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E90/E91/E92/E93 (2006 - 2013)
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  #1  
Old 09-13-2013, 01:03 PM
hondo402000 hondo402000 is offline
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335 hard top seal replacement ( or ripoff)

I started a new thread so it would get read

called BMW Service center, asked what it would cost to replace the Center roof section seal.

Service guy says about 7-10 hours at 125.00 per hour.

so lets go with the min of 7 hours, 825.00 to replace a SEAL? and the seal is 525 bucks for some reason he said they have to take the whole top off to do it, now the question who else thinks this is un reasonable as hell..
so if all the top seals were replaced that would be 2200.00

looks like these cars will not be around as collector items when they have to start being repaired,
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  #2  
Old 09-13-2013, 01:12 PM
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Based upon some of the information I picked up when we visited the factory in Regensburg where the E93s are built, that price and the time involved doesn't surprise me a whole lot. There are special jigs that are used to set the tolerances of the top parts and the tolerances for the top are in the tenths of millimeters.

Why do you need to replace the seal?
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Old 09-13-2013, 01:14 PM
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LarkHouston LarkHouston is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordic_Kat View Post
Based upon some of the information I picked up when we visited the factory in Regensburg where the E93s are built, that price and the time involved doesn't surprise me a whole lot. There are special jigs that are used to set the tolerances of the top parts and the tolerances for the top are in the tenths of millimeters.

Why do you need to replace the seal?
He undoubtedly failed to read and adhere to your seal maintenance protocol.
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Old 09-13-2013, 01:16 PM
hondo402000 hondo402000 is offline
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they said nothing about setting the top clearances, just replace the seal but I think I will go to the dealer and talk directly to the person thats putting the seal on to get clarification on exactly what they have to do to replace it, and then decide if I can live a few drips when it rains
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  #5  
Old 09-13-2013, 01:21 PM
hondo402000 hondo402000 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LarkHouston View Post
He undoubtedly failed to read and adhere to your seal maintenance protocol.

well since I aquired the car used only a year ago, its kind of hard to perform the rubber care from brand new, and yes I did read Kats write up and Yes I have greased the seals like every time I wash and detail the car and I bet I have done it more in the past year than it was done since it was purchased new. but you can only bring rubber back so far.

I have just a drip when it rains, so its not like I have to do it either, Really I am just doing some investigative work on what is involved, is it a DYI and the costs associated

plus it they touch it who is to say they wont make it worse!
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Old 09-13-2013, 01:34 PM
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Originally Posted by hondo402000 View Post

plus it they touch it who is to say they wont make it worse!
+1
Make sure the person who does this work at your service center has been certified to do it. According to the shop foreman at the dealership I use, there is course work specific to the hardtop and not all technicians are trained to work on it.

Where is the leak?
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Old 09-13-2013, 01:38 PM
roadkillrob roadkillrob is offline
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The statement that they have to take the whole top off would scare the hell out of me, maybe they mean just that panel section, otherwise I would be afraid of more leaks if they have to remove the entire top!
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Old 09-13-2013, 01:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roadkillrob View Post
The statement that they have to take the whole top off would scare the hell out of me, maybe they mean just that panel section, otherwise I would be afraid of more leaks if they have to remove the entire top!
Bingo! That's why I asked where the leak is.

There was a discussion about shoring up the rubber seals a few years back. IIRC, Ragzimmer had a good solution for fixing a small leak in the front rubber seal.
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  #9  
Old 09-13-2013, 02:29 PM
mikesevel mikesevel is offline
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Teenie weenie leak for now?

I have an '08 E93 and the roof has a teenie weenie leak at the top of the passenger side front window. I used Zymol Seal on all of the seals and I hope that I do not encounter more leaks over time.
Mikey
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  #10  
Old 09-13-2013, 03:12 PM
jburke4689 jburke4689 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LarkHouston View Post
He undoubtedly failed to read and adhere to your seal maintenance protocol.
I that protocol would be: Set aside about $500 per year so when you need to replace the seal it seems free! Sorry it cost that much. I was done with vert's after my MGB and Alpha Romeo Spyder. A whole new top for those as around $300 and you could install it yourself. I got real tired of getting while driving in the rain.

I just saw the "sticky" on seal maintenance. That would definitely work.
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  #11  
Old 09-13-2013, 05:43 PM
tomsteele01 tomsteele01 is offline
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My experience with seals. Bought the car used so not sure if previous 2 owners properly maintained the seals or not. I had my rear seals replaced recently under warranty and they had the car for 7 days. Some how they were torn on both sides of the rear. They replaced the seals and used rubber butyl as well to ensure no leaks. Every time they made an adjustment, they waited a day to test the following day. A few weeks prior I had the driver side fixed, they added rubber butyl to make the seal better, that one only took a few hours.

Car is now no longer under warranty so hopefully no more leaks as long as I own the car. I will continue to do the seal maintenance in hopes i can prevent them from going bad this time.
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  #12  
Old 09-14-2013, 07:14 AM
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On an E93, the thing that really scares me is the hard top. I love it vis a vie the old soft tops, but if you ever have a major issue with it out of warranty, sell it on a sunny day. N4S
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  #13  
Old 09-14-2013, 08:07 AM
irianjim irianjim is offline
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I guess I have to do the seal maintenance soon. I have had it about a year now, so it is probably time. It isn't a daily driver and has only seen rain once (on a trip to Houston) and I plan to keep it that way if I can. Three more years of warranty so I will have to test for leaks periodically. Thanks for the reminder.....
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  #14  
Old 09-14-2013, 01:54 PM
hondo402000 hondo402000 is offline
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the leak is occurring on the passenger side, where the center section meet the rear section, approximate where the passenger front and passenger rear windows meet. its not seen in Kats photos but if you have a convertible, raise the top and stop it in mid stream, and look at your center section, follow the rain gutter metal trim back and look where it turns into rubber, there is a metal sub structure and mine has worn thru. the metal showing is about the size of a 1/8 inch. Maybe I will just keep gobing krytox in that area as a water dam

but no way at this point am I spending 1200 bucks to replace it, I got the money just tired of wasting it on an inanimate objects
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Old 09-15-2013, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hondo402000 View Post
the leak is occurring on the passenger side, where the center section meet the rear section, approximate where the passenger front and passenger rear windows meet. its not seen in Kats photos but if you have a convertible, raise the top and stop it in mid stream, and look at your center section, follow the rain gutter metal trim back and look where it turns into rubber, there is a metal sub structure and mine has worn thru. the metal showing is about the size of a 1/8 inch. Maybe I will just keep gobing krytox in that area as a water dam

but no way at this point am I spending 1200 bucks to replace it, I got the money just tired of wasting it on an inanimate objects
I wonder if using a piece of backer rod to fill in behind the wear spot might do the trick?

Can you post a pic?
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Old 09-17-2013, 07:24 AM
hondo402000 hondo402000 is offline
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here is a pic of one side, other side is the same,
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  #17  
Old 09-17-2013, 08:55 AM
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Is the leak from the horizontal split seen in the picture?
If I get this problem in my E93 I will be trying black RTV first to see if that can solve the problem vs 1200 bucks.
Just not sure exactly where the leak is occuring from.
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Old 09-17-2013, 01:09 PM
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Several years ago a 'fester had a problem with his top that BMW ATTEMPTED to rectify by replacing the entire top. They ended up buying back his car, because the dealership could not successfully get the new top aligned correctly to accomplish the installation. THE IS NO WAY ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH I WOULD ALLOW A DEALER TO DISASSEMBLE THE TOP!!!!!
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Old 09-17-2013, 06:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fun2drive View Post
Is the leak from the horizontal split seen in the picture?
If I get this problem in my E93 I will be trying black RTV first to see if that can solve the problem vs 1200 bucks.
Just not sure exactly where the leak is occuring from.
Agreed.

That horizontal split looks like it could be repaired in a number of ways, with a lot less angst than doing a seal replacement.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tturedraider View Post
THERE IS NO WAY ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH I WOULD ALLOW A DEALER TO DISASSEMBLE THE TOP!!!!!

Amen!!

Just having the front latch on the cowl replaced worried me that the alignment wouldn't be right.

Something tells me that if I were in driving distance of the delivery center in Spartanburg, I'd much rather have them take a look at a top issue than have a local dealership futz with it.
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Old 09-17-2013, 06:19 PM
fdriller9 fdriller9 is offline
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I only skimmed the first few posts but if you issue is not major, skip the replacement.

Convertible tops are pain to service. Getting the panels lined up properly is such a headache. It will never be the same once it's reassembled. If you're ever in an accident with a vert, push for the car to be totaled...

I've wrapped a few headliners in suede for E9xs and just placing the sunroof back correctly is a pain. I can't imagine trying to service a convertible top!
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  #21  
Old 09-18-2013, 03:34 PM
hondo402000 hondo402000 is offline
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well actually the photo needs to be rotated 90 degrees to the right to get the correct perspective, the only thing that is the issue is the metal sub frame of the seal has worn thru

so maybe just gobs of dupont stuff will seal it , but no the dealer is not touching my top
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  #22  
Old 09-18-2013, 05:48 PM
Submariner Submariner is offline
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Based on my E93 that has had its share of discovering the wonders of the NY/NJ potholed road surfaces, I wonder whether one should 'tweak' or tighten nuts/bolts on the moving origami parts where they fold up/down etc. ..or I am just looking for a solution where no problem exists ...
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  #23  
Old 09-19-2013, 03:51 AM
hondo402000 hondo402000 is offline
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well since there is absolutely no information on the top in the manual, or on the internet about tighten things, replacing seals, or maintenance how would you go about it?
maybe their is a sub manual on the top only but I cannot find one

the only information is Kats write up
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Old 09-19-2013, 06:09 AM
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I guess if something is obviously loose you may want to tighten it up. I wouldn't go looking for trouble on these roofs however, imho you will find it. I follow the KAT page for the seals and lube the moving parts, other than that I try not to mess with it. It is too complicated and too expensive for me to "work on". N4S
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Old 09-19-2013, 06:17 AM
hondo402000 hondo402000 is offline
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you said it, BMW probably has a million dollar rig they use in the factory to set these tops up and drop them in the car during production, doubt any BMW stealer can duplicate that during repair, so my opinion is leave it alone,

I think I will just purchase some grey wash cloths to put under the leak when it rains
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