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F30 / F31 / F32 / F33 (2012 - current)
The sixth generation 3 series, chassis code F30. 2013 model year 328i and 335i sedans now in production. Read the F30 frequently asked question thread for all your basic question and dive into all the details in the ultimate F30 information thread.

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  #26  
Old 09-17-2013, 07:58 AM
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Capobranco Capobranco is offline
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Originally Posted by Dr. 328xi View Post
I completely agree. It's a comfortable commuter car that's still a ton of fun to break out on the back roads on the weekends. Swallows up all the junk that goes along with having a toddler with plenty of room to spare. Good fuel economy. Gorgeous styling. It's not the enthusiast's track car like some of the prior 3ers (without some aftermarket work anyway), but what it is to me is a true driver's family car. Does that break from its roots some? Probably. But, it feels like a natural evolution more than change in direction....
People on Bimmerfest use the word "appliance" often as a pejorative - my use, although a bit of hyperbole, implies no evil connotations. I find myself driving 2K miles a month - through Metro DC congestion, cobblestone streets of Baltimore and on challenging West Virginia mountain roads. I need safe, comfortable, all weather capability and since I am spending so much time behind the wheel - I want a spirited ride that is fun. I admire Toyotas for their legendary ability to be bullet proof but I would not derive any satisfaction driving one. Besides - after 8 BMWs - BMW is my go to brand of choice. I appreciate my 328xi for what it is...but what about ...suspension softness and EPS? - yeah it exists but the 328xi's foibles are way over exaggerated on this forum ad nauseum. Best thing I can say about my 328xi Sportline is not only does it serve up gobs of utility but it does so in an unmistakably BMW manner.
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  #27  
Old 09-17-2013, 08:00 AM
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Quinn Lasser Quinn Lasser is offline
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Well, she does make the car seem rather "pedestrian".

I still smile every time I drive my car so despite the spotty customer service (very good at the new dealership, however), and not having DHP (wish I could drive one), and despite this commercial where she declares "it's an every day normal car", I still think and believe I am driving "the Ultimate Driving Machine" and I grin like a crazy person when I step on the gas and the 335 engine kicks in. In the end, it's all about the car and this car is amazing. Nuff said....
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  #28  
Old 09-17-2013, 08:05 AM
f30jojo f30jojo is offline
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Originally Posted by elistan View Post
I honestly think your car is broken. Normal behavior for Sport Mode is that 2000 rpm is the MINIMUM engine speed. If your car is shifting AT 2000 rpm even in Sport Mode, something is definitely wrong. Also, when you activate a paddle shifter, after a period of time driving at a constant speed the transmission will go back to auto mode. It only stays in manual if you've moved the shift lever to the left into M/S mode.

BTW, doesn't the N20 have 258 lb-ft from 1250 rpm to 4800 rpm? How is that 50% less than the N52's 199 lb-ft at 2750 rpm?

Wait - do you have the 328d xDrive Sport Wagon? The diesel? With only 180 hp? If so, it's no wonder the transmission shifts at such a low rpm. And that would explain your feelings of lackluster performance. And, of course, the engine sounding like a diesel. Although the torque comment still confuses me, regardless of which engine you have.
I was agreeing with everything till you thought the n20 doesnt sound like a diesel. especially at cold start it most certainly sounds like a diesel. even after warm up you can hear it especially with the windows down. Yes the actual diesel is louder but for lack of a better word they both still have a disticnt "clack". Also i own a 07 530i as well (with N52). I'll just say numbers dont tell the whole story. you may think the n20 is more fun/powerful. in reality you cant beat the throttle resonse and surge of torque from the N52 255hp version. BMW does a good job mitigating turbo lag, but even just the slightest hesitation makes all the difference in the world. case in point... from a stand still, stomp the gas in a N52 328, then stomp the gas in a N20 328 and tell me which one FEELS better. This is not to say the N20 is a bad motor, its great for what it does. But its definantly no N52. its like comparing a fresh new 1st round draft pick College QB vs Peyton Manning.... yeah theyre both good at what they do, but peyton kinda re-defines what it is to be a QB.
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  #29  
Old 09-17-2013, 08:13 AM
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Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
You drive a 20 year old car. Your opinions on the value of new cars is out of your comfort zone. Stick to what you know.

BJ
I have an E36 and an F30

I posted this because of all the excitement around petitioning BMW to change their suspension.

In actuality most of their customers will be fine with it.

It was a funny video, don't be a dick.
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  #30  
Old 09-17-2013, 08:13 AM
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Quinn Lasser Quinn Lasser is offline
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Originally Posted by need4speed View Post
No flames just
It does seem like BMW wants to be the new Lexus. Or maybe the Lexus with a dash of sport. That is where their new focus seems to be. Plush(er) ride, bigger, more apps and other gadgets, better mpg. They will likely make more money catering to that crowd. My question is will the badge kissers still want to buy the roundel if it looses it's "ultimate driving machine" cache? Also can you out Lexus, Lexus in the long run? N4S
I admit, I'm not a super duper car enthusiast with every answer to every question, but I doubt that BMW is trying to be the new Lexus. After all, BMW has been around much longer than Lexus. Where we live, the rudest drivers are Lexus owners and they are out there in monotonous droves.

There's a huge difference between the 2005 BMW we bought and the 2013 we bought but I doubt the engineers at BMW said, oh let's make this look like a Lexus. Perhaps they are making cars a bit plusher because that's what their customers have asked for. Personally, I have no desire to "out Lexus Lexus".
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  #31  
Old 09-17-2013, 08:15 AM
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It's not just the F30 328i that shifts poorly and gives you that hesitation at startup with a herky jerky feeling when shifting through the lower grears. I had a 6 cylinder turbo 2012 Porsche Panamera loaner for two weeks and it was worse, IMO. I couldn't stand driving the thing because of the hesitation at startup. I asked the service manager about it and he said it's because the car starts up in second gear to save fuel. He said to put it in sport mode or use the paddle shifters to downshift to first before starting up, if I wanted to eliminate the hesitation (just what I want to do to drive the car normally - Not!)

These 7 and 8 speed transmissions that are constantly shifting, along with turbo lag, have ruined the smooth driving characteristics that I used to enjoy with NA engines with 6 speed auto tansmissions. Fortunately, one still gets that to some extent when driving cars with MTs, but then you still have to deal with turbo lag.

I thank my lucky stars that I have one car with an NA engine and MT.
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  #32  
Old 09-17-2013, 08:18 AM
f30jojo f30jojo is offline
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cant beat that N52 induction noise wide open throttle.... its heaven.
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  #33  
Old 09-17-2013, 08:21 AM
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Capobranco Capobranco is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quinn Lasser View Post
Well, she does make the car seem rather "pedestrian".

...."it's an every day normal car", ....
Porsche recently had an entire campaign centered on the theme "everyday car" - although this stretches credibility, the point is that Porsche thought it sufficiently important that people understood that a Porsche has an "appliance" alter ego and spent big bucks promoting the idea. Nothing wrong with BMW producing an F30 that can actually be used everyday and enjoyed in the process.

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  #34  
Old 09-17-2013, 08:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Capobranco View Post
Porsche recently had an entire campaign centered on the theme "everyday car" - although this stretches credibility, the point is that Porsche thought it sufficiently important that people understood that a Porsche has an "appliance" alter ego and spent big bucks promoting the idea. Nothing wrong with BMW producing an F30 that can actually be used everyday and enjoyed in the process.

Yea, I'm going to load up my 911 with bags of mulch - NOT! That's what SUVs are for.
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  #35  
Old 09-17-2013, 08:32 AM
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Yea, I'm going to load up my 911 with bags of mulch - NOT! That's what SUVs are for.
"Yeah, yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could that they didn't stop to think if they should." -Dr. Ian Malcolm
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  #36  
Old 09-17-2013, 08:36 AM
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I was agreeing with everything till you thought the n20 doesnt sound like a diesel.
I did not say anything like "the N20 doesn't sound like a diesel." I have an N20 - I hear the clatter. I said something along the lines of "if you have a diesel, of course it will sound like a diesel."
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  #37  
Old 09-17-2013, 08:38 AM
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"Yeah, yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could that they didn't stop to think if they should." -Dr. Ian Malcolm
Like seeing how many people one can cram into a VW Bug?

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  #38  
Old 09-17-2013, 08:53 AM
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chiefneil chiefneil is offline
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Not sure why people are so down on the video. A 3-series is a normal everyday day car in terms of intended use. As are 5- and 7-series too. It's a really nice and somewhat expensive everyday car, but it's not something like a Ferrari or Lambo, or Volt.

The only funny thing in the video is that she's driving Laguna Seca like a mall parking lot at what sounds like 2k rpm. And she took the corkscrew at about 5mph. She had time for a full narrative through the corkscrew: "The very famous turn is the corkscrew. Which I am now in. Woo hoo." She should actually just barely have time to scream, "Gaah!" before being in and out

Anyway, the narrator is an everyday chick driving a mildly sporty everyday car. Not many women aspire to be Danica Patrick and most probably think the engine is going to explode if you rev past 3k rpm.
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  #39  
Old 09-17-2013, 09:36 AM
namelessman namelessman is offline
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Originally Posted by beden1 View Post
These 7 and 8 speed transmissions that are constantly shifting, along with turbo lag, have ruined the smooth driving characteristics that I used to enjoy with NA engines with 6 speed auto tansmissions. Fortunately, one still gets that to some extent when driving cars with MTs, but then you still have to deal with turbo lag.
Agreed, it is confusing to drive MT with nanny modes plus turbo in modern bimmers. I still have fond memories of my old M54 I6 NA that keeps revving in 2nd gear MT to 60mph and redline with pose.
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  #40  
Old 09-17-2013, 10:10 AM
Jamesonsviggen Jamesonsviggen is offline
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N20: perhaps an ok engine if you can get past the fact is not BMW silky smooth, has a sound more appropriate to a diesel and a linear torque and hp curve that strikes us as just plain boring. Compared to its 6-cylinder brethren, its 50% lower torque at 3,500 rpm than the N52 at 2,500 rpm. In other words, a stone that needs to be pushed constantly.
Opinions are fine, but let's not get factual information wrong. The dynos have been studied on here before. At no RPM does the N52 make more tq than the N20. It was claimed the the N20 also had less hp up top than the N52, also incorrect. The N20 made about 7% less peak hp at redline/fuel cut off-so not exactly falling on it's face and the number was still higher than the N52. So again, at no point does an N52 outpower an N20, aside from maybe idle to 1000rpms. Sound and feel-sure, the N52 has it all over the N20.

I did spend 4 days driving my friend's F30 335 PPK equipped car I found for him this week. I will say, the N20 lacks charisma in comparison-largely due to the inherent nature of the design.
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  #41  
Old 09-17-2013, 10:28 AM
Dippydo Dippydo is offline
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Originally Posted by Pat_X5 View Post
Yup, very much so correct and did they ever mention the issues of drivetrain failures and brake problems on these new F30s ???

I have never heard of so many major problems with a new series of BMWs.

LOL at least our HPFP work...How many years did they try to get that right on the N54? All the issues with the new F30 have been few and minor.
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  #42  
Old 09-17-2013, 10:35 AM
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Quinn Lasser Quinn Lasser is offline
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Originally Posted by chiefneil View Post
Anyway, the narrator is an everyday chick driving a mildly sporty everyday car. Not many women aspire to be Danica Patrick and most probably think the engine is going to explode if you rev past 3k rpm.
I'm pretty sure most of us know that the engine isn't going to explode if we push it.
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  #43  
Old 09-17-2013, 10:49 AM
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av98 av98 is offline
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Originally Posted by f30jojo View Post
honestly as I've owned an E30, E46, E90 and a F30 only one of those may be used as a family car. The E90 gets a bit cramped in the back after children get around 3 or 4 years old. E46 no way, I tried... just.. no. then the E30, common. I only have 1 child (6 years old now) and he has to reach to kick the back of the seat.
My 7 year old fits fine in our E46 ZHP but with our twin girls, that's what the mini-van is for.


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  #44  
Old 09-17-2013, 11:12 AM
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tturedraider tturedraider is offline
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Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen View Post
Opinions are fine, but let's not get factual information wrong. The dynos have been studied on here before. At no RPM does the N52 make more tq than the N20. It was claimed the the N20 also had less hp up top than the N52, also incorrect. The N20 made about 7% less peak hp at redline/fuel cut off-so not exactly falling on it's face and the number was still higher than the N52. So again, at no point does an N52 outpower an N20, aside from maybe idle to 1000rpms. Sound and feel-sure, the N52 has it all over the N20.

I did spend 4 days driving my friend's F30 335 PPK equipped car I found for him this week. I will say, the N20 lacks charisma in comparison-largely due to the inherent nature of the design.
Something relatively new for Bimmerfest here in the F3x forum - facts and reasoned statements are of little value to many posters here. The result is the F3x forum is a much less enjoyable forum to participate in than the E9x forum was. It's a very similar situation in the F10 forum.
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  #45  
Old 09-17-2013, 12:18 PM
jwalz1 jwalz1 is offline
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This is absolutely the worst review I've seen. She should start on some regimen of diet pills and cosmetic products.

.
FIXED

I have not seen a face squish out of a helmet like that since Jim Plunkett QB'ed for the Raiders.

She talks about the car the way my wife talks about her Ford Focus. "ITS CUTE!" The wife gets a $700 a month car allowance from her employer and she picks a Ford Focus and pockets the rest for shoes.

That lady is running Laguna Seca and the engine noises sound like she is driving in a grocery store parking lot. Please BMW, do not engineer cars for that person. She would do just fine in a KIA Soul.

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  #46  
Old 09-17-2013, 04:35 PM
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boltjaM3s boltjaM3s is offline
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Originally Posted by f30jojo View Post

Boltja, I respect your opinion. That being said, I think a E36 owners opinion on driving dynamics weighs in much more than whatever the hell a "L328i luxury sedan" driver does. not an attack at you just an observation that I know would be pointed out to me if I made the same comment. With the description of your F30 IMO you fall directly into the demographic BMW is targeting with the F30..... maybe you should stick to what YOU know. I really don't have beef with you boltja, this comment was interesting though.

....now ill just wait for the backlash and insults... 3...2...1..
Yeah, except that I owned an E36 and an E46 and an E90 so I too know what I'm talking about.

This is the F30 forum and we've got enough haters already, don't need another one, especially one who claims he owns one too.

The E36 and the F30 are completely different cars for different people. The F30 grew up with the Baby Boomers who aren't in their 30's anymore. They're in their 60's. They need a bigger car with a more forgiving ride and lots of comfort features. That's the reason the F30 is more Lexus-like.

See, many people think "The Ultimate Driving Machine" is the 3 Series heritage. They are wrong. The 3 Series heritage is the Baby Boom generation and the 3 is moving right along with them. They're bigger and softer, their cars need to be too.

BJ
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  #47  
Old 09-17-2013, 04:58 PM
hmc hmc is offline
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I come from E60 550 and I think F30 is great.

I couldn't pick E90 since it was too small to me. E60 was excellent for its size but it's a little too big (and too heavy) to me. It has Active Roll Stabilization and corners very flat for example but I still feel the weight...

F30 fits my needs very well. Not too small and not too big; nimble enough but also practical enough; luxurious enough but also sporty enough. Fast enough but also fuel efficient enough ... Nothing ultimate but simply a good total package.

Last edited by hmc; 09-17-2013 at 05:00 PM.
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  #48  
Old 09-17-2013, 05:17 PM
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beden1 beden1 is offline
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I come from E60 550 and I think F30 is great.

I couldn't pick E90 since it was too small to me. E60 was excellent for its size but it's a little too big (and too heavy) to me. It has Active Roll Stabilization and corners very flat for example but I still feel the weight...

F30 fits my needs very well. Not too small and not too big; nimble enough but also practical enough; luxurious enough but also sporty enough. Fast enough but also fuel efficient enough ... Nothing ultimate but simply a good total package.
...not too hot, not too cold. Sounds like you need some porage to go with your F30.
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  #49  
Old 09-17-2013, 05:46 PM
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Capobranco Capobranco is offline
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Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
Yeah, except that I owned an E36 and an E46 and an E90 so I too know what I'm talking about.

This is the F30 forum and we've got enough haters already, don't need another one, especially one who claims he owns one too.

The E36 and the F30 are completely different cars for different people. The F30 grew up with the Baby Boomers who aren't in their 30's anymore. They're in their 60's. They need a bigger car with a more forgiving ride and lots of comfort features. That's the reason the F30 is more Lexus-like.

See, many people think "The Ultimate Driving Machine" is the 3 Series heritage. They are wrong. The 3 Series heritage is the Baby Boom generation and the 3 is moving right along with them. They're bigger and softer, their cars need to be too.

BJ
No you are mistaken....

BMW is not going to oriented its core product to aging baby boomers who represent a diminishing market share demographic.

The F30 is BMW's attempt to address the priorities and values of an younger affluent customer who prizes efficiency and technology over traditional "performance".
Indeed, performance cars are increasingly viewed by emerging younger opinion leaders as "declassee".

BMW must be able to offer attractive products to a customer base that has different priorities while still trying to maintain their traditional customer - thus the new marketing paradigm.
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  #50  
Old 09-17-2013, 06:57 PM
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boltjaM3s boltjaM3s is offline
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Originally Posted by Capobranco View Post
No you are mistaken....

BMW is not going to oriented its core product to aging baby boomers who represent a diminishing market share demographic.

The F30 is BMW's attempt to address the priorities and values of an younger affluent customer who prizes efficiency and technology over traditional "performance".
Indeed, performance cars are increasingly viewed by emerging younger opinion leaders as "declassee".

BMW must be able to offer attractive products to a customer base that has different priorities while still trying to maintain their traditional customer - thus the new marketing paradigm.
Wrong.

What you describe- "orienting its core product to a market share demographic"- is what BMW is doing with it's overall strategy in the sub-$50,000 category.

X1, 3 GT, X3, 4 Gran Coupe, 1 Sedan, and the F30 all attract a different customer at a different life-stage. The 3 Sedan is merely the one that is most applicable to the aging Baby Boom generation, the very generation who BMW catered to since the 80's. The 'enthusiasts' back then were in their 30's and the 3 Series was a rockin' tight compact sports car. Little by little, the Baby Boomers grew and matured and the 3 went right along with them.

"The Ultimate Driving Machine" made sense for 30 year olds in 1980. Today, "The Ultimate Driving Machine" is only something with an M on it not because BMW has lost its way but because there aren't enough customers out there who want a harsh ride and zero comfort features because they're happy merely with great performance. What worked for the Boomers in their 30's doesn't fly now that they're in their 60's.

I mean, seriously? Do you people even look at other F30 drivers on the roads? It's a bunch of old people.

BJ
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