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F10 / F11 (2011 - Current)
The new chapter in the highly successful story of the BMW 5 Series Sedan (F10) and wagon (F11)

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  #1  
Old 09-10-2013, 09:15 AM
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badblack550xi badblack550xi is offline
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BMS Stage I F10 550Xi VS Stage 5 Dinan 550XI

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  #2  
Old 09-10-2013, 09:58 AM
hotrod2448 hotrod2448 is offline
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Potential outcomes of this thread:

1. BMS stage 1 beats Dinan stage 5. Dinan is such overpriced crap.
2. It takes Dinan stage 5 to match/beat BMS stage 1. Dinan is such overpriced crap.

The end.
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  #3  
Old 09-10-2013, 10:47 AM
PapaFlEx PapaFlEx is offline
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Originally Posted by badblack550xi View Post
Stay Tuned guys this show down will be here shortly
When
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  #4  
Old 09-10-2013, 11:10 AM
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There better be a video or it didn't happen, but im putting my money on you
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  #5  
Old 09-10-2013, 11:12 AM
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BMS Stage I F10 550Xi VS Stage 5 Dinan 550XI

Quote:
Originally Posted by hotrod2448 View Post
Potential outcomes of this thread:

1. BMS stage 1 beats Dinan stage 5. Dinan is such overpriced crap.
2. It takes Dinan stage 5 to match/beat BMS stage 1. Dinan is such overpriced crap.

The end.
Hate much?

Over in the F01 forum a non-drag racer type (no bag of tricks) only gained 0.1 secs in the quarter mile with BMS. BB can easily beat anyone who only installs BMS, so us BMS a piece of crap? I don't think we'll learn anything significant no matter who he races. He knows how to make his cars go fast in a straight line.


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  #6  
Old 09-10-2013, 12:59 PM
PapaFlEx PapaFlEx is offline
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Originally Posted by dunderhi View Post
Hate much?

Over in the F01 forum a non-drag racer type (no bag of tricks) only gained 0.1 secs in the quarter mile with BMS. BB can easily beat anyone who only installs BMS, so us BMS a piece of crap? I don't think we'll learn anything significant no matter who he races. He knows how to make his cars go fast in a straight line.


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Seems like you have the same type of feeling for BB and BMS as well? And the difference was .3 secs. Cant we all just get along?
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Last edited by PapaFlEx; 09-10-2013 at 01:01 PM.
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  #7  
Old 09-10-2013, 01:33 PM
hotrod2448 hotrod2448 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dunderhi View Post
Hate much?

Over in the F01 forum a non-drag racer type (no bag of tricks) only gained 0.1 secs in the quarter mile with BMS. BB can easily beat anyone who only installs BMS, so us BMS a piece of crap? I don't think we'll learn anything significant no matter who he races. He knows how to make his cars go fast in a straight line.


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A bit sensitive huh?

It's not hate, it's a joke. I've seen the OP's previous posts and was taking a bit of a jab at him and his hate for Dinan.
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  #8  
Old 09-10-2013, 01:46 PM
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There better be a video or it didn't happen, but im putting my money on you
i don't run with out videos
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  #9  
Old 09-10-2013, 01:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hotrod2448 View Post
Potential outcomes of this thread:

1. BMS stage 1 beats Dinan stage 5. Dinan is such overpriced crap.
2. It takes Dinan stage 5 to match/beat BMS stage 1. Dinan is such overpriced crap.

The end.
you summed it all up =D
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  #10  
Old 09-10-2013, 03:54 PM
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BB, is your car bought or leased?
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  #11  
Old 09-10-2013, 04:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hotrod2448 View Post
1. BMS stage 1 beats Dinan stage 5. Dinan is such overpriced crap.
2. It takes Dinan stage 5 to match/beat BMS stage 1. Dinan is such overpriced crap.
3. Dinan is such overpriced crap.
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  #12  
Old 09-10-2013, 06:46 PM
greyF10 greyF10 is offline
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Just ordered the BMS unit. Will report back this weekend when it arrives.
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  #13  
Old 09-10-2013, 06:52 PM
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Please provide tire setup, psi and octane info as reference too. Thanks!
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  #14  
Old 09-10-2013, 07:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hotrod2448 View Post
A bit sensitive huh?

It's not hate, it's a joke. I've seen the OP's previous posts and was taking a bit of a jab at him and his hate for Dinan.
A have helped me get the joke. BTW, BB doesn't really hate Dinan, he's just having some fun poking at the F10 establishment. His car would be faster if he had Dinan and BMS together pushing 16-18psi. Now, if he could program BMS to push those pressures on its own, he could start poking fun at M5 owners.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PapaFlEx View Post
8571Seems like you have the same type of feeling for BB and BMS as well? And the difference was .3 secs. Cant we all just get along?
I have no hate for BB or BMS. I respect BB and have been supportive of him in multiple threads. I believe he'll eventually break the 12 second barrier. I am concerned when people start thinking just installing add-on tune will give them a 12.1 sec car. As far as BMS is concerned, I have posted several times that I have considered putting BMS on top of my Dinan tune for track days, so there's no hate there. I just want people to know the facts on a level playing field.

We can get along only if you tell the whole truth and not use apples vs oranges to inflate any tune's performance. Richard only did one back-to-back test of Stock vs BMS and the difference was 0.1 sec.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard109 View Post
Here were my times running stock and then with the BMS. I only had about 800 miles on the car at the time so I think the numbers will improve now. Going to try and go to the track this Thursday.

*******>*******>********>********>
StockBurger N63 Stage 1
8/1/20138/1/2013
#1#2#3#4AVG#1#2#3#4AVG
Reaction0.43040.18610.17860.10020.223825Reaction0.07390.00840.50610.68380.31805
60 FT2.49462.50832.40232.47162.469260 FT2.46462.52622.23872.39022.404925
330 FT6.09746.08955.96776.0566.05265330 FT6.01636.0795.6485.92025.915875
1/8 ET9.01429.00158.87868.97678.967751/8 ET8.92138.97958.65578.81718.8434
1/8 MPH84.6284.7684.7684.7384.71751/8 MPH84.9785.185.3285.1685.1375
1000 ET11.508611.495111.373811.472111.46241000 ET11.413911.467311.136511.305311.33075
1000 MPH98.1998.1798.1798.398.20751000 MPH98.1798.3698.5898.2198.33
1/4 ET13.605513.59213.471513.571113.5600251/4 ET13.512513.560913.224713.402513.42515
1/4 MPH107.42107.4107.42107.32107.391/4 MPH107.37107.58107.91107.45107.5775
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Last edited by dunderhi; 09-10-2013 at 07:53 PM.
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  #15  
Old 09-10-2013, 07:54 PM
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  #16  
Old 09-10-2013, 10:38 PM
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Not enough runs
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  #17  
Old 09-10-2013, 10:40 PM
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"Here were my times running stock and then with the BMS. I only had about 800 miles on the car at the time so I think the numbers will improve now. Going to try and go to the track this Thursday."

*******>*******>********>********>



1. Reaction time is different
2. Wheel spin? Not commented on.
3. N=4. Low statistical power.
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  #18  
Old 09-11-2013, 04:11 AM
hotrod2448 hotrod2448 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dunderhi View Post
A have helped me get the joke. BTW, BB doesn't really hate Dinan, he's just having some fun poking at the F10 establishment. His car would be faster if he had Dinan and BMS together pushing 16-18psi. Now, if he could program BMS to push those pressures on its own, he could start poking fun at M5 owners.



I have no hate for BB or BMS. I respect BB and have been supportive of him in multiple threads. I believe he'll eventually break the 12 second barrier. I am concerned when people start thinking just installing add-on tune will give them a 12.1 sec car. As far as BMS is concerned, I have posted several times that I have considered putting BMS on top of my Dinan tune for track days, so there's no hate there. I just want people to know the facts on a level playing field.

We can get along only if you tell the whole truth and not use apples vs oranges to inflate any tune's performance. Richard only did one back-to-back test of Stock vs BMS and the difference was 0.1 sec.
I figured the wink was enough to convey sarcasm.

Just like dynos have issues for comparisons so does the drag strip. Usually the driver being the biggest one and the track being the second. Across several forums I've seen tuners that get themselves a hot shoe that can put up numbers no one can match just to say "with our tune you can run low 12's" even though no average driver could match those numbers.

As far as stacking tunes goes I'd be very wary of doing that. You could run into a situation where not only does the boost increase compound but, so could timing advance, which could be bad with that amount of boost.

If BMS put out a tune specifically for stacking with Dinan or GIAC or whatever is out there that might be kind of cool but, that might be a limited market since it seems the main reasons most people go with a flash are to avoid "tricking" the ECU with some type of external logic, hopefully for it to be more a refined tune, and with Dinan to keep the warranty.

Last edited by hotrod2448; 09-11-2013 at 04:15 AM.
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  #19  
Old 09-11-2013, 05:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hotrod2448 View Post
I figured the wink was enough to convey sarcasm.

Just like dynos have issues for comparisons so does the drag strip. Usually the driver being the biggest one and the track being the second. Across several forums I've seen tuners that get themselves a hot shoe that can put up numbers no one can match just to say "with our tune you can run low 12's" even though no average driver could match those numbers.

As far as stacking tunes goes I'd be very wary of doing that. You could run into a situation where not only does the boost increase compound but, so could timing advance, which could be bad with that amount of boost.

If BMS put out a tune specifically for stacking with Dinan or GIAC or whatever is out there that might be kind of cool but, that might be a limited market since it seems the main reasons most people go with a flash are to avoid "tricking" the ECU with some type of external logic, hopefully for it to be more a refined tune, and with Dinan to keep the warranty.
I understand the could be some additional for risk engine damage, but I'd only stack tunes for track night when running on 100 Octane gas. I had read that Procede tuned the N63 up to 17 psi before backing off. So, while both Dinan(14psi) & BMS(12 or 14psi) are being a bit conservative, I would think a 16psi stack could work out for driving 12 seconds at a time, then again I've seen cars towed away for only making it halfway down the track.
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Old 09-11-2013, 05:46 AM
hotrod2448 hotrod2448 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dunderhi View Post
I understand the could be some additional for risk engine damage, but I'd only stack tunes for track night when running on 100 Octane gas. I had read that Procede tuned the N63 up to 17 psi before backing off. So, while both Dinan(14psi) & BMS(12 or 14psi) are being a bit conservative, I would think a 16psi stack could work out for driving 12 seconds at a time, then again I've seen cars towed away for only making it halfway down the track.
I don't know man. When I had my 335 with a procede I could run higher settings on the street with a given octane than I could at the track. I think it has to do with the load being that much higher due to the amount of traction available at the strip.

As I said before I would be more concerned about the potential of the dinan tune advancing ignition timing X and then the BMS tune advancing it X more than I would be about just the boost.

I'm not the type to gamble on a hand I'm not willing to lose and the cost of a BMW engine replacement is more than I'm willing pay for a few tenths of a second.

Last edited by hotrod2448; 09-11-2013 at 06:35 AM.
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  #21  
Old 09-11-2013, 06:30 AM
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badblack550xi badblack550xi is offline
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BB, is your car bought or leased?
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  #22  
Old 09-11-2013, 06:56 AM
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Originally Posted by badblack550xi View Post
Seems like a reasonable question. You are certainly running the car hard and if I was driving a two year rental I would perhaps feel inclined to do the same. You should take her on a course with a few turns and see how she does.
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  #23  
Old 09-11-2013, 07:06 AM
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badblack550xi badblack550xi is offline
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Seems like a reasonable question. You are certainly running the car hard and if I was driving a two year rental I would perhaps feel inclined to do the same. You should take her on a course with a few turns and see how she does.




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  #24  
Old 09-11-2013, 07:47 AM
PapaFlEx PapaFlEx is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dunderhi View Post
A have helped me get the joke. BTW, BB doesn't really hate Dinan, he's just having some fun poking at the F10 establishment. His car would be faster if he had Dinan and BMS together pushing 16-18psi. Now, if he could program BMS to push those pressures on its own, he could start poking fun at M5 owners.



I have no hate for BB or BMS. I respect BB and have been supportive of him in multiple threads. I believe he'll eventually break the 12 second barrier. I am concerned when people start thinking just installing add-on tune will give them a 12.1 sec car. As far as BMS is concerned, I have posted several times that I have considered putting BMS on top of my Dinan tune for track days, so there's no hate there. I just want people to know the facts on a level playing field.

We can get along only if you tell the whole truth and not use apples vs oranges to inflate any tune's performance. Richard only did one back-to-back test of Stock vs BMS and the difference was 0.1 sec.

This is what I was quoting

[QUOTE=Richard109;7819631]On August 1, 2013 I averaged 13.56 stock, today I averaged 13.2318 for a difference of .3282. I have picked up .32 with the Burger tuner.
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  #25  
Old 09-11-2013, 08:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greyF10 View Post
"Here were my times running stock and then with the BMS. I only had about 800 miles on the car at the time so I think the numbers will improve now. Going to try and go to the track this Thursday."

*******>*******>********>********>



1. Reaction time is different
2. Wheel spin? Not commented on.
3. N=4. Low statistical power.
1. Reaction time has no effect on the quarter mile time.
2. True, but if there was a signficant difference, I think he would have mentioned it.
3. N=4 is much better then the N=0 or N=1, which we usually get on these forums.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PapaFlEx View Post
This is what I was quoting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard109 View Post
On August 1, 2013 I averaged 13.56 stock, today I averaged 13.2318 for a difference of .3282. I have picked up .32 with the Burger tuner.
Yup, and he pointed out that his car now had more miles on his motor probably leading to the faster time. The 0.1 apples to apples comparison stands until he decides to test both again on the same night.
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