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E46 (1999 - 2006)
The fourth generation 3 Series (E46 chassis) was introduced in 1999 and set the standard for engineering and performance during it's years of production including being named to Car & Driver's 10 best list every one of those years! ! -- View the E46 Wiki

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  #26  
Old 01-22-2005, 01:53 PM
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Glad you made it out alive and in one piece. This is one of the main reasons i refuse to drive anything else unless it has those 3 letters on the hood. I totaled my first bimmer(E30 325) when i was 16 after running a stop sign and being t-boned by a GMC truck at 35Mph. Then a few years back my brother totaled his E38 7 series and walked away from the accident after the cops told him he should of been a dead man. The engineering that goes into these vehicles is 2nd to none, we are very fortunate to own these Wonderful German motorcar masterpieces.

P.S. So ur gettiing an E90 coupe, why not go for one of the last E46s?
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  #27  
Old 01-22-2005, 03:45 PM
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Yikes very scary! Luck was on your side.
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  #28  
Old 01-22-2005, 08:42 PM
adc adc is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SONET
I agree, these cars are incredibly safe. After two [comparatively minor] accidents in the past year, the invincibility fallacy has passed and there's no question that safety has become top priority when considering a replacement.--SONET
Well I'm glad the original poster walked from the accident and hope the young lady makes a full recovery.

I totalled my VR6 Jetta after being T-boned by a 16 year old in a massive 80's Pontiac who didn't stop for his left turn. Hit smack where the driver door hinge is located, catapulted me spinning over a curb and into a light pole. I was driving maybe 35mph, maybe less, and it was dark and raining.

The Jetta was a goner, but I only walked away with a bruised nose from the airbag. Even so, they were able to start her and drive her off a few yards on her little broken wheels, to better maneuver the tow truck. After that, I decided I would only buy German cars if I can help it (Volvo ok too).

No more invincibility thoughts here. I drive fast and I want a car that will protect my life from others - and my - mistakes.

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  #29  
Old 01-22-2005, 09:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adc
No more invincibility thoughts here. I drive fast and I want a car that will protect my life from others - and my - mistakes.
As long as you realize that common sense is your first line of defense; any car is secondary to that.

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  #30  
Old 01-22-2005, 09:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarke
The interior capsule held up beautifully.
Wow, look at that interior, virtually no damage at all!

BMW & German Engineering =

Good luck with the recovery.
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  #31  
Old 01-22-2005, 10:55 PM
KwlAznKid KwlAznKid is offline
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my faith in bmw safety has just increased by a lot!
sorry bout ur crash btw at least ur okay =)
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  #32  
Old 01-23-2005, 12:32 AM
jetstream23 jetstream23 is offline
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Cars can be replaced.....people cant'!

Just wondering, was the cracked rib from the seatbelt restraining you at such as high impact speed?
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  #33  
Old 01-23-2005, 10:04 AM
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I believe it was from the seatbelt...I'd take a broken rib over a faceplant to the windshield. I'm hesitant on buying a new car now...some jackass will probably come along and run into me again, ding my car, scratch it, or steal it...I just can't have anything nice...
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  #34  
Old 01-23-2005, 06:17 PM
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msbrown msbrown is offline
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Notice the car from the windshield on back....

....and how it is pretty much undamaged? *That's* the engineering we are paying for. Money's story is pretty much like what Nancy and I went through this last Oct (15th) in my late, lamented Z3: sudden appearance of SUV passenger side in our lane, at about 50MPH. Knocked the SUV over on its side(!), the Z3 just stopped.

You must sit further back from the wheel than I do, since the rib injury sounds pretty much like seatbelt damage. My wife took a lot of that as a passenger, while I didn't (the airbag caught me first). Is the foot trauma from being on the brake when you hit? I can't tell from the wheel/fender position in the pictures....

Still, walking (limping) away beats the alternative, hope the pax in the GMC comes out OK .
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  #35  
Old 01-23-2005, 06:48 PM
allaboutme allaboutme is offline
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Not to put a downer in this convo, but many modern cars will equally protect the driver as well as or better than a BMW. There are safer cars out there from Europeans or Japanese, so I don't want the dellusion that the BMW is the safest and that being placed in any other car will mean certain doom. By the way, an SUV impact at 40mph into the side of a 3 series would be disasterous for us once the height of an suv, its weight, and its momentum are taken into consideration. And those considerations don't include the "worthiness" of the 3 series crash structure (relatively low waistline, for example).

and money dumper, buy whatever you can afford that you meets your qualifications. If anything does happen, that's the way of life.
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  #36  
Old 01-23-2005, 06:56 PM
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EdCT EdCT is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allaboutme
Not to put a downer in this convo, but many modern cars will equally protect the driver as well as or better than a BMW. There are safer cars out there from Europeans or Japanese, so I don't want the dellusion that the BMW is the safest and that being placed in any other car will mean certain doom. By the way, an SUV impact at 40mph into the side of a 3 series would be disasterous for us once the height of an suv, its weight, and its momentum are taken into consideration. And those considerations don't include the "worthiness" of the 3 series crash structure (relatively low waistline, for example).

and money dumper, buy whatever you can afford that you meets your qualifications. If anything does happen, that's the way of life.
I believe the new Subaru Outback gets five stars across the board.

Perception still sells, though.

Ed
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  #37  
Old 01-23-2005, 06:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allaboutme
Not to put a downer in this convo, but many modern cars will equally protect the driver as well as or better than a BMW. There are safer cars out there from Europeans or Japanese, so I don't want the dellusion that the BMW is the safest and that being placed in any other car will mean certain doom. By the way, an SUV impact at 40mph into the side of a 3 series would be disasterous for us once the height of an suv, its weight, and its momentum are taken into consideration. And those considerations don't include the "worthiness" of the 3 series crash structure (relatively low waistline, for example).

and money dumper, buy whatever you can afford that you meets your qualifications. If anything does happen, that's the way of life.
So your saying that a honda civic would of performed just as well under the current circumstances? Maybe a Lexus or and Infinti which have excellent safety records too, but i think this kind of safety comes only in the premium segment and up.
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  #38  
Old 01-23-2005, 07:36 PM
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wow, WOW...

...but you passed a signal light at 50mph...what kind of road is this? thats pretty fast..no?
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  #39  
Old 01-23-2005, 07:38 PM
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The new Outback had great safety results. The NHTSA gave them 5 stars in front and side. Of course if I got an Outback it would have cost as much as my Bimmer so I don't know, is an Outback a premium luxury segement car?
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  #40  
Old 01-23-2005, 07:56 PM
allaboutme allaboutme is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Double Vanos
So your saying that a honda civic would of performed just as well under the current circumstances? Maybe a Lexus or and Infinti which have excellent safety records too, but i think this kind of safety comes only in the premium segment and up.
I can't say that the Civic will perform worse, the same, or better than our car. But you have to take into account factors which I can't even name. There's also the size consideration, which is really important. Our cars are significantly larger than a civic and presumably heavier. In a collision with each other, I'd place my bet on the BMW to come out in better condition with all things equal, and that will never happen. In a collision with just two Civics, that MAY make no difference than from having two equal BMWs collide with all things equal. An suv versus suv will produce similar results. However, an suv going head on with a civic will be ugly or uglier than a collision with a BMW.

Fifth Gear had a presentation where they tested its safety against other cars. First, I admit Smart is engineered by Mercedes-Benz. Secondly, the cars the smart tested against were, I believe, econoboxes or similar segment cars. In the test, the Smart was the smallest car by a big margin. Anyway, the program showed the Smart and other car(s) ramming straight into a concrete barrier at some ridiculous speed only to show the Smart bested the other(s). The structure of the Smart stayed in tacked whereas the others disintegrated. I'm only using this as an example to prove that smaller cars (civics) may be better than their rivals which were bigger. That is to rebut your statement about Civics. Of course, there is the better engineering and other junk I can't really think to comment on now. Moving on though...

But you may have a point will premium segment cars. Our cars are generally heavier, using heavier and stronger materials, and provide that vault-like perception. Nevertheless, I still think there are more factors to safety than the BMW badge or European superiority.

Anyway, again I'll go back to the Civic because other stuff popped into my mind while looking at your sig. Our cars are larger and have inherently bigger crumple zones. If the Civic were equally sized, there is a chance that yes, it may perform as well as our cars. Surviving head on collisions are easier because of those large hoods with large crumple zones. Any side impacts are harder because only a few inches and steel separate us from the other object.

Oh.. another edit. Do I feel safer in my car than I would in a civic? Yes, of course. Can I justify it other than the feeling? No, not really. That's just my perspective. Please don't take it as an attack on you but as something for everyone to think about in the invincibility complex while in a BMW.

Last edited by allaboutme; 01-23-2005 at 08:14 PM.
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  #41  
Old 01-23-2005, 08:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moneydumper
I believe it was from the seatbelt...I'd take a broken rib over a faceplant to the windshield. I'm hesitant on buying a new car now...some jackass will probably come along and run into me again, ding my car, scratch it, or steal it...I just can't have anything nice...
well how about being more careful next time..you say that you got hit, sure its her fault...but now you will proceed light intersections more carefully eventhough you got the light....I do...I have to drive for the idiot in front of me, back of me, to my right and to my left....its a tedious job, driving...your senses have to be ON...100%.

well dinging your car, then park far away

scratch your car, well dont park it where the risk is high.

steal it...well dont leave your car unprotected get a brake lock

what is nice comes with a price, if you dont pay (due diligence) you cant play

Think of it this way..you have another chance to play...at least you can walk talk and keep your job to play again....just play right..this time.
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  #42  
Old 01-23-2005, 09:24 PM
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swchang swchang is offline
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Moneydumper, you're a cop, right? I admit that after reading your post, the first thought that came to mind (after being glad that you were okay, and hoping that the girl comes out of her coma) was that recent post about how cops get into the fewest accidents...

Anyway, this is a prime example of why I think posts like, "Who cares about safety, as long as I can drive the best handling car, that's the safety I really need, 'cuz I'll avoid all accidents" are so worthless. Everyone has different priorities in life, fine, but don't think that just because you drive a BMW or a Miata or an Elise or S2000 or whatever that you'll be able to outhandle the big rig bearing down on you, out of control in the snow, while you're stuck in standstill rush hour traffic.
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  #43  
Old 01-23-2005, 11:02 PM
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icemanjs4 icemanjs4 is offline
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Don't forget about brakes. BMW's brakes are pretty darn good. That means that you're able to T-bone that car in front of you at a slower speed than if you were driving a Civic. Also, since the car doesn't nose dive as much during braking as some of the cheaper cars, your angle will be better to absorb the impact than if your nose had squatted down.

But a car can only do so much. It's way too easy to forget how dangerous cars can be. When I was 16 my mom told me "you are now licensed to drive a killing machine. Be careful".
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  #44  
Old 01-24-2005, 07:07 AM
dakotadog dakotadog is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Riuster
but now you will proceed light intersections more carefully eventhough you got the light....I do...I have to drive for the idiot in front of me, back of me, to my right and to my left....its a tedious job, driving...your senses have to be ON...100%.

Yup, that's the truth. Even if you have the right of way, you always have to be on the look out for the other idiots on the road. Unfortunately, it sometimes takes a major incident to make that realization. I was rear-ended twice badly in my old Avenger and now I'm always driving for myself and for the others around and behind me.

Anyway, I am glad that you are ok moneydumper. Hope you have a quick recovery. It will be a while, but I'm sure you'll be ready for a new car before you know it.
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  #45  
Old 01-24-2005, 07:11 AM
adc adc is offline
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Civic vs. BMW not fair, you say? Compare it with similar size cars, you argue? OK by me.

I know exactly how my 95 Jetta held up in an accident, I've been there. My friend's 95 Civic 4 door caved in on a similar impact with a heavier Mitsu. His mother on the passenger side suffered broken ribs and multiple lacerations from the door intrusion. He swore he will NEVER buy another Japanese car: he went straight for an A4 with the maximum number of airbags.

When I first rode with him in the Civic I realized it had a more spacious interior even though an almost identical external footprint. When I first closed a door in that Civic I knew exactly how this disparity had come to be.

The Civic is (was?) a thin piece of tin. No two ways about it. It's designers made some decisions about the weight & chassis integrity equation and the result came out on the wrong side of safety. Go slam a door on a Civic and you'll know what I mean. In a side impact, that door is the only thing standing between you and a deadly piece of metal.

Incidentally, this is one onf the reasons my wife will probably end up with an X3 this summer. Height is another reason.

Your money, your life.

adc
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  #46  
Old 01-24-2005, 07:14 AM
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It's worth noting if Money had been driving a Porsche Boxter, he'd probably be dead.

We had a guy get killed up here in a relatively low speed head-on in one of these, there's simply no protection up front. I confess to not knowing the safety rating on these, though.

Ed
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  #47  
Old 01-24-2005, 07:30 AM
bmw325 bmw325 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allaboutme
Not to put a downer in this convo, but many modern cars will equally protect the driver as well as or better than a BMW. There are safer cars out there from Europeans or Japanese, so I don't want the dellusion that the BMW is the safest and that being placed in any other car will mean certain doom. By the way, an SUV impact at 40mph into the side of a 3 series would be disasterous for us once the height of an suv, its weight, and its momentum are taken into consideration. And those considerations don't include the "worthiness" of the 3 series crash structure (relatively low waistline, for example).

and money dumper, buy whatever you can afford that you meets your qualifications. If anything does happen, that's the way of life.
Agree. The latest Accords and Camrys for example are quite safe, probably safer than our e46s. Newer car designs tend to be safer than older ones; even if you're comparing "premium European" to Japanse econobox. Also, I think the perception of Japanese cars as "tin boxes" is kind of outdated. Yes, it used to be that companies like Volvo, BMW, Saab and Mercedes made the safest cars. But, as safety has become more of a mainstream selling point (and government requirement), I think this is becoming less and less true. European cars tend to "feel" safer because of their generally heavier doors, but I don't think that it really makes a difference compared with a mainstream Japanese or American car. I was thinking about this as I was looking at a Volvo ad the other day-- they were touting stuff like "side impact protection, 3 point seatbelts, crumple zones, safety cage, etc' that every modenr car has. I do still think that a BMW's slight advantage in handling/braking can add a margin of safety in certain situations.
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  #48  
Old 01-24-2005, 07:58 AM
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EdCT EdCT is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robg
Agree. The latest Accords and Camrys for example are quite safe, probably safer than our e46s. Newer car designs tend to be safer than older ones; even if you're comparing "premium European" to Japanse econobox. Also, I think the perception of Japanese cars as "tin boxes" is kind of outdated. Yes, it used to be that companies like Volvo, BMW, Saab and Mercedes made the safest cars. But, as safety has become more of a mainstream selling point (and government requirement), I think this is becoming less and less true. European cars tend to "feel" safer because of their generally heavier doors, but I don't think that it really makes a difference compared with a mainstream Japanese or American car. I was thinking about this as I was looking at a Volvo ad the other day-- they were touting stuff like "side impact protection, 3 point seatbelts, crumple zones, safety cage, etc' that every modenr car has. I do still think that a BMW's slight advantage in handling/braking can add a margin of safety in certain situations.
Well put and it's worth noting our 3 series, though best in class when they were designed in the late 90's, have now been superseded by newer designs, all one has to do is look up the insurance institute's rating to see.

Ed
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  #49  
Old 01-24-2005, 08:00 AM
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Moneydumper, I hope you're recovering well. The accident happened 3 weeks ago? Is the Jimmy passenger still in a comma? Hopefully she will fully recover. Even though you were not at fault, I know it can be troubling to know that someone else was hurt in the accident. Take care of yourself. Please keep us up to date.
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  #50  
Old 01-24-2005, 10:34 AM
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I just think that this kind of safety is what you get when you pay premium price. Yes the europeans had this market covered since the 70's and 80's but technology has gotten cheaper and more accessible. As long as you pay between $30k and $40k for a well known brand of car(BMW,Lex, Benz) your very likely to get very safe car. But lets not kid ourselves, just cause a car has airbags and yaw control doesnt make it a world class safe car. For example look at kias and hyndas they come with all these airbags and usually get low scores on front and side impact tests. Bottom line is "You get what you paid for".
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