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X1 E84 (2011 - current)
The new to the US BMW X1 will arrive at BMW dealers in the fall of 2012 as a 2013 model year. Get your X1 28i with either sDrive (RWD) or xDrive (AWD) or get the US exclusive I6 N55 powered X1 35i dDrive.

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  #26  
Old 12-27-2013, 07:31 AM
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stonex1 stonex1 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mullini View Post

Our friends in other countries - is the car buying routine the same where you are?
Very much so in Canada.

Bought 2 vehicles this year. My 2013 X1, and a 2013 Titan Pro4x.
Both were bought the same way, over email via dealerships in different cities.
Price was negotiated over email, and deposit given.
The X1 was an order, so I had to wait 10 weeks. The Titan was on the lot.
Just drove down in my trade to pick it up about a week later.
I had some "quotes" in .pdf format from BMW that had final pricing, but with Nissan, I just had emails.
I saved them in case they tried to change anything I wasn't expecting.
I picked up my Titan in 45 minutes and was driving off.
All numbers were what I was expecting.
Both were great buying experiences, and I never signed anything until the keys were in my hand.
I had my documents with me in both cases, but never had to whip them out as exhibit A.

I think it helps to really do your homework before buying a car. For example, if you are ready to buy and you show your dealer the exact options you want,
with invoice pricing, they soon figure out they can't "sell" you a car, but you are "buying" a car.
Seems like a lot of bmw owners have done it this way.
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  #27  
Old 12-27-2013, 07:37 AM
jayb328i jayb328i is offline
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Originally Posted by mullini View Post
I think two different things are being discussed. The purchase contract is a legal doc and will have all the numbers broken out. But there can be no purchase contract until the vehicle is at the dealership and you are there to buy it and drive it off. When you order the car, you should get the complete order details and something on paper with your negotiated terms/price. That doc is not binding, it's true. But a reputable dealer - and an honest customer - will treat it as such. Now some dealers may not be so reputable, and some customers may find a better deal at the last moment and tell the original dealer "meet this new price or I walk." Or there may be other reasons why the customer walks away.

But you want that paper. When I ordered and weeks later went to buy my X1 at Beverly Hills BMW, I had that paper. I went into the finance office, chat chat chat, smile smile smile, and then the long yellow gets handed over. I check the numbers, and the sales price is - MSRP. I whip out my signed order form with the negotiated price. Embarrassment for finance guy, and great relief for me.

My sister just bought a new Subaru, and we hadn't expected to buy that afternoon. But it's year-end and they wanted a sale, so they offered her invoice on the new hybrid Crosstrek. She had to get to work so finance was rushed. I never looked at the numbers, and I don't think she did either. Later she called me in a panic because the long form confused her. I looked it over and it was fine, the invoice price was there, etc. But I cursed myself after the BMW experience for 1) not making the salesperson write the negotiated price on paper for us to take to the finance office and 2) not making sure my sister looked carefully at the numbers on the contract before signing.

Our friends in other countries - is the car buying routine the same where you are?
I do not think so. A Contract is a CONTRACT. A contract must have all the terms in it, and be signed by the authorized person at the Dealership. And that is the catch--most of the salespeople (if not all) are not authorized to sign it---therefore you must have the manager/owner sign it (or whoever is authorized). Once done, it is binding. It is the Contract that the Dealer will sell you that car for the agreed price when it is delivered to the Dealership. And the Dealer needs to take whatever reasonable actions to make sure that it is delivered---such as placing the order, paying the incoming freight, not cancelling the order, etc.
It is similar to contracting for a house. You contract for the finish product (the house) with all the details (dimensions, fixtures, finish, room size, etc). One does not wait until the house is built to renegotiate or sign a binding contract.
This is how I have done it with a house, and this is how I done it with a car. A dealer would love to keep it open (none binding--meaning it is not a contract)--YOU should make sure every detail is in writing and signed by the authorized person at the Dealership---it is then a binding contract by law. And READ what you sign. Like most CONTRACTS, the party offering it/wrote it, has terms more favorable to them. READ it carefully--do not sign it until you agree and have deleted anything that is not agreeable, such as wording that this is not a contract (or that the dealer can raise the cost by xx%). What I normally do when I get a several page contract is tell the dealer (party) that it will take me an hour to read and where is the conference room so I have quite time. The dealer is hoping you will not do that and are stupid enough to just sign without reading.
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  #28  
Old 12-28-2013, 07:43 AM
mullini mullini is offline
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Buying a house and a car are very different things. If you bought the house from a dealer with dozens/hundreds of houses on the lot, and the dealer could sell the house you ordered to someone else if you walked away, that would be similar. And that's what happens with ordered cars.

Numbers on the back of an order form with the manager's initials are good to have, but that doesn't make it a legally binding contract. Take my situation with BV BMW. I had that paper with initialed numbers, and the finance guy handed me the true contract with MSRP. Now if I had produced my paper and BH BMW said, "That manager is no longer here and we won't honor that price," what would I do? Take them to court? I'd badmouth them all over forums and Yelp, etc., but basically I would just move onto another dealer (and possibly an even better price!).

I don't think that scenario happens all that often, because even the worst dealers don't seek bad publicity. But I am sure it has. I do think a much more likely event is the intended purchaser reneges on the deal. So should the dealer take the customer to court, with that paper and initialed numbers as a "legally binding contract"? How far would that get?

It's maybe just semantics. Even if the paper with initialed numbers is in some sense a "contract," it's not worth much as a contract if it's unlikely to be enforced. So be glad you have it, and probably it's all you need to make sure you get your price. But if you spill coffee on it or wrap a sandwich in it and toss it, do you really think you threw away a contract?
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  #29  
Old 12-28-2013, 09:02 AM
jayb328i jayb328i is offline
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You can bet that that house is sold to someone else if the original buyer defaults on the contract. You can bet that that car is sold to someone else if the original buyer defaults on the contract.
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  #30  
Old 12-28-2013, 09:17 AM
cwickberg cwickberg is online now
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FWIW

A couple of years ago I had a an initialed sales order by sales guy for a GMC truck...it was about 2 hours away and I needed to get my trade... Ir was late and we agreed that i would return the next or so day with the trade...Gave a $500 deposit

Received a call later that evening that I needed to be back before noon the next day otherwise i would loose my deal... Drove down and during the drive, got a call saying the vehicle is being sold to someone in the lobby right then and there.

I was 15 minutes away and when i pulled into the dealership, there was indeed, someone else looking at the truck...

I went in and demanded that the deal be done and showed my "receipt" and charge for the deposit...The sales manager said they never charged my credit card and the Sales Guy had no authority to sign a deal.

I asked to speak to the general manager and eventually got worked out, but not without a lot of gnashing of teeth and some poor feelings, especially from the other buyer who also came from out of town to look at the truck...

...just because the dealership sign says BMW doesn't mean thay are any less or more honest than the next guy...

Sad to say, but I do not really trust any car dealer until the paperwork is done and signed...
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  #31  
Old 12-28-2013, 09:21 AM
jayb328i jayb328i is offline
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Just looked at a BMW Order Purchase Agreement for a new car. It say it is a CONTRACT. But in law, the term Agreement and Contract are used interchangeably.
As expected, the CONTRACT has conditions that are favorable to the dealer, such as if the Recommended Price goes up, one will pay the increase, or if shipping goes up.....you will need to pay that.
But with a Contract you are locked in on the terms, as I stated before, and although the Dealer most likely will not go after you, you will forfeit your deposit.
Most Dealers only have one or two individuals who are designed as the authorized person to sign the Purchase Order so it becomes a CONTRACT. The CONTRACT will state that. It will also state IT IS A CONTRACT. That is not to say that many dealers may not want to execute a contract at the point of order.
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  #32  
Old 12-30-2013, 02:51 PM
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STE92VE STE92VE is offline
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Originally Posted by Moe 92 View Post
After being told that if I placed an order I'd receive a production number and lock in the currently available incentive finance rate, I was told today that the production number may not be available until the car goes into production and that I'd not be able to lock in financing until I take delivery. I was only able to get a gentlemens agreement that if I were unable to get similar financing when the car came in I'd have the option of taking back my deposit and cancelling the purchase.

Am I being cynical in thinking there may be some shenanigans afoot? It just doesn't feel very official at this point.
I think your feelings are spot on. You get a production# before the car goes into production and an estimate of when production is scheduled to start. You can secure financing before delivery and can lock in an interest rate, I believe for up to 60 days.

You only have a gentleman's agreement if gentlemen are involved, not car salesman!
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  #33  
Old 12-30-2013, 03:13 PM
jayb328i jayb328i is offline
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Guys, I was at a social event last night and was introduced to someone who is a salesman in a auto dealership. He has been doing this for 20 years. Took the opportunity of asking him if the paperwork that is issued/signed at time the car is order, is that a Contract. He said yes, and it says so. He also indicated even though there is a clause in there where under certain situations the dealer can adjust the price--that never happens.
But as I have been say, every time I purchased a new car, I got a Contract with all the details and final costs. Not saying that all dealers do this, or want to do that, or that perhaps the practices differs in some States.
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  #34  
Old 01-08-2014, 07:04 AM
patirhodes patirhodes is offline
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That is a beautiful color combo !!!!
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  #35  
Old 01-08-2014, 02:21 PM
Moe 92 Moe 92 is offline
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Originally Posted by patirhodes View Post
That is a beautiful color combo !!!!
Thanks! I was a little tired of white, black, and shades thereof. I'm 44 now, so I told my wife to consider it a perfect car for the practical man's mid-life crisis.
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  #36  
Old 01-08-2014, 02:56 PM
patirhodes patirhodes is offline
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That's a great excuse!!!! LOL
In the pic it looks almost like a dark turquoise...correct? I guess you had to pay extra for that color?
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  #37  
Old 01-08-2014, 03:25 PM
Moe 92 Moe 92 is offline
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Originally Posted by patirhodes View Post
That's a great excuse!!!! LOL
In the pic it looks almost like a dark turquoise...correct? I guess you had to pay extra for that color?
BMW calls it Midnight Blue. Dark turquoise is probably pretty accurate, though I'm pretty terrible at that sort of thing. I can just say I liked the way it looked. It is one of the standard metallic options for 2014 on the X1. Metallic paint (so that's any color other than Jet Black or Alpine White) adds $550, but that's it as far as additional cost.
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  #38  
Old 01-08-2014, 04:44 PM
pony_trekker pony_trekker is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cwickberg View Post
FWIW


I went in and demanded that the deal be done and showed my "receipt" and charge for the deposit...The sales manager said they never charged my credit card and the Sales Guy had no authority to sign a deal.
too bad. If they put someone in the position to sign and you reasonably believe he has the authority they are bound.

Apparent authority refers to a situation where a reasonable person would understand that an agent had authority to act. This means a principal is bound by the agent's actions, even though the agent had no actual authority, whether express or implied.
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  #39  
Old 01-09-2014, 06:43 PM
Wolfex Wolfex is offline
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A car order contract and purchase contracts are two different documents. Order contracts probably have clauses like subject to change to protect the dealership. In California the deposit on a car order is fully refundable. After all you need to test drive the car and look under the hood to make sure it's good before you sign the purchase contract. Check your state law on the deposit refund.


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  #40  
Old 01-10-2014, 07:32 AM
HBWT HBWT is offline
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Originally Posted by jayb328i View Post
...and although the Dealer most likely will not go after you, you will forfeit your deposit.
In most states, if not ALL, there is NO forfeiture of deposit under any conditions. Here in VA and NC, the "contract" is only binding after the new owner drives the car off the lot(not taking and test drive). And in ALL instances, the car can be returned to the dealer, and the contract nullified, if the customer was not allowed a test drive of the actual vehicle before taking "delivery".
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  #41  
Old 02-05-2014, 12:30 PM
Moe 92 Moe 92 is offline
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Just a quick update as promised. Production has been competed, and my car arrived at the port in Germany today! "Endurance" is scheduled to leave Bremerhaven on Friday and arrive in Galveston 2/26. So, if it makes that ship I'll end up with the car about a month earlier than I expected. Next ship is 2 weeks later, so my fingers are crossed.
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  #42  
Old 02-05-2014, 12:44 PM
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STE92VE STE92VE is offline
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Good news! Now you can prepare to track your new baby across the Atlantic. You can find out which ship she's loaded on via the Wallenius Wilhelmsen webiste.
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  #43  
Old 02-05-2014, 12:46 PM
Gort Gort is offline
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Originally Posted by Moe 92 View Post
Just a quick update as promised. Production has been competed, and my car arrived at the port in Germany today! "Endurance" is scheduled to leave Bremerhaven on Friday and arrive in Galveston 2/26. So, if it makes that ship I'll end up with the car about a month earlier than I expected. Next ship is 2 weeks later, so my fingers are crossed.
I hope you are luckier than I was. Mine arrived at Bremerhaven two days before a departure and still didn't get loaded. It waited another 4 days before getting on the following departure. Nonetheless I had it delivered in less than 6 weeks total from the date of the order (in Ohio).
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  #44  
Old 02-05-2014, 01:16 PM
bmw_again bmw_again is offline
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Originally Posted by Moe 92 View Post
Just a quick update as promised. Production has been competed, and my car arrived at the port in Germany today! "Endurance" is scheduled to leave Bremerhaven on Friday and arrive in Galveston 2/26. So, if it makes that ship I'll end up with the car about a month earlier than I expected. Next ship is 2 weeks later, so my fingers are crossed.
Are you sure your car will be on Wallenius lines? Mine (I'm also in texas) for instance is traveling on Michigan Highway ship (K-line I think) and is going to unload in Georgia.
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  #45  
Old 02-05-2014, 02:41 PM
Moe 92 Moe 92 is offline
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Originally Posted by bmw_again View Post
Are you sure your car will be on Wallenius lines? Mine (I'm also in texas) for instance is traveling on Michigan Highway ship (K-line I think) and is going to unload in Georgia.
No, pure speculation at this point. I haven't called the dealership, and the Customer Representative at the 800# was only able to tell me where it was currently. I was only guessing it would be WW based on what I've read here and elsewhere on the interwebz. I though K-line was primarily for West Coast, so I assumed WW.

bmw_again, how did you find out you'd be on K-line and then shipped overland from GA to TX? Dealer? That seems counterintuitive, but I'm admittedly no logistician.
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  #46  
Old 02-05-2014, 03:13 PM
bmw_again bmw_again is offline
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Originally Posted by Moe 92 View Post
No, pure speculation at this point. I haven't called the dealership, and the Customer Representative at the 800# was only able to tell me where it was currently. I was only guessing it would be WW based on what I've read here and elsewhere on the interwebz. I though K-line was primarily for West Coast, so I assumed WW.

bmw_again, how did you find out you'd be on K-line and then shipped overland from GA to TX? Dealer? That seems counterintuitive, but I'm admittedly no logistician.
So, I wasn't seeing any updates online/800# (automatic info kept saying in production) and then I talked to a representative, who told me that the car was on the Michigan Highway. Very soon after, the dealer sent me an update mentioning the expected ship docking date in Georgia.

So maybe they just use whatever shipping option is closest in time.
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  #47  
Old 02-05-2014, 07:28 PM
DAC17 DAC17 is offline
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I'm ready to order. Does anyone know if there is any reason not to wait for the 2015's? I think they're supposed to be built starting in March.

Thanks.
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  #48  
Old 02-06-2014, 09:11 AM
Moe 92 Moe 92 is offline
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My understanding is that they're only making minor cosmetic changes for the 2015 model, and then a complete redesign (with a front wheel drive base ) for the 2016 model.

BMW has explicitly said that the color options will be updated for 2015:
Quote:
For 2015 model year, BMW is adding minor changes to colors, ambiance as they say, and new optional equipment.
... so if your heart is set on a somewhat specialized color (say, Midnight Blue or Valencia Orange), that may be a reason to pull the trigger on a 2014. Obviously there is also the addtional wait to consider. Perhaps also the fact that you've owned the car a shorter period of time before your car would be considered "previous generation" - if you're concerned about that from a prestige point-of-view. I could not care less about that one, personally.

Last edited by Moe 92; 02-06-2014 at 09:12 AM.
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  #49  
Old 02-06-2014, 09:54 AM
Moe 92 Moe 92 is offline
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Here is an article with some detail of the planned cosmetic changes. Regarding paint options, it looks like they're adding "Sparkling Brown" as an option. Not clear to me if any current options will be removed.
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  #50  
Old 02-06-2014, 10:16 AM
mullini mullini is offline
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Sparkling Brown? Is BMW blending Sparkling Bronze and Marrakesh Brown (both have been available in US since X1's introduction) into one color? I wonder if there's really a new color here of just some naming confusion.
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