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E36 (1991 - 1999)
The E36 chassis 3-Series BMW was a huge hit among driving enthusiasts from the first moment the car hit the pavement. The E36 won numerous awards over the years it was produced and is still a favorite of many BMW enthusiasts to this day! -- View the E36 Wiki

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  #1  
Old 04-06-2013, 02:35 PM
kujawac kujawac is offline
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Location: michigan
 
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Mein Auto: chevy s10
help with single vanos timing

Hi I am new to BMW. I am a certified tech and do this for a living in an independent shop doing everything from head gaskets to tires. but I think I bit off more than I can chew. I just did head gaskets on a 1996 328i the head was in fact cracked and we got a new one (refurbished). Before installation of the head I had my machinist go through the head and confirm that it was flat and uncracked. after it checked out perfectly I installed the head and did the timing step for step according to
http://www.beisansystems.com/procedu..._procedure.htm
and
http://www.pelicanparts.com/bmw/tech...aft-Timing.htm
(these had better pictures than ALLDATA and Mitchel ondemand 5) which I also referenced.
I have the cam locking blocks and the flywheel locking pin.

The issue I am having is when the car is under load it will not accelerate hardly at all, it seems to bog down and fall on its face. wont get out of its own way. after tearing it back apart and re timing it, it is better but not nearly what it should be for a bmw, still bogs. im wondering if the vanos unit is not working correctly? if the car is simply not timed right even though I have checked and re timed 3 times? or if there is another problem. the only code the car has is an o2 heater circuit code. (not worried about this) I never drove the car before the car was torn apart, it was towed in with the coils and spark plugs removed. done by another shop that refused to do the head gasket.
ANY ideas are greatly appreciated its kinda kicking my ass right now.

because the car overheated and cracked the head. I disconnected the exhaust manifolds to see if the cats had melted and caused a restriction but there was no difference. Soo I'm back to timing? maybe?
thank you for all responses.
I did call a buddy that is a BMW tech and he said that if I do not use a tool , then I will never get it right. But according to the articals above i don't need a tool for a single vanos system. other than the cam locking blocks and the flywheel pin._a_
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  #2  
Old 04-14-2013, 10:35 PM
94oklahoma 94oklahoma is offline
94 525i
Location: fort towson, OK
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
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Mein Auto: 1998 bmw 740il e38 m62
I have the same problem did the same thing and I refuse to let it get hot because I don't have the funds to buy another head does it make a chattering sound when it bogs down? Mine does...and this is also my first time doin a bmw I followedbthe steps from pelican parts because the Bentley manual didn't do a very good job on the timing part hope sumone could help us with this issue
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  #3  
Old 04-14-2013, 10:45 PM
hornhospital's Avatar
hornhospital hornhospital is offline
D'oh, You kids!
Location: In the Grumpy Chair
 
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Mein Auto: 1995 318is / 1993 325is
kujawac, you do indeed have to use the tool to time the VANOS. Go back and use the correct tool and it will make all the difference in the world.

I don't know how I missed this when it was posted. Sorry. I should have told you this days ago.
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1995 318is "Bebe"; 1993 325is "Elvira" 1985 635CSi "Katja" 1984 633CSi "Sylvia"
HAVE I HAD MY MEDS YET?

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  #4  
Old 04-14-2013, 10:47 PM
94oklahoma 94oklahoma is offline
94 525i
Location: fort towson, OK
 
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Any idea how much and possibly where to buy it at?
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  #5  
Old 04-14-2013, 10:55 PM
hornhospital's Avatar
hornhospital hornhospital is offline
D'oh, You kids!
Location: In the Grumpy Chair
 
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Mein Auto: 1995 318is / 1993 325is
$200-$300+. eBay, or rent a set from a BMW specialist/parts vendor.
__________________
Quotes to live by:
guessing gets expensive...drivinfaster
nothing is more expensive than a cheap BMW...c4harpe13

Ken Kanne, Silverhill, AL, E36 Forum Mod/Craigslist addict/Hoarder of all sorts of stuff
BMW-CCA #441426
1995 318is "Bebe"; 1993 325is "Elvira" 1985 635CSi "Katja" 1984 633CSi "Sylvia"
HAVE I HAD MY MEDS YET?

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  #6  
Old 04-14-2013, 11:20 PM
94oklahoma 94oklahoma is offline
94 525i
Location: fort towson, OK
 
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Mein Auto: 1998 bmw 740il e38 m62
Damn...maybe I should just sell it I don't have that much money just used my tax return to fix my car
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  #7  
Old 04-14-2013, 11:28 PM
TRaV MaNN's Avatar
TRaV MaNN TRaV MaNN is offline
Somebody stop me....
Location: Slackramento, CA
 
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Mein Auto: EW/// 86
http://item.mobileweb.ebay.com/viewi...d=121076166840

Would this be enough?
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  #8  
Old 04-14-2013, 11:34 PM
94oklahoma 94oklahoma is offline
94 525i
Location: fort towson, OK
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 38
Mein Auto: 1998 bmw 740il e38 m62
Ok wats the 115490 cuz I used alternate parts for holding the cams flat bar and 2" c clamps
used a 1/4 inch extension for the locking tool and a couple of drill bits worked fine book says or even a pieceof wire but I figure it was like a computer machine or somethin I've done all the mechanical things by the book and the link from pelican parts honestly it was very easy just time consuming
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  #9  
Old 04-14-2013, 11:46 PM
hornhospital's Avatar
hornhospital hornhospital is offline
D'oh, You kids!
Location: In the Grumpy Chair
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 14,151
Mein Auto: 1995 318is / 1993 325is
You used your makeshift parts and now have problems.

Sent from my MB860 using Bimmer App
__________________
Quotes to live by:
guessing gets expensive...drivinfaster
nothing is more expensive than a cheap BMW...c4harpe13

Ken Kanne, Silverhill, AL, E36 Forum Mod/Craigslist addict/Hoarder of all sorts of stuff
BMW-CCA #441426
1995 318is "Bebe"; 1993 325is "Elvira" 1985 635CSi "Katja" 1984 633CSi "Sylvia"
HAVE I HAD MY MEDS YET?

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  #10  
Old 04-14-2013, 11:49 PM
94oklahoma 94oklahoma is offline
94 525i
Location: fort towson, OK
 
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They all serve as the same purpose keeps cams level while installing Wat more do u need? Oh did I mention...white smoke is coming out of the tail pipe...new head has not been hot yet
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  #11  
Old 04-15-2013, 01:24 AM
deSwede deSwede is offline
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Mein Auto: 1998 328is
There is a vanos actuating test you can make to se if there is enough movement on the camshaft, search for "vanos test" on youtube!
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  #12  
Old 04-15-2013, 06:43 AM
94oklahoma 94oklahoma is offline
94 525i
Location: fort towson, OK
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
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Mein Auto: 1998 bmw 740il e38 m62
Ok so just watched the YouTube video says somethin bout a switch to activate the vanos and be careful to not reverse the polarity or u will fry the vanos solenoid hook up sum air...nit not say how much psi tho...and use a micrometer get a measurement and then active the switch and should have atleast 8.5 mm increase and if u do your vanos is good so hope this works
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  #13  
Old 04-15-2013, 06:44 AM
94oklahoma 94oklahoma is offline
94 525i
Location: fort towson, OK
 
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But still doesn't explain the white smoke...which is getting worse
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  #14  
Old 04-15-2013, 06:58 AM
hnaz hnaz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 94oklahoma View Post
But still doesn't explain the white smoke...which is getting worse
What color is the oil and coolant?
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  #15  
Old 04-15-2013, 07:05 AM
94oklahoma 94oklahoma is offline
94 525i
Location: fort towson, OK
 
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Mein Auto: 1998 bmw 740il e38 m62
Oil is black and coolant is clear green
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  #16  
Old 04-15-2013, 07:06 AM
94oklahoma 94oklahoma is offline
94 525i
Location: fort towson, OK
 
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Mein Auto: 1998 bmw 740il e38 m62
Not exactly black but it's normal color atleast under 100 miles on the oil before I had to replace The head
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  #17  
Old 04-15-2013, 09:33 AM
deSwede deSwede is offline
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Is there any possibility that you may have shift any of the electrical connectors to different sensors around the head or intake manifold?
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  #18  
Old 04-15-2013, 09:36 AM
94oklahoma 94oklahoma is offline
94 525i
Location: fort towson, OK
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
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Mein Auto: 1998 bmw 740il e38 m62
No everything has its place like it's molded and also is numbered
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  #19  
Old 04-15-2013, 09:42 AM
hnaz hnaz is offline
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Let's see, smoke is getting worse... I am assuming it doesn't smell sweet? And has a bluish color (suggesting burning oil)? Have you done a leak down test or checked compression or removed one of the spark plugs to check the condition of the plug? Have you tried using some seafoam in the tank?
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  #20  
Old 04-15-2013, 09:49 AM
deSwede deSwede is offline
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Do you smell any coolant from the exhaust since there was exessive white smoke you mention? its hard to diagnos this problem you have without actually see the car
and not nowing the history about it, but we try!
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  #21  
Old 04-15-2013, 09:53 AM
94oklahoma 94oklahoma is offline
94 525i
Location: fort towson, OK
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
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Mein Auto: 1998 bmw 740il e38 m62
It's white smoke and evaporates fast like steam not like burning oil and does not have bluish color I'll pull number 3 because that was the cylinder that had a bent valve and 3 cracks on the old head and seam foam I highly do not recommend using sea foam because it deteriorates seals I do how ever very highly suggest using Lucas fuel injector cleaner because it has oils in it to help lubricate compression rings, pumps, and injectors and also helps create a cushion seal at the valve where as seamfoam acts like alcohol to remove water...but that's it basically dries everything out
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  #22  
Old 04-15-2013, 10:06 AM
94oklahoma 94oklahoma is offline
94 525i
Location: fort towson, OK
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 38
Mein Auto: 1998 bmw 740il e38 m62
And the cause of replacing the head was because of an upper hose blowing out nearly halfway off and didn't know it I thought it was reading wrong I had stopped before but nothin seemed out of place till I got a few more miles which I was at work the checked again knowing something was wrong and discovered the hose blown on the bottom side...
Then replaced the hose bled the system kept overheating them removed the head assuming blown head gasket and notice 4 total cracks on the head so I then bought a new head ran fine before the hose situation averaged 27 highway mpg @ 60 mph I did notice signs of the head being worked on before lots of seals in better condition than others ...the injectors had brings dry rotted on the tops but the bottoms looked fairly new
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  #23  
Old 04-15-2013, 10:06 AM
hnaz hnaz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 94oklahoma View Post
I...and seam foam I highly do not recommend using sea foam because it deteriorates seals I do how ever very highly suggest using Lucas fuel injector cleaner because it has oils in it to help lubricate compression rings, pumps, and injectors and also helps create a cushion seal at the valve where as seamfoam acts like alcohol to remove water...but that's it basically dries everything out
Uhm... where did you hear/read this from? I looked on Bobistheoilguy.com extensively and the few people that mentioned the same thing were nothing but tin-hat fashion models.
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  #24  
Old 04-15-2013, 10:19 AM
94oklahoma 94oklahoma is offline
94 525i
Location: fort towson, OK
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
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Mein Auto: 1998 bmw 740il e38 m62
Didn't hear this saw it for my self using it on a 79 Honda goldwing GLASS 1000 dried up all the seals in its path within a few months and all the seals were new beaxuse the carbe needed rebuilt and had been sittin awhile started using Lucas been fine ever since
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  #25  
Old 04-15-2013, 10:39 AM
hnaz hnaz is offline
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Location: Communist Republic of Maryland
 
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Mein Auto: 328i, M3, 325is M-Tech
Quote:
Originally Posted by 94oklahoma View Post
Didn't hear this saw it for my self using it on a 79 Honda goldwing GLASS 1000 dried up all the seals in its path within a few months and all the seals were new beaxuse the carbe needed rebuilt and had been sittin awhile started using Lucas been fine ever since
People been using seafoam forever, including my dad using that stuff on his classic cars. -NEVER- had the issue you are describing. You might be doing it wrong...
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