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F10 / F11 (2011 - Current)
The new chapter in the highly successful story of the BMW 5 Series Sedan (F10) and wagon (F11)

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  #1  
Old 04-17-2013, 02:28 PM
gregc11514 gregc11514 is offline
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ActiveHybrid 5

Working in sales for a BMW dealer and reading all the info, I just had to try the Hybrid 5, so I leased one.
I have to say I am impressed. Plenty of power, great fuel economy, comfortable, and great looks. I was a little bit concerned with the automatic engine shutoff which cannot be over ridden on the hybrid. It's seamless. Rarely do I feel the gas engine kick in.

Still freaks me a bit when I see my tachometer drop to zero when I take my foot off the accelerator at 60MPH!

Anyone else have a Active 3 or 5 they'd like to comment about?
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  #2  
Old 04-17-2013, 03:04 PM
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quackbury quackbury is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregc11514 View Post
Working in sales for a BMW dealer and reading all the info, I just had to try the Hybrid 5, so I leased one.
I have to say I am impressed. Plenty of power, great fuel economy, comfortable, and great looks. I was a little bit concerned with the automatic engine shutoff which cannot be over ridden on the hybrid. It's seamless. Rarely do I feel the gas engine kick in.

Still freaks me a bit when I see my tachometer drop to zero when I take my foot off the accelerator at 60MPH!

Anyone else have a Active 3 or 5 they'd like to comment about?
I really wanted to like the Active 3. But the one I test drove last month had far and away the WORST brake feel of any car I have driven in the past 35 years. Not the worst German car. Not the worst new car. The worst car PERIOD, including a number of POS's my friends had in college, or that I had as rentals early in my career. Devastatingly bad. Soft spongy pedal, and no matter how much force was applied it felt like the car would not slow down. Pretty frightening, actually.

Shortest test drive I've ever taken. I couldn't wait to get back to the dealership.

I hope the Active 5 is better.
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Prior BMW's
2011 535ix MSport
2011 X5 35D
2008 ///M3 Vert
2008 X5 3.0
2007 X5 3.0
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  #3  
Old 04-17-2013, 03:25 PM
ae86pwr ae86pwr is offline
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I have the AH5 for about a month now and I love it so far. It's a 5er for geeks.
The biggest tradeoff is the battery eating up 1/3 of the trunk space so this is not the car you want to pick up your inlaws from the airport.

If you have to keep the engine running then put the car in SPORT / DS mode (that puts the car in eBOOST mode)


-No issues on brake pedal at all.
Ref Point: (We traded the E60 530i for this which I bleed the brakes every two years with ATE Super Blue)

If you plan to hypermiling the car. Drive the car in ECO PRO and set navigation to everywhere you are going so the car can use the topographical information to maximize your battery usage.
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Last edited by ae86pwr; 04-17-2013 at 03:30 PM.
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  #4  
Old 04-18-2013, 10:12 AM
gregc11514 gregc11514 is offline
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Also never feel any problem with the brakes... actually feel better than my 3 Series did.

I was in very slow traffic on the LI Expressway last night.. had the cruise set to 30 MPH and sped up or slowed down with the cruise control switch.... 3 miles pure electric power.. I'm luvin it!
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  #5  
Old 04-18-2013, 10:16 AM
ae86pwr ae86pwr is offline
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Another benefit of this car is you can sneak home at night without waking up your wife

The annoying thing about this car is the valet parking guys are always confused as they never expect BMW hybrid and keeps turning the car on and off.
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  #6  
Old 04-18-2013, 11:31 AM
Kar Don Kar Don is offline
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I have the AH7, while the brakes don't feel that great I can't say it is the worst brake feel ever. That award goes to the 2003-2006 W211 Mercedes E-class.
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  #7  
Old 04-18-2013, 12:01 PM
SuperTerp SuperTerp is offline
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MGPS? far and away most important thing.
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  #8  
Old 04-18-2013, 12:18 PM
ae86pwr ae86pwr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperTerp View Post
MGPS? far and away most important thing.
Nothing to write home about.

It's bascially a 535i with 528i's fuel economy.
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  #9  
Old 04-18-2013, 12:31 PM
SuperTerp SuperTerp is offline
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Originally Posted by ae86pwr View Post
Nothing to write home about.

It's bascially a 535i with 528i's fuel economy.
I just can't wrap my head around bmw hybrids. I have to assume its more about the name then the actual overall performance right?
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  #10  
Old 04-18-2013, 12:41 PM
Kar Don Kar Don is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperTerp View Post
I just can't wrap my head around bmw hybrids. I have to assume its more about the name then the actual overall performance right?
Depends on what you consider "performance". I like my activehybrid, A/C on and engine off at stop lights, E-boost when accelerating, etc. I get a little boost in fuel economy as an added bonus. In cars like the 5 and especially 7, carting around a little extra weight doesn't really matter. These cars aren't light anyways.
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  #11  
Old 04-18-2013, 12:46 PM
neilsarkar neilsarkar is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperTerp View Post
I just can't wrap my head around bmw hybrids. I have to assume its more about the name then the actual overall performance right?
I guess so, otherwise they would have created a hybrid system for N20. Those who are concerned about MPG are buying 528i anyway (according to my CA). In my neighborhood, AH5s are rarer than M5, and the situation will most likely worsen after 530d/535d is introduced in the States.
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  #12  
Old 04-18-2013, 12:50 PM
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quackbury quackbury is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperTerp View Post
I just can't wrap my head around bmw hybrids. I have to assume its more about the name then the actual overall performance right?
The business case for hybrids boils down to 3 factors:

1. The cachet of positioning yourself as a "green" manufacturer.
2. The ability for nerds and geeks to one-up their Prius-driving friends
3. The fact that the CAFE impact of hybrids allows BMW to sell more M cars and 550's to its traditional demographic.

#3 is the only reason that matters to me. If I wanted #1 or #2, I'd be looking at a Tesla.
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Prior BMW's
2011 535ix MSport
2011 X5 35D
2008 ///M3 Vert
2008 X5 3.0
2007 X5 3.0
2006 X5 3.0
2006 550iA SP
2003 540iA M-Technic
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  #13  
Old 04-18-2013, 01:03 PM
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cordoor cordoor is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperTerp View Post
I just can't wrap my head around bmw hybrids. I have to assume its more about the name then the actual overall performance right?
It certainly isn't about fuel economy.

The 535 and AH5 get 20/30 and 23/30 mpg, respectively.

Consider two drivers who drive 15K miles per year and 100% city driving (since that is where the mpg difference is between the 535 and AH5). Over three years and at $4 per gallon, the 535 bought only 293 gallons more of gas for $1,172. Considering the AH5 costs $8K more than the 535, a lot more driving is needed to break even. In fact, if you use math, you find the AH5 driver would need to drive 306,667 miles to break even.

(I am not including any potential tax write offs you get when buying an AH vehicle, this perhaps might help justify it maybe but probably not)

I think I'd rather have the trunk space.
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Last edited by cordoor; 04-18-2013 at 01:05 PM.
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  #14  
Old 04-18-2013, 02:37 PM
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Needsdecaf Needsdecaf is offline
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AH5 doesn't cost $8k more when you consider the added features. More like $4k.

So only 150k miles to break even.
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  #15  
Old 04-18-2013, 02:48 PM
neilsarkar neilsarkar is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Needsdecaf View Post
AH5 doesn't cost $8k more when you consider the added features. More like $4k.

So only 150k miles to break even.
And then you have $3,500 Eco credit.
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  #16  
Old 04-18-2013, 03:17 PM
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cordoor cordoor is offline
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$2,800 for the Technology Package + $500 for special order 4-zone + $3,500 for eco credit = $6,800. We will disregard any value lost by not having split fold down rear seats and a smaller trunk.

This means only $1,200, or 300 gallons of gas, or 46,000 miles of 100% city driving, is needed to break even. It's worse for a 50/50 city/highway driver (double everything).

I don't think this vehicle is something you would purchase for fuel savings unless you were going to hold it for a very long term.
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  #17  
Old 04-18-2013, 04:06 PM
ae86pwr ae86pwr is offline
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AH5 is more of a "oh we have one too" product to match E400 hybrid / M35h / GS450h

Afterall BMW/MB/GM worked together to create this mild hybrid torque conventer/electric motor combo. Since North America is not embracing the diesel engines, so these guys are throwing hybrid alternative as an option.

Interesting bit: This hybrid electric motor/ZF 8 speed combo is 15k compared to the normal 535i autobox is around 8-9k. (ref: penskeparts.com)


I like geeky cars and it's easier to sell my wife the idea of getting a "hybrid"
GEICO gives me discount for being a "hybrid" too
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  #18  
Old 04-18-2013, 05:49 PM
Kar Don Kar Don is offline
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This is not a mild hybrid. This subject has been beaten to death So many times about pay off of hybrid etc.
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  #19  
Old 04-18-2013, 06:28 PM
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cordoor cordoor is offline
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Originally Posted by Kar Don View Post
This is not a mild hybrid. This subject has been beaten to death So many times about pay off of hybrid etc.
Being that it is a full hybrid, wouldn't you expect a bit more improvement than 2 mpg city and 0 mpg highway?

If I am missing something, I am genuinely interested in knowing what it is. I don't know much about hybrids but I can read the numbers on BMW's website and I can do math.
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  #20  
Old 04-18-2013, 07:13 PM
Kar Don Kar Don is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cordoor View Post
Being that it is a full hybrid, wouldn't you expect a bit more improvement than 2 mpg city and 0 mpg highway?

If I am missing something, I am genuinely interested in knowing what it is. I don't know much about hybrids but I can read the numbers on BMW's website and I can do math.
That is based on the EPA city cycle route. It gets better than that in heavy city driving. Also the hybrid has many more benefits which I already listed that make it more desirable.

The full hybrid you are thinking of (Prius) is running a weak Atkinson cycle 4 cyl...it can't even get out of its own way. Take the battery and electric power train out of the Prius and I bet it won't suffer mpg wise that much.
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  #21  
Old 04-18-2013, 07:40 PM
SuperTerp SuperTerp is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kar Don View Post
That is based on the EPA city cycle route. It gets better than that in heavy city driving. Also the hybrid has many more benefits which I already listed that make it more desirable.

The full hybrid you are thinking of (Prius) is running a weak Atkinson cycle 4 cyl...it can't even get out of its own way. Take the battery and electric power train out of the Prius and I bet it won't suffer mpg wise that much.
so I see a 2-4mpg addition to the epa numbers based on my style. Are you seeing improvements above those gains over epa?
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  #22  
Old 04-18-2013, 08:20 PM
Kar Don Kar Don is offline
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so I see a 2-4mpg addition to the epa numbers based on my style. Are you seeing improvements above those gains over epa?
I don't have an F10. I have an F04 which is a mild hybrid. I just like the additional benefits of the electrical system and e boost. I get slightly better than EPA city on the F04. Maybe by 1-2 mpg, but I didn't get it for mpg.

Family member has an F30 AH coming in soon so I'll have more experience with the full hybrid soon.
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  #23  
Old 04-18-2013, 08:27 PM
ae86pwr ae86pwr is offline
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Originally Posted by Kar Don View Post
This is not a mild hybrid. This subject has been beaten to death So many times about pay off of hybrid etc.
Correction. I meant 535i with a 9V battery and heavy discount since no one are rushing to buy it for that I thank the public and Greg @ Pacific BMW for hooking it up.



Sent from my Nexus 4 using Bimmer App
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  #24  
Old 04-18-2013, 09:09 PM
Kar Don Kar Don is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ae86pwr View Post
Correction. I meant 535i with a 9V battery and heavy discount since no one are rushing to buy it for that I thank the public and Greg @ Pacific BMW for hooking it up.



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ok? It's a full hybrid, not a mild setup.
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  #25  
Old 04-18-2013, 09:29 PM
ae86pwr ae86pwr is offline
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Let's us know how the AH3 drives.

It's a much better setup than my AH5. The battery is much better placed.

Maybe I am too fat for my AH5. The electric drive is really good for off the line up to 10mph. Any lighter on the throttle will piss off the motorist in back of me.

Cheers


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