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E39 (1997 - 2003)
The BMW 5-Series (E39 chassis) was introduced in the United States as a 1997 model year car and lasted until the 2004 when the E60 chassis was released. The United States saw several variations including the 525i, 528i, 530i and 540i. -- View the E39 Wiki

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  #1  
Old 01-20-2014, 04:02 PM
douglas1137 douglas1137 is offline
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Mein Auto: 1998 528i M52
Fan clutch bolt hell

I am trying to remove the oil filter housing to replace the gasket- it leaks like crazy.Problem is I have tried almost every means possible to break the fan clutch bolt free but NOTHING has worked so far. I researched here, google, etc & I have tried them all- screwdriver trick broke one & bent the other, tried using a large heavy duty steel punch in place of screw driver & bent that! I have been spraying PB on it for 3 days, hitting the bolt with 5# hammer & crowbar, made the home made removal tool & broke it (aluminum), etc.

Only thing left is to heat the darn thing- I have map gas, but I dont want to damage anything in the process. I have a good torch & can direct heat inward so it hits the bolt & front of water pump housing. My mechanic had the same trouble with removing it previously to replace the fan until they heated the bolt.

Can anyone help me with this? Parts coming tomorrow so I need to get thing off as soon as possible. Thanks.
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  #2  
Old 01-20-2014, 04:12 PM
rstackels rstackels is online now
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i used a big screw driver that i bent at the end it was just some cheap off brand tool and a big wrench my friend was under the car with wrench and i was on top with screw driver you just have to get it in the right spot to hold/push it and it should come off
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  #3  
Old 01-20-2014, 04:20 PM
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Fudman Fudman is offline
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Buy the real tool (on eBay) or make one out of real steel stock, not aluminum. I did the latter using a garage door opener link. And use some anti-seize to make it easier the next time.
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  #4  
Old 01-20-2014, 04:21 PM
Burning2nd Burning2nd is online now
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one of any of these

http://www.amazon.com/ATD-Tools-2151...rds=air+hammer
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  #5  
Old 01-20-2014, 05:27 PM
edjack edjack is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by douglas1137 View Post
I am trying to remove the oil filter housing to replace the gasket- it leaks like crazy.Problem is I have tried almost every means possible to break the fan clutch bolt free but NOTHING has worked so far. I researched here, google, etc & I have tried them all- screwdriver trick broke one & bent the other, tried using a large heavy duty steel punch in place of screw driver & bent that! I have been spraying PB on it for 3 days, hitting the bolt with 5# hammer & crowbar, made the home made removal tool & broke it (aluminum), etc.

Only thing left is to heat the darn thing- I have map gas, but I dont want to damage anything in the process. I have a good torch & can direct heat inward so it hits the bolt & front of water pump housing. My mechanic had the same trouble with removing it previously to replace the fan until they heated the bolt.

Can anyone help me with this? Parts coming tomorrow so I need to get thing off as soon as possible. Thanks.
You DO know this is a left-hand thread?
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  #6  
Old 01-20-2014, 05:51 PM
dvdlkd dvdlkd is offline
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I just replaced my oil filter housing gasket and never removed the fan or shroud. The belt can be released easily coming up from the bottom of the car. The alternator has to be removed but even the upper alternator mounting bolt can be removed without removing the fan or shroud. My car is a 97 with the M52 so we have the same setup.

Hope you didn't try to turn it counter clockwise at first to remove. This nut is reverse thread. If you own the car long you will eventually have to take this fan off.
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  #7  
Old 01-20-2014, 07:00 PM
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bartelbe bartelbe is offline
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I usually use a 1 1/4 wrench and a 3lb hammer and give it a full swing but the last one I had to break out the air hammer with a chisel bit work like a charm.
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  #8  
Old 01-21-2014, 06:28 AM
JKRIT JKRIT is offline
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The last resort way to get the fan off is to remove the water pump with the fan still on it. Had to do it on an E36 and even with a bench vice gripping the pump shaft with impeller ripped off, couldn't budge the fan nut; Had to replace the whole assembly: pump, pulley, clutch and fan. PO must've used loctite on the threads.
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  #9  
Old 01-21-2014, 07:48 AM
cn90 cn90 is offline
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Spray some PB Blaster at the area between WP shaft and Fan Clutch nut interface.
Let it sit for a few days.
Repeat it a few more times.
Then use the tricks mentioned above.

Whatever you do, during installation, apply a small dab of antiseize or grease, the next time it will be alot easier to remove the Fan Clutch.
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  #10  
Old 01-21-2014, 08:31 AM
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Flybot Flybot is offline
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Dont use heat. The water pump pulley is plastic. You need a proper holder and wrench. Then knock it with a hammer.
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  #11  
Old 01-21-2014, 05:24 PM
planeengineer planeengineer is offline
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I'm getting ready to do the same job (ofhg replacement) and it looks like you can do it without having to remove the fan or shroud. Do more research on line. You'll see what I mean.


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  #12  
Old 01-21-2014, 06:40 PM
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eparayno eparayno is offline
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I hope you tried loosening it by turning the nut to the right, towards the drivers side. Mine came out extremely easy. Attached a long adjustable wrench and pushed down with little force and it loosened right up. I've since deleted the mechanical fan and installed an electric one though.
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  #13  
Old 01-21-2014, 07:27 PM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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More than you can possibly imagine on this topic is found here:
- BMW cooling system overhaul fan clutch nut counterhold tools (1)
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Please read the suggested threads, where the best always add value to those threads, either by pictures or by descriptions, so the next person with the same problem stands on your shoulders.
See also: E39 Bestlinks & How to easily find what you need
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  #14  
Old 01-21-2014, 08:25 PM
occhis occhis is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by planeengineer View Post
I'm getting ready to do the same job (ofhg replacement) and it looks like you can do it without having to remove the fan or shroud. Do more research on line. You'll see what I mean.


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Wp bolts are behind the cone shaped pulley, so I can't see how that can happen.
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  #15  
Old 01-21-2014, 09:56 PM
zersys zersys is offline
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I have a method that I haven't seen anywhere else, and like you I tried everything and my method is the only thing that worked.



Hopefully my crappy diagram is self explanatory. I also recommend a really long open ended wrench, or if you are using a wrench that is open ended on both sides, slip a breaker bar onto the opposite end of the wrench for more leverage.

Personally, I rested my tool on a jackstand beneath the car because of the force I would have to use to break the bolt, and (although it is highly unlikely) I didn't want to damage the crankshaft pulley in any way and create more problems for myself.

With this method, your full body weight is used to crack the bolt, rather than traditional methods which require you to use both arms to counter hold the force, so it makes quick work of this impossible task. Mine cracked after one push. (I spent the two previous nights trying the traditional methods and it didn't budge, all I managed to do was break the pulley in half).

I recommend giving it a good forceful push, while at the same time being careful not to damage anything (most notably, the fan shroud). If you give it a slow push you will just bend the bolts or snap the water pump pulley.

I hope this helps!


EDIT: One thing I've realized is that my method looks impossible due to the serpentine belt being in the way, this is not the case. The tool rests on the outer part of the crankshaft pulley, not on the grooves in which the belt slips on to.
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  #16  
Old 01-22-2014, 11:48 AM
e39-rijder e39-rijder is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluebee View Post
More than you can possibly imagine on this topic is found here:
- BMW cooling system overhaul fan clutch nut counterhold tools (1)
Yep, I will submit my reply there.
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  #17  
Old 01-25-2014, 07:18 PM
douglas1137 douglas1137 is offline
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UPDATE!! Thanks for all of the advice- most of it was very helpful & some seemed like they never read my original post but I wanted to let you know I appreciate it all. I never once tried to remove the thing by trying to turn it to the right and as I stated I used PB Blaster on it for about 3 days & a LOT of time and trials to get it off. I would have been much happier if I could have done everything I wanted without taking the fan & shied off but I am trying to get to as many things I need to while I am working on getting this car the maintenance & repair it needs- remember it has 210k miles on it. I am the second owner. I also looked for answers not only here but by Google as well but nothing was working- I prob spent as much time researching than I did working on removing it. I wanted to make sure I exhausted all other avenues prior to posting a new thread on here cause I didnt want to get schooled about if I just looked harder I would get it right & this would make the darn thing mysteriously release & come off! : 0

I ended up taking the advice from Fudman & bought the tool off ebay for $20 and as soon as it got here I went to work on it right away & ..........it STILL would not come off!!! I fought with it for about 30 minutes until I was sweating from the exertion. My last straw was I climbed up on top of the engine compartment (hood just propped as normal & balanced myself so that my left foot was on the tool & my right on the 32mm wrench. If anyone had seen this they would have laughed at me as sure as crap my weight(210#) would NOT break it loose.

Finally I gave a little jump - the tool went to the left & the wrench went to the right & I went down. I figured I had broke who knows what but I looked down & gave the fan a little spin & the bolt from hell was free! That thing tried to get the best of me but thanks to you all it did not so thanks to you all once again.

That all being said, I am now deep into this project & would like some help on what I should check out, replace, inspect, etc. Valve cover off for VCG replacement, everything removed to get oil filter housing gasket replaced, replace vanose high pressure pipe, power steering hoses need replacing, intake manifold off for new gaskets, CCV replaced with new grommet, ICV cleaned with new grommet, throttle body gasket, etc. What I am asking for is some advice about a few misc. parts that I should replace while I am in there. Plan to replace all vacuum lines as well. Oil filter & fuel filter changed out as well.

Is it a good idea to replace the vacuum non-return valve, relay switch under the manifold? How about the oil pressure sensor on the filter housing, the double temperature switch mounted to the block & the Air temp sensor as well? I do not know if this is important, but my dash outside temperature is WAYYYY off the actual outside temp.

I apologize this post is so long- guess I am actually excited to see just how much better this old girl will run after this little project is done.

Douglas
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  #18  
Old 01-26-2014, 12:12 AM
zersys zersys is offline
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Did you try what I posted or was it too hard to understand? My method works, and makes the bolt insanely easy to remove.


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  #19  
Old 01-26-2014, 08:27 AM
rdl rdl is offline
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An emphatic +1 on CN90's advice in post #9 to apply antiseize to the thread before reinstalling the fan clutch.

Also, although the spec'd torque is 45 Nm (33 lb-ft) you can safely tighten to less. The engine rotation is such that the fan tends to self tighten during operation - there is no risk of the fan spinning itself off. Further, the thread is long and fine enough to align the fan clutch on the w/p shaft to prevent any wobble without the specified torque. Spin the clutch to bottom and then lightly snug the clutch nut using only the serpentine belt for resistance. I've used this method 3 years and ~40k miles without incident.

I a had a terrible time releasing my fan the first time, although not quite the ordeal you've had. Since then, with anti-seize and a light snug torque, my fan releases with a tap or two on the wrench without a holding tool.

The outside temperature sensor is mounted in the plastic wheelhouse panel ahead of the right front wheel - accessable from beneath the car. It isn't anywhere near the fan. You can safely leave that for another day.
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  #20  
Old 01-26-2014, 02:36 PM
douglas1137 douglas1137 is offline
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zersys- i had already ordered the tool by the time I saw your post- looks like a good idea though.

I have been seeing anti-seize recommended so much I bought some before I turned the first bolt on this project- very good idea. Again want to say thanks to all but wanted to thank bluebee & cn90 for their huge contribution to this forum- you guys are incredible! Your advice, knowledge, wisdom & unbelievably good DIY"s have given me the confidence to do this project in the first place- not to mention the amount of parts & labor from dealer/mechanic. If you notice all of the projects I am doing were covered extensively by you two!!

I am asking for help on the misc parts to replaced, cleaned, etc while I have it torn down- espec under the intake manifold with all of the "spaghetti" & access to the sensors on the block, vacuum relays, etc because I am ordering the last of my parts tomorrow, so anything you guys can think of please let me know.

If you want an up to date best places to buy your parts let me know because I already have a box of over $300 in gaskets, CCV, etc to perform this project taped up with return for refund forms inside for UPS to ship back to the parts place I bought them from tomorrow. Let me just say that the places that have been recommended in the past appear to not have the same quality of parts from yesteryear. Cheap crap product substituted for real BMW parts is rampant!! One example is CCV- important part with a lot of known problems, right? Paid over $70 for the BMW OE part but was sent a $25-$35 URO part instead. Called company & was told that if they had a part to substitute the OE that is what they send. Seems like fraud to me but what do I know? FYI- there is a parts manufacturing company that named itself....OEM!! WTF???
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  #21  
Old 01-26-2014, 05:29 PM
rdl rdl is offline
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You might add these items to your lists from earlier posts:
1) check the two cabin heater water pipe connections at the front of the head for any sign of weeping or deterioration in the pipes themselves. Not common, but not unheard of, and definitely not easy to replace with the manifold in place.
2) check MAF to throttle boots for splits or deterioration, especially at the branch to the IAC valve

The CCV and related hoses are common failure items which seems to be more a problem in cold weather regions. It appears you already have that in mind.

The air inlet temp sensor is not reported as a common failure & is on top of the manifold so easily replaced any time.

The coolant temp sensor, oil pressure switch and evap system solenoid valve are not common failure items. The sucking jet pump (which I think is what you mean by the vacuum non-return valve) is also not a common failure. But they are not very expensive either. OTOH, they can be replaced with manifold in place, although not so easily. Some would, some wouldn't. Your choice.
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Old 01-26-2014, 08:51 PM
douglas1137 douglas1137 is offline
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Here are a few pics of the parts I am talking about and a few other little things.

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Looking at intake propped up. Lower red arrow is the piece of aluminum bar I made the bolt removal tool out of- at least it did not go to waste! Yellow arrow #1 is the air temp sensor or maybe the double temp switch? I have tried to find correct names for these things but these are from RealOEM diagrams the best I could understand. Yellow arrow #2 goes from there to the throttle body I think that is right but what is it? Upper red arrow is a switch or relay or something that has vacuum lines attached to it. Vac line #1 comes from a vacuum valve on the passenger side & line #2 goes to the non-return valve located under the manifold & on down to a Y connector where another vacuum line comes in from a connection under manifold right next to ccv & icv area.?? Do I have this right?

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Closer view of the sensor and hose connection. Any help with these things appreciated. Note the red circle around wire shroud on wire with connector that attaches to the fuel rail electronics area.

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Another close up- blue arrow looking into valves looking a little rough or OK for 210k miles?

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Close up of the no- return valve that the vacuum line from the switch/relay cgoes into. Is it a good idea to go ahead & replace? How do I test it?

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This is the vacuum valve? that the blue striped vac line- arrow #2- comes fromon its way to that switch under front of manifold.

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Here is the last one- a closeup of the front underside of the intake manifold showing the device that the vacuum lines are going through.

I already have new vac lines to replace these. This vacuum system was sucking so much air its pitiful. Funny thing is that it had vacuum when I put my hand over the oil fill on valve cover. I do not know if it was too much vacuum because I do not have a tester.

I apologize about for these simplistic questions that I am sure a common knowledge to many of you, but I am new to all of this.
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  #23  
Old 01-26-2014, 09:43 PM
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16valex 16valex is offline
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Good job!
None of those sensor needs to replace unless it's bad.
If the ambient temp sensor is way off then replace it. It's located under the right front bumper.

One essential part you must replace with the intake manifold off is the fuel pressure regulator.
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  #24  
Old 01-27-2014, 04:33 PM
douglas1137 douglas1137 is offline
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Smile

16valex, thank you for the info on the fuel regulator valve. I started digging into where I should find it since I could not locate it anywhere around that intake manifold nor the fuel rail. I found what it should look like & it's location on realOEM but I could not find it on my car. I found a few posts that lead me to think it is located under the driver side right around the fuel filter- looks like a box with multiple hose connections.

My car is a 1998 model with a 11/97 Manufacturing date. I think this is another one of the BMW "transition vehicles" in which some parts & diagrams are different than what is indicated. I have found posts for 98 models that are like mine, but more often than not they are kinda blended with other posts so it is necessary to put the pieces together. For example I added dipstick tube o-rings to my parts order using the same realOEM parts diagrams & numbers, but they came up as 3 series parts and some 5 series, but none for my make, model, or year. That FPR was on the diagrams but not the car.

I am wondering if others have experienced the same thing or is it just me not knowing what I am talking about?
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  #25  
Old 01-27-2014, 07:42 PM
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16valex 16valex is offline
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Originally Posted by douglas1137 View Post
16valex, thank you for the info on the fuel regulator valve. I started digging into where I should find it since I could not locate it anywhere around that intake manifold nor the fuel rail. I found what it should look like & it's location on realOEM but I could not find it on my car. I found a few posts that lead me to think it is located under the driver side right around the fuel filter- looks like a box with multiple hose connections.

My car is a 1998 model with a 11/97 Manufacturing date. I think this is another one of the BMW "transition vehicles" in which some parts & diagrams are different than what is indicated. I have found posts for 98 models that are like mine, but more often than not they are kinda blended with other posts so it is necessary to put the pieces together. For example I added dipstick tube o-rings to my parts order using the same realOEM parts diagrams & numbers, but they came up as 3 series parts and some 5 series, but none for my make, model, or year. That FPR was on the diagrams but not the car.

I am wondering if others have experienced the same thing or is it just me not knowing what I am talking about?
You have done your homework, good job. And yes, a 98 model the FPR moved to under the car. I think you should label yours as a 98 not 97.
Nevertheless it should be replaced with all the hoses too.
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