leather, premium audio, etc.) then the math massively tilts in favor of the GTI. My last three cars (2 BMWs and a Mini) have all had sport suspension, xenons, manual, leather, and premium audio. I really can't see myself driving a car without these basics.

-James
Seattle, WA

Originally Posted by mrbelk

Only if you weren't already planning for/budgeting for a European vacation.

-MrB

And if I were planning a trip to South Carolina, then suddenly a new X3 would make a lot of sense too! Not trying to be rude, but this is a somewhat odd way of looking at the purchase of a car Your point is valid though; if you already plan a driving trip around Europe starting in Munich, then you can omit that cost from the calculations.

Originally Posted by bmw325

Was just messing around to see how cheap I could lease a somewhat "barebones" car that doesn't completely repulse me and isn't slower than sh*t. Came up with a base GTI 4 door/DSG vs a 320i with sport, BMW assist and leather. The 320i has the advantage of being eligible for ED, BMWCCA rebate and BMW loyalty.

Given those discounts, I come up with a pretax lease price of $272 (acq fee down). Assumed $500 over invoice. For the GTI I came up with 310. the GTI has paddle shifters not available on a 320 as well as sat radio. It has a slightly more power and is slightly faster but of course the BMW is RWD and better balanced. THat price diff is enough to pay for a quick ED trip and/or add some goodies to the BMW (premium pkg, chip, etc). Of course, several comparisons I've read have already put the GTI ahead of the F30 in fun to drive but neither of these things are sports cars by any definition.

If my wife could drive stick that would open up some other interesting possiblities like the 128i, Focus ST and FRS/BRZ. Still wouldn't be surprised if the above 2 beat them in cheap leasing. ACtually, I bet I could find some pretty cheap leases on a Cadillac ATS too if I looked. And if BMW ever offers decent lease deals on the upcoming 228i that will be a slam dunk that woudl be hard to turn down.

PRetty incredible huh?

Somone is going to say you cant compare them cause they're in different "classes". The "class" i'm defining here is "daily drivers that i might find acceptable with atleast a level of performance/features/comfort equal to my old 2001 325i". And I know, I know ....you can't possibly compare a BMW to anything else cause its made with magic fairy dust-- just an interesing observation. THough in this case its able to make a case purely on lease price alone!

If I was in your position I would get the 128i hands down. The GTI is nice but it is an old platform. While the 2.0TSI is a blast to drive, it also gave me a lot of problems. From the cars you listed, the 128i is by far the best drivers car. Check this out and give it a shot:

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=724228

http://www.motivemag.com/pub/feature...agen_R32.shtml

I read a review of the new 2014 GTI in CAR Magazine, I would not get the old one now, the new one is a big improvement in power, mpg, even steering feel.

Legends-
Yes I've read those reviews in the past. Thanks for reminding me. The main issue with the 128 is that I'd have to get the auto which isn't so great in that car (wife's rules) would love one with a stick though

Sounds like a really nice car. What troubles me is that the Mark 7 will have been around for almost two years by the time it arrives on this continent. Same goes for the new A3. In contrast, BMW brings cars to the US at almost the same time as they do in Europe.

Originally Posted by Chris90

I read a review of the new 2014 GTI in CAR Magazine, I would not get the old one now, the new one is a big improvement in power, mpg, even steering feel.

Originally Posted by bmw325

Legends-
Yes I've read those reviews in the past. Thanks for reminding me. The main issue with the 128 is that I'd have to get the auto which isn't so great in that car (wife's rules) would love one with a stick though

Well in this case the DSG would be your best bet but I don't think the GM auto in the 128 is that bad. IMO it shifts as quick if not quicker than the 6 speed ZF in the E90 335 but it is a little rough and gets caught out of gear at times. I think it is the software rather than the transmission. The AA tune solves most of the issues caused by the throttle delay and while it doesn't change the transmission tuning directly, it does affect it in a positive way. Personally I don't like any auto transmissions whether it is a DCT /DSG or a conventional one.

To the original poster, please post the following for your lease deals

Msrp and cap cost
Cap reduction
Leasing fees like security deposit, acq fees etc
Lease term and mileage
Residual

As others note, you are of course giving the BMW a $3,000 or more advantage by not including the cost of your trip

Yet you are shopping based solely on price of a stripped car. Fact is you can't get pricing like that on the BMW without spending thousands on a trip and this must be included in your calculations

BMW with no options, ie undersized wheels etc is really not that exciting

Are both leases 12/15k miles per year?

Originally Posted by Chris90

I read a review of the new 2014 GTI in CAR Magazine, I would not get the old one now, the new one is a big improvement in power, mpg, even steering feel.

I wish it were available in 2013. The lease on my 328 is up later this year and a 2014 GTI would be a great replacement if I can't budget for an F30 328. Unfortunately it's at least a year away.