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E30 (1982 - 1993)
God's Chariot. The E30 was produced primarily from 1982 through 1991. The cabriolet was the one exception which was produced through 1993.

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  #1  
Old 08-31-2013, 11:23 AM
Pancho325ic Pancho325ic is online now
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Again no fuel/spark, but cranks

Hi all. Well heres the deal my 1989 e30 325ic has no fuel or spark.Here's what I have done so far:
There's fuel, fuse#11 good, main & fuelpump relay good, coil is good, cps has good ohms but no voltage when cranking, ecu good, fuel pumps when jumped run, I've checked for continuity to the wires all good. The only thing that I've seen not do is main relay #87 red/wht wire doesn't power fuel pump relay #85. I understand that pin #3 on the ecu grounds 85 on tbe puelpump relay in order to power #87 on the main relay wich supplies power to fuse #11.
QUESTION: CAN I ground pin #3 of the ecu to a permanent ground ? OR of course any other advise???
Oh what does pin #27 do??
Thanks in advance...
Pancho
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  #2  
Old 08-31-2013, 01:46 PM
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sounds like the ignition switch is worn
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Old 08-31-2013, 02:03 PM
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Re: Again no fuel/spark, but cranks

Thanks, downhiller. As a matter of fact that was my other project this afternoon. By aby chance is it true that if a cps has good ohms but no voltage when cranking its a bad cps?

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Old 09-01-2013, 01:56 AM
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no. if you dont have voltage to the cps, then its something before. so wiring, ecu, ignition switch, relays, fuses
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Old 09-04-2013, 07:24 AM
Pancho325ic Pancho325ic is online now
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Re: Again no fuel/spark, but cranks

Hi downhiller, I wanted to give u an update. I went with the igintion and started testing it. Theres a red wire(always hot) that's ok, but when you turn on the ignition, the green wire that goes to the C101 connection pin #7, theres no voltage to it. I suspect that's my problem because that same wire goes to the ECU Pin #27, which is the start ignition connection. So I did a reverse test, I placed power to the connection of the ECU end(without the ecu connected) and got voltage to Pin #7 of the C101. But from there, there was no voltage to the ignition. BUT HERES another deal, the green wire feom the ignition is also connected to two relays and the on board computer. QUESTION? DO they all have to be connected?
And thanks for the advice. Ill keep u updated
Pancho325ic

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Old 09-06-2013, 01:59 PM
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Re: Again no fuel/spark, but cranks

Ok so here's the update. Still after changing the cps NOTHING! I'm bummmed out now since I thought for sure it was the cps. Any help would be appreciated. HELP.
SO FAR:
Fuse#11good-but no power
Main and fuel pump relays -good
Cps -good
Coil -good
Fuelpump -good
Ignition swith -good
Ecu -good
Help help help


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  #7  
Old 09-08-2013, 03:07 AM
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What test did the ecu undergo?
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  #8  
Old 09-08-2013, 03:45 AM
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I have the exact same problem on my 1983 318i!!!!!!
The previous owner removed the fuel pump and bought a new one as he suspected that was wrong with the fuel. I changed it, then discovered theres no power reaching the pump. Turns out the relay was cooked so I rewired a new 30 amp relay in. Nothing. The car cranks but still no go its so frustrating please HELPPPPP
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Old 09-08-2013, 08:09 AM
Pancho325ic Pancho325ic is online now
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Re: Again no fuel/spark, but cranks

I tested the ecu by getting a chart of the 55pin diagram and the test recomendations....everything tested good however I still need to recheck Pin #36 since that pin powers the main relay.
That was one of my two issues that I had with the car. I thought Pin #3 powered the main relay but it only grounds the main relay
The other issue I have is that Pin #27 has only 7-9 volts If I remember right that should have 12 volts since the power comes from the ignition switch.....
Ohh on another note, I've been reading about the immoboliser. I want to by pass it, where is it located?
Thanks for the help in advance.....

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Old 09-08-2013, 05:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pancho325ic View Post
I tested the ecu by getting a chart of the 55pin diagram and the test recomendations....everything tested good however I still need to recheck Pin #36 since that pin powers the main relay.
That was one of my two issues that I had with the car. I thought Pin #3 powered the main relay but it only grounds the main relay
The other issue I have is that Pin #27 has only 7-9 volts If I remember right that should have 12 volts since the power comes from the ignition switch.....
Ohh on another note, I've been reading about the immoboliser. I want to by pass it, where is it located?
Thanks for the help in advance.....

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If you have only 7-9 volts on pin 27, everything did NOT test good, but nice work on taking the steps to actually test it. Not many do.

I have no advice about the immobilizer. None of the E30s I've worked on had one.
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Old 09-08-2013, 10:19 PM
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I don't think the imob will be factory. Easy to find - look under the dash for the non factory wiring installed to the lowest standard.
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  #12  
Old 09-12-2013, 03:48 PM
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Re: Again no fuel/spark, but cranks

Can anyone tell me if pin #36 of the ecu is a positive power for the main relay Or is it a ground. That brown wire from what I have read powers the the main relay which in return provides back power to the ecu pin #37. Red/blue wire. Any help would be greatly appreciated....Or is my ecu not working since it doesn't provide power?..... thanks in advanve

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Old 09-12-2013, 05:32 PM
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#36 pin is the power to operate the main relay. Pin #37 is the power input FROM the main relay to the ECU. In other words, if #36 doesn't power up, #37 will never get power.

You need this:

http://wedophones.com/Manuals/BMW/19...g%20Manual.pdf

Right-click and "save as". It's the factory ETM for the '89 E30 convertible.
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1995 318is "Bebe"; 1993 325is "Elvira" 1985 635CSi "Katja" 1984 633CSi "Sylvia"
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Old 09-17-2013, 06:20 AM
Pancho325ic Pancho325ic is online now
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Re: Again no fuel/spark, but cranks

I want to thank those who have been helping out. As far as my problem. ...
It looks like the connect to fuse #11 is broken! From an eye view, I took it for granted that the fuse was ok. But I didn't realize or see that one of the connector that provided power to fuse 11 was broken.
Question? can I cut the two wires the green violet that comes from the fuel pump relay and the red violet one? Place a fuse to them so that I don't have to take off the distribution box? ?

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Old 09-23-2013, 02:59 PM
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Re: Again no fuel/spark, but cranks

Even though I bypaased the fuse box NOTHING. DAM car still wont start. I rechecked for spark but yhe coil was burning up. I changed ir nope no luck. I still have no spark or fuel pumping. The other issue is that Pin #3 of the ecu is with positive power. Shouldnt it be. Ground? Since it grounds fuel pump relay #87??? Any help wold be appreciated. ..getting desperate here..

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Old 09-24-2013, 06:09 PM
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The coil SHOULD NOT be "burning up". It will get warm, even hot, but not excessively so. Something's not connected right. I can't diagnose it further without being there.
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1995 318is "Bebe"; 1993 325is "Elvira" 1985 635CSi "Katja" 1984 633CSi "Sylvia"
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Old 09-24-2013, 08:42 PM
Pancho325ic Pancho325ic is online now
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Re: Again no fuel/spark, but cranks

Thanks HornH, I was begining to think I was on my own. Ok so, I'm thinking its gotta be all the green wires connected right after tge ignition swith. I noticed that the abs and the on board computer is also conected to it. There's also a relay an abs relay? What should icheck now. Oh and another question? Pin #3 of the ecu is the ground to #87 of the fuel pump relay why is it then that it has positive power to it and not ground??? Thanks!

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Old 09-24-2013, 08:45 PM
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the ground could have a bad connection/broken wire
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Old 09-27-2013, 06:14 AM
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Re: Again no fuel/spark, but cranks

Ok so now two coils got super hot and burned???? Any suggestions??

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Old 09-28-2013, 08:11 AM
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This thread is beginning to confuse me, looks like 2 different problems from afar... 1) no fuel pump action.. and 2) ign coils burning up...

... no spark,... no fuel... = no run..


Pancho good catch on finding the broken fuse connector " inside" the fuse box, I suspect you 'could' jump the violet//red -(into the fuse box) and green/ violet(out of the fuse box),...install a7.5A fuse, and bypass the fuse box all together as you described, but it is recommended only as a temp 'field-fix'...You failed to mention if after jumping and installing the fuse, ..if 'now ' you have battery power to the fuel pump ": in Start or/and Run?? Both??.... A so do you have fuel now??

The fuel pump relay now works??? always verify each repair or step... never take anything for granted.....











Contrary to popular belief ...loose connections do indeed blow fuses,. The .high resistance found between poor metal connections can and WILL develop LARGE amounts of HEAT, certainly enough to melt the protective plastic sheathing over the copper stranded wire...
often enough to melt the plastic fuse box interior bindings which hold the small metal connector at the wire end in place...allowing it to 'slip away' from it's anchorage and touch things it's not intended to.... cascading into more weird unexplained problems... bare wires inside the fuse box is never a good thing..

try tackling one circuit/ problem at a time... circuit by circuit...

You may have to disassemble the fuse box to inspect for unknown issues... and to replace any lost smoke...



I'll be watching from afar....




Also for your information... any brown wires you encounter are almost certainly " grounds or ground paths"...
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Old 09-28-2013, 09:43 AM
cjmertz cjmertz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hornhospital View Post
If you have only 7-9 volts on pin 27, everything did NOT test good, but nice work on taking the steps to actually test it. Not many do.

I have no advice about the immobilizer. None of the E30s I've worked on had one.


From what I can see, pin 27 at the ECU should receive "Battery voltage"... on 1.5 GN from IGN Swx thru C101"without" an OBC,


"with OBC" the ECU Pin 27 sees battery voltage from IGN Swx thru pin4, connector C4 (green/Red) at the code relay box.... then thru a single pin connector (C104),green Red
to 1.5 Green ... then, thru pin 7 at C101.,. look at and review the circuit schematics closely..

...2 important things about this..



#1) To clarify what Horn Doctor mentions..., 7-9 volts is a marginal reading, most solid state ECU's will often refuse to "wake-up" with less than 9 volts or even operate correctly with less than 12-13 volts....charge the battery, insure the ECU receives a "full" 12 volts,
anything less results in a lot of unnecessary tail-chasing.. repeated attempts to start the vehicle may have lowered the battery voltage availability...

#2) ..As a quick check, if the IGN coil has 12volts at the 2.5 green connection, the OBC relay box is working and allowing voltage to pass thru it, .. forget about trying to eliminate it, that usually only creates more of a Rat's nest/reliability problem later....

On the other hand ,, if the 2.5 Green connection at the IGN coil has battery voltage with the
Ignition key in in ANY position "other than" "START" or "RUN" , you have another issue
that needs to be corrected,,
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Old 09-28-2013, 10:04 AM
Pancho325ic Pancho325ic is online now
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Re: Again no fuel/spark, but cranks

Thank you so much Cjmertz! I really appreciate the fact that you are reading into my post/problem.

Ok so after jumping the wires with an outside fuse still no power to fuse. I backtracted for power to the main and fuel pump relays and they are good. HOWEVER, on the fuel pump relay #87 brn/grn wire, that comes from the ECU PIN #3. That pin is supposed to ground the fuel pump relay so that it can provide power to fuse #11 But it does not. I did ground it manually and the fuelpump did run....maybe its my Ecu that's bad?

As far as the coil burning up. The only thing that I can see is that the green wire that goes to the coil is also wired to other green wires that are connected to the abs relay the abs itself and the on board computer. So I'm thinking that If one of those parts are not working maybe its shorting out the coil thus burning it up.

To make things clear on when this happened. One day I parked the car and I started placing all the wires underneath the driver side to its normal position. I also started to connect all the wiring connectors that were not connected together thinking they belong together and after that no spark or fuel.
Thanks again.
Pancho

Ps someone also mention I should get the code for thw on board computer
Where can I get this from.

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Old 09-28-2013, 11:35 AM
cjmertz cjmertz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pancho325ic View Post
Thank you so much Cjmertz! I really appreciate the fact that you are reading into my post/problem.

Ok so after jumping the wires with an outside fuse still no power to fuse. I backtracted for power to the main and fuel pump relays and they are good. HOWEVER, on the fuel pump relay #87 brn/grn wire, that comes from the ECU PIN #3. That pin is supposed to ground the fuel pump relay so that it can provide power to fuse #11 But it does not. I did ground it manually and the fuel pump did run ...maybe its my Ecu that's bad?..

As far as the coil burning up. The only thing that I can see is that the green wire that goes to the coil is also wired to other green wires that are connected to the abs relay the abs itself and the on board computer. So I'm thinking that If one of those parts are not working maybe its shorting out the coil thus burning it up.

To make things clear on when this happened. One day I parked the car and I started placing all the wires underneath the driver side to its normal position. I also started to connect all the wiring connectors that were not connected together thinking they belong together and after that no spark or fuel.
Thanks again.
Pancho

Ps someone also mention I should get the code for the on board computer[?
Where can I get this fro

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So , If the fuel pump relay powers fuse 11 after grounding pin 85 of the fuel pump relay externally and MANUALLY... that circuit is good!... of course the ECU will have to ground the relay internally via pin3 of the ECU but only after all other running/start conditions are met,...IE; good battery voltages all around are needed, engine revolutions/cranking signal via the CPS, IGN Power/spark and fuel availability ...I would not be too quick to condemn an ECU just yet...slow down verify all other inputs are good 1st.


Did you double check your IGN Swx power at the coil? does power go away with IGN Swx off

do you have 12 volts coming out of the fuel pump relay at pin85 ?? when cranking?

if not your main relay is inop for some reason..

review the ETM Horn Doctor provided...let us kknow what you find....


Sounds like your problems began when you crawled under the drivers side dash and began tidying things up... this is where you should return, examine everything. Twice , 3 times...

99.9% of the time when something starts happening AFTER you did something else, your at fault without realizing it you may have created an issue... trust me on this one..
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Old 10-24-2013, 09:14 AM
Pancho325ic Pancho325ic is online now
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Re: Again no fuel/spark, but cranks

Hey guys, I'm still at it with these issues. Any other suggestions?? Last thing I can do now is change the ECU.

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Old 10-24-2013, 10:06 PM
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give it a shot thats bout the last thing there is. maybe when the coil went it send enough power to fry the ecu
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