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F30 / F31 / F32 / F33 (2012 - current)
The sixth generation 3 series, chassis code F30. 2013 model year 328i and 335i sedans now in production. Read the F30 frequently asked question thread for all your basic question and dive into all the details in the ultimate F30 information thread.

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  #51  
Old 07-09-2013, 10:03 AM
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Quote:
The e46 ZHP dominates the e90 in terms of connectedness, interior design, and road feel
I don't think so. The E90 is the best athlete of the bunch so far. By a landslide. Even better than the E36 becasue the platform is more ridgid and fully controllable.

The E46 was more emotional, even enough to be a better BMW. Unexplainable, maybe defined by more BMW-esque styling and more intimacy.

The F30 needs a lot of money to be considered as a genuine Bimmer. Possible but you must be convinced.
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  #52  
Old 07-09-2013, 10:16 AM
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  #53  
Old 07-09-2013, 11:24 AM
Jamesonsviggen Jamesonsviggen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeFromPA View Post
Just in case anyone was wondering:

The e46 ZHP dominates the e90 in terms of connectedness, interior design, and road feel
The e36 328is dominates the e46 330i in terms of steering feel and road connectedness
The e30 crushes the e36 in terms of classic german build quality, road feel, 3-box design

The e21 doesn't crush any of them.
And watch for all these opinions and counters from people who have not driven half the cars you just listed

A best friend of mine who has an equal BMW obsessions has an E36 328is that gets all of my leftovers(like my S52 cams), an E30 325e he converted to an I, and also in the driveway is his brothers E46 328i. All 5spds. What a great way to sample the 3 series between his cars and mine. We joked that we should get an E90 just to round us out lol.
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  #54  
Old 07-09-2013, 01:53 PM
JoeFromPA JoeFromPA is offline
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Originally Posted by Saintor View Post
I don't think so. The E90 is the best athlete of the bunch so far. By a landslide. Even better than the E36 becasue the platform is more ridgid and fully controllable.

The E46 was more emotional, even enough to be a better BMW. Unexplainable, maybe defined by more BMW-esque styling and more intimacy.
I said the e46 ZHP or 'performance package'. The e90 328i, 330i, and 335i never made a car that connected, with that wonderful steering feel, and of course no where near the interior design.

I mean, c'mon, we're sharing subjective opinions and magazine racing so OF COURSE my opinion is more valid than yours.

That's just the nature of the beast!
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  #55  
Old 07-09-2013, 02:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeFromPA View Post
I said the e46 ZHP or 'performance package'. The e90 328i, 330i, and 335i never made a car that connected, with that wonderful steering feel, and of course no where near the interior design.

I mean, c'mon, we're sharing subjective opinions and magazine racing so OF COURSE my opinion is more valid than yours.

That's just the nature of the beast!
Which OF COURSE entitles me to say that you are wrong. BTW, I owned both.
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  #56  
Old 07-09-2013, 06:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Bratters123 View Post
2 E46 M3's

1 E90 M Sport 6MT

1 E92 M Sport 6MT

F30 330d M Sport

Berk! As soon as you play the I have an M3 card you think it automatically gives you credibility on the F30 forum.


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Oh the irony... Aren't you doing the very thing yourself by mentioning your past cars? Having owned all these cars gives you more authority over the other people's opinions?
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  #57  
Old 07-09-2013, 08:16 PM
RobertaZ RobertaZ is offline
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Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen View Post
^I sill want to know what the wheels/tires and suspension setup is like between the two cars of yours. Your CDN F30 is a bit different than what we are offered in the US, such as your $400 sport suspension, I want to figure out what you have.
I am not a technical person and, to be honest, don't know very much about cars - I just know what feels right to me. The F30 has P225/45R18 all season run-flat tires with 2,400 miles on them and the E90 has 205/55R16 summer tires have been driven for 65,000 miles. The sport suspension is listed as item #704 in the BMW spec sheet. Certain features are standard up here, such as leather, heated seats, heavy duty battery and a few other things......none of which affect handling and ride......unless leatherette makes you itch.

BMW.ca has a downloadable PDF with all of the specs.

http://www.bmw.ca/ca/en/newvehicles/...alogue_CAE.pdf

I'm sure the differences between the U.S. and Cdn versions are mostly cosmetic and weather-related. Does the Sport Line in the U.S. come with the same suspension as the other two lines? It does up here.
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  #58  
Old 07-09-2013, 08:32 PM
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BJ,

I've thought long and hard about what is upsetting me with the F30 and I think I've figured it out! It's the fact that the over the years, BMW has built a reputation for itself. That reputation is that a BMW conquers corners. With the F30, that has gotten blurry. The 3 series has ALWAYS been the benchmark, and THE car that sets the standard with both it's luxurious and sporting nature. It just doesn't seem to be there anymore. I love the BMW brand, and my family has been fortunate enough to own a lot of them. That's why I feel so strongly about the company. One that use to call itself 'The Ultimate Driving Machine'.
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  #59  
Old 07-09-2013, 09:48 PM
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Originally Posted by BMW 3-SERIES View Post
Cant deny that F30 looks miles better than that E90.
F30 looks good in M Sport only.
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  #60  
Old 07-10-2013, 02:55 AM
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Originally Posted by bayoucity View Post
F30 looks good in M Sport only.
F30 M Sport front looks like an old E90 LCI.

F30 M Sport rear looks like my mom in a poodle skirt.

BJ
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  #61  
Old 07-10-2013, 04:35 AM
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Originally Posted by EstorilF30 View Post
funny that only on the BMW forums will BMW owners bash any new chassis when theirs becomes outdated.
If you think this is bad, go to a Porsche forum when they bring out a new 911. To 99% of the population the cars look identical but Porsche owners still complain about the new car.

My E92 coupes have been the best daily drivers I have ever owned but when I drove an F30 sedan my car felt a little long in the tooth when I got back in it. I have ordered a 435i xDrive and expect it to be a better overall car than my 335i xDrive coupe. Yes, there are things I would have done differently on the new car but I am not going to bash it because it isnít perfect. What car is?

For a daily driver, you canít beat the 3 Series. If you want a more focused driving experience, buy a Porsche. When the 3 and 4 Series cars get too big for my tastes, I will buy a 1 or 2 Series car. I have owned a lot of cars and while BMWs have changed a bit, I think they have remained true to their core values and I still find each new iteration of the 3 Series to be an improvement over the last.

Alan
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  #62  
Old 07-10-2013, 04:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
F30 M Sport front looks like an old E90 LCI.

F30 M Sport rear looks like my mom in a poodle skirt.

BJ
LOL BJ, you are funny sometimes.

How's your jet lag?
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  #63  
Old 07-10-2013, 05:47 AM
Jamesonsviggen Jamesonsviggen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertaZ View Post
I am not a technical person and, to be honest, don't know very much about cars - I just know what feels right to me. The F30 has P225/45R18 all season run-flat tires with 2,400 miles on them and the E90 has 205/55R16 summer tires have been driven for 65,000 miles. The sport suspension is listed as item #704 in the BMW spec sheet. Certain features are standard up here, such as leather, heated seats, heavy duty battery and a few other things......none of which affect handling and ride......unless leatherette makes you itch.

BMW.ca has a downloadable PDF with all of the specs.

http://www.bmw.ca/ca/en/newvehicles/...alogue_CAE.pdf

I'm sure the differences between the U.S. and Cdn versions are mostly cosmetic and weather-related. Does the Sport Line in the U.S. come with the same suspension as the other two lines? It does up here.
You don't need to be a technical person to know that the all seasons on one car, especially if run flats, are very different than summer tires on the other. The summer tires alone have a huge edge in braking performance and grip/handling. If they are non run flats, they may ride softer and smoother and quieter as well.
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  #64  
Old 07-10-2013, 06:00 AM
Michael Schott Michael Schott is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BiggerTwin View Post
If you think this is bad, go to a Porsche forum when they bring out a new 911. To 99% of the population the cars look identical but Porsche owners still complain about the new car.

My E92 coupes have been the best daily drivers I have ever owned but when I drove an F30 sedan my car felt a little long in the tooth when I got back in it. I have ordered a 435i xDrive and expect it to be a better overall car than my 335i xDrive coupe. Yes, there are things I would have done differently on the new car but I am not going to bash it because it isnít perfect. What car is?

For a daily driver, you canít beat the 3 Series. If you want a more focused driving experience, buy a Porsche. When the 3 and 4 Series cars get too big for my tastes, I will buy a 1 or 2 Series car. I have owned a lot of cars and while BMWs have changed a bit, I think they have remained true to their core values and I still find each new iteration of the 3 Series to be an improvement over the last.

Alan
The 3 series sedan has been the benchmark for handling in it's class for a very long time and for those who need 4 doors, a Porsche is not practical. I don't expect a 3 series to be as focused as a Cayman but it's the next best thing and unfortunately it seems the F30 has regressed in that category.
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  #65  
Old 07-10-2013, 07:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Michael Schott View Post
The 3 series sedan has been the benchmark for handling in it's class for a very long time and for those who need 4 doors, a Porsche is not practical. I don't expect a 3 series to be as focused as a Cayman but it's the next best thing and unfortunately it seems the F30 has regressed in that category.
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  #66  
Old 07-10-2013, 08:37 AM
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Re: Road and Track: BMW 328i(e90) vs. BMW 328i(F30)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Schott View Post
The 3 series sedan has been the benchmark for handling in it's class for a very long time and for those who need 4 doors, a Porsche is not practical. I don't expect a 3 series to be as focused as a Cayman but it's the next best thing and unfortunately it seems the F30 has regressed in that category.
Well said. Thank you for this post.

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  #67  
Old 07-10-2013, 12:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeFromPA View Post
Just in case anyone was wondering:

The e46 ZHP dominates the e90 in terms of connectedness, interior design, and road feel
The e36 328is dominates the e46 330i in terms of steering feel and road connectedness
The e30 crushes the e36 in terms of classic german build quality, road feel, 3-box design

The e21 doesn't crush any of them.
While I miss my E36, it wasn't superior in any way to my E46. The steering is very similar between the two, with the E36 being a touch slower. I wouldn't characterize one as being superior to the other, just different. "Road connectedness" - not sure exactly what that means but I drove both my E36 and E46 at the track and they were both a blast. The E36 was a bit better balanced (i.e. less understeer) probably due to the square tire setup.

The E36 was just a really, raw car that delivered a unique driving experience. It was awesome for it's time, and I had it when I was in my 20's so it was perfect for my age group. But no way, no how, would I ever for a second think about trading my E46 for an E36.

The E90 I think is a fine car. I've only driven them as loaners so I don't have significant seat time in them. I found the E90 to be a bit austere, but it certainly handled well. The only real drawback was that it wasn't sufficiently different from the E46 to entice me to open my wallet and buy one (and I'm not fond of the looks). The E46 was a big improvement over the E36. The E90 was more of a baby step better. I don't think my E46 crushes the E90 in any category, but ymmv.
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  #68  
Old 07-16-2013, 09:42 PM
Kayani_1 Kayani_1 is offline
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I agree with this article.

This whole trend of BMW making soft core cars with less communicative steering feel/feedback is just sad.

I am not digging the new F30's. I have driven the Base F30's both 328i and 335i and find them less engaging and fun to drive then the Base versions of E9x 328i/335i.

Last edited by pix335i; 07-17-2013 at 11:10 AM.
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  #69  
Old 07-17-2013, 06:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Schott View Post
The 3 series sedan has been the benchmark for handling in it's class for a very long time and for those who need 4 doors, a Porsche is not practical. I don't expect a 3 series to be as focused as a Cayman but it's the next best thing and unfortunately it seems the F30 has regressed in that category.
So does the new buyers' enthusiasm for driving. Now they find all kind of lame excuses to defend their cars.

When 3-series buyers complained in '98-99 about the E46 steering, BMW responded with an update. Same goes when the '05-06 330i E90 powerplant was judged a bit short on power... the rest is history.

Now, BMW just laugh at their new kind of 3-series buyers, who cares less at driving.

This is not to say that the F30 is all wrong ... I like some aspects of it. However driving is no longer a top priority, NO MATTER THE NUMBERS. Yes it is a fair statement that itjust lost its soul.

I'd bet that most BMW engineers related to dynamic virtues were replaced in the last 6 years.
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Last edited by Saintor; 07-17-2013 at 06:56 AM.
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  #70  
Old 07-17-2013, 06:52 AM
Jamesonsviggen Jamesonsviggen is offline
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Decent review of the 320i, .91 g's, 106ft from 60, they describe the sports suspension as just right.
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...0i_first_look/
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  #71  
Old 07-17-2013, 08:29 AM
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To those lamenting that BMW has lost its focus and is making softer cars: has the M3 gotten softer or is it still the ultimate driving machine?

I had an E46 M3 which I bought after cross-shopping Corvettes, Porsches, and even used Ferraris. While my E92 335i xDrive coupe is definitely softer focused, that is not such a bad thing in my book. When I had the M3 I also had a WRX to use as my winter AWD car. I ended up using the WRX quite a bit in the summer as well since there were days I simply wanted a softer focused car that didn't require as much muscle power to depress the clutch, move the shift lever, or turn the wheel. While the E9 now serves as my only car, it would indeed be sad if BMW no longer made M cars that handled as well as the best in the world.

Alan
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  #72  
Old 07-17-2013, 08:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BiggerTwin View Post
To those lamenting that BMW has lost its focus and is making softer cars: has the M3 gotten softer or is it still the ultimate driving machine?
If I tell you that the M3 is still an E9X and not a F3X, does this give you a clue?
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  #73  
Old 07-17-2013, 09:03 AM
Jamesonsviggen Jamesonsviggen is offline
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If I tell you that the M3 is still an E9X and not a F3X, does this give you a clue?
I think they ceased production on the E92 M3 in the last week or two. There is always a 1+ year lag for the M3 to switch over to the new platform.

I have high hopes for the F80, but who knows, BMW could screw it up. At which point I would look to the new ATS-V.
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  #74  
Old 07-17-2013, 09:56 AM
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Road and Track: BMW 328i(e90) vs. BMW 328i(F30)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen View Post
I think they ceased production on the E92 M3 in the last week or two. There is always a 1+ year lag for the M3 to switch over to the new platform.

I have high hopes for the F80, but who knows, BMW could screw it up. At which point I would look to the new ATS-V.
The M3 coupe was killed today, actually. ):


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  #75  
Old 07-17-2013, 10:10 AM
Spagolli94 Spagolli94 is offline
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I recently had a rental 328xi rental when I went to Vail. I have a, E90 335i 6spd, sport and lots of other goodies too, so it's not apples to apples. That said...

F30 Pros
1. I was shocked at how quick the F30 was. All that power and smooth acceleration from a 4 cal? Wow?
2. I didn't notice the diesel clatter people complain about
3. The ride quality was great. Firm, but smooth. Not Camry-ish like the article said.
4. The steering, while way too light in the parking lot, firmed up nicely at speed, especially when in sport mode.

F30 Cons
1. I immediately noticed the cheapness of the interior. Not sure if it was more plastic, the grade of plastic, the fact I had a stripped-down rental, or all of the above.
2. The car felt big and I much prefer smaller cars (that's just a personal preference though, not really a knock on the F30).
3. The steering wheel was very thin and ugly shape. Would be rectified with better "line" I imagine.
4. The ASS feature and other non-sport driving modes blow. Why bother? I guess they had to do that crap for CAFE regulations or something?

It very well be possible that the cons I noticed would be a non-issue on a higher line. That said, I think two things will prevent me from getting the F30. One is the fact they have lines at all. I would like a sport package with a saddle brown interior. I would like the ability to chose more options and not be pigeon-holed into a specific line. And two, the size. Who knows, maybe in a few years, I'll want a bigger car, but not now.

I like a lot of things about the F30. IF it was the same size as the E90 with more configurable options, I'd likely be all over it.
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