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F10 / F11 (2011 - Current)
The new chapter in the highly successful story of the BMW 5 Series Sedan (F10) and wagon (F11)

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  #1  
Old 02-24-2013, 03:56 AM
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mryakanisachoad mryakanisachoad is offline
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How long will it take getting used to buttons being on wrong side of steering wheel?

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  #2  
Old 02-24-2013, 05:26 AM
astrohip astrohip is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mryakanisachoad View Post
It would help if you were a little more descriptive.

Trying to read between the lines, you came from an earlier 5-series (E39? E60?) and now your F10 has the volume buttons on the right instead of the left? Also, cruise has moved from a stalk to buttons on the left, eh?

In my case, in just a few days I adapted. Really doesn't take long. And I love the little scroll wheel for moving between selections. Especially the way you can use it to see ahead/behind without actually having to move ahead/behind.
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  #3  
Old 02-24-2013, 06:10 AM
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Never.

I have had two cars like this (my Volvo and now the BMW) and I still think it's stupid.

It doesn't help that my Acura, that I drive every day, has them on the "correct" side, that is, the left.
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  #4  
Old 02-24-2013, 06:13 AM
tlm999 tlm999 is offline
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Took me about two minutes. The F-10 buttons are a big improvement over the E-60.
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  #5  
Old 02-24-2013, 06:19 AM
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The funny thing is that lots of people here in Poland who cannot afford a new BMW buy used ones abroad, including the UK - in the latter case, they need to have steering swapped to the right (left ) side. When I saw the header of this thread, this was my first connotation...
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  #6  
Old 02-24-2013, 06:21 AM
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I don't get the complaints (and Needs, actually Acura is backwards on not only the steering wheel buttons). I would venture to say that the majority of BMW drivers (in the U.S.) primarily use the left hand, in the twelve or two o'clock position, for steering. For me, this comes from many years of manual shifting. After all, BMW heritage is all about manual shifting, right? Anyway, with the left hand busy steering, having volume buttons on the right side lets the "secondary" right hand work those buttons. Otherwise, you have to change hands on the wheel first, then push the volume buttons -- think about it. Also, you normally use the right hand for the actual volume control, so buttons on the right keeps things consistent. (I wonder if the buttons are reversed for right-hand drive countries).

And as for Acura, we've had 4 for my wife, it drives me crazy that:

1) Volume buttons on the left
2) Push DOWN to turn on the wipers, UP for off (how stupid is that?) UP is always "ON" in my book.
3) Oh, and yes, window lockout switch also locks out all driver controls (!). Makes the feature totally useless and voids its actual purpose to allow driver to control all windows at all times while preventing passengers from "playing" with the windows.

Next, Acura will probably decide that pushing the turn signal lever DOWN is the correct way to signal a right turn.
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  #7  
Old 02-24-2013, 09:19 AM
RambleJ RambleJ is offline
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I actually hit my voice command button yesterday twice when trying to turn down my volume and I've had the car for 9 months.
So I'm still getting used to it.
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  #8  
Old 02-24-2013, 09:28 AM
rparik01 rparik01 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mryakanisachoad View Post
I've been thinking the same thing everyday! If I'm going to use my right hand for volume on the steering wheel I can just use the the volume knob...I think you're right that the habit originates from driving manual.
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  #9  
Old 02-24-2013, 09:32 AM
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In my opinion, the E60 has it right with the cruise controls on the stock and audio and phone on the left. This allows the driver to use only the left hand for everything when you are in lounge/cruise mode. You can change audio volume, answer and hang up the phone, change cruise speed, steer, everything, only with the left hand while your right arm gets to lounge rested on the center console or hold a loved one's hand without interruption. It's pretty much perfect.

This is one thing about the F10 I am not looking forward to.
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  #10  
Old 02-24-2013, 10:09 AM
rparik01 rparik01 is offline
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+1
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  #11  
Old 02-24-2013, 10:53 AM
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I think the amount of time it takes to get used to the buttons is commensurate with the time it took for many of us to get use to the stepronic up/down manual shifting being reversed. A few weeks, maybe longer if you have two different vehicles with opposing button placement.

What I really miss is the ability to program at least one of the steering wheel buttons to my choosing.

And I don't understand the MODE button. All it does is alternate from whatever the radio mode currently is to AUX/iphone input. I thought it would alternate between the last two settings but that does not work on my car.
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  #12  
Old 02-24-2013, 11:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markl53 View Post
I don't get the complaints (and Needs, actually Acura is backwards on not only the steering wheel buttons). I would venture to say that the majority of BMW drivers (in the U.S.) primarily use the left hand, in the twelve or two o'clock position, for steering. For me, this comes from many years of manual shifting. After all, BMW heritage is all about manual shifting, right? Anyway, with the left hand busy steering, having volume buttons on the right side lets the "secondary" right hand work those buttons. Otherwise, you have to change hands on the wheel first, then push the volume buttons -- think about it. Also, you normally use the right hand for the actual volume control, so buttons on the right keeps things consistent. (I wonder if the buttons are reversed for right-hand drive countries).

And as for Acura, we've had 4 for my wife, it drives me crazy that:

1) Volume buttons on the left
2) Push DOWN to turn on the wipers, UP for off (how stupid is that?) UP is always "ON" in my book.
3) Oh, and yes, window lockout switch also locks out all driver controls (!). Makes the feature totally useless and voids its actual purpose to allow driver to control all windows at all times while preventing passengers from "playing" with the windows.

Next, Acura will probably decide that pushing the turn signal lever DOWN is the correct way to signal a right turn.
Horses for courses, but I prefer to be able to work the volume controls with my left hand. If I was shifting, my right hand would be busy shifting...not being able to control volume.

In my F10 I almost always turn the volume using the radio controls on the dash. If I'm engaging my right hand, might as well use a nice knob.

Now with the Acura, I'm with you regarding the reversed wiper controls. Also the nav zoom is backwards, as to me, rotating away from you should zoom out, not zoom in.

Switching cars often drives me nuts. I drove the Bimmer for almost 2 years before switching back to the Acura and I'm not JUST at the point where I can zoom the nav without doing it backwards.
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  #13  
Old 02-24-2013, 11:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Needsdecaf View Post
Horses for courses, but I prefer to be able to work the volume controls with my left hand. If I was shifting, my right hand would be busy shifting...not being able to control volume.

In my F10 I almost always turn the volume using the radio controls on the dash. If I'm engaging my right hand, might as well use a nice knob. .
Exactly my experience, too!
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  #14  
Old 02-24-2013, 11:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Needsdecaf View Post
In my F10 I almost always turn the volume using the radio controls on the dash. If I'm engaging my right hand, might as well use a nice knob.
I'm with you, I rarely use the volume buttons on the steering wheel, but I'll stand by my observations. I'm sure there is a 50/50 preference among all of us.

Quote:
Now with the Acura, I'm with you regarding the reversed wiper controls. Also the nav zoom is backwards, as to me, rotating away from you should zoom out, not zoom in.
+1. It pisses me off after I drive my wife's TSX I start turning my 535i nav knob the wrong way.
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  #15  
Old 02-24-2013, 12:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Needsdecaf View Post
Also the nav zoom is backwards, as to me, rotating away from you should zoom out, not zoom in.
Again agree - always do it wrong the first time

Perhaps it can be coded the opposite way?
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  #16  
Old 02-24-2013, 01:26 PM
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Again agree - always do it wrong the first time

Perhaps it can be coded the opposite way?
He was talking about the Acura, agreeing with some of the pet peeves about my wife's Acuras that I mentioned. We feel the BMW nav dial turns the "right" way. Clockwise for further out, counter-clockwise for zooming in.
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  #17  
Old 02-24-2013, 03:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Needsdecaf View Post
Horses for courses, but I prefer to be able to work the volume controls with my left hand. If I was shifting, my right hand would be busy shifting...not being able to control volume.

In my F10 I almost always turn the volume using the radio controls on the dash. If I'm engaging my right hand, might as well use a nice knob.
I switch back and forth from my F10 to my E46 (left volume) every day and it still distracts me. I need to shift and run all kinds of other stuff with my right hand and would have preferred the volume on the left and the seldom used cruise control on the right. Do we think this is just for cost cutting or was there some consumer demand for it (i.e. what does MBZ do?)
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  #18  
Old 02-24-2013, 04:52 PM
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Took me not too much time at all. They make sense and work for me. I always use the steering wheel buttons to control about everything regarding the stereo.

One thing I wish it had that my Benz did is a Mute option on the steering wheel. Came in handy. On my F10 I have to push the knob, thus being less "convenient" for my spoiled lazy a$$ to Mute since I have to take my hand off the wheel, then to get sound back on, I have to actually turn it back up (instead of "Un-Mute" which would immediately take it back to my previous volume setting).

I'm also more of a fan of M-B's way of letting you actually select a different pre-set on the wheel when you click onto said next pre-set. With BMW you have to spin the wheel to get there THEN click it to engage it into the pre-set. I get the logic i.e they figure you'd rather want to be able to flick through unwanted channels without actually engaging them, but for my style I like how I could get the channel and do one step of less work with M-B's way of doing it (i.e just click it to the channel and it automatically engages). Though there's something really cool and Germanic to me about BMW's "spinning channel wheel" so maybe it's simply worth keeping it like that for that regard.... or maybe due to heritage (?) or something.
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Old 02-24-2013, 05:21 PM
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C'mon guys ... stop the bellyaching. I'm a septuagenarian, and I had no problem getting used to the different button positions from my E60.
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Old 02-24-2013, 06:08 PM
tlm999 tlm999 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markl53 View Post
He was talking about the Acura, agreeing with some of the pet peeves about my wife's Acuras that I mentioned. We feel the BMW nav dial turns the "right" way. Clockwise for further out, counter-clockwise for zooming in.
It's all in what you are used to but in my experience you turn clockwise to turn a screw 'in', clockwise to tighten a nut, clockwise to tighten a jar lid, clockwise to close a valve and clockwise to zoom in. The BMW method is just backward to me and that I still haven't got used to after several years.
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Old 02-24-2013, 08:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tlm999 View Post
It's all in what you are used to but in my experience you turn clockwise to turn a screw 'in', clockwise to tighten a nut, clockwise to tighten a jar lid, clockwise to close a valve and clockwise to zoom in. The BMW method is just backward to me and that I still haven't got used to after several years.
What helped me is a visual (I'm visually-based in general). When you turn the nav knob, did you notice the scale indicator is shown in like a list on the left side of the nav screen (400ft, 800ft, .25mile, .5mile 1mile, 2.5miles, etc). As you move down that list, the numbers go higher. Turning the knob clockwise is the logical way (for me) to work downward through that list, to the left, or counter-clockwise, moves up through the list. This corresponds to the zoom level on the screen. So, to the right is wider zoom, to the left (up the list of scale), zoom in. Once I realized that (and got it right on my very first guess), I always find it natural.
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  #22  
Old 02-25-2013, 07:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tlm999 View Post
it's all in what you are used to but in my experience you turn clockwise to turn a screw 'in', clockwise to tighten a nut, clockwise to tighten a jar lid, clockwise to close a valve and clockwise to zoom in. The bmw method is just backward to me and that i still haven't got used to after several years.
+1
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  #23  
Old 02-25-2013, 07:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tlm999 View Post
It's all in what you are used to but in my experience you turn clockwise to turn a screw 'in', clockwise to tighten a nut, clockwise to tighten a jar lid, clockwise to close a valve and clockwise to zoom in. The BMW method is just backward to me and that I still haven't got used to after several years.
Exactly what I mean - the way it is now is counter-intuitive. But perhaps using "mental association" with enlarging the scale to the right, tightening to the left will help...
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Last edited by MoldCAD; 02-25-2013 at 11:02 AM.
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Old 02-25-2013, 10:21 AM
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Exactly what I mean - the way it is now is counter-intuitive. But perhaps using "mental association" with enlarging the sacel to the right, tightening to the left will help...
It's perfectly logical the way it is. It's just like tightening a bolt on a lawn mower blade. You tighten by turning counter-clockwise and you loosen by turning clockwise. What, you guys don't think of lawn mower blades when using iDrive?
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Last edited by cordoor; 02-25-2013 at 11:11 AM.
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Old 02-25-2013, 11:02 AM
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The buttons are a minor annoyance. It was eliminating the simple and intuitive cruise control stalk that really p*ssed me off. The classic BMW design wasn't broken, so why did they need to fix it?
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