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E39 (1997 - 2003)
The BMW 5-Series (E39 chassis) was introduced in the United States as a 1997 model year car and lasted until the 2004 when the E60 chassis was released. The United States saw several variations including the 525i, 528i, 530i and 540i. -- View the E39 Wiki

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  #51  
Old 03-01-2013, 11:44 AM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 540iman View Post
My father died when I was almost 9
I'm very sorry about that. You're a good man, and he would be proud of you now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 540iman View Post
I thought you had two FSUs that are bad and did not want to buy a third until you knew #2 was definitely bad.
What drives me more than fixing the bimmer (which is as simple as buying a new FSU) is HELPING OTHERS diagnose and fix theirs.

And, the KEY to helping others is putting the pieces together (as you did with the ABS control module diagnostic tree) to determine how to tell WHAT went wrong (inside the FSU).

Quote:
Originally Posted by 540iman View Post
I am replacing the guibo; Want to know from someone who has done this job themselves.
Unfortunately I have not so I can only refer to the threads. Sorry. But there are folks in the threads who have done it, so they'd know best.

- How a worn drive shaft, flex disc, center bearing, or "giunti Boschi", aka giubo, can cause the vehicle to vibrate (1) (2) (3) (4) & how to repair the rear driveshaft seal by the differential (1) & how to repair the inner constant velocity (CV) half-drive shaft (1) & how to replace motor mounts (aka engine mounts) and transmission mounts (aka holders) on the BMW E39 I6 (0) (1) (2) (3) (4) & for the E39 V8 (1) (2) (3).
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  #52  
Old 03-01-2013, 12:35 PM
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540iman 540iman is offline
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Thank you for the kind words Blue. I just want to understand which FSU you are going to reinstall and what it was doing wrong when you last removed it? Do both of your FSUs have the same failure mode? I.E. they acted the exact same way when they failed? Did the blower go to high speed, stop running, or work with huge battery drain? Just trying to understand. The one I would fear the most would be the one that still controls the fan speed, but never goes to sleep or goes to a place where it only draws excess current occasionally. I'm not sure I have my understanding correct. Did you put them side by side on the desk and test the resistance point to point of each one and see any significant difference?
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  #53  
Old 03-02-2013, 01:43 PM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 540iman View Post
Do both of your FSUs have the same failure mode?
Nope.
The original GKR / Siemens / BMW all-aluminum FSU failed on 1/26/2009 as per this thread:
- How to diagnose what's wrong with a battery that goes dead once a month?

There were no initial symptoms except for a repeated dead battery overnight (battery & alt were fine). Three days later, I had learned to listen for the fan motor with the key removed, so I had bought a new (acm) FSU.

On 2/2/2009, I tested the old and new FSU side by side:
Quote:
RESISTANCE FROM TERMINAL TO ALUMINUM FINS:
#4 #5
#1 #2 #3

pin 1 OLD: 600 K ohm NEW: 11.2 ohms
pin 2 OLD: 3.02 M ohm NEW: 1.22 M ohm
pin 3 OLD: 2.219 M ohm NEW: 608 K ohm
pin 4 OLD: 2.136 M ohm NEW: 602 K ohm
pin 5 OLD: 3.05 M ohm NEW: 1.277 M ohm
Notice that these measurements were NOT consistent with my measurements in this thread above.

The primary symptoms for the second (acm) FSU were, again, the battery drained successive nights; however I could never hear any oddities of the fan. And only once, was I able to see the 14Amp spikes every three seconds which you see earlier in this thread.

Pulling the fuse and/or the FSU stopped the battery drain.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 540iman View Post
The one I would fear the most would be the one that still controls the fan speed, but never goes to sleep or goes to a place where it only draws excess current occasionally.
I think that's what I have, but, further tests are in order.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 540iman View Post
Did you put them side by side on the desk and test the resistance point to point of each one and see any significant difference?
Not only is the pin-to-pin and pin-to-fin resistance vastly different between the two bad FSUs, side by side, but also, the acm FSU doesn't read the same thing it read when I first tested it. All tests were done with the same DMM and test leads.

It's a pretty simple test, so I couldn't have screwed it up.

My pensive conclusion is that both FSUs went bad in different ways, yet both exhibited nary a symptom save for the dead battery overnight.
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Last edited by bluebee; 03-02-2013 at 01:45 PM.
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  #54  
Old 03-02-2013, 02:02 PM
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540iman 540iman is offline
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So they both continued to control your fan what seemed to be to the proper speed. One of the FSUs however allowed the fan to run probably slowly after car was shut off. Is this correct? Problem with the pins you tested are that the "quills" are likely not even at ground potential so testing the resistance from the quills to anything is a waste (I know you tried your best). It would be pins 1-2, 1-3-1-4 and 1-5 and then 2-3,2-4, and 2-5 and the3-4 and 3-5, and finally 4-5.There could be a diode shorted as well which would require each test to be done with the leads reversed just to see if the resistance changes, then we know we have a diode action going on...could be a transistor as well. Still don't know what we would do with it, but just maybe..... Your problem shows that the newer design is no better than the OEM! Damn, had hoped it would be better as the quill layout is better for heat sink action.
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  #55  
Old 03-02-2013, 06:22 PM
Burning2nd Burning2nd is online now
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not that bad of a right up... its never that ez.. but this is the steps...
of course 200% of this fourm doesnt understand what the frakk that means... but at least its here
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  #56  
Old 03-19-2013, 10:30 AM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burning2nd View Post
200% of this fourm doesnt understand ... but at least its here
Speaking of understanding parasitic drain diagnostic procedures, EdJack recommended this thread over here today:

Quote:
Originally Posted by edjack View Post
bluebee, you may wish to reference this PDF http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=683264

Looks like a superior way to find current drains, if you have a sensitive enough DMM, and the skill to make accurate measurements..
Quote:
Due to the state of the CAN Bus communications in the vehicle, it is no longer acceptable to pull each individual fuse one at a time to try and identify which circuit is consuming current. Removal/ reinsertion of a fuse while vehicle is in a sleep state may wake the bus of the vehicle, and invalidate the test. Identifying "consuming" circuits must be done by measuring a voltage drop across fuse and aligning with the value in matrix located at end of this document.
The reference document is located here:
- vw.tb.27-07-11 Battery Discharged Diagnosis for Static Current Draw.pdf (111.9 KB)

It's not all that easy to understand their recommended method:
  1. Connect calibrated 50 amp current clamp to the battery negative cable
  2. Close all doors, trunk, or hood latch so vehicle control units detect all doors closed
  3. Arm vehicle anti-theft system with remote
  4. Observe sleep state current draw after vehicle is left untouched for TWO HOURS.
  5. If after two hours the vehicle does not exceed maximum sleep state current draw, perform a long term (overnight) measurement test
If the parasitic current is too high in the above tests, then run the following Consuming Circuit Isolation test:
  1. Measure the millivolt drop across the resting fuse (e.g., 0.3mv)
  2. Given the fuse amperage (e.g., 5A), check what current draw that equates to (e.g., 20ma)
  3. Now you know the resting current through that fuse is 20 milliamps
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Last edited by bluebee; 04-01-2013 at 09:58 PM. Reason: Added diagram
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  #57  
Old 08-09-2013, 06:29 PM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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FYI ... here is a reference to all the fuses:
- One user's attempt at locating and snapping a picture of every single fuse & relay in the BMW E39 (1) & the most often recommended method to diagnose overnight parasitic battery current drain including the FSU (1)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluebee View Post
I'm not the expert; but cn90's thread (already referenced) shows how to test the HVAC controller.

So, I guess, it could be one of these (all of which can be tested):
  1. Final Stage Resistor (final stage unit), blower motor resistor (1) (2) (3)
  2. Fuse F76 = 40A, Heater blower (yellow) [cn90 says it should have 12V when HVAC is turned on][QSilver7 says the heater blower controls the air velocity for the cabin/interior HVAC system.]
  3. Fuse F46 = 15A, Blower relay/Parked Car ventilation/Receiver, parked car ventilation (1)
  4. HVAC controller (see tests) by cn90)
  5. K4 = interior heater blower motor relay (1)
  6. Blower motor (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6)
  7. Are there any other related fuses or relays? (1)
See also:
- How to troubleshoot a bad FSU final stage unit (1) and how to build a test jig for your FSR final stage resistor (1)
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Last edited by bluebee; 09-08-2013 at 01:13 PM.
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  #58  
Old 09-24-2013, 03:01 PM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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This information posted today will be useful as it shows what the Bentleys think our standing & sleeping parasitic drain should be ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by scottjoh View Post
You probably know this that the current isn't at it's lowest until 17 minutes after last activity (switch press, door closing or opening, etc) the general module keeps track of this time and send the sleep message over the bus. This makes looking for a current draw a very time consuming task. According to the Bentley manual current is approximately 750mA after turning off the ignition, 1 minutes later it should drop to approx 560mA and after another 16 minutes it should drop to approx 18mA. This of course does not include lights that turn on when the door is ajar. Bentley says the values are from a 528i and that sleep is after 16 minutes of turning off the ignition, but, from my experience it's 17 minutes from the last switch or door activity. Locking the door or arming the car does not make it immediately go to sleep (wish it did, that would make this process a whole lot faster)
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  #59  
Old 10-09-2013, 12:02 AM
cdorsettc cdorsettc is offline
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This thread is incredible. I think the programmers should add a "pat-on-the-back" or "like" button to these how-to threads. The authors of these imformative step methods need to know how much they are appreciated. Bluebee et al you guys are my heroes.
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  #60  
Old 11-01-2013, 06:20 PM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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For the record, an updated set of links is here:
- How to test a BMW battery & alternator (1) & one user's attempt to locate, describe, and photograph all fuses and relays in the BMW E39 with a picture of every fuse & relay (1) & the most often recommended diagnostic procedure to test for overnight parasitic battery drain (1) how to choose a good aftermarket battery (1) and a simple battery replacement DIY (1) & how to troubleshoot a bad FSU final stage unit (1) and how to build a test jig for your FSR final stage resistor (1) & how to repair solder cracks in your blower motor resistor (1) & how to replace your HVAC blower motor control (1) (E46) & what FSU is the right one to buy based on user experiences (1)
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Last edited by bluebee; 01-30-2014 at 10:27 PM.
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