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X1 E84 (2011 - current)
The new to the US BMW X1 will arrive at BMW dealers in the fall of 2012 as a 2013 model year. Get your X1 28i with either sDrive (RWD) or xDrive (AWD) or get the US exclusive I6 N55 powered X1 35i dDrive.

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  #1  
Old 08-19-2013, 06:18 PM
Chris Pringle Chris Pringle is offline
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X1's Electric Steering Vs Hydraulic Steering

Leaving the subject of RWD and AWD aside, a couple of years ago Car and Driver ran a series of blind (measured) tests with 11 expert drivers to drive a couple of BMW 5-series: one with electric steering and the other one with hydraulic steering. In the end, the results shocked the magazine as drivers overall performed better handling the electric-steered vehicle. The magazine even acknowledged that BMW got it right (or pretty close to it) in its implementation and programming characteristics of electric steering, but they were afraid that other manufacturers are not as meticulous as BMW.

As acknowledged, BMW is very careful about its implementation of new technologies and it is also into applying best practices. So, if they did a good job in the 5-series electric steering, they should have been able to dial it in in the X1.

So, I wonder: Is the preference for pure hydraulic steering (i.e., no Servotronic) in the X1 completely subjective? I have noticed that the bashing/criticism generally comes from drivers who have owned older generation of BMW's (some of whom also think manual shifting rules.) The changes taking place obviously represent a completely different sensation -- bad in the sense of "Hey! I'm not used to this! Give me my old BMW feel". But if they were put under similar tests in the X1, would the results shock us again?
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  #2  
Old 08-19-2013, 08:15 PM
HotRodW HotRodW is offline
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Having spent quite a bit of time with both 3- and 5-Series loaners with electric steering, i'm still of the opinion that BMW's hydraulic steering remains superior. It's not that their electric steering isn't accurate, it's that it lacks feel/feedback. There's a little bit of a disconnect between the steering wheel and front tires. It's also a little over-boosted for my taste. That said, there are hydraulic systems that lack feel as well. Some companies are doing their electric systems at least as good as their old hydraulics. But historically BMW has been renowned for steering feel, so they are measured against a higher standard.

Now that Infiniti is entering into "by-wire" steering, it will be interesting to see how the market reacts. My understanding is that this system deliberately isolates the driver from road feel in the interest of comfort. I just can't imagine how that must feel. I remain convinced that throttle-by-wire is at minimum a contributing factor toward the BMW and Audi throttle lag issues, so I'm not yet sold on any "by-wire" technology.
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  #3  
Old 08-19-2013, 08:48 PM
0w40X1 0w40X1 is offline
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My X1 s28i is my first BMW, but I have a Mazda RX8 with my first electric steering.

As new it would corner pretty good, but no cigar and felt vague, so I took it to the track a few times, then the alignment rack.

The rear camber was -2.1 degrees and the front was about -0.5 deg, so I had the rears minimized to their minimum adjustment of -1.65 deg, and matched the fronts to that with minor toe out.

Wow! It turns great, and I can actually feel off camber pavement pushing steering left to right.

In other words: feedback, and the tires are wearing evenly now.

If I catch my staggered 8x18 and 9x18 tires wearing funny, I'll do the same on those wheels.

My X1 M Sport without servotronic feels great so I don't know if it makes it any better.

I'm a less is less to go wrong guy.
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Old 08-19-2013, 09:24 PM
nostatic nostatic is offline
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My "gold standard" for steering was my '79 Porsche 911 that ended up being a street-legal track car. No power steering assist at all, and it was totally dialed in. You got incredible feedback into what was going on with the car. My two recent BMW data points are a 328i loaner (electric) and my new X1 (hydraulic). I also test drove the X1 (electric). I have to say that despite being taller the X1 fell more composed and reacted to steering inputs better than the 328i. The s28i wasn't bad actually but I actually didn't care for the steering feel changing with speed. There is a consistency with the hydraulic that so far I love. And even my wife, who drove it for the first time today, said, "I see why you like the steering on this."

It is inevitable that they'll all go to electric. And it is probably inevitable that cars will be increasingly self-driving and take almost all control away from the driver. Basically computers with wheels (we're mostly there). If I didn't have to slog through LA traffic a lot I'd be back in a Subie STi with a 6speed. The old Porsche was awesome in that regard. There wasn't auto anything in that car. Incredibly visceral experience. In my hands the hydraulic gives a bit more of that visceral "I'm part of the driving experience" feeling as opposed to the electric. The electric uses less gas, and is "smarter" (light at low speeds, tightens at higher speeds, can change modes, etc) but sometimes that isn't what people want. I remember tracking my VW GTI w/DSG (I couldn't drive a clutch at that point due to recovering from a moto accident). I did some laps in sport mode and others where I manually shifted with the paddles. I knew the track well and knew the proper shift and braking points. I was a bit faster in full auto because the car transmission was a bit smarter than me. But I lost a bit of connection with the driving experience.

Same with other nanny technologies. things like traction control are great on the road - they can save your butt. At the track though, when a student wanted me to drive his newer car I would usually turn them off. Because sometimes you want to get some slide/slip to learn things or to practice a technique. You can't really learn what a spin feels like (and then how to save it) if the car won't let you induce oversteer.
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  #5  
Old 08-20-2013, 05:09 AM
0w40X1 0w40X1 is offline
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I turned a 73 RX3 into a stiff autox car, and it was a light 2400# car without any power steering that worked great.

Now with all the cars loaded up with safety stuff,etc, they're all needing electric power. I don't care for power steering pumps since they can howl or leak.

My X1 has paddle shifters, but I only see the need on a steep hill.

I'm a real heretic since my RX8 even has 6spd auto, and it finds the right gear way better than me, so I can concentrate on the corner on track day.

I like traction control on both cars, since they can brake 1-2 or 3 wheels only which a driver can't do with one pedal.
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  #6  
Old 08-20-2013, 09:20 AM
mullini mullini is offline
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I have the sDrive and didn't test any other X1. First BMW. I wish the steering were a little tauter. Just a smidge. Now sure if I would be happy with hydraulic or wish it were just a smidge looser. Since I am so so happy with my X1 otherwise, it's no biggie.
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  #7  
Old 08-20-2013, 07:09 PM
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Pat_X5 Pat_X5 is offline
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I test drove the s28i and didn't like the disconnected steering but then I am a 12 year BMW veteran.

The next X1 I will test drive is the x28i and see if they have the hydraulic feel that I have become accustomed to.

I just don't know anything about the "Servotronic" option available on the s28i and x28i - is it worth the $250 ???

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  #8  
Old 08-20-2013, 07:24 PM
nospam nospam is offline
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Reports are that Servotronic is standard on all X1s from this point forward.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ///jbeck
Sorry for the response delay, crazy weekend. BMW put out the builliten a few weeks ago:

***IMPORTANT***
We are pleased to announce that starting with August, week 33 production, Option 216 (Servotronic) will be 100% equipment on the Model Year 2014 X1 2.8i (14XA) and X1 2.8xi (14XB). This change brings the X1 2.8 in line with the X1 3.5 and the New X5 (F15) which all have Servotronic as 100% equipment.


All Model Year 14 X1 2.8 vehicles equipped with 216 (Servotronic) that were produced prior to week 33 and have not be wholesaled will show no charge, which is a ($230/$250) reduction in wholesale/retail price.


National Automotive Sales

Last edited by nospam; 08-20-2013 at 07:29 PM.
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  #9  
Old 08-20-2013, 08:55 PM
Chris Pringle Chris Pringle is offline
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Great responses everyone!

Quote:
Originally Posted by HotRodW View Post
Having spent quite a bit of time with both 3- and 5-Series loaners with electric steering, i'm still of the opinion that BMW's hydraulic steering remains superior. It's not that their electric steering isn't accurate, it's that it lacks feel/feedback.
Yes, this is the general consensus from BMW's old guards. When you had the opportunity to drive those other BMW's, did you play around with the different modes (Sport, Comfort, etc.)? If so, what did you get out them?

Quote:
It's also a little over-boosted for my taste.
Could this be changed through programming of the EPS in the X1? BMW should really run with the ball with their massive rolling out of electric steering. If the entire thing is programmable, could they tackle this by having simulators at the dealerships. (Gosh, don't they have those steering wheels w/ feedback even on videogames now?) The customer dials in his/her steering preference. It goes into the dealership's service department for programming. BMW delivers a vehicle with the steering's feel and feedback that matches the customer's preference. I know I'm making it seem too easy, but we are living in the world of customization. The fact that lots of X1s are bespoke directly from the factory reflects this. It seems like they are missing an opportunity in regard to the personalized driving experience. In other words, MY ultimate driving experience might be completely different than YOURS. This might actually work better than having a bunch of buttons that most likely people forget about or are unsure when to use.

Quote:
But historically BMW has been renowned for steering feel, so they are measured against a higher standard.
Concur.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 0w40X1 View Post
My X1 M Sport without servotronic feels great so I don't know if it makes it any better.
I see you drive an X1 M Sport sDrive (electric steering, right?) I still don't understand why BMW offers servotronic as an option with its sDrive X1. Could someone enlighten me? Servotronic seems redundant with EPS.

I think most drivers new to BMW find their new electric steering pretty "dialed in." There are tons of these new BMW drivers in the new emerging markets around the world. I have driven a few vehicles with EPS (including Audi's.) I personally came out with the impression that BMW's EPS still feels the best. But the truth of the matter is that I haven't had the opportunity to drive most of the top brands/models out there to make a fair comparison.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nostatic View Post
My two recent BMW data points are a 328i loaner (electric) and my new X1 (hydraulic). I also test drove the X1 (electric). I have to say that despite being taller the X1 fell more composed and reacted to steering inputs better than the 328i. The s28i wasn't bad actually but I actually didn't care for the steering feel changing with speed. There is a consistency with the hydraulic that so far I love. And even my wife, who drove it for the first time today, said, "I see why you like the steering on this."
Very interesting to read how/why you chose your X1. It's indeed a great car in so many ways. But when it comes to steering, it seems so hard to please everyone. There are others who test-drive the hydraulic steering in the xDrive and find it too heavy (even unacceptable) at low speeds unless they equip it with servotronic.

Your old Porsche was indeed a true sports car. BMWs, on the other hand, is a mixed bag of sports, comfort and sophistication in one package. A car that can be driven everyday on virtually all kinds of (paved) roads. Comfort ranks high on BMW's priority list as we see how these cars are equipped.

Quote:
In my hands the hydraulic gives a bit more of that visceral "I'm part of the driving experience" feeling as opposed to the electric. The electric uses less gas, and is "smarter" (light at low speeds, tightens at higher speeds, can change modes, etc) but sometimes that isn't what people want.
Yes, it's a situation where BMW (same goes with other car manufacturers) has taken the position of "We know what's best for our customers." The blind test ran by Car and Driver Magazine very much reflects this -- overall better steering/handling with EPS. The results, albeit shocking, were certainly insightful and spoke for themselves.

Quote:
I remember tracking my VW GTI w/DSG (I couldn't drive a clutch at that point due to recovering from a moto accident). I did some laps in sport mode and others where I manually shifted with the paddles. I knew the track well and knew the proper shift and braking points. I was a bit faster in full auto because the car transmission was a bit smarter than me. But I lost a bit of connection with the driving experience.
Exactly! Point in case.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mullini View Post
I have the sDrive and didn't test any other X1. First BMW. I wish the steering were a little tauter. Just a smidge. Now sure if I would be happy with hydraulic or wish it were just a smidge looser. Since I am so so happy with my X1 otherwise, it's no biggie.
It sounds like overall BMW got it right for you the first time.

Last edited by Chris Pringle; 08-21-2013 at 06:08 AM.
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  #10  
Old 08-20-2013, 09:10 PM
Chris Pringle Chris Pringle is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nospam View Post
Reports are that Servotronic is standard on all X1s from this point forward.
That's right...

xDrive - Hydraulic w/ standard Servotronic
sDrive - Electric steering (also w/ Servotronic??)

PAT: I bet you can still find some '14 X1 xDrive without Servotronic (pure hydraulic steering) at your local dealership before they are all gone.
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  #11  
Old 08-20-2013, 09:28 PM
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Pat_X5 Pat_X5 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Pringle View Post
That's right...

xDrive - Hydraulic w/ standard Servotronic
sDrive - Electric steering (also w/ Servotronic??)

PAT: I bet you can still find some '14 X1 xDrive without Servotronic (pure hydraulic steering) at your local dealership before they are all gone.
Thanks Chris for the heads up!

Looks like based on this forum that I will be having a custom built x28i X1 with hydraulic steering which I have become accustomed to !

I am looking forward to my European Delivery of a custom built X1 next spring!

Thanks to everyone !

Last edited by Pat_X5; 08-20-2013 at 09:50 PM.
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  #12  
Old 08-21-2013, 06:12 AM
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Originally Posted by nospam View Post
Reports are that Servotronic is standard on all X1s from this point forward.
Thank you nospam for the good news!
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  #13  
Old 08-21-2013, 08:32 AM
mullini mullini is offline
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So what does Servotronic do? (I think of MST3K every time I see that word). In a hydraulic X1, it makes steering a little easier at lower speeds? In an electronic X1, it makes it heavier at freeway speeds? I don't quite get how it works to the advantage of both systems.

When I was initially researching the X1 in summer/fall 2012, a frequent comment was on the heaviness of the steering at lower speeds. So when I test drove the sDrive, I thought, "What the heck are they talking about? It's not heavy at all." Only later did I become aware those commentators were in the xDrive, which had the hydraulic.

I've mentioned this before, and no one has chimed in with a "me too" - but from time to time, when I start my car up, I'll get a brief flashing notice "steering assistance malfunction." I think it happens when I have swung into a favorite office parking space at an angle. The flash disappears almost immediately and doesn't reappear during the drive. I'll ask about it when I finally go in for service. Have a feeling the SA will shrug and say, "Nothing serious. Ignore it." Which I do. But I didn't know I had "steering assistance. " In the sDrive it's hard to imagine needing assistance.
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Old 08-21-2013, 09:53 AM
nospam nospam is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mullini View Post
So what does Servotronic do? ....In an electronic X1, it makes it heavier at freeway speeds?
That is my understanding on sDrives.
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Old 08-21-2013, 10:05 AM
eric9610 eric9610 is offline
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I just heard that all new '14 orders come with servotronic included at no charge. It is on the new build sheets.
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Old 08-21-2013, 11:17 AM
nospam nospam is offline
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Originally Posted by eric9610 View Post
I just heard that all new '14 orders come with servotronic included at no charge. It is on the new build sheets.
Yes, see post #8 above.
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Old 08-21-2013, 10:22 PM
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Just ordered my sDrive. Servotronic is listed as N/C.
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Old 08-25-2013, 05:12 PM
ubanysan ubanysan is offline
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I was just in the process of deciding on how to custom build my X1. I took the time to test drive models both with and without servotronic. Upon deciding that I preferred models without servotronic much more than with. . . I was very aggravated to see the new bulletin stating that servotronic is now standard. Does anyone have the info on whether it would be possible to custom build a new X1 without the servotronic? my sales managers seems to be downplaying the importance of this to me and suggesting that i might just have to go with servotronic. I would much rather find an existing model on the lot without it and compromise custom features. also, question #2: does anyone know if there is a difference in the m sport line's servotronic? is the steering feel and handling affected by tuning for that particular line? I know the suspension supposedly is but wanted to know if the heavier feel of the hydraulic would be incorporated in an "m line servotronic" #wishfulthinking #iwantoneofthelasthydraulics!
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Old 08-25-2013, 05:47 PM
dgkfl dgkfl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ubanysan View Post
I know the suspension supposedly is but wanted to know if the heavier feel of the hydraulic would be incorporated in an "m line servotronic" #wishfulthinking #iwantoneofthelasthydraulics!
You may be confused...xDrives will still have hydraulic power steering. Servotronic is a feature available with both HPS and EPS.
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Old 08-25-2013, 06:05 PM
Chris Pringle Chris Pringle is offline
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1. Servotronic is now part of the X1's standard assembly line. When this happens, standard components cannot be removed unless they're being upgraded. Your best bet (to find an xDrive without servotronic) is to find a vehicle from a lot. It's very common to see people in this forum call around (even to dealerships in nearby states) until find the X1 they want. We drove 6 hours to get ours. Also your local BMW dealer can open a national search and have it transported to their door. It's very likely that in Atlanta (due to local weather) that sDrive X1's are more readily available than xDrive. The inventory is different in other states where it snows a lot.

2. Yes, suspension is affected in M sports, but the steering remains the same. It will just vary if you choose sDrive (electric steering) or xDrive (hydraulic.)

Last edited by Chris Pringle; 08-25-2013 at 06:15 PM.
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Old 08-25-2013, 06:10 PM
Chris Pringle Chris Pringle is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dgkfl View Post
You may be confused...xDrives will still have hydraulic power steering. Servotronic is a feature available with both HPS and EPS.
Yes, the xDrive's steering is hydraulic. It used to come with optional servotronic for a $250 add-on, but as of this month, BMW added servotronic to its entire line of X1's. It's now a standard feature on all X1's (sDrive and xDrive) being manufactured from here on.

Last edited by Chris Pringle; 08-25-2013 at 06:11 PM.
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  #22  
Old 08-26-2013, 11:43 AM
bmw_again bmw_again is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Pringle View Post
Yes, the xDrive's steering is hydraulic. It used to come with optional servotronic for a $250 add-on, but as of this month, BMW added servotronic to its entire line of X1's. It's now a standard feature on all X1's (sDrive and xDrive) being manufactured from here on.
Ok, just my luck.. So what does it do exactly to the hydraulic? I liked the xDrive hydraulic so much that chances are I'm not going to like servotronic!
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Old 08-26-2013, 12:29 PM
eric9610 eric9610 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmw_again View Post
Ok, just my luck.. So what does it do exactly to the hydraulic? I liked the xDrive hydraulic so much that chances are I'm not going to like servotronic!
servotronic on the hydraulic steering makes it loose at low speeds so the car is easy to maneuver for parking. At higher speeds i believe 40mph and above it gets firm like normal hydraulic steering.
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Old 08-26-2013, 12:36 PM
Chris Pringle Chris Pringle is offline
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It just makes it easy to steer at very low speeds (e.g., parking, making a U-turn, etc.) Supposedly at higher speeds it should feel normal "hydraulically" speaking, although some people here report that it doesn't feel quite the same anymore with servotronic installed. This is why some are trying to snatch up the remainder X1 xDrives with "raw" hydraulic steering still left at some dealers' lots. If you were thinking of doing a custom order from the factory, forget about it.

Last edited by Chris Pringle; 08-26-2013 at 12:45 PM.
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  #25  
Old 08-26-2013, 06:30 PM
Jim Quilliam Jim Quilliam is offline
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Would the X1 sDrive 28i be a good car for driving around town, freeway driving, etc. We are not planning to use this car for mountain/snow driving. We live in the San Francisco area. Trying to decide if getting the xDrive 28i would improve the driving performance of this car under these conditions and be worth the extra money.
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