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F30 / F31 / F32 / F33 (2012 - current)
The sixth generation 3 series, chassis code F30. 2013 model year 328i and 335i sedans now in production. Read the F30 frequently asked question thread for all your basic question and dive into all the details in the ultimate F30 information thread.

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  #76  
Old 01-14-2013, 01:51 PM
Jamesonsviggen Jamesonsviggen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beden1 View Post
You had corrected me earlier, but we used to refer to Mercedes vinyl as Text. Regardless of what is was or is called, it wore very well.
Yep, that's the appeal for me.

My VW CC had V-tex, much more convincing than the BMW leatherette, wear was nill at nearly 60k. BMW's feels as though it would last 3x longer than anything else on the car lol.
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  #77  
Old 01-14-2013, 01:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen View Post
Yep, that's the appeal for me.

My VW CC had V-tex, much more convincing than the BMW leatherette, wear was nill at nearly 60k. BMW's feels as though it would last 3x longer than anything else on the car lol.
Not to split hairs or anything, but here is an ad that I pulled off of the internet. This owner also refers to the "Text" interior.

"MERCEDES-BENZ 350SL 1979. Yellow with black hard and soft-tops, black mb text and check interior including rear seats. Two families from new. 41,800 miles only from new with service history. Absolutely fabulous condition. A cherished motorcar.

He probably also got the real name wrong, but we had that 300D for 8+ years and got to know the car very well.
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  #78  
Old 01-14-2013, 01:58 PM
Jamesonsviggen Jamesonsviggen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beden1 View Post
Not to split hairs or anything, but here is an ad that I pulled off of the internet. This owner also refers to the "Text" interior.

"MERCEDES-BENZ 350SL 1979. Yellow with black hard and soft-tops, black mb text and check interior including rear seats. Two families from new. 41,800 miles only from new with service history. Absolutely fabulous condition. A cherished motorcar.

He probably also got the real name wrong, but we had that 300D for 8+ years and got to know the car very well.
Yeah, not the same as MBTex, notice the spelling, this is a TM.

It is also decades later, it is a different grade and surely from a different supplier.

Granted, MBTex is a shortened name for what may have previously known as MB Text.
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  #79  
Old 01-14-2013, 02:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vector Pilot View Post
Hope this delivers outstanding gas milage because by the time you select a couple packages and two or three options you're looking the price of a 328i
That's exactly the point, and I don't think the buyer cares that much about the gas mileage either.

You have a lot of people out there who want to get into a BMW, and right now the cost of entry is near $40,000 or $375 a month. And that's for a car that is completely stripped, maybe has one option on it and that's it.

Instead of a very fast twin turbo powerplant making 240 horses, they trade that off for a more sedate powerplant and can add both the premium package and the technology package for the same money. Essentially, the 328i stripper becomes a 320i decently equipped for the same money.

BJ
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  #80  
Old 01-14-2013, 02:06 PM
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Anyone puzzled how a new model fits in the lineup should consider that BMW has always offered choices with considerable pricing overlap, depending on option choices (and no doubt for exactly that reason, making power output just another option). This is the 3 Series sedan lineup in Germany:
316i
320i
320i EfficientDynamics Edition
320i xDrive
328i
328i xDrive
335i
335i xDrive

316d
318d
320d
320d EfficientDynamics Edition
320d xDrive
330d
Exluding the new introduction, we get only the variants in bold. There's plenty of room for expansion.
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  #81  
Old 01-14-2013, 02:06 PM
Jamesonsviggen Jamesonsviggen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post

Instead of a very fast twin turbo powerplant making 240 horses, they trade that off for a more sedate powerplant and can add both the premium package and the technology package for the same money.
BJ
Careful BJ, the N55 and N20 are TWINPOWER turbos, BMW marketing for twin-scroll turbos-but are in fact singular turbos.

The N54 was an actual twin turbo setup.
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  #82  
Old 01-14-2013, 02:09 PM
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boltjaM3s boltjaM3s is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dtc100 View Post
I think 320i is here to pull that 48 average age down. Most younger buyers into job market not too long ago cannot afford the payment on a $40k+ 3 series, BMW does not want to lose out to the competitions in that demographic of 20 to 30 year-olds.

The 320i looks no different than the 328i or 335i. Very soon BJ you need to increase the size of your L328i badge, or risk being laughed at by new college grads.
It's always been that way, nothing is really going to change except there will be more people stepping down from the 328i and newer young people enjoying the BMW brand for the first time.

And just like 335i owners look down upon 328i owners, we 328i folk now have a new group of people to pick on.

Mr. and Mrs. Camry know one thing: a new BMW versus an old BMW. So the more the merrier I say, so long as there are boatloads of E90‘s out there my status is safe. Keep yours in good shape, ya hear?

I'm surprised you're even posting today. Ironic isn't it? On the very day that the Cadillac ATS is proclaimed North American Car of the Year, BMW launches a vehicle that will destroy it before it ever gets off the ground.

BJ
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  #83  
Old 01-14-2013, 02:17 PM
Jamesonsviggen Jamesonsviggen is offline
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Back in the E36 days, not only was there 318i/318is(the equivalent of our 328 now) but there was the 318ti which had even cheaper interior materials, the older trailing arm rear suspension of the E30 and a HATCHBACK to lower the price. In the rest of the world, this continued as there was E46 generations in other countries. I saw one in person last year in China where I took this pic:

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  #84  
Old 01-14-2013, 02:26 PM
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Blax Blax is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeichen311 View Post
Anyone puzzled how a new model fits in the lineup should consider that BMW has always offered choices with considerable pricing overlap, depending on option choices (and no doubt for exactly that reason, making power output just another option). This is the 3 Series sedan lineup in Germany:
316i
320i
320i EfficientDynamics Edition
320i xDrive
328i
328i xDrive
335i
335i xDrive

316d
318d
320d
320d EfficientDynamics Edition
320d xDrive
330d
Exluding the new introduction, we get only the variants in bold. There's plenty of room for expansion.
Quite right. I'm surprised it took over three pages of comments for someone to point this out.

My dad chose a 320i in Australia recently over a 316i or 318d. Of course in countries outside the US these cars cost a LOT more (as does the gas), so folks tend towards the smaller engines. If I remember, the 328i starts at $65k in Australia (a much lower price than the e90). Maybe the Aussies on the forums can keep me honest here...
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  #85  
Old 01-14-2013, 02:35 PM
wmcilwain wmcilwain is offline
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BMW 320i to be Released in the US

This took me by surprise:

http://www.bmwusa.com/detroitautoshow/?s_kwcid

I hadn't read anywhere that BMW were planning to release the 320i in the US. It looks to have a detuned version of the 2.0 tubo in the 328i.
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  #86  
Old 01-14-2013, 02:47 PM
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boltjaM3s boltjaM3s is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen View Post
Careful BJ, the N55 and N20 are TWINPOWER turbos, BMW marketing for twin-scroll turbos-but are in fact singular turbos.

The N54 was an actual twin turbo setup.
Same thing. It's got the word "twin" in it.

BJ
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  #87  
Old 01-14-2013, 02:48 PM
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krash krash is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeichen311 View Post
Anyone puzzled how a new model fits in the lineup should consider that BMW has always offered choices with considerable pricing overlap, depending on option choices (and no doubt for exactly that reason, making power output just another option). This is the 3 Series sedan lineup in Germany:
316i
320i
320i EfficientDynamics Edition
320i xDrive
328i
328i xDrive
335i
335i xDrive

316d
318d
320d
320d EfficientDynamics Edition
320d xDrive
330d
Exluding the new introduction, we get only the variants in bold. There's plenty of room for expansion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blax View Post
Quite right. I'm surprised it took over three pages of comments for someone to point this out.

My dad chose a 320i in Australia recently over a 316i or 318d. Of course in countries outside the US these cars cost a LOT more (as does the gas), so folks tend towards the smaller engines. If I remember, the 328i starts at $65k in Australia (a much lower price than the e90). Maybe the Aussies on the forums can keep me honest here...
When they originally announced the F30, didn't they say the 320i may hit our shores? I vaguely recall something like that, but not 100% sure...
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  #88  
Old 01-14-2013, 02:52 PM
BMW220i BMW220i is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Vida_ View Post
So besides the C250, what would be competing with the 320i? Higher end Accords maybe?
With this $33k BMW 3 series, it will put pressure on the $32k Acura TSX. The TSX has to either improve or lower the price. It will also put pressure on the Audi A4, which used to be only a bit cheaper but now is more expensive than the 320i.
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  #89  
Old 01-14-2013, 02:55 PM
Jamesonsviggen Jamesonsviggen is offline
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With this $33k BMW 3 series, it will put pressure on the $32k Acura TSX. The TSX has to either improve or lower the price. It will also put pressure on the Audi A4, which used to be only a bit cheaper but now is more expensive than the 320i.
I also feel like good luck finding one of those A4 FWDs on a dealer lot. There is less money to be made on such a car. Sure, you can order one lol. Audi spends too much time drilling Quattro into your brain to get people excited about a FWD A4.
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  #90  
Old 01-14-2013, 03:03 PM
jfox335i jfox335i is offline
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Don't care about the 320, but if they decide to bring the M135i hatchback to our shores, that'll be a sweet DD.
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  #91  
Old 01-14-2013, 03:12 PM
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I think it's nice to have a cheaper 3-series. It's not hard to load up a 328i to $50K. Which puts it out of the league price-wise with Acuras, etc. Which is where a 3-series still needs to compete.

Now, you'll be able to get a very well equipped F30:

320i @ $40K
328i @ $50K
335i/AH3 @ $60K

Last edited by SamS; 01-14-2013 at 03:13 PM.
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  #92  
Old 01-14-2013, 03:14 PM
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tturedraider tturedraider is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
That's exactly the point, and I don't think the buyer cares that much about the gas mileage either.

You have a lot of people out there who want to get into a BMW, and right now the cost of entry is near $40,000 or $375 a month. And that's for a car that is completely stripped, maybe has one option on it and that's it.

Instead of a very fast twin turbo powerplant making 240 horses, they trade that off for a more sedate powerplant and can add both the premium package and the technology package for the same money. Essentially, the 328i stripper becomes a 320i decently equipped for the same money.

BJ
Looks like the 320 will not offer the Tech package. Guess that will help keep up 328 status.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen View Post
I also feel like good luck finding one of those A4 FWDs on a dealer lot. There is less money to be made on such a car. Sure, you can order one lol. Audi spends too much time drilling Quattro into your brain to get people excited about a FWD A4.
You might be surprised how many fwd A4s and even A6s I see around Chicagoland.
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  #93  
Old 01-14-2013, 03:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
It's $4,000 cheaper.

That buys BMW many more customers who couldn't afford the base 328i and/or allows someone who really wanted a 328i with a lot of option packages to step down in engine class and accomplish that goal. Instead of taking a 328i and feeling forced to put no Line on the car or skip something like the technology package, now you can just cut the horsepower and keep all the goodies.

BJ
It's all about growing the market and expanding product lines to accomplish this is a growth strategy.
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  #94  
Old 01-14-2013, 03:19 PM
Jamesonsviggen Jamesonsviggen is offline
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Originally Posted by tturedraider View Post
Looks like the 320 will not offer the Tech package. Guess that will help keep up 328 status.



You might be surprised how many fwd A4s and even A6s I see around Chicagoland.
Yeah, but what are dealers STOCKING.

Big player here, Paul Miller Audi, 39 A4's on the site, ALL Quattro, lowest MSRP $36k and change.
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  #95  
Old 01-14-2013, 03:22 PM
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SamS SamS is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tturedraider View Post
Looks like the 320 will not offer the Tech package. Guess that will help keep up 328 status.
For the 320i, you can still order Nav and BMW Apps. Just no HUD and extended panel.
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  #96  
Old 01-14-2013, 03:31 PM
JoeFromPA JoeFromPA is offline
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What's funny is that, from an options perspective, that $32k Acura TSX is a far more impressive car to step into.

I'm curious how much more down market they are going to move the 3-series. Part of the "pay for the badge" appeal has always been, in the U.S., the exclusivity.

This has been eroded substantially in recent years by lease deals and can be witnessed by the huge relative expansion of BMW ownership in the U.S.

Now they are knocking another ~12.5% off the entry-level cost and probably another $50 off/month on the lease deals.

Wonder how this is going to impact the long-term perception of BMW.
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  #97  
Old 01-14-2013, 03:37 PM
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Originally Posted by JoeFromPA View Post
What's funny is that, from an options perspective, that $32k Acura TSX is a far more impressive car to step into.
But not to drive.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeFromPA View Post
I'm curious how much more down market they are going to move the 3-series. Part of the "pay for the badge" appeal has always been, in the U.S., the exclusivity.

This has been eroded substantially in recent years by lease deals and can be witnessed by the huge relative expansion of BMW ownership in the U.S.

Now they are knocking another ~12.5% off the entry-level cost and probably another $50 off/month on the lease deals.

Wonder how this is going to impact the long-term perception of BMW.
So you have no problem with the entry level BMW creeping up to $50K, with just the standard array of options that a $31K Accord buyer gets?
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  #98  
Old 01-14-2013, 03:39 PM
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boltjaM3s boltjaM3s is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tturedraider View Post

Looks like the 320 will not offer the Tech package. Guess that will help keep up 328 status.


Nor the Luxury line.

I'm very safe. An elite 3 Series if there ever was one.

BJ
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  #99  
Old 01-14-2013, 03:40 PM
Jamesonsviggen Jamesonsviggen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeFromPA View Post
What's funny is that, from an options perspective, that $32k Acura TSX is a far more impressive car to step into.

I'm curious how much more down market they are going to move the 3-series. Part of the "pay for the badge" appeal has always been, in the U.S., the exclusivity.

This has been eroded substantially in recent years by lease deals and can be witnessed by the huge relative expansion of BMW ownership in the U.S.

Now they are knocking another ~12.5% off the entry-level cost and probably another $50 off/month on the lease deals.

Wonder how this is going to impact the long-term perception of BMW.
A TSX is just marketing for NA. Our Accord got too big so they just started sending us the Euro Accord. Pass.

In the recent comparo the 328 came on top and was faster than the 280hp TSX V6. The 320 might do better against the 2.4 than you think.

I would not worry about BMW perception due to the 320. As noted above, there have been some pretty low end iterations of BMWs in the E36/E46 generations as well.
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Last edited by Jamesonsviggen; 01-14-2013 at 03:43 PM.
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  #100  
Old 01-14-2013, 03:45 PM
sqa4life sqa4life is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Technic View Post
At $38,000 base, a 328i is no longer "low" end.

Therefore, a 320i at $33,000. That puts it right where the "new" meat is. Consider this: A BMW 3-Series cheaper than an Honda Accord (V6, though).

And by the way, I would bet that the 180hp are at the wheels. This is like a 210hp/220lbs-ft engine.
face the reality!

2013 honda accord EX-L V6 is loaded and has more features than the base 328i and invoice on the Accord EX-L V6 is only $28292. Plus it has almost 280HP. Beat the hell out of the base 328i.
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