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Old 07-22-2013, 10:15 AM
countersurfer countersurfer is offline
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Unhappy Help appreciated: All window seals (bottom) rolling under or rippling?

Hi everyone!

This is my first post. I got my new-to-me 2009 E91 back in September. This is my first BMW, although we have had them in my family growing up. I have a bit of a combo problem: the actual window seals and also the dealership. Any input is appreciated!

My car is currently at the dealership (because it was supposed to be covered under warranty) to fix the window seals (weatherstripping) that are either rolling under/into the door or rippling. By rolling under, I mean that it looks like one end of the weatherstripping has been sucked under and into the door; about 1/4 of the piece is "sucked in," and you can't even see where it went. I would post a photo if I had the car with me—I hope this makes sense. It's basically the rubber that meets the window glass on the inside, and one that is often mentioned as a culprit for scratching tints (due to lack of felt/barrier).

A few months ago (before my new car warranty expired), the dealership took the car in to repair the seals, but ended up not having all the parts (?!), so they replaced just the front passenger side, which was the worst one. Two weeks later, they called to let me know that the seals are in stock and to bring my car in. I had to describe my situation all over again to a different SA (i.e., seal defect that would be covered under warranty; just bringing it in to finish the incomplete job from last visit). They left me a VM this morning saying that the window seals won't be covered by warranty and that he'd explain to me over the phone.

I'm stuck at work unable to call them back for a while to find out what the deal is, so I'm asking you guys for help in the meantime.
  1. What causes this? I've never seen this on my previous cars (Honda, Lexus, Saab)
  2. If warranty really doesn't cover it, is this something I could leave alone, or does it need to be fixed? I haven't experienced any problems, really, that I could tell. I was alarmed by the appearance and assumed it would later cause problems and the SA agreed at the time;
  3. How much would it cost to fix this, and is a body shop where I would take it? I have zero skills with cars in general, and the only thing I've done is replace a side view mirror in an Accord twice.

My rear windows came tinted in the back, and I'm wondering if that's why they may refuse to cover the seals under warranty. They really shouldn't refuse it for any other reason since the problem was logged before the warranty expired and I was repeatedly reassured that it will be covered.

Thanks for helping out a newbie!
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Old 07-22-2013, 10:20 AM
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thekurgan thekurgan is online now
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Any photos?
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Old 07-22-2013, 10:48 AM
countersurfer countersurfer is offline
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I don't, because the car is at the dealer right now. Sorry! All I could find was this picture from a Subie forum that shows something kind of similar (at the least, the same part), but mine is actually sucked entirely into the door at the front end. On the ones that are just rippling, it is happening in the middle of the seal.

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Old 07-22-2013, 10:48 AM
countersurfer countersurfer is offline
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Oops, I'm sorry for the double post and the huge picture!

Last edited by countersurfer; 07-22-2013 at 11:43 AM.
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Old 07-22-2013, 11:56 AM
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thekurgan thekurgan is online now
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From the photo, I'd say the window has too much pressure outward. I wonder if the window was removed to tint it and not replaced correctly. You can see the wear on the outer seal, even lubrication wouldn't help this and would just smear on the glass. The one thing you can do, is polish the glass with something like Zaino, it's a pumice based cream that will make the glass smooth(er), which may help the catching of the seal.
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Old 07-22-2013, 12:22 PM
countersurfer countersurfer is offline
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Thanks for your advice! Just FYI and to clarify, the photo I attached was just for reference and *not my car*. (Because my car is in the shop.) Oh man, I hope my window was replaced properly...
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Old 07-22-2013, 12:49 PM
countersurfer countersurfer is offline
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Well, I talked to the dealer and they said that the manager denied the claim because *my dog had slobbered on the window and it causes stickiness that could have ruined it*!! WTH?!

1) I have never even opened the rear windows-the car came to me this way (used)
2) My dog never sits or licks the drivers' side window but it is rippled no less.
3) They had previously approved these repairs! The only reason I am back is because they didn't have the parts in stock!

I think this is absurd. I have a call into the manager, but the SA I talked to didn't sound optimistic. It sounds completely nuts to me.

They also can't locate the rattle/squeak I mentioned, which was very noticeable before. Ugh.
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Old 07-22-2013, 12:58 PM
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BiHoTTo115 BiHoTTo115 is offline
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Wow, dog slobber, really? That's the best they could do? Sounds like a friggin' terrible dealership. Let us know what you hear back from manager.
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Old 07-22-2013, 01:08 PM
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thekurgan thekurgan is online now
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LOL @ dog slobber, it is caustic, but that isn't the cause of this rolling seal.
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Old 07-22-2013, 01:28 PM
Ilovemycar Ilovemycar is offline
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Eesh! Both at your "service" and the seal. If you go with kurgan's expert DIY tips, the only thing I might add is that you can use a card (possibly wrapped with something), to help fish out the seal if need be.

As for rattles and creaks, I've had them temporarily, maybe in order, central AC vent, rear seat/shelf, rear passenger shelf/door area, seat belt extender for driver. I solved them in order by adjusting vent, (this next one took the most work) backer rod then vacuum tubing between folding seat top and shelf then fonzie method then gummi pflege n krytox knockoff, Fonzie method, just tapping the seat belt extender. I suspect that the rear area rattles were exacerbated when I had a PDR done just a tiny bit rear of the passenger door (rear seat cushion and rear passenger side panel interior panel were removed). I've not had any rattles for a while now, and for a while there it was my #1 complaint about the car, far and away, no second place.

If kurgan is right about a a window being removed, I wonder how much that job exacerbated your rattles. For now, try some of this stuff on various seals for reducing rattle?
http://www.amazon.com/Finish-Line-Ex...4521213&sr=8-6
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Old 07-22-2013, 01:30 PM
hongsc hongsc is offline
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Just take it to another dealership. First dealership denied my broken air vents. Took it to another dealership and no problems. I know it's a pain otherwise it would have been $200 out of my pocket.
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Old 07-22-2013, 01:41 PM
countersurfer countersurfer is offline
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Thank you, guys! I feel more validated now that more people believe this dog slobber explanation is ridiculous! I will definitely check out the Gummi Pflege/Krytox for future use.

As for the "unreproduce-able' rattle/creak, it can be heard from *outside* the passenger's side, from underneath the car. It is metallic, relatively high-pitched, worse on bumpy roads, and sounds like a hollow/tinny metal pieces that were screwed on too tight about to break. It's like a combo of creak/rattle-clank/squeak. It sounds horrifying and embarrassing. (Perhaps compounded by the fact that I don't know much about how to fix cars.) Apologies for the weird description, but that's what it sounds like! It's audible when going slowly (driving on alley, pulling in to garage), going forward, going reverse, and at a stop (I was letting out a friend in front of his house and when he opened the door, it was very loud then.)

Thanks again! I left a long voicemail for the manager, and am in process of writing an email (I can better explain myself, and for everyone's records to have it in writing) will definitely update with what happens.
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Old 07-22-2013, 01:41 PM
countersurfer countersurfer is offline
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Oops, sorry again for the double post-don't know why I keep doing it!

Last edited by countersurfer; 07-22-2013 at 02:18 PM.
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Old 07-22-2013, 02:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by countersurfer View Post
Thank you, guys! I feel more validated now that more people believe this dog slobber explanation is ridiculous! I will definitely check out the Gummi Pflege/Krytox for future use.

As for the "unreproduce-able' rattle/creak, it can be heard from *outside* the passenger's side, from underneath the car. It is metallic, relatively high-pitched, worse on bumpy roads, and sounds like a hollow/tinny metal pieces that were screwed on too tight about to break. It's like a combo of creak/rattle-clank/squeak. It sounds horrifying and embarrassing. (Perhaps compounded by the fact that I don't know much about how to fix cars.) Apologies for the weird description, but that's what it sounds like! It's audible when going slowly (driving on alley, pulling in to garage), going forward, going reverse, and at a stop (I was letting out a friend in front of his house and when he opened the door, it was very loud then.)

Thanks again! I left a long voicemail for the manager, and am in process of writing an email (I can better explain myself, and for everyone's records to have it in writing) will definitely update with what happens.
Be careful with gummi or krytox on that seal, the innerside should be flocking material, if you get either of those on the flock, it will smear on the glass and will drive you nuts trying to get it off.
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Old 07-22-2013, 02:40 PM
countersurfer countersurfer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hongsc View Post
Just take it to another dealership. First dealership denied my broken air vents. Took it to another dealership and no problems. I know it's a pain otherwise it would have been $200 out of my pocket.
That's a thought; there is another one in my area. However, while dinking around with this window seal (and rattle) issue, my car has since gone out of warranty (back in May)—the repair order was started when it was still under warranty, and that's why I went back to this same place. I wonder if another dealership would honor repairs started pre-warranty expiration?

And, thekurgan, thanks for the tip about the Gummi stuff. My windows seems to be all rubber (I can't see any flocking material, anyway), but I will definitely heed your advice.
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Old 07-22-2013, 10:03 PM
hongsc hongsc is offline
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Wow good luck with that. You have a slim to no chance of a "good faith" repair. Most likely you're SOL with the warranty expired. You might want to check the DIY section and if you can do it.
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Old 07-23-2013, 07:05 AM
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Orient330iNYC Orient330iNYC is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hongsc View Post
Wow good luck with that. You have a slim to no chance of a "good faith" repair. Most likely you're SOL with the warranty expired. You might want to check the DIY section and if you can do it.
wow, thats misinformation.
"good will" repairs are done fairly regularly, especially if its documented within the warranty period and if the car is close to warranty expiration. the OP sounds like he is only about 2 months out of warranty. this is when having a good relationship with your dealer is critical.
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Old 07-23-2013, 12:51 PM
hongsc hongsc is offline
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Originally Posted by Orient330iNYC View Post
wow, thats misinformation.
"good will" repairs are done fairly regularly, especially if its documented within the warranty period and if the car is close to warranty expiration. the OP sounds like he is only about 2 months out of warranty. this is when having a good relationship with your dealer is critical.
Not misinformation. Actually in his case it's "good faith" because he initiated the repair before his warranty expired and went back to the same dealership. They said they would the repair it then denied. You also said "fairly regularly", which is dealership dependent. When you're out of warranty then it's a good will repair or not covered under warranty. Also he might have to go to a couple, several dealerships to get this fixed for free. He might give up and just pay out of pocket. It depends on much effort he wants to put in and if the dealership is willing to help out.
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Last edited by hongsc; 07-23-2013 at 12:52 PM.
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