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X5 E70 (2007 - 2013)
E70 BMW X5 produced between 2007 and 2013. Discuss the E70 X5 with other BMW owners here.

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  #26  
Old 01-25-2014, 12:46 PM
xx xx is offline
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I'll have to get you a picture after I get the truck back from the shop
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  #27  
Old 01-26-2014, 03:15 PM
kldriver kldriver is offline
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My x5 has currently lost all power when trying to start the truck. My mechanic immediately thinks it's the fuel pump. I have already replaced the battery. I will try a local dealership in the morning to get a relay. I don't want to start replacing parts and that not be the issue.


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  #28  
Old 01-27-2014, 04:41 AM
PAX5 PAX5 is offline
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Originally Posted by kldriver View Post
My x5 has currently lost all power when trying to start the truck. My mechanic immediately thinks it's the fuel pump. I have already replaced the battery. I will try a local dealership in the morning to get a relay. I don't want to start replacing parts and that not be the issue.

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Keep us posted ... real curious what's going on. What year is the truck, model, miles?
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  #29  
Old 01-27-2014, 07:26 AM
nardoyno nardoyno is offline
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Well, my car started just fine on the driveway the other morning with the outside temperature at 20F. So, apparently, that little $17 part was in fact responsible for disabling the entire vehicle every time the temperature dropped below ~36F. I disassembled the relay and noticed that the contacts are worn down such that <50 of the contact surface area is making contact with the other electrode. Also, I consistently measure 0.5 ohms when energized. I'm not sure if this should be lower or not. Every amp of current that passes through the contact will drop the voltage tot he fuel pump by 1/2 a volt though. So, maybe if the fuel pump pulls allot of current then it would drop too much voltage and consequently the voltage delivered to the pump might be insufficient for it to operate correctly. Not sure about that. The other thing I noticed is that when disassembling the relay there is allot of slop in the mechanical assembly that hold the coil and contacts in close proximity. Also, it's possible to apply a small amount of sideways pressure to the relay assembly and get the contacts to engage at a different angle. Maybe vehicle vibrations or hitting a large enough bump in the road could possibly cause this to occur and lead to a higher still contact resistance. Anyway, I also froze the relay but did not observe any change in contact resistance. The absence of a reverse EMF diode in the relay assembly or near by to the relay insures that every time it is discharged an arch likely occurs across the contacts. This could also be contributing to the premature failure of the part.

Anyway, satisfied that my vehicle now starts reliably in all weather, I don't care to purse the root cause of the relay failure further. Low reliability TYCO relay is my diagnosis. If I worked for BMW I would recommend replacing devices such as this with solid state equivalent parts. Specially when they are in circuits critical to basic vehicle operation.
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  #30  
Old 01-27-2014, 07:32 AM
cravin cravin is offline
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Helped on my 3.0 as well. Starts right up and it's been below freezing every night
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  #31  
Old 01-27-2014, 10:26 AM
Masoe Masoe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nardoyno View Post
Well, my car started just fine on the driveway the other morning with the outside temperature at 20F. So, apparently, that little $17 part was in fact responsible for disabling the entire vehicle every time the temperature dropped below ~36F. I disassembled the relay and noticed that the contacts are worn down such that <50 of the contact surface area is making contact with the other electrode. Also, I consistently measure 0.5 ohms when energized. I'm not sure if this should be lower or not. Every amp of current that passes through the contact will drop the voltage tot he fuel pump by 1/2 a volt though. So, maybe if the fuel pump pulls allot of current then it would drop too much voltage and consequently the voltage delivered to the pump might be insufficient for it to operate correctly. Not sure about that. The other thing I noticed is that when disassembling the relay there is allot of slop in the mechanical assembly that hold the coil and contacts in close proximity. Also, it's possible to apply a small amount of sideways pressure to the relay assembly and get the contacts to engage at a different angle. Maybe vehicle vibrations or hitting a large enough bump in the road could possibly cause this to occur and lead to a higher still contact resistance. Anyway, I also froze the relay but did not observe any change in contact resistance. The absence of a reverse EMF diode in the relay assembly or near by to the relay insures that every time it is discharged an arch likely occurs across the contacts. This could also be contributing to the premature failure of the part.

Anyway, satisfied that my vehicle now starts reliably in all weather, I don't care to purse the root cause of the relay failure further. Low reliability TYCO relay is my diagnosis. If I worked for BMW I would recommend replacing devices such as this with solid state equivalent parts. Specially when they are in circuits critical to basic vehicle operation.
Thanks for the follow-up/comprehensive write up! I was wondering what happened. It seems to be a common issue with the set up of this engine and vehicle. And to think..it's just the ones that report to these sites that we see, what about all of the others that don't???? Hopefully this is not an issue with the Fxx chassis. Thanks again
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  #32  
Old 01-27-2014, 10:33 AM
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serge1 serge1 is offline
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If we keep it up, we may drive the post-warranty cost of ownership of BMW down to sensible numbers! )

My theory about why BMWs are so expensive to maintain post warranty:
1. Breakdown happens
2. Owner panics
3. Owner drives vehicle to his clueless dealer
4. Clueless dealer chases root problem by replacing parts
5. Root problem found after 6th trip
6. Owner presented with 7,000$ invoice for labor and parts that never needed replacing.
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  #33  
Old 01-27-2014, 10:59 AM
kldriver kldriver is offline
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My truck is a 2007 X5 with 70k miles.


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  #34  
Old 01-28-2014, 06:57 AM
PAX5 PAX5 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nardoyno View Post
... Low reliability TYCO relay is my diagnosis. If I worked for BMW I would recommend replacing devices such as this with solid state equivalent parts. Specially when they are in circuits critical to basic vehicle operation.
Nice analysis, great write-up!

The contact surfaces on these relays are often electro-plated. Unless BMW specifies the electroplate material composition, constant arching across an inferior electroplate surface can/will cause premature degradation ...

What brand did you replace it with? If another TYCO, I suppose another failure maybe in the (near) future?
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  #35  
Old 01-28-2014, 07:14 AM
rh71 rh71 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serge1 View Post
If we keep it up, we may drive the post-warranty cost of ownership of BMW down to sensible numbers! )

My theory about why BMWs are so expensive to maintain post warranty:
1. Breakdown happens
2. Owner panics
3. Owner drives vehicle to his clueless dealer
4. Clueless dealer chases root problem by replacing parts
5. Root problem found after 6th trip
6. Owner presented with 7,000$ invoice for labor and parts that never needed replacing.
BMW just wants us to buy their newer cars every few years.
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  #36  
Old 01-30-2014, 08:04 PM
kldriver kldriver is offline
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So today I went to shop that's is currently servicing my 2007 X5. The minute I walked in the mechanic tells me I need a starter. Just the road I didn't want to go down. Meaning I don't want to start replacing random parts before finding the issue if long cranks in cold weather. He proceeds to tell that the fuel pump us working fine, and he doesn't think it is the fuel pump relay. I was not aware that you could burn out the starter by over cranking the truck. Also does anyone have any concerns with having the starter rebuilt. Or do you suggest replacing with a Bosh starter.


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  #37  
Old 01-31-2014, 08:56 AM
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serge1 serge1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kldriver View Post
My mechanic immediately thinks it's the fuel pump.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kldriver View Post
So today I went to shop that's is currently servicing my 2007 X5. The minute I walked in the mechanic tells me I need a starter.
Not sure the mechanic knows what's really going on.
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  #38  
Old 02-07-2014, 01:23 PM
kldriver kldriver is offline
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So my initial problem with my 2007 x5 still exist. The truck will crank but fails to start in cold weather. I have replaced the battery, and the starter. I put new spark plugs in. The truck ran great for a couple of days in the cold. I left it out if the garage on a sub zero night, and the problem started again. I was able to jump the car and move it into my garage And that is where it sits now not starting. Any ideas? I am researching fuel pump relays on line now.


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  #39  
Old 02-07-2014, 01:40 PM
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serge1 serge1 is offline
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Originally Posted by kldriver View Post
I have replaced the battery, and the starter. I put new spark plugs in. The truck ran great for a couple of days in the cold.
Still haven't tried replacing fuel pump relay? It worked for several people on this forum...
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  #40  
Old 02-07-2014, 02:14 PM
Masoe Masoe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kldriver View Post
So my initial problem with my 2007 x5 still exist. The truck will crank but fails to start in cold weather. I have replaced the battery, and the starter. I put new spark plugs in. The truck ran great for a couple of days in the cold. I left it out if the garage on a sub zero night, and the problem started again. I was able to jump the car and move it into my garage And that is where it sits now not starting. Any ideas? I am researching fuel pump relays on line now.


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I hope you replaced all of that BEFORE you got to this thread? I know that I posted on a number of "wont start in cold" threads (including this one) that it seems to be a faulty Fuel Pump Relay. I included all of the paperwork that I had from my dealership. The relay is about $17.00 and that is minimal considering. Good luck

(http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...6&postcount=12)
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  #41  
Old 02-07-2014, 02:15 PM
Masoe Masoe is offline
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Originally Posted by serge1 View Post
Still haven't tried replacing fuel pump relay? It worked for several people on this forum...
+1
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  #42  
Old 02-07-2014, 08:15 PM
kldriver kldriver is offline
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I am picking one up in the morning from a local dealership. Wish me luck.


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  #43  
Old 02-18-2014, 08:43 AM
tjhammon08 tjhammon08 is offline
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Originally Posted by kldriver View Post
I am picking one up in the morning from a local dealership. Wish me luck.


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I've had the same problem earlier this month on my 2007 X5 4.8. It's the fuel pump relay.
I got it from the dealer (you'll need the part # because for some reason the parts guy said BMW is not good at keeping up with the correct part numbers to things, PART # 6136-8 373 700). Mine came to $20.90 total.
When I got back home I replaced the part and it started right up with no problem.
And if you notice before you replace the part, it no longer does that 2 second hum whenever you press the unlock button on your remote, which is the fuel pump preparing for start-up.
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  #44  
Old 02-25-2014, 06:12 AM
kldriver kldriver is offline
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You're correct, I replace the relay and the X5 has been running great.
Thanks.


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  #45  
Old 02-25-2014, 07:47 AM
Masoe Masoe is offline
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Originally Posted by kldriver View Post
You're correct, I replace the relay and the X5 has been running great.
Thanks.


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Glad to hear that!! Thanks for the follow up!
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  #46  
Old 07-08-2014, 04:54 AM
redwood78 redwood78 is offline
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Originally Posted by xx View Post
I lifted the flap (can see everything and all the fuses and a different/black relay in the fuse block... but not a green relay at the lower area). oh well...
Same issue here. I have a 2011 x35i (with the n55 turbo engine). I am getting the long crank and ordered the green fuel pump relay but, surprise, it's not behind that flap in the passenger rear wall compartment as it apparently is on other e70 x5's.

Does anyone know where the green fuel pump relay is on the e70 x35i? Is it actually the square black relay in the fuse box?

Last edited by redwood78; 07-08-2014 at 05:29 AM.
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  #47  
Old 07-09-2014, 05:51 PM
redwood78 redwood78 is offline
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replying to my own post, i have searched everywhere and cannot figure out if the x35i lci x5 actually takes the green relay or not. the pn is listed for the vehicle, but i don't see where it goes. oddly, i also cannot figure out what the black relay does. it is not listed with the fuse diagram, and realoem and other such sites it is listed as "relay, make contact." anyway, a few random people on the internet (with other model bmw's) have reported that replacing the black relay solved a long crank problem so for $13 from tischer i'm going to give it a shot.
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  #48  
Old 07-09-2014, 11:58 PM
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serge1 serge1 is offline
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Good luck and please report back . May help someone in your situation
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  #49  
Old 07-17-2014, 04:41 AM
redwood78 redwood78 is offline
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Good luck and please report back . May help someone in your situation
black relay replaced but still having the long cranks. i'm guessing it is the HPFP.
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  #50  
Old 07-17-2014, 08:26 AM
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serge1 serge1 is offline
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Sorry to hear it didn't fix the long crank. At the very least, you have eliminated one of common causes, at low cost.
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