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F10 / F11 (2011 - Current)
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  #126  
Old 03-06-2014, 03:11 PM
Stonehauler Stonehauler is offline
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No, I am an engineer, but I've help develop and enforce certain regulations (not related to automotive or transportation) and now I work on analyzing what happened when things go very wrong in my industry.

So, am I advising him to get a lawyer because I am one? Nope. I've worked with lawyers in the past on both sides of the table and I know the value of good ones. I also say it because from my (brief) research, you are only allowed 4 points in 12 months before license suspension in California and this takes up two of them. A regular speeding ticket (again, from the little research I've done) is 1 point. He can only go to traffic school once every 18 months and I don't know how many points the OP has on their license or how long ago they went to school last. From a risk perspective, having half of your allowed points taken up in a single incident leaves you in an exposed place. It's just not a place I would like to be from a "what happens if" point of view. I am very conservative in personal risk management and would not want any points on my license if I could avoid it.

Yes, the obvious thing is to avoid speeding in the future, but here in the US, that is not always possible. There are roadways that are posted at 55 Miles/hour that if you actually travelled at that speed, you would be a hazard to traffic and likely to be hit or subjected to road rage as everyone else travels at 70 MPH. If you are pulled over at that point in order to be made an example of (which police will sometimes do in order to slow traffic down), you have yet another point on your license. As others point out, sometimes the officer will cite you for multiple violations in a single stop (read an earlier post about the person who got the improper lane change/speeding ticket in Louisiana. Other times, they will pull you over for just 1 mph over the limit.

From my own experience. Driving down a four lane (each way) highway, I notice a cop decently far behind me I am traveling in the second most righthand lane (to allow room for people entering and exiting the highway but still one more travel lane to my left and the passing lane beyond that. I set my cruise control to 55 (the posted limit) and continue on down the road. The road is almost completely empty. The cruiser get right up on my bumper and stays there for about 2 miles. Finally, another car behind us moves one lane over to the left and VERY SLOWLY passes us. The difference can not be more than 1 or 2 MPH..well within our combined speedometer errors. The cruiser immediately pulls in behind the guy and flips on his lights to pull the person over. The thing is, his speedometer could have been reading 55 as he was passing us (my 55 could have been 54 actual and his indicated 55 could have been 56). That means if the cop is really wants to pull someone over, they can do just that (and have done in my experience). Is this right? Should the person be in jeopardy of losing their license for something like that? Again, this is all about risk management. If the OP is fine with having 2 points on their license and knows they can keep their nose clean for 12 months plus another 24 after that so that they drop off...just pay the fine. If they want to keep their risk exposure to a minimum, they should fight it. It's their choice.

As for my "money spent on cars"...most of them were retire with significant milage on them or when repair costs, etc make them more of a money pit than anything else. They also represent all cars my family has owned (including my wife's cars)....so, 7 years for the T-bird...totalled when rear ended at a stop light. 10 years Yukon - trailer tower with serious brake issues that were not resolved after 4 times in the shop, 12 years - grand prix, significant milage and needed a new engine, 9 years lexus - 10k value, with some engine issues showing up...decided to get a new car before I needed to spend 20k on an engine. That leaves me with 3 vehicles. One of which is a truck I use for towing/hauling stuff. So, I get my money out of my cars, but I also get rid of them before they start costing more than they are worth in repairs or their reliability goes down to the point where they are unsafe or in are in danger of leaving me on the side of the road.
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  #127  
Old 03-06-2014, 07:22 PM
Rick550i Rick550i is online now
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Originally Posted by bmw325 View Post
Haven't read through all the righteousness in this thread, but why don't you just hire a traffic attorney? Here's one in california for example that's always plugged on a podcast i listen to:
http://www.4mrticket.com/
Hey, I like that link "remember a good attorney is not cheap and a cheap attorney is not good." I don't know if I can afford him but I bookmarked his page just in case.
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  #128  
Old 03-06-2014, 11:46 PM
Sophisto Sophisto is offline
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@stone, quite some information in that post, thanks, I do not enjoy the way you describe the attitude of the force.
There is a kind of facist mentality in there, in the speed controlling attitude.
Overhere we are penalized in masses by electronic controlls for mostly minor speed offences, when 3 kms over you will be penalized starting at 40 euro fastly climbimg to summs of a couple of hundred. Lots of people get a couple of small fines per year, that is just that, some extra tax, but no further harassment.
Enjoy your cars!
And yes I know, a good lawyer can really help.

Last edited by Sophisto; 03-06-2014 at 11:49 PM.
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  #129  
Old 03-07-2014, 05:01 AM
Stonehauler Stonehauler is offline
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Most police overe here are good decent people who are not out to ruin your day. That said, there are always bad apples or someone just having a bad day. I do not know why that officer did what they did, but the fact remains they did so. Again, no matter what their reasoning, it's still not appropriate IMO.
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  #130  
Old 03-07-2014, 06:09 PM
beashonda beashonda is offline
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Originally Posted by hufington View Post
Could you please pm me how is it possible that you had 38 ticketsand a clean record? i had only one single speeding ticket 3 years ago (a 27mph in a 25mph zone) and it is still in my record!
You didn't plead out to "unsafe" driving? That's the way you still pay a bunch of $$$$ ($250 admin fee) + court costs and unsafe driving fine and end up with zero points. I had been speaking (42 mph on a 25 mph) and the first and only cop Ive ever seen on this not heavily travelled road I take EVERY day, was just sitting there pulling over folks. Told me to not feel bad, i wasn't the only one. I was guilty and was going to just pay, but when i saw how many points......changed my mind, called an attorney friend, who said to ask for "unsafe driving" special.
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  #131  
Old 03-08-2014, 12:10 AM
SuperTerp SuperTerp is offline
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Originally Posted by Stonehauler View Post
Most police overe here are good decent people who are not out to ruin your day. That said, there are always bad apples or someone just having a bad day. I do not know why that officer did what they did, but the fact remains they did so. Again, no matter what their reasoning, it's still not appropriate IMO.
I interacted with one that while he foolishly wrote tickets having no real idea what the driver was doing (in my car) was a very nice pleasant man... The ones I most recently interacted with while one seemed genuinely good the other was what I'd stereotype as an extremely overly aggressive cop and while maybe he was doing that to try and show off or as a scare tactic all it did was made me buy into the bad things I hear about officers... You can be firm and hard without being overly aggressive, and I respect that they deal with things we probably can't fathom, but if you're no longer capable of removing yourself from a clearly awful situation and a day to day white collaresq crime, then really you should be looking for a different job in my opinion, and maybe be awarded some type of early retirement/ pension etc.

Last edited by SuperTerp; 03-08-2014 at 12:12 AM.
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  #132  
Old 03-08-2014, 07:59 AM
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Leslierc Leslierc is offline
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Originally Posted by Rick550i View Post
Hey, I like that link "remember a good attorney is not cheap and a cheap attorney is not good." I don't know if I can afford him but I bookmarked his page just in case.
No case is too big; no fee is too big.
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  #133  
Old 03-08-2014, 07:59 AM
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Leslierc Leslierc is offline
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Originally Posted by Rick550i View Post
Hey, I like that link "remember a good attorney is not cheap and a cheap attorney is not good." I don't know if I can afford him but I bookmarked his page just in case.
No case is too big; no fee is too big.
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  #134  
Old 03-08-2014, 08:04 AM
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Leslierc Leslierc is offline
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Originally Posted by Stonehauler View Post
Most police overe here are good decent people who are not out to ruin your day. That said, there are always bad apples or someone just having a bad day. I do not know why that officer did what they did, but the fact remains they did so. Again, no matter what their reasoning, it's still not appropriate IMO.
I have the utmost respect for police officers. Yes, there may be some of them (a few perhaps) on the job that shouldn't be there; but we count on them to put it all on the line when the time comes and that's what they do. I think like teachers, police officers are under paid and mostly under appreciated for what they do for our society.
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  #135  
Old 03-13-2014, 04:27 PM
HD34 HD34 is offline
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I was a carreer law enforcement officer, after I retired I became a Law Enforcement Trainer and worked nationwide.

I always get a kick out of these converstations, particularly the perceptions people have about cops. I dont know if some jurisdictions use a quota system or not, I can tell you the ones that I have worked for and with do not. My standard response to someone who asked was that I got to write as many tickets as I wanted

But even if a quota system existed, so what? Every job has some type of performance standard, if your job is writing tickets then Im guessing thats what your bosses expect you to do. Dont take it so personally, just fight the ticket if you really disagree with it, maybe the Judge will just take it under advisement and just charge you court fees. I was more of a tactical guy and later worked at the command level so I did not do a lot of traffic but when I did, I can assure you it was never personal, hell I would not even remember you most likely & would have to just testify to what I documented at that time.

As for all of you Haters, Cops are just like any other profession except we have less problems. But its a people profession and as long as you hire people you will have some people problems.

BTW I love driving my 528XI on the rural roads here in NM at 100MPH plus, it handles like its on rails!

Last edited by HD34; 03-13-2014 at 04:30 PM.
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  #136  
Old 03-13-2014, 04:42 PM
falar falar is offline
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If you live in California and got the ticket in Oklahoma I wouldn't pay it. The state of Oklahoma has no jurisdiction over your driver's license in California.

However, if you ever relocate to OK someday there might be an issue.


Also, to those saying "You were speeding just shut up and pay it" I laugh at you and call you the 98%. It is very easy to beat most tickets and they set everything up knowing that 98% of people are just sheep that fall for their revenue generation schemes and will blindly pay.

Last edited by falar; 03-13-2014 at 04:43 PM.
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  #137  
Old 03-13-2014, 04:55 PM
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07 E63650i 07 E63650i is online now
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Originally Posted by dunderhi View Post
In a Stealth-esque world, you, despite your success, are just a poor schmuck who only can't afford to drive a proper sports sedan, like best car in the world: the ///M5. In this alternative world, one's success is measured solely upon the car one drives and the size of the investment account statement that one brings to the car dealership to prove that one qualified to test drive a worthy car. I'm not that creative , so no, I didn't make that up.



As far as his post, I believe it does not have any merit at all. I have worked with people at all income levels and stations in life and out-of-the-box thinking is not the exclusive domain of wealthy or the Porsche/M5 driver, which by the way are the cars of choice for plenty of middle managers. Heck, one of my non-degreed computer techs drives an M5.



Anyway, this is a car forum. More specifically, this is a BMW F10 forum. We come here because we share ownership or interest in this automobile. We come from diverse backgrounds and from around the world. Some of us are young and some of us are old. Some of us can barely afford our lease payments and some of us see the cost as a drop in the bucket. Some of us drive conservatively and some of use drive like maniacs. Some of us change our oil every 3kmi and some of us change it every 19kmi. The list can go on ad nauseam (maybe it already did), but fundamental point is that we are all different and should take a moment to consider what the "other guy" will think when one posts demeaning statements with respect to money, jobs, and the like.



P.S. The impact of Points are like Fuel Economy numbers. When the total costs are calculated, the actual impact maybe isn't quite as big as some people think.

One of the best quotes I have read in a long time.

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  #138  
Old 03-13-2014, 05:20 PM
HD34 HD34 is offline
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Originally Posted by falar View Post
If you live in California and got the ticket in Oklahoma I wouldn't pay it. The state of Oklahoma has no jurisdiction over your driver's license in California.

However, if you ever relocate to OK someday there might be an issue.

Also, to those saying "You were speeding just shut up and pay it" I laugh at you and call you the 98%. It is very easy to beat most tickets and they set everything up knowing that 98% of people are just sheep that fall for their revenue generation schemes and will blindly pay.
Not true unless Ca is one of the handful of states that does not belong to an interstate compact that allows one state to suspend your license in another for failing to appear& seek a warrant.


Dude you just need to get over it. Insulting everyone is no way to go through life...
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  #139  
Old 03-13-2014, 07:29 PM
falar falar is offline
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Originally Posted by HD34 View Post
Not true unless Ca is one of the handful of states that does not belong to an interstate compact that allows one state to suspend your license in another for failing to appear& seek a warrant.


Dude you just need to get over it. Insulting everyone is no way to go through life...
In your opinion. I'm perfectly fine insulting people every day, I didn't even say anything that mean. If that offended someone then they need to get some thicker skin, their problem not mine.

My whole point is that not enough people stand up to the government. They get their ticket in the mail and throw a check in an envelope and send it off and don't even realize how many weapons they have at their disposal to get the ticket dismissed.

I pay enough ****ing taxes. I don't need jack booted thugs hiding behind trees with radar guns trying to pad the coffers of state and local governments with even more money for them to waste. I will fight them tooth and nail for every dollar and wish more would do the same.
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  #140  
Old 03-13-2014, 09:49 PM
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K-A K-A is online now
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Originally Posted by falar View Post
In your opinion. I'm perfectly fine insulting people every day, I didn't even say anything that mean. If that offended someone then they need to get some thicker skin, their problem not mine.

My whole point is that not enough people stand up to the government. They get their ticket in the mail and throw a check in an envelope and send it off and don't even realize how many weapons they have at their disposal to get the ticket dismissed.

I pay enough ****ing taxes. I don't need jack booted thugs hiding behind trees with radar guns trying to pad the coffers of state and local governments with even more money for them to waste. I will fight them tooth and nail for every dollar and wish more would do the same.
While I agree that paying more money to the Govt. is an obvious waste, you're the one in the wrong, and their job as they see it is to catch every "thug" who's speeding irresponsibly. It's the law, their job is to uphold it. Citing you for tickets isn't crooked, corrupt or wrong for them to do, it's what you pay them to do.
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  #141  
Old 03-14-2014, 09:32 AM
HD34 HD34 is offline
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Originally Posted by falar View Post
In your opinion. I'm perfectly fine insulting people every day, I didn't even say anything that mean. If that offended someone then they need to get some thicker skin, their problem not mine.

My whole point is that not enough people stand up to the government. They get their ticket in the mail and throw a check in an envelope and send it off and don't even realize how many weapons they have at their disposal to get the ticket dismissed.

I pay enough ****ing taxes. I don't need jack booted thugs hiding behind trees with radar guns trying to pad the coffers of state and local governments with even more money for them to waste. I will fight them tooth and nail for every dollar and wish more would do the same.
Lol, what is your whole point? There is within our legal system a way for you or anyone else to contest a traffic ticket. If someone chooses to just pay it that is one way, if they decide to contest it, thats another way. Because you might choose to contest it that does not make your choice a more valid one. Nor does it make someone who chooses to not contest it less informed or shrinking from their rights under the law.

So if you get a traffic ticket its because the "jack Booted Thugs" are to blame? What are you saying? That they should not enforce the law? Or just not enforce it where your concerned because, well because your so special?

I would offer you some advice which Im guessing your personality wont go along with but what the heck, I have a few minutes to kill:

If you do get stopped dont go on about your opinons of the COP's, what a tough guy you are and how your gonna fight it and make them look like the fools that you know that they are. Trust me, as a carreer lawman I can tell you that they are not going to be impressed other than to tell their buddies what a jerk you were and how they made you wait twice as long on the side of the road and found a couple extra violations because, well because you are so special.

When you get to court I doubt the cop will remember you, he forgot about you 2 seconds after he let you go, while you seethed and seethed and seethed. Then if you pull that same stuff with the judge, the judge will be, well as impressed as the COP with your point of view, and while your rambling on he'll be thinking about what hes going to have for lunch before throwing the book at you for blabbering so much.

So if I was you, Mr. Wonderful, I would just stick to the facts, either prove that you were not in violation or not. The rest of us can be spared the lectures.
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  #142  
Old 03-14-2014, 10:07 AM
falar falar is offline
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Originally Posted by HD34 View Post
Lol, what is your whole point? There is within our legal system a way for you or anyone else to contest a traffic ticket. If someone chooses to just pay it that is one way, if they decide to contest it, thats another way. Because you might choose to contest it that does not make your choice a more valid one. Nor does it make someone who chooses to not contest it less informed or shrinking from their rights under the law.

So if you get a traffic ticket its because the "jack Booted Thugs" are to blame? What are you saying? That they should not enforce the law? Or just not enforce it where your concerned because, well because your so special?

I would offer you some advice which Im guessing your personality wont go along with but what the heck, I have a few minutes to kill:

If you do get stopped dont go on about your opinons of the COP's, what a tough guy you are and how your gonna fight it and make them look like the fools that you know that they are. Trust me, as a carreer lawman I can tell you that they are not going to be impressed other than to tell their buddies what a jerk you were and how they made you wait twice as long on the side of the road and found a couple extra violations because, well because you are so special.

When you get to court I doubt the cop will remember you, he forgot about you 2 seconds after he let you go, while you seethed and seethed and seethed. Then if you pull that same stuff with the judge, the judge will be, well as impressed as the COP with your point of view, and while your rambling on he'll be thinking about what hes going to have for lunch before throwing the book at you for blabbering so much.

So if I was you, Mr. Wonderful, I would just stick to the facts, either prove that you were not in violation or not. The rest of us can be spared the lectures.
Here you don't even have to go to court, you have a legal right to a trial by written declaration.

This is ALWAYS the route to go because cops get paid to appear in court and if you go the written route they get no compensation to write their version on their own time and send it in.

If you actually get someone that does take the time and send in a report you can request an immediate retrial. I'm 3 for 3 with this method so far. It is also a good idea to do research and find out if you are in absolute or presumed speed limit state as well, it makes a big difference in how you can argue your case.

These are a few examples of what I was talking about in my previous post.........there are so many weapons at your disposal to beat this revenue generation game that anyone with 1/2 a brain should do the research and fight back instead of just becoming another statistic.
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