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  #1  
Old 09-23-2009, 04:17 PM
abelhands abelhands is offline
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Anyone think a (new) BMW could go a half million miles?

I am wanting to finally reach this goal. I drive over 50,000 miles a year, sometimes more. I am considering a 2009 328i coupe with manual. No xdrive, no navigation, as simple as I can find it.

Just trying to see what others think? Do you think with proper care and maintence it could happen? Or do you think I am barking up the wrong tree with a BMW?

Do you think a coupe is a better choice than the sedan? Or is that just a style thing?

Can you think of any new, lux car, sport sedan, or just nice auto that could have a shot? Any ideas or thoughts welcome! Please don't write anything worthless. Don't waste everyone's time.

Thanks.
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  #2  
Old 09-23-2009, 04:30 PM
d geek d geek is online now
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a diesel should be capable of that
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  #3  
Old 09-23-2009, 04:49 PM
abelhands abelhands is offline
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not sure how i feel about diesel. i still remember the old days when they stunk to high heaven and wouldn't start in the winter. right now i live in manhattan, but i will be moving back to minneapolis. plus, i don't really want the 335d. too expensive! if they made a 328d or something similar without the turbo, i might consider it. depending on cost.
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  #4  
Old 09-23-2009, 04:51 PM
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No car can run 500k miles without significant costs incurred to replace parts. The market doesn't demand a car that lasts that long (certainly not in North America) and given the huge role that electronics play, it's even more unlikely that a car can run without problems for even half that mileage goal.

Sure, a BMW can run 500k with good maintenance. But at a certain point, the cumulative money that you've spent replacing parts will be more than the cost of a new car.
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Old 09-23-2009, 05:15 PM
d geek d geek is online now
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abelhands- check into the audi or vw tdi if the 335d is too much. I'll wager that you can load either car to the gills and not pay much more than a stripped 328i. for the miles you drive in a year, the fuel operating savings would be great with a diesel.

in spite of the extras in todays cars, they can be operated for 500K miles without much more than scheduled maintenance. Many folks are getting close to this mileage now with the circa 2000 model tdi.
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Old 09-23-2009, 05:18 PM
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I think that is completely doable in a milder climate.
Not sure about attempting this in the NE without significant dedication and cash reserves.

Like another poster mentioned, once the electric gremlins start popping up, everything is trial and error - these aren't 60's VWs that a student with basic electrical knowledge can troubleshoot or completely re-wire on a weekend. A modern BMW has miles of copper.

On the flipside, lots of BMW bikes have done 500,000 in 10 or less years with only owner wrenching.
Just depends how deep you want to play or how much you want to pay...
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Last edited by mullman; 09-23-2009 at 05:21 PM.
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  #7  
Old 09-23-2009, 07:40 PM
machtnichts machtnichts is offline
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How many miles are on your 525i and what has your experience been? The engine of a 328i could probably go 500k but I worry about all the sensors and electrical stuff. My non scientific opinion is that your 50k miles/year will give you a better chance for 500k, doing it over ten years rather than 30-40.
A friend of mine got a fairly crappy Saturn wagon to go almost 300k before the frame rusted out, so many things are possible.
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Old 09-23-2009, 09:40 PM
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there is a member who owns a 528 e39 that has a little over 300k on it. still runs strong.
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  #9  
Old 09-23-2009, 09:50 PM
DHC8 DHC8 is offline
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There are two things that hurt electrical systems; corrosion and wire damage. Regular use helps a great deal with corrosion, as does the use of quality connectors. With regard to wire damage, I am moderately impressed with the design and assembly work on our E90. That is not to say that motors, switches and components won't fail over time, but the idea of some mysterious electrical gremlins eating away at the car is, in my opinion, exaggerated. We are not talking about an MGB. A better example would be that 20 year old 737 at the airport, which has 17 miles of wiring and flies reliably day in and day out.

I see no reason that an E90 would not have good odds of running over 500k over 10 years. All it takes is good preventative maintenance, a good shop and a maintenance re$erve.

Last edited by DHC8; 09-23-2009 at 10:40 PM. Reason: typo
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  #10  
Old 09-23-2009, 10:54 PM
Solid_c Solid_c is offline
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In Germany and Lebananon it's not uncommon to see a Benz or a BMW with well over 300k miles. Those cars are well belt and the engines will last 300k miles easily. I believe it's north American marketing that makes you think anything with 6 digit mileage is no good.

Preventive maintenance and anti corision measures will do the trick.
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  #11  
Old 09-23-2009, 11:00 PM
Solid_c Solid_c is offline
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Where do you think all of are old cars disapear? Scrap yard? Yeah right.
They get schipped out to 3rld world countries, where cars hold there value MUCH better and than here. And they get driven to anywhere between 300 to 700k miles. Before getting de-assembled for parts on less old cars.

Your talking about German engineering at it's best. The car will last for as long as you wanted to. The question is are you a spoiled north American like the rest of us and wl want a new car after 3 years.
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  #12  
Old 09-24-2009, 01:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AzNMpower32 View Post

Sure, a BMW can run 500k with good maintenance. But at a certain point, the cumulative money that you've spent replacing parts will be more than the cost of a new car.
+1

I ran my 1990 535i to just over 250,000 before selling it.

The motor will be good for 250k to 300k. At 50k/year that is 5 or 6 years. When you replace the motor be sure to replace ALL the plastic parts in the cooling system along with hoses.

Not sure how long the interior will last. They don't make them like they used to. Might still be serviceable at 10 years / 500,000 miles. Partly depends on how hard you are on a car and what you are willing to put up with. Anything can be fixed of course. We bought new door panels for our 318ti.

BMW is better than most manufactures about stocking parts for older cars. But be prepared to pay for them.
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Last edited by Andrew*Debbie; 09-24-2009 at 01:37 AM.
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  #13  
Old 09-24-2009, 05:00 AM
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They don't make them like they used to. Might still be serviceable at 10 years / 500,000 miles.
This is the main point.
Sure we have all seen 25-30+ year old Mercedes in third world countries, but historically, the engineering of Mercedes, especially the S-Class, usually occurred without regard to cost, a practice which continued through the W140 line.
A late 80's S500 was $90K and was IMHO one of the last great S class cars.

Any MB/BMW built since the late 80s, or early 90s, has been engineered to a size (3er/5er/7er or A, B, C, E, S klasse) & price point (say $30K, 50K, 80K) and many compromises made.
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  #14  
Old 09-28-2009, 07:16 PM
2004BMW325Ci 2004BMW325Ci is offline
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Well I have a friend who has an 2000 323Ci that he bought brand new back in 1999 with 302k on the clock right now. This was the first new car he ever owned so he is a bit, shall we say, attached to it. He has a fear of flying so anytime he has to go somewhere for business or vacation, in the bimmer he goes. And get this... all the servicing has been done at the dealership. He has a 3-inch binder full of records and just from flipping through it a couple times I know he's spent at least 10 grand on maintenance. Probably the only thing that's original in the engine is the block. The real kicker is that it drives better than my '04 which only has 60k. He is an eccentric cat to say the least, but my point is that if you are as anal retentive about servicing and maintenance as he is then you're E9x will have no problem reaching 500k.
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Old 09-28-2009, 07:48 PM
02325xi 02325xi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abelhands View Post
I am wanting to finally reach this goal. I drive over 50,000 miles a year, sometimes more. I am considering a 2009 328i coupe with manual. No xdrive, no navigation, as simple as I can find it.

Just trying to see what others think? Do you think with proper care and maintence it could happen? Or do you think I am barking up the wrong tree with a BMW?

Do you think a coupe is a better choice than the sedan? Or is that just a style thing?

Can you think of any new, lux car, sport sedan, or just nice auto that could have a shot? Any ideas or thoughts welcome! Please don't write anything worthless. Don't waste everyone's time.

Thanks.
I'm assuming "as simple as I can find it" includes leatherette? I shudder to think what a real leather driver's seat will look like after 500k miles.

I've been in a handful of car service / black cars with high miles (Mostly Lincoln Town Cars). The ones in the 250k-300k mile ranges all tended to feel similar to the 100k-150k mile cars-- well maintained by their drivers. Surprisingly, many of those owners told me that they were on their 1st transmissions (albeit, much simpler than BMW automatics). The few that I have ridden in that were in the 400k+ mile range felt much more ragged. Granted, these are cars that spend many hours idling and doing short city hops, but they are also very simple machines relative to the E90 generation BMWs.

I think that even with generally proven hardware such as the Ford/Lincoln large RWD platform, there is an upper limit on miles, and 500k feels very ambitious for a gas engine.
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  #16  
Old 09-28-2009, 07:53 PM
gfd1989 gfd1989 is offline
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maybe a toyota or lexus could do it.
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  #17  
Old 09-28-2009, 11:07 PM
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maybe a toyota or lexus could do it.
A Toyota interior would be in shreds after 300,000 miles. Lexus would fair better but then you are driving a Toyota with a nice interior and not a BMW.
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  #18  
Old 09-29-2009, 03:20 AM
jkp1187 jkp1187 is offline
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Originally Posted by AzNMpower32 View Post
No car can run 500k miles without significant costs incurred to replace parts. The market doesn't demand a car that lasts that long (certainly not in North America) and given the huge role that electronics play, it's even more unlikely that a car can run without problems for even half that mileage goal.

Sure, a BMW can run 500k with good maintenance. But at a certain point, the cumulative money that you've spent replacing parts will be more than the cost of a new car.
Counterpoint: financially, it makes more sense to keep your money in your hands, giving you a return on your investment for you for as long as possible. Cars are an expense, not an investment, so if you're resigned to spending $40,000 on a car anyway, far better to dole it out over the next few years maintaining an existing vehicle instead of incurring a large liability tomorrow.

Of course, time lost due to breakdowns or maintenance should be factored in, too (especially if one has a job that is dependent on being on time all the time.) But I think the typical American reaction - to recoil in horror at a $5,000 repair because "it's more than the car is worth," then immediately go incur a $30,000 liability for a brand-new car - is not necessarily a sensible one, financially.
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Old 09-29-2009, 05:43 AM
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But I think the typical American reaction - to recoil in horror at a $5,000 repair because "it's more than the car is worth," then immediately go incur a $30,000 liability for a brand-new car - is not necessarily a sensible one, financially.
Yeah. At 50,000 a year fuel costs add up too. Would cost less to buy a used Jetta TDI, drive it into the ground and repeat. Another option would be to repair and refurbish his e34. Design life on the e34 is 300,000 but they will keep going if you want to put the money into them.


One high mileage 1989 535i + One Lap of America -->

http://redfivemotorsport.com/index.html

http://www.turbochargingdynamics.com...c.php?f=4&t=53
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Last edited by Andrew*Debbie; 09-29-2009 at 05:54 AM.
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  #20  
Old 09-29-2009, 05:52 AM
Patrick Patrick is offline
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a diesel should be capable of that
Yep.

I have been in an E39 530d taxi that had +375,000 KILOMETERS on the clock. And it was less than 3 years old.

According to the driver, regular maintenance was all that was required - and lots of new tires each year.
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  #21  
Old 10-01-2009, 04:17 AM
pony_trekker pony_trekker is offline
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It's possible but depends on the luck of the draw.

Guy I know has an 03 E39 530 with about 225k miles on the clock that hasn't done anything but regular maintenance. The car looks like it rolled out of the showroom.

OTOH, plenty of Honda drivers talk about mega high mileage.

http://automobiles.honda.com/mile-makers/

Here's one example:

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Old 10-01-2009, 09:22 PM
2004BMW325Ci 2004BMW325Ci is offline
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Originally Posted by pony_trekker View Post
It's possible but depends on the luck of the draw.

Guy I know has an 03 E39 530 with about 225k miles on the clock that hasn't done anything but regular maintenance. The car looks like it rolled out of the showroom.

OTOH, plenty of Honda drivers talk about mega high mileage.

http://automobiles.honda.com/mile-makers/

Here's one example:

That's not nearly as impressive given the car is a hybrid. What's really impressive is that the guy put 800,000 miles on a 2003 model car. He must drive 14 hours a day. That or it is some kind of fleet vehicle.

If it were a conventional engine, I'd be very impressed but with a hybrid not so much!
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Old 10-02-2009, 01:27 AM
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If it were a conventional engine, I'd be very impressed but with a hybrid not so much!
Really? On the Hondas the internal combustion motor is running whenever the car is moving. And there is all the added complexity from the IMA. I wonder how many repairs that car has seen. How many transmission rebuilds?

2003 and earlier Civic Hybrids had transmission troubles. Quite a few of them failed well under 100,000 miles. The current CVT might be much better


800,000 is high even for a passenger car diesel although it is possible.
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Last edited by Andrew*Debbie; 10-02-2009 at 03:56 AM.
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  #24  
Old 10-02-2009, 06:55 AM
JimD1 JimD1 is offline
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I replaced my garage door after the compression of a high mileage, but nowhere near 500,000 mile, honda motor was insufficient to keep it from rolling in my driveway. I don't know the miles exactly but I'm confident they were under 300,000, probably not over 200,000. Hondas are well engineered but susceptible to wear just like all other engines.

I don't think any motor, diesel or gas, will go 500,000 without a rebuild. Diesel would probably go further. To make 500,000 you're probably looking at 2 rebuilds of a gas motor and 1 of a diesel. For the gas, I'm saying you would need to replace valves twice and probably seats once, bore for over sized pistons twice, and replace every bearing that can be replaced both times. Probably need at least one new camshaft. I'm not sure what the diesel would need but I suspect at least one over bore would be required.

Transmission might make 500,000 but would make noticably more noise. Same with rear end. Safer and better to plan on new bearings for each at least once.

My 128i has the N52 engine with the silicon aluminum cylinders. I read up on them prior to purchase but I don't know what to think. They've been used for awhile but that or the aluminum/magnesium block could be a longevity asset or liability. I like proven things so I tend to look at the new block technology as a liability. If that is true, you would need to source a different engine somewhere along the way. That may not grossly change the cost of a rebuild, however. Buying a rebuilt short or long block can be cheaper than rebuilding what you have.

Electronics seem to be a gamble. If they do not fail within the first few months, they typically last a long time. But not necessarily 10 years. Mileage shouldn't really matter, however. Maybe a little more vibration on them but I would be less worried about this than just wear on the moving components.

So if you are asking if you can go 500K with nothing but normal maintenance I would say definitely not. If you are asking if you are willing to spend several thousand dollars on the vehicle once or twice along the way will it do it, I would say I think it would. I also think most cars would and so far I've been impressed that BMWs are better engineered than most cars.

I will also agree with you on the 3 series diesel. I think it is comparable to the 335 in power (more torque, less hp = comparable to me) not the 328. I would prefer less power, lower price, and better mileage.

Jim
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  #25  
Old 10-05-2009, 04:04 PM
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If you plan on doing 500k miles, then a new bmw isn't for you. Get a diesel 4cyl vw like others said. or a Honda. I'm a firm believer in BMW build and reliability. But 500k trouble-free miles is asking for a bit much. You'll need to do a tranny or two, few guibos, 10 brake changes, 100 oil changes, 10 tranny flushes, possibly some vanos repairs, sensors, couple of suspension rebuilds (actually probably more). These cars just aren't for that. Plan first, drive later. Not the other way around
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