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F30 / F31 / F32 / F33 (2012 - current)
The sixth generation 3 series, chassis code F30. 2013 model year 328i and 335i sedans now in production. Read the F30 frequently asked question thread for all your basic question and dive into all the details in the ultimate F30 information thread.

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  #1  
Old 11-16-2013, 09:59 AM
HELLR0T HELLR0T is online now
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Mein Auto: 96 E36, 14 F30
Steering e36 greater than F30

So I've had my F30 for about a month.

I was in denial about reading everyone whining about the steering, it couldn't possible be THAT bad, could it?

I have to say, when compared to my e36, I'm slightly let down.

You all know the story so I wont beat that horse.

I just wanted to share with you guys that the ultimate driving machine I thought I would be buying... I already owned.

The F30 has given me a new found respect for my e36.

While its slower, older and louder than the f30, its by far the car that is more fun to drive. When I get in the e36 my body just has a feeling of "now its time for some fun".

If you are a true bmw enthusiast you understand, other than name, these are completely different cars in every respect, so much has changed.Click image for larger version

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My next bimmer WILL be an e30. When I'm driving down the road and see a well preserved one I get so excited, my friends think I'm nuts.

...or maybe an F23






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Last edited by HELLR0T; 11-16-2013 at 10:41 AM.
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  #2  
Old 11-16-2013, 11:35 AM
LegendsNeverDie LegendsNeverDie is offline
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People that never experienced the E36 or E46 will never understand.
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  #3  
Old 11-16-2013, 01:15 PM
pony_trekker pony_trekker is offline
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Originally Posted by LegendsNeverDie View Post
People that never experienced the E36 or E46 will never understand.
I thought E92 carried on the tradition. Man I miss that car.
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  #4  
Old 11-16-2013, 01:34 PM
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Miss my E36. You'd know you were driving a BMW even blindfolded.
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  #5  
Old 11-16-2013, 11:51 PM
KOpower KOpower is offline
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Steering e36 greater than F30

Your e36 looks awesome -
F30 is good to cruise around in I suppose -
E46 is a good cruiser and can be fun too !
E30!? I'm sure will be awesome fun!!
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  #6  
Old 11-17-2013, 12:14 AM
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Agree with the op....
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  #7  
Old 11-17-2013, 02:31 AM
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mwm1166 mwm1166 is offline
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E36 = Great Car.
F30 = Great Car.

There are some changes in 15 years...
However BMW "fixed" the steering for the 4 series and for me, that change does the job and brought back that BMW feel, and advanced it into the future. F32 (I'm biased) is better than E36 and F30.
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  #8  
Old 11-17-2013, 04:13 AM
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boltjaM3s boltjaM3s is online now
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Every road in Orlando, Florida is flat, straight, and full of rent-a-car traffic, besides parking lots there's no place to put an E36 through its paces anyway.

BJ
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  #9  
Old 11-17-2013, 04:30 AM
Trey100 Trey100 is offline
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Steering e36 greater than F30

This is starting to get to be like the 50s, 60s, and 70s generation people that still wear GTO and Barracuda T Shirts.


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  #10  
Old 11-17-2013, 04:32 AM
Trey100 Trey100 is offline
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Steering e36 greater than F30

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trey100 View Post
This is starting to get to be like the 50s, 60s, and 70s (edit - I'm a 70s gen guy and there was nothing remotely good about the 70s cars) generation people that still wear GTO and Barracuda T Shirts.


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  #11  
Old 11-17-2013, 06:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
Every road in Orlando, Florida is flat, straight, and full of rent-a-car traffic, besides parking lots there's no place to put an E36 through its paces anyway.

BJ
Besides parking lots and Sebring, yes.

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  #12  
Old 11-17-2013, 08:16 AM
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Steering e36 greater than F30

E30- raw BMW steering feel, love it as a driver's car. No tech wizardry all driver corrections.

E36- More refined but still raw. Early versions of the suspension nannies to make the driver better.

E46- IMHO, the best all around refined road feel and suspension nannies combination. Made the driver an extension of the machine w/o too much or too little interference from the nannies plus still being able to use driver skill for corrections; perfect balance.

E9x- overly stiffened suspension that removed the perfect balance between road feel & feedback along with precise/accurate steering. I actually love this stock suspension setup as it's what I have on my ZHP with adjustable Koni yellows + Hotchkis sways. Due to this increased suspension stiffness the nannies either over or under compensate similar to how the earlier gen E36 would react. However post-LCI E9x are much better dialed in vs the earlier versions.

F3x- EPS first gen implementation; enough said.


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  #13  
Old 11-17-2013, 09:18 AM
gkr778 gkr778 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
Every road in Orlando, Florida is flat, straight, and full of rent-a-car traffic, besides parking lots there's no place to put an E36 through its paces anyway.

BJ
In addition to Sebring (as Chris90 mentioned), Daytona International Speedway is proximate to Orlando and has an autocross track in the infield just inside of turn 3.

HELLR0T, that is a lovely E36 there!
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  #14  
Old 11-17-2013, 03:56 PM
MotoWPK MotoWPK is offline
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There is a significant difference in weighting and perceived feel between the modes, comfort being the lightest, EcoPro with more weighting and Sport considerably better weighted than Comfort and I find quite good - and I'm comparing that to my '13 128i which has great steering.

When someone compares the steering feel of a 128i to something else, there's only one steering feel available so you know what they're comparing. With three different feeling steering modes in the F30, when anyone laments the steering in the F30 but does not state what mode they're referring to, I don't know what to make of the comment - were they aware of the different modes? are they comparing the different modes?
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  #15  
Old 11-17-2013, 03:59 PM
JoeFromPA JoeFromPA is offline
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Hellrot - Are you on the original suspension, steering system, and suspension/steering bushings? Any upgrades?

I only ask because I've driven an e36 with significantly stiffer components in the suspension. It's steering was sublime, but it's ride quality was barely passable for a street car for my tastes.
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  #16  
Old 11-17-2013, 05:21 PM
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boltjaM3s boltjaM3s is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gkr778 View Post
In addition to Sebring (as Chris90 mentioned), Daytona International Speedway is proximate to Orlando and has an autocross track in the infield just inside of turn 3.

HELLR0T, that is a lovely E36 there!
No one should be confusing an F30 with a weekend track car.

Anyone who can afford a $50,000 German luxury car can afford a weekend ride that's nice and tight. Go buy one. Not sure who died and said a BMW 3 Series is supposed to be both.

BJ
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  #17  
Old 11-17-2013, 05:23 PM
HELLR0T HELLR0T is online now
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Mein Auto: 96 E36, 14 F30
Steering e36 greater than F30

Quote:
Originally Posted by MotoWPK View Post
There is a significant difference in weighting and perceived feel between the modes, comfort being the lightest, EcoPro with more weighting and Sport considerably better weighted than Comfort and I find quite good - and I'm comparing that to my '13 128i which has great steering.

When someone compares the steering feel of a 128i to something else, there's only one steering feel available so you know what they're comparing. With three different feeling steering modes in the F30, when anyone laments the steering in the F30 but does not state what mode they're referring to, I don't know what to make of the comment - were they aware of the different modes? are they comparing the different modes?
Was comparing to sport. I used to drive in comfort around town and eco pro on highway, but I now drive sport 90% of the time because of the steering. I have a mt so I take care of the shifting.


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Last edited by HELLR0T; 11-17-2013 at 05:45 PM.
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  #18  
Old 11-17-2013, 05:42 PM
HELLR0T HELLR0T is online now
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Mein Auto: 96 E36, 14 F30
Steering e36 greater than F30

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeFromPA View Post
Hellrot - Are you on the original suspension, steering system, and suspension/steering bushings? Any upgrades?

I only ask because I've driven an e36 with significantly stiffer components in the suspension. It's steering was sublime, but it's ride quality was barely passable for a street car for my tastes.
That's a great point. At 130k miles I had the suspension completely replaced with Bilstein parts. I wanted near original specs. Its as close to stock as possible.


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  #19  
Old 11-18-2013, 08:50 AM
MotoWPK MotoWPK is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HELLR0T View Post
Was comparing to sport. I used to drive in comfort around town and eco pro on highway, but I now drive sport 90% of the time because of the steering. I have a mt so I take care of the shifting.
My experience is similar...using Sport mode a majority of the time because I prefer the weighting of the steering in that mode. Too bad BMW didn't configure the system to allow you to choose a steering mode independent of the other parameters (throttle and transmission).

My comment about making comparisons without reference to the mode was a general one. There have been so many comparisons of the F30 to previous gen 3 series but they seemingly never mention what mode they're comparing.
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  #20  
Old 11-18-2013, 04:52 PM
Kayani_1 Kayani_1 is offline
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Do not even get me started on this discussion

The new crappy steering of a thing they call in F30 or other newer BMW's with EPS.......... have just made me almost walk away from BMW. I did not turn my 7 series in for a newer 7 series because they ruined it and made it a barge to drive.....far less sporty then E65. Instead I moved to an E92 that still carried the banner of what BMW used to be well enough. Then again when it came time to turn in my 5 series I walked away from the newer 5 series because in RWD the horrible EPS and non sporty demeanor was a turn off. Seems like E92 would be my last one and I will hold on to it for as long as I can. I have been voting with my wallet. My money will not go towards the generic bland cars that they are making to appease the masses.

In my opinion........the early generations were more raw and connected. The E46 brought more of the medium ground and the E9x carried on the banner very well it brought huge power gains all around and a tons of more technology.

In comparison the F30 has been more generic and created to appease the masses.......more one step forward and two steps backward with only hints of what it could have been. Who would have thought we will have a day when the Cadillac will have a better feeling steering and more driver connected feel then a legendary BMW 3 series. Just utter embarrassment.

My only hope in BMW is left with the M3/M4/M2 or 2 series now. However, with ever increasing prices of the M cars and imminent horrible EPS setup on horizon in all of them. I am quickly losing whatever remaining faith I have in BMW. This horrible EPS setup has been out now for more then 2 plus years and it is still no where near good.


I think it is time to go buy a GM bang for the buck C7 stingray at least their engineers have been busting butt and the management is on track with what most enthusiast want. The new offering all are pretty good ATS, CTS, and the best of all C7.

Last edited by Kayani_1; 11-18-2013 at 05:03 PM.
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  #21  
Old 11-18-2013, 07:04 PM
Trey100 Trey100 is offline
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Steering e36 greater than F30

I had an E90 335 RWD Sport with 6MT and pound for pound I like my new F30 335 MSport xdrive 6MT with DHP better. Such a smooth car and beautiful to look at (which the E90 was not). For the street, it handles great and is so relaxed doing it. I do keep it on Sport almost all the time (chassis and drivetrain) for the better throttle response more so than the steering. I like that on a 6MT, you can get the enhanced throttle response without having to live with the raised shift points of the auto (no I wouldn't paddle shift).

The E46 is still my favorite exterior style BMW but the overall package that the F30 offers (at least how I have it optioned) is tough to beat.


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  #22  
Old 11-18-2013, 07:24 PM
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boltjaM3s boltjaM3s is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kayani_1 View Post

In comparison the F30 has been more generic and created to appease the masses.......Who would have thought we will have a day when the Cadillac will have a better feeling steering and more driver connected feel then a legendary BMW 3 series. Just utter embarrassment

I think it is time to go buy a GM bang for the buck C7 stingray at least their engineers have been busting butt and the management is on track with what most enthusiast want.
If there were more enthusiasts BMW would cater to them.

Don't blame BMW; blame your little clique whose numbers are so small they aren't a market segment any more.

BJ
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  #23  
Old 11-18-2013, 07:36 PM
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Saintor Saintor is offline
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Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
If there were more enthusiasts BMW would cater to them.

Don't blame BMW; blame your little clique whose numbers are so small they aren't a market segment any more.

BJ
That's just another way of saying 'corruption'.
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  #24  
Old 11-18-2013, 07:44 PM
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boltjaM3s boltjaM3s is online now
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That's just another way of saying 'corruption'.
No, that's just another way of saying "denial".

BMW is clearly going after market share. 3 Sedan, 3 Wagon, 3 GT, 4 Convertible, 4 Coupe, 4 Gran Coupe, X3, X1, 2 Series, there's a niche car everywhere you look in the line, something to cater to everyone out there. If the F30 were destined for Andretti wannabe's, they'd make a version for them. There simply aren't enough people interested.

The F30 is not an enthusiasts car. The E36, yes. The E46, perhaps. The E90, definitely not. The F30, absolutely not. But if you insist on making an F30 into the Ultimate Driving Machine, you still can, BMW allows you to. Get the dealer installed M-Suspension and the hands of time are dialed back, you're in E36 heaven. All it takes is money. Something all but a few BMW owners have plenty of.

BJ
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Old 11-18-2013, 09:04 PM
mrstas mrstas is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MotoWPK View Post
My experience is similar...using Sport mode a majority of the time because I prefer the weighting of the steering in that mode. Too bad BMW didn't configure the system to allow you to choose a steering mode independent of the other parameters (throttle and transmission).

My comment about making comparisons without reference to the mode was a general one. There have been so many comparisons of the F30 to previous gen 3 series but they seemingly never mention what mode they're comparing.
Actually, they did.

My F30 has a Sport and Sport+ mode. Sport mode is configurable, and in my car, I have it set to only change steering + suspension, but not throttle. In Sport+ mode, it changes everything. The difference is VERY noticeable as I switch from Comfort to Sport to Sport Plus.

However, I think Sport+ mode exists only in the Sport and M Sport lines.
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