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F30 / F31 / F32 / F33 / F36 (2012 - current)
The sixth generation 3 series, chassis code F30. 2013 model year 328i and 335i sedans now in production. Read the F30 frequently asked question thread for all your basic question and dive into all the details in the ultimate F30 information thread.

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  #101  
Old 09-28-2013, 08:29 AM
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Pat_X5 Pat_X5 is offline
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Originally Posted by izzyM3 View Post
2006 330i - transmission replaced after two weeks of ownership, 2013 M3 - totaled RIP, 2013 328i - now this... *sigh*. But, for now, I'm gonna enjoy the car (putting new wheels today), and just be attentive and hopefully my natural reactions if failure occurs work.
+1

I am not worried, after 3 BMWs and having to go thru major issues in the past, I know they will fix it to my satisfaction.

In retrospect, BMW has been more than accommodating in my safety.

My first BMW had a major safety issue 2002 E53 which is still documented after I reported to NHTSA. The engine would cut out while making a left turn from standstill and stall in the middle of the road or intersection. After many trips to my original dealer (useless Monrovia dealer that is still awful) - BMWNA finally got involved after the 4th time it happened and got the car into their master tech dealer located in Alhambra. They gave me a loaner for a month and finally figured out after sending the entire engine to NJ - that the injection system & ECU were faulting at high temps (Southern California desert weather). Got the E53 back and was a perfect car till I retired it at 130,000 miles!

Then my first E90, I had a major engine failure - fixed that in 3 days and no problems since that time I retired it at 90,000 miles...

Now my current E90 has ZERO problems - my first BMW without a single problem minor or major!

This weekend I am visiting my BMW dealer and looking at my options for another BMW...
I will enjoy the less crowded dealership this weekend...

So let's all not worry the sky will be falling shortly.....

Last edited by Pat_X5; 09-28-2013 at 08:31 AM.
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  #102  
Old 09-28-2013, 08:39 AM
poudre poudre is offline
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Originally Posted by 328AL View Post
Your CA says your car held at Bremerhaven due to a recall?

No, he never said that my car was being held at Bremerhaven due to a recall. He informed me that the car had been produced on Aug. 26.

They can't fix your car at the port, there're no repair facilities there. I understand that.

Mine was completed on 9/6 and is on the ship. I contacted my SM, he said if it's impacted it would be fixed at VDC.

There is a logistical problem with your car, contact your dealer and let them figure it out.
8/26/13 - Production completed

9/21/13 - Transported to port of exit

9/24/13 - Vehicle at the port awaiting a shipping vessel

As you can see, the car was somewhere (other than at the port) for 26 days.


I am not complaining, just wondering if the delay might have been due to the brake issue

or

Perhaps a German longshoreman was using it for his daughter's wedding?

Last edited by poudre; 09-28-2013 at 08:44 AM.
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  #103  
Old 09-28-2013, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
It's only one data point, but two weeks ago I was doing 80 in the fast lane when all of a sudden all traffic came to a complete stop and the car in front of me didn't react in time and I thought for sure I was going to crash right into his rear end. Was without a doubt the worst emergency stop situation I have ever encountered.

The F30 brakes performed like an absolute champ. The guy in front of me made eye contact in the rearview mirror and gave me a huge thumbs up (and a bit of an apology). Now I understand the problem can be intermittent and next time I might not be so lucky, but right now I'm not very concerned. Never had a single issue with the brakes since I've owned the car.

I will, however, be cognizant of the handbrake and would likely lean my hand over there if I encountered that situation again just in case.

BJ
Hey Bolt. Glad you made it out of that one with all the sheet metal straight. There is one heck of a flaw in BMWNA's suggestion about the handbrake. It could result in a very bad scenario if misused.

The handbrake mechanically activates the rear (only!) brakes, it does not do anything with the fronts. So whether your foot is on the brake pedal or not, and whether you are really having a brake boost issue or not, the handbrake is going to apply the rear brakes.

So let's assume for a second that a driver with only a split second to react decides that he is not stopping properly and applies the handbrake. Unfortunately he made a bad call, the road conditions were a little slippery due to rain or snow and what he really perceived was his adrenelin magnified sense of time passing while the ABS system was doing its thing. He yanks up the handbrake which overrides the modulated ABS force to the rear pads. He is going to go sideways. Immediately. Faster than he can react. He is going to entirely lose control of his car.

Maybe most of us on this board know enough to properly stop a handicapped car, the average person doesn't. Asking owners to apply the handbrake to stop the car is weak at best. I have a feeling that that suggestion as a 'fix' will not be on the table too long.

[If early reports remain true, that the fault is only obvious at very low speeds then my scenario is inappropriate. I don't see how this hydraulic failure can only be apparent at low speeds though. It is true that low speeds usually go along with low engine rpm's and that could be the connection. I can think of situations where someone could have low rpm's at high speeds, especially with a standard trans car.]
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  #104  
Old 09-28-2013, 09:44 AM
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boltjaM3s boltjaM3s is offline
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Originally Posted by DSXMachina View Post
Hey Bolt. Glad you made it out of that one with all the sheet metal straight. There is one heck of a flaw in BMWNA's suggestion about the handbrake. It could result in a very bad scenario if misused.

The handbrake mechanically activates the rear (only!) brakes, it does not do anything with the fronts. So whether your foot is on the brake pedal or not, and whether you are really having a brake boost issue or not, the handbrake is going to apply the rear brakes.

So let's assume for a second that a driver with only a split second to react decides that he is not stopping properly and applies the handbrake. Unfortunately he made a bad call, the road conditions were a little slippery due to rain or snow and what he really perceived was his adrenelin magnified sense of time passing while the ABS system was doing its thing. He yanks up the handbrake which overrides the modulated ABS force to the rear pads. He is going to go sideways. Immediately. Faster than he can react. He is going to entirely lose control of his car.

Maybe most of us on this board know enough to properly stop a handicapped car, the average person doesn't. Asking owners to apply the handbrake to stop the car is weak at best. I have a feeling that that suggestion as a 'fix' will not be on the table too long.

[If early reports remain true, that the fault is only obvious at very low speeds then my scenario is inappropriate. I don't see how this hydraulic failure can only be apparent at low speeds though. It is true that low speeds usually go along with low engine rpm's and that could be the connection. I can think of situations where someone could have low rpm's at high speeds, especially with a standard trans car.]
Good point, definitely don't need the rear wheels locking up.

More importantly: When are you getting delivery of your new 4 Series? Time to put that ol' E92 out to pasture.

BJ
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  #105  
Old 09-28-2013, 09:53 AM
MotoWPK MotoWPK is offline
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I see a post yesterday asking for a source of this report, but no reply. Curiously, the only reports I can find of this are on a couple of other forums, one of which links back to bimmerfest.com and the other with the same information beginning this thread but with no source. Also, NHTSA only reports an investigation, no recall, though according to the initiating post BMW notified NHTSA of their recall 9/26/13.

Does anyone have an independent source for this?
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  #106  
Old 09-28-2013, 10:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
It's only one data point, but two weeks ago I was doing 80 in the fast lane when all of a sudden all traffic came to a complete stop and the car in front of me didn't react in time and I thought for sure I was going to crash right into his rear end. Was without a doubt the worst emergency stop situation I have ever encountered.

The F30 brakes performed like an absolute champ. The guy in front of me made eye contact in the rearview mirror and gave me a huge thumbs up (and a bit of an apology). Now I understand the problem can be intermittent and next time I might not be so lucky, but right now I'm not very concerned. Never had a single issue with the brakes since I've owned the car.

I will, however, be cognizant of the handbrake and would likely lean my hand over there if I encountered that situation again just in case.

BJ
BJ

You should try to get in the habit of looking as far in the distance as possible so that the fact that the car in front of you reacts slowly does not impact you. Ideally you should have seen the traffic ahead coming to a stop and not depended on the car in front of you.

I can tell you from experience that "low eyes" is a very hard habit to break.

CA
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  #107  
Old 09-28-2013, 10:03 AM
Bimmer3oi Bimmer3oi is offline
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Re: Major recall for 2012-14 F30 BMW 3 Series with N20/N26 for dangerous loss of bra

I'm not an engineer, so does anyone who is more technically educated believe that just adding the o-ring or whatever, can completely solve this braking issue?...or is this more of a quick/economical/partial fix that will show BMW is at least doing "something" to already built cars...it just seems to me like this is too simple a solution to a problem that may require a little more re-engineering

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  #108  
Old 09-28-2013, 10:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
BJ

You should try to get in the habit of looking as far in the distance as possible so that the fact that the car in front of you reacts slowly does not impact you. Ideally you should have seen the traffic ahead coming to a stop and not depended on the car in front of you.

I can tell you from experience that "low eyes" is a very hard habit to break.

CA
Looking far ahead and trying to anticipate forward traffic conditions is a part of the basics when driving something like a Suburban or Tahoe. Their brakes take a while to slow down these large mass vehicles. Pay attention and drive defensively.
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  #109  
Old 09-28-2013, 10:42 AM
greywolf328i greywolf328i is online now
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Re: Major recall for 2012-14 F30 BMW 3 Series with N20/N26 for dangerous loss of bra

Quote:
Originally Posted by DSXMachina View Post
Hey Bolt. Glad you made it out of that one with all the sheet metal straight. There is one heck of a flaw in BMWNA's suggestion about the handbrake. It could result in a very bad scenario if misused.

The handbrake mechanically activates the rear (only!) brakes, it does not do anything with the fronts. So whether your foot is on the brake pedal or not, and whether you are really having a brake boost issue or not, the handbrake is going to apply the rear brakes.

So let's assume for a second that a driver with only a split second to react decides that he is not stopping properly and applies the handbrake. Unfortunately he made a bad call, the road conditions were a little slippery due to rain or snow and what he really perceived was his adrenelin magnified sense of time passing while the ABS system was doing its thing. He yanks up the handbrake which overrides the modulated ABS force to the rear pads. He is going to go sideways. Immediately. Faster than he can react. He is going to entirely lose control of his car.

Maybe most of us on this board know enough to properly stop a handicapped car, the average person doesn't. Asking owners to apply the handbrake to stop the car is weak at best. I have a feeling that that suggestion as a 'fix' will not be on the table too long.

[If early reports remain true, that the fault is only obvious at very low speeds then my scenario is inappropriate. I don't see how this hydraulic failure can only be apparent at low speeds though. It is true that low speeds usually go along with low engine rpm's and that could be the connection. I can think of situations where someone could have low rpm's at high speeds, especially with a standard trans car.]
I believe the stability control will prevent that regardless. Pretty sure you can't drift one of these cars without disabling it. And the person that ranks this up with the Ford and Toyota recalls, check the incident report. You'll find a significant number difference there. Oh and both actually killed people. No one has even reported an injury yet. Take your fear mongering somewhere else. This is not an excuse for BMW but simply why they aren't telling us to stop driving. The likelihood of major accident is low. Your more likely to hit someone using your phone/texting than as a result of power assist loss.

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  #110  
Old 09-28-2013, 10:59 AM
Jerseyal Jerseyal is offline
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Took my car out for a spirited drive this morning, and i'm happy to report that the brakes work. So I think I'm good for now.
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  #111  
Old 09-28-2013, 11:02 AM
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Originally Posted by greywolf328i View Post
I believe the stability control will prevent that regardless. Pretty sure you can't drift one of these cars without disabling it. And the person that ranks this up with the Ford and Toyota recalls, check the incident report. You'll find a significant number difference there. Oh and both actually killed people. No one has even reported an injury yet. Take your fear mongering somewhere else. This is not an excuse for BMW but simply why they aren't telling us to stop driving. The likelihood of major accident is low. Your more likely to hit someone using your phone/texting than as a result of power assist loss.

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You BELIEVE the stability control will prevent it or you know it as a fact?
The fact that nobody has reported an injury yet is going to be of little consolation to the first person that gets injured (if and when it happens).

I am not likely to hit anyone while I am texting because I dont text.

CA
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  #112  
Old 09-28-2013, 11:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Jerseyal View Post
Took my car out for a spirited drive this morning, and i'm happy to report that the brakes work. So I think I'm good for now.
Obviously with the number of affected cars on the road, the number of miles they are driven and the number of times the brakes are applied on these cars the problem is only going to show up very rarely. The issue is that it should not show up at all.

CA
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  #113  
Old 09-28-2013, 11:06 AM
gkr778 gkr778 is offline
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Originally Posted by MotoWPK View Post
I see a post yesterday asking for a source of this report, but no reply. Curiously, the only reports I can find of this are on a couple of other forums, one of which links back to bimmerfest.com and the other with the same information beginning this thread but with no source. Also, NHTSA only reports an investigation, no recall, though according to the initiating post BMW notified NHTSA of their recall 9/26/13.

Does anyone have an independent source for this?
I can't find one either. The initial post in this Bimmerfest thread is a replica of a page on F30driver.com, but with some typos corrected.

Would any Bimmerfest sponsors be able to confirm whether this information is available on Dealerspeed/DCSnet/CenterNet?
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  #114  
Old 09-28-2013, 11:08 AM
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From information posted about this issue via the thread in another forum, it appears the problem shows up in very low-mileage cars that are a couple of months old. I could be wrong, but it looks like for most of us that have higher mileage (5000ish+) and "older" F30's, it doesn't appear. Obviously don't let your guard down, but it does appear if it is going to be a problem, it shows up fairly early on.

Edit: Built in Regensburg, 12000 miles/8 months in service and have not had this problem.
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  #115  
Old 09-28-2013, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Jerseyal View Post
Took my car out for a spirited drive this morning, and i'm happy to report that the brakes work. So I think I'm good for now.
Obviously with the number of affected cars on the road, the numbers of miles they are driven and the number of times the brakes are applied on these cars the problem is only going to show up very rarely. The issue is that it should not show up at all.

CA
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  #116  
Old 09-28-2013, 11:34 AM
aorbigo aorbigo is offline
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Is my car safe then

I just bought my 2013 328i xdrive last night. Does it mean it is safe and exempt from this issue as it was sold to me? Thanks
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  #117  
Old 09-28-2013, 11:34 AM
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Major recall for 2012-14 F30 BMW 3 Series with N20/N26 for dangerous loss of b

Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
You BELIEVE the stability control will prevent it or you know it as a fact?
The fact that nobody has reported an injury yet is going to be of little consolation to the first person that gets injured (if and when it happens).

I am not likely to hit anyone while I am texting because I dont text.

CA
+1, brake issues in any modern car is unacceptable.


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  #118  
Old 09-28-2013, 11:49 AM
namelessman namelessman is offline
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Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
Obviously with the number of affected cars on the road, the numbers of miles they are driven and the number of times the brakes are applied on these cars the problem is only going to show up very rarely. The issue is that it should not show up at all.

CA
+1, I am not too worried about this, my brakes have gone through their paces and they still work as expected. Having said that I will start practicing emergency handbrake maneuvers. I am so glad there is a manual handbrake.
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  #119  
Old 09-28-2013, 11:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
BJ

You should try to get in the habit of looking as far in the distance as possible so that the fact that the car in front of you reacts slowly does not impact you. Ideally you should have seen the traffic ahead coming to a stop and not depended on the car in front of you.

I can tell you from experience that "low eyes" is a very hard habit to break.

CA
A collision occurred 10 cars in front of me and both cars came to a complete stop, we were bunched up doing 80 during the evening commute home with the sun glare dead ahead.

Wasn't a matter of low eyes, rather the SUV in front of me without 8 car lengths to match the 80 MPH.

BJ
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  #120  
Old 09-28-2013, 12:01 PM
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Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
A collision occurred 10 cars in front of me and both cars came to a complete stop, we were bunched up doing 80 during the evening commute home with the sun glare dead ahead.

Wasn't a matter of low eyes, rather the SUV in front of me without 8 car lengths to match the 80 MPH.

BJ
Well whatever happened I am glad to hear that you (and the car) escaped unscathed.

CA
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  #121  
Old 09-28-2013, 12:02 PM
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DSXMachina DSXMachina is offline
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Originally Posted by namelessman View Post
+1, I am not too worried about this, my brakes have gone through their paces and they still work as expected. Having said that I will start practicing emergency handbrake maneuvers. I am so glad there is a manual handbrake.
Find a very large parking lot and accelerate to 30 mph. Without touching the foot brake try to stop the car with the hand brake (apply it slowly!). You'll eventually come to a stop. How would you compare your stopping distance with a foot brake stop?
That's why it's not called an emergency brake by any manufacturer anymore.
The purpose of the hand brake is to help prevent rollaways when the car is parked. It does that well.
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  #122  
Old 09-28-2013, 12:09 PM
crazygordon crazygordon is offline
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Major recall for 2012-14 F30 BMW 3 Series with N20/N26 for dangerous loss of b

My dealer told me that there was no recall. I don't know to believe him or he just wants to sell a car.


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  #123  
Old 09-28-2013, 12:11 PM
namelessman namelessman is offline
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Originally Posted by DSXMachina View Post
Find a very large parking lot and accelerate to 30 mph. Without touching the foot brake try to stop the car with the hand brake (apply it slowly!). You'll eventually come to a stop. How would you compare your stopping distance with a foot brake stop?
That's why it's not called an emergency brake by any manufacturer anymore.
The purpose of the hand brake is to help prevent rollaways when the car is parked. It does that well.
I was referring to manual instead of electronic handbrake, at least I know where to reach for the big lever versus the tiny latch!

Last edited by namelessman; 09-28-2013 at 12:17 PM.
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  #124  
Old 09-28-2013, 12:13 PM
greywolf328i greywolf328i is online now
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Re: Major recall for 2012-14 F30 BMW 3 Series with N20/N26 for dangerous loss of bra

Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
You BELIEVE the stability control will prevent it or you know it as a fact?
The fact that nobody has reported an injury yet is going to be of little consolation to the first person that gets injured (if and when it happens).

I am not likely to hit anyone while I am texting because I dont text.

CA
Since stability control was mandated after the Explorer issues and what the tech actually does, I can be reasonably confident it will prevent loss of control. It's job is to prevent people from doing stupid things after all

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'14 328i Sport Line - Mineral Grey/Black-Red Dakota Tech/Lighting/Premium/HK -Sport Auto w/ paddles

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Old 09-28-2013, 12:14 PM
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DSXMachina DSXMachina is offline
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Location: New Hampshire
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
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Mein Auto: 335i E92 TiAg 6MT ED
Quote:
Originally Posted by greywolf328i View Post
I believe the stability control will prevent that regardless. Pretty sure you can't drift one of these cars without disabling it. And the person that ranks this up with the Ford and Toyota recalls, check the incident report. You'll find a significant number difference there. Oh and both actually killed people. No one has even reported an injury yet. Take your fear mongering somewhere else. This is not an excuse for BMW but simply why they aren't telling us to stop driving. The likelihood of major accident is low. Your more likely to hit someone using your phone/texting than as a result of power assist loss.

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Tell you what, I won't say you have the blind faith of a recent convert, if you don't call me a fear mongerer. OK?
BMW has an unfortunate history of denial and stonewalling when it comes to manufacturing defects. The list is long and anyone who has been around a while can tell you it goes way back. In this case they seem to be jumping at the chance to 'fix' something even up to the point of stopping sales and deliveries. That is a serious move on their part and it probably denotes their interpretation of this defect as being a very serious matter. I think one shoe has dropped, there's going to be another.
It sounds as if had you been the man in charge at BMW you'd still be delivering the cars.
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