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  #1  
Old 04-05-2005, 04:24 PM
ZenX5 ZenX5 is offline
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Exclamation Is my 4.8is a lemon??!

Man oh man, this car really is starting to drive me nuts.

I purchased my '04 4.8is back in september. The first week of owning the car, the battery died 3 times. I brought it into the dealer, and they "fast charged" it overnight without even checking if the battery had a defect. A couple days later, the battery died right as I was supposed to leave on an important trip. I brought it back into the stealer, yelled like a crazy woman and demanded that my battery be replaced ON THE SPOT, and not "fast charged." They found two dead cells in my battery.

Then, as I hit 2,000 miles, I get the dreaded "check rear lights" signal, and then a few days later I got a "check engine oil level" warning. I check the oil, and my my was it LOW. I mean right below the minimum mark. Is this normal? I called my stealer's service advisor and asked them what I should do. They said "Oh, it's normal for a new car to consume oil. Go ahead and fill it up with a few quarts." I ended up filling the car with 4 quarts of OIL!!!

So I kept driving the car everyday as I normally do. When my car hit 11,000 miles I got the "check engine oil level" warning AGAIN. So I turned off the car, checked the oil level, and it was just as low as it was the first time. It was right below the minimum mark. This time, I ended up filling my car with 5 quarts of oil (unbelievable.)

As if this wasn't bad enough, yesterday I was driving home and I got a "self leveling suspension inact." warning. I am about ready to flip my lid!!!

Would this be considered a lemon?? I've never heard of a new car consuming this much oil! Any help is very much appreciated.

Thanks
-Kristie
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  #2  
Old 04-05-2005, 04:32 PM
shahkg shahkg is offline
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You'll have to check with your state's lemon law's, but I don't think that this will qualify. Consuming oil I don't think equates to mechanical/structural problems, but I could be wrong. Do a Google search for Lemon Law and you'll get some answers.

Sorry to hear about the horror story, but I would go back to the stealer and keep screaming!
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  #3  
Old 04-05-2005, 04:40 PM
Jeremy Jeremy is offline
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Normal people would say, "YES"

Qualifying for Lemon Law in CA is a little tougher than that though.

Be aware that CA law says the problems must occur within the first 18 mo or 18K miles and the manuafacturer has had a reasonable number of attempts to repair the vehicle.

I advise you contact BMW directly in addition to asking the dealer to repair the problem.

Good luck Kristie.


CA Lemon Law
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  #4  
Old 04-05-2005, 06:59 PM
ZenX5 ZenX5 is offline
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The car hit 12,000 miles a few days ago. I made an appt with my dealer on Thursday morning. The girl I spoke with sounded like she really didn't know what she was talking about. I explained all of my problems in detail to her and she says, "sounds like you need an oil change." I think the most accurate description of how I felt at that moment could be summed up like this...

I plan on bringing my boyfriend with me since the male service advisors at this particular stealer seem to act like I don't know what I'm talking about because I'm a woman. I'm sure all of you have dealt with what I'd like to call "the run-around" from BMW's wonderful customer service.

Imagine, I've had to fill my car with 9 quarts of oil since I have purchased it. I haven't even had my first service yet.

Thankyou guys so much for your input.

-Kristie
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  #5  
Old 04-05-2005, 07:21 PM
ZenX5 ZenX5 is offline
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Vin #

By the way, my vin# is LE81424, and I just read on another thread that the cars that were affected by the recall are LE81202-LE81643. Hmm.....just great.
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  #6  
Old 04-05-2005, 08:10 PM
vinu_neuro vinu_neuro is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZenX5
By the way, my vin# is LE81424, and I just read on another thread that the cars that were affected by the recall are LE81202-LE81643. Hmm.....just great.
i think your engine is burning quite a bit of oil. 9 qts in that many miles is waaaaayy beyond spec. If anything, they should be looking at replacing the engine. check with another dealer also.
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  #7  
Old 04-05-2005, 09:10 PM
ZenX5 ZenX5 is offline
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I think the LEAST they could do is replace the entire car. I have done nothing but baby the car and I haven't even gone over 90 mph! I always warm up my engine as well.

Who knows what else could be wrong, the car is pretty new.

My previous 4.4i NEVER had any of these problems. One check rear lights warning and that was it.

As much as I love this car, it's becoming a complete nightmare.

I guess I will have to update on Thurs, see what they say.
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  #8  
Old 04-06-2005, 09:59 AM
vinbah vinbah is offline
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i don't know if it will help you. when i got my first oil change done. same thing started happening. i ended up "buying" and putting in 12 quarts of oil before the second oil change.
initially i kept getting the same story.. your car is burning oil and its "normal" i kept mentioning the fact that it did not burn that much oil in first 15,000 miles.

when they did my second oil change..they found that the seal was not properly installed due to which it was leaking. i never had a problem after that.
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  #9  
Old 04-06-2005, 10:21 AM
bork111 bork111 is offline
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I believe that CA lemon laws not only require that problem recurr over and over, but it must be the SAME thing that keeps breaking. I would think that a dealer who wanted to get repeat business would try a little harder to address your problems.
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  #10  
Old 04-06-2005, 08:50 PM
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Bavarian Bavarian is offline
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9 quarts in top-offs?!

LOL my recent oil CHANGE cost me 9 quarts of oil. Something's defintely a problem. I really can't believe how these newer X5s are so error-prone!

Makes me think of the 2003 and 2004 E46s equipped with the 3.0L I6. Remember those failed ignition coils, and slipping transmissions? Well I do...

It always seems like when you own a mid-life car in the BMW lineup, it's the one without problems. Although, in my opinion, with each model year, the product should be less and less error-prone.
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  #11  
Old 04-07-2005, 08:57 AM
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dsheli dsheli is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZenX5
Man oh man, this car really is starting to drive me nuts.

I purchased my '04 4.8is back in september. The first week of owning the car, the battery died 3 times. I brought it into the dealer, and they "fast charged" it overnight without even checking if the battery had a defect. A couple days later, the battery died right as I was supposed to leave on an important trip. I brought it back into the stealer, yelled like a crazy woman and demanded that my battery be replaced ON THE SPOT, and not "fast charged." They found two dead cells in my battery.

Then, as I hit 2,000 miles, I get the dreaded "check rear lights" signal, and then a few days later I got a "check engine oil level" warning. I check the oil, and my my was it LOW. I mean right below the minimum mark. Is this normal? I called my stealer's service advisor and asked them what I should do. They said "Oh, it's normal for a new car to consume oil. Go ahead and fill it up with a few quarts." I ended up filling the car with 4 quarts of OIL!!!

So I kept driving the car everyday as I normally do. When my car hit 11,000 miles I got the "check engine oil level" warning AGAIN. So I turned off the car, checked the oil level, and it was just as low as it was the first time. It was right below the minimum mark. This time, I ended up filling my car with 5 quarts of oil (unbelievable.)

As if this wasn't bad enough, yesterday I was driving home and I got a "self leveling suspension inact." warning. I am about ready to flip my lid!!!

Would this be considered a lemon?? I've never heard of a new car consuming this much oil! Any help is very much appreciated.

Thanks
-Kristie



Well Kristie I will give you $5000 for it and take it off your hands.










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  #12  
Old 04-07-2005, 09:01 AM
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Nick325xiT 5spd Nick325xiT 5spd is offline
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Where are you filling the oil to on the marker? Typically, when the oil gets below the minimum marker, the car is about 1 quart or so low. If you're putting that much oil in, you're probably overfilling the the thing.
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  #13  
Old 04-07-2005, 01:55 PM
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SARAFIL SARAFIL is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick325xiT 5spd
Where are you filling the oil to on the marker? Typically, when the oil gets below the minimum marker, the car is about 1 quart or so low. If you're putting that much oil in, you're probably overfilling the the thing.
(sorry Nick )

I don't understand the complaints about the low oil. I find it hard to believe that your car could go down 4 or 5 quarts on oil without making it quite noticeable, and without triggering the Check Oil Level warning. From what I've seen on most cars, being down 1 qt of oil is enough to trigger the computer that something is wrong. Something has got to be wrong. What, are you filling the oil until it starts pouring out of the top of the engine?

If your car was in bad enough shape to need 4 quarts of oil after 2000 miles, I'm pretty confident that you'd notice a problem immediately with the car.
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  #14  
Old 04-07-2005, 03:58 PM
vinu_neuro vinu_neuro is offline
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another thing, what kind of oil are you using to top it off?
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  #15  
Old 04-07-2005, 04:15 PM
philippek philippek is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZenX5
By the way, my vin# is LE81424, and I just read on another thread that the cars that were affected by the recall are LE81202-LE81643. Hmm.....just great.
According to the vehicle history the DME recall was performed on your car prior to you taking delivery.
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  #16  
Old 04-08-2005, 07:51 PM
ZenX5 ZenX5 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick325xiT 5spd
Where are you filling the oil to on the marker? Typically, when the oil gets below the minimum marker, the car is about 1 quart or so low. If you're putting that much oil in, you're probably overfilling the the thing.

Actually, I'm not overfilling anything. The FIRST time the check engine oil level warning came on, it was below<<<< the MINIMUM. So I filled up one quart of oil, drove it, and the warning was STILL on. I filled it up again with another quart, letting the oil sit for 15 min, and checked the level again. The warning did NOT go away until I filled it up with four quarts. I'm not overfilling anything. The manual for the 4.8 states that the oil level should be at the MAX level. My oil level was BELOW the minimum. THEN, it hits 12,000 miles and the check engine oil level comes on AGAIN.


To Sarafil.....you really don't have to believe anything. In fact, u don't have to respond to my thread if you don't believe me. These are the problems on my car, thats it. Take it or leave it. I find it hard to believe that my car is burning this much oil ALSO, which is why I came on here for advice. BTW, I've had problems with my car since the first week that I bought it. You obviously didn't read my post thoroughly.

vinu.....I use the recommended oil from the owner's manual. Castrol syntec 5w-30

phillip....the recall was performed on my car before i picked it up, but a number of x5s have had problems linking to this specific recall. Ask steved, he knows all about it.


Thankyou to those people who offered helpful suggestions.
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  #17  
Old 04-08-2005, 07:52 PM
ZenX5 ZenX5 is offline
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btw when my car's engine oil level warnings came on, and i opened the oil cap, there was a ton of steam coming out of the cap.

Yeah, thats really normal.
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  #18  
Old 04-09-2005, 12:35 AM
Poisonsnail Poisonsnail is offline
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hmmm.. when is the engine oil level warning light came on? while the engine is running?or when you turn off the ignition then the display came on? Did u hear any weird knocking noise coming from the engine when the light came on? these little details would help a technician pin point the problem a lot,save their time to perform a work faster less time for your car to stay in a Dealer yes?
by the way according Bmw spacification "BMW engine consume atleast 1 Qt of oil in every 750miles" which is normal.
mostlikely as for your case if the oil level is ok or maybe a bit low then what they can do is they'll Reprogram the control unit (LCM) for your car other than that some further diagnosis would have to be perform
just a little bit of an idea ,hope this help
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  #19  
Old 04-09-2005, 02:03 AM
ZenX5 ZenX5 is offline
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The first time the check engine level warning came on (at 2k miles) after I turned off the car. However, even when I filled 3 whole quarts (each quart at separate times, checking the level after each quart) and drove the car all day, the warning was STILL on.

The second time the warning came on, was while I was driving.

I'm picking up my car tomorrow morning, hopefully I will like what I hear and BMW won't give me the "run-around."

Very odd that a BMW would consume a whole quart every 750 miles. My dad has owned 3 mercedes CL600's, and he has never once had to top off his engine with oil.

Btw poisonsnail, thank you for the suggestions.

I'll update tomorrow....
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  #20  
Old 04-09-2005, 05:09 AM
vinu_neuro vinu_neuro is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZenX5

vinu.....I use the recommended oil from the owner's manual. Castrol syntec 5w-30
castrol syntec is not what BMW uses! bmw uses german formula castrol synthetic oil. castrol syntec isnt even a real synthetic oil. use mobil1 synthetic if you have to. fyi: the dealer will top it off for free.
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  #21  
Old 04-09-2005, 11:13 AM
ZenX5 ZenX5 is offline
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Really, well can you please tell me why it says "BMW only uses Castol Syntec" on my oil cap. How am I supposed to know that they use the "german version"??
You know what's funny, I picked up 4 quarts of Mobil 1 the first time I needed to fill up oil, and my boyfriend told me to put the same oil it recommended. Although everyone I know uses Mobil 1, we were just going by the directions.

Anyway, I'm off to pick up my car.
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  #22  
Old 04-09-2005, 02:06 PM
ZenX5 ZenX5 is offline
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So I'm back from the dealer...............


They told me that the cluster/warning indicator was faulty and that they fixed it. I requested to speak with a service technician because I smelled bull****. I told the technician the whole oil situation, and how the engine is PHYSICALLY burning oil, its not a faulty sensor. The technician made an appt on Tuesday for an "oil consumption test."
Why the hell wasn't this test performed initially?

Next, they found that a pump for my air suspension was dropping in pressure and is faulty. They special ordered this part and it should be replaced on Tuesday.
I always knew there was something wrong with the suspension, because driving on the freeway was like hell. I would have to make CONSTANT little corrections to keep the wheel straight.

They also found a permanent failure in my rear right bulb, which then had to be replaced.

Don't forget, I also had a defective battery that was replaced within the first week of owning my car.

I KNOW there is something wrong with the engine, and BMW is trying as hard as possible to not take any liability. I will be contacting a lawyer if any other problems arise.

This has been one frustrating experience!!!!
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  #23  
Old 04-09-2005, 05:17 PM
mdbmw mdbmw is offline
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Hmmm..... Oil consumption problem? I had a car several years ago that was going through a ton of oil as well. Took it to the dealer and they couldn't figure it out. My dad was changing the plugs one day and noticed they were sitting in about an inch of oil. Back to the Dealer......the oil consumption test is not a one time thing. I had to bring it by once a week for 2 months so they could keep track. Anyway, they did end up rebuilding the engine at no cost.

I know that your frustrated....just hang in there. I don't think the answer lies with an attorney. Kill them with kindness worked best for me.
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  #24  
Old 04-12-2005, 03:18 AM
Steved Steved is offline
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ZenX5, sorry to hear about your issues. The oil consumption you describe is certainly not normal. I've now run 3 different 4.8is and they each have consumed around 1-2 litres (not sure what that is in quarts) in the first 6-8 thousand miles. The 4.8is seems to consume oil up until around 5,000 miles then it settles down. The first check your dealer should be making is for any signs of 'external' oil leaks (seals, gaskets etc.) and if not external there should be signs of oil depositing on the inside of the exhaust or perhaps the ignition coils should look more sooted up than normal. The remedy should be an engine out replacing of the necessary seals or otherwise a replacement engine, since it's cheaper for BMW to replace your engine than hand build your existing one at a dealer.

I personally do not think your car sounds like a lemon (sorry!) as the first battery problem was down to an underperforming dealer and the second 'could' be remedied by a replacement part (i.e. the engine). In my understanding a car can only be classified as a lemon if the dealer has repeatedly attempted resolution but failed and thereafter is unable to resolve the issue in a 'reasonable' period of time.

I am having my 4.8is replaced with a new one due to a litany of problems to nearly ever major electrical system in the car and then once it was discovered that some of these were due to a bad earth connections. Because of this I can never be sure that my problems have been resolved and I've been patient enough after the 30 or so dealer visits to resolve them.

I can see your problem being addressed by some good customer service from your dealer, taking the car off your hands (providing you with a decent replacement) and remedying the cause of your high oil consumption.

It's rare that such consumption issues will just 'go away' and you should be challenging your dealer on finding out where the oil is going and whether it's doing any potential damage to your car. After all, if it's leaking onto brakes or tyres then the liability issues they could incur would outweigh any repair costs now. Why don't you put this in writing, cataloging the problem and holding them accountable if they fail to resolve it before it causes a further problem, then copy this letter to BMW NA and state how unhappy you are with the service you're receiving.

In my experience a problem that could cause third-party damages is much more likely to result in a positive response from BMW, whereas at the moment they seem to have merely classified it as an inconvenience.
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  #25  
Old 04-12-2005, 04:29 AM
hungdynasty hungdynasty is offline
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ZenX5

It may not be your case but I just tell you my similar experience.
A few months ago my MB S320 started to 'burn' oil, like a litre every two weeks. I could not find any leak at the engine or not even any oil on the floor. One day my dad found the problem for me. It was the engine oil somehow got through the engine wall(or seal) to the cooling system. When my dad open the coolant cap, that was all chocolate milk(oil mix with coolant). Got the problem fixed and now it doesn't eat a drop of oil.

Charles
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