CONFIRMED - No TFT Instrument Panel on MY 2013 7 Series LCI

by Tim Jones on June 18, 2012, 2:52 pm
BMW 7 series LCI 2013

The F01 7 Series Life Cycle Impluse (LCI) was just announced with much excitement. The big list of changes include -
  • New front and rear bumpers
  • New headlights
  • New front seats
  • More power for the V8
  • N55 6 cylinder replaces N54 6 cylinder
  • And much more

BMW 7 series TFT display

One feature that was shown in the press photos but will not be making it to the US for the start of the model year 2013 (MY) is the TFT instrument panel. BMW's TFT panel replaces the traditional needles and gauges with what is in effect an LCD panel. The gauges, needles and numbers are simply displayed on a screen, nothing is physically moving.

BMW 7 series US LCI 2013 not getting TFT dispaly

Despite information to the contrary my sources indicate that there was not enough time to get the TFT panel tested and integrated for US spec model year 2013 vehicle before production starts in July. I expect the TFT display will come state side for the 7 series in model year 2014. Will a lack of a TFT instrument panel keep you from buying a 7 Series LCI?


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67 responses to CONFIRMED - No TFT Instrument Panel on MY 2013 7 Series LCI

Individual750LI commented:
June 18, 2012, 3:37 pm

Geez, this is the most amazing feature of the new 7!
rsingh111 commented:
June 18, 2012, 8:46 pm

That is BS
nonamerequired commented:
June 19, 2012, 3:35 am

I was planning to get a 2013 740LI via European Delivery. Now it looks like I'll have to reconsider that. Why are we being treated like 2nd class citizens? BMWUSA, do you hear that? This is your largest market! Come to your senses and make it happen!
beamlord commented:
June 19, 2012, 5:11 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by nonamerequired View Post
I was planning to get a 2013 740LI via European Delivery. Now it looks like I'll have to reconsider that. Why are we being treated like 2nd class citizens? BMWUSA, do you hear that? This is your largest market! Come to your senses and make it happen!
Actually, it's not. Largest foreign market for BMW (and Audi) is China. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-17677651
rsingh111 commented:
June 19, 2012, 9:26 am

So china has just become their number one market. US still very important to sales.

However, you don't roll out a major upgrade and then not have it in all your markets.
beamlord commented:
June 19, 2012, 12:02 pm

Surely you don't expect that BMW, selling record high ~500.000 vehicles in three months, out of which only like 60.000 are sold in the US (and out of which the amount of 7 series is, well, miniscule - compared to the German and world market) - will postpone a whole roll out just because some US bureaucrats took their time and couldn't get the TFT screen approved for the release.

It's a large market, but not large enough to have the German market wait and/or adjust for it
rsingh111 commented:
June 19, 2012, 12:05 pm

I agree if it was a governmental thing rather than a supply chain issue
chrischeung commented:
June 19, 2012, 12:31 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by rsingh111 View Post
However, you don't roll out a major upgrade and then not have it in all your markets.
So you say they should hold back until everyone is ready? I'm not sure that makes sense. In that case, we still wouldn't have GPS navigation, since it's not available for all markets. Every company has staggered roll outs - food, technology, auto etc. The reasons can be technical, regulatory, and market driven for example. How about the X1? Hold that back until all markets are ready for it?

Let me ask you this - how would it make better financial sense for BMW to hold the TFT panel back worldwide than stagger the release as they are doing now? Naturally, it's not ideal, but if a product is not yet ready, then that is a fact of life, and the choice is wait, or stagger.
rsingh111 commented:
June 19, 2012, 1:15 pm

If a supply chain issue then have it for all the markets.
Hard to advertise to the US how wonderful the TFT is and then not have it

Don't advertise it if you can't deliver. Not on such high end cars where buyers are extremely particular. Delay the rollout for the 2013 until it is ready to go in the US. It's. It like you can just do a software update.

Whatever the reason. They should not have marketed the screen or have some fine print saying not available in US
chrischeung commented:
June 19, 2012, 1:39 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by rsingh111 View Post
They should not have marketed the screen or have some fine print saying not available in US
I don't think I have seen the TFT display as being marketed on any BMWNA release. The BMWNA releases just lists the ECO Pro mode, which is probably implemented with the existing bottom display.

I still don't see how your approach would make financial sense to BMW. How would they sell more cars by holding the update back worldwide? And if they could, why wouldn't BMW do that? Remember, there are folks coming off lease, and I'm pretty sure most would likely want a watered down 2013 than a 2012.
rsingh111 commented:
June 19, 2012, 1:49 pm

I said hold back in US only till ready
beamlord commented:
June 19, 2012, 3:03 pm

What supply chain??? They're manufactured in Germany.
I bet it's even more expensive for BMW to produce the US-non-TFT cars in the same production line/MY as all the rest TFT-cars.
LovinM6 commented:
June 19, 2012, 8:23 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrischeung View Post
Remember, there are folks coming off lease, and I'm pretty sure most would likely want a watered down 2013 than a 2012.
How about another car other than a BMW. It has competition.
BMR2009 commented:
June 20, 2012, 11:48 pm

I'll wait and see, but don't doubt you. Will it affect my purchase, absolutely. Mercedes has some neat stuff on the S that I'll be looking at before deciding to wait or go another direction. No hurry either way...
Individual750LI commented:
June 21, 2012, 12:22 am

The next gen S is coming out soon, don't rush yourself if your option is open.

II Kings 9:20 commented:
June 26, 2012, 12:23 am

Disappointing to say the least. Below is one example of how nice a TFT can be. Jaguar XJ has had a TFT since the new model but at last check it was not configurable so pretty pointless. It's also a good way to get killed if you try to fiddle with it while driving-I expect limited inputs are allowed whilst in motion.

Cue System
dbs600 commented:
June 27, 2012, 1:19 am

Tim: Any updates on this? Anything official yet? How close is your source and how certain is he?

If it's not coming to the US, what's the deal with this car(?) [It's at the US debut for the LCI in California, has the full TFT instrument cluster, along with a US-spec trunk lid, no rear fog lamps (US-spec) and no rear iDrive controller (US-spec)]:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_obRMLP80rE
beamlord commented:
June 27, 2012, 4:11 am

...and no US homologation. It's a show car.
II Kings 9:20 commented:
June 27, 2012, 6:25 am

Ticks me off that many manufacturers treat the US as an unwanted stepchild. VW and Ford are famous for keeping their best products in Europe. The lack of rear fog lights is typical as if to say that the US does not get fog. Truth be told, US drivers are so clueless they wouldn't use it anyway. My 92 Alfla 164 had rear fog lights on the US model. Name one item on a US model that is not available on the European model? The 85 mph speedometer of the late 70sto mid 80s is not a good example. Ford had a brilliant response to that on the Xr4ti. They put a 140 mph speedometer in and had the numbers read only to 85 with hash marks for the remainder of the numbers to 140.
beamlord commented:
June 27, 2012, 6:29 am

I wouldn't assume it's the manufacturers - I mean why would they underfeature their products in one specific country ? I think it's the differences in homologation procedures.
LovinM6 commented:
June 27, 2012, 9:19 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by beamlord View Post
...and no US homologation. It's a show car.
I would be shocked if they brought in and showed a car with something that was not approved. That would seem rather ridiculous to me but then again, one never knows.

I ordered a loaded 7 Individual yesterday with a July production date subject to the new TFT panel being included. The sales manager said he will get me the answer.
beamlord commented:
June 27, 2012, 9:25 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by LovinM6 View Post
I would be shocked if they brought in and showed a car with something that was not approved. That would seem rather ridiculous to me but then again, one never knows.

I ordered a loaded 7 Individual yesterday with a July production date subject to the new TFT panel being included. The sales manager said he will get me the answer.
Wonder how can you order a MY13 7er before it's being officially sold yet?
II Kings 9:20 commented:
June 27, 2012, 9:41 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by beamlord View Post
I wouldn't assume it's the manufacturers - I mean why would they underfeature their products in one specific country ? I think it's the differences in homologation procedures.
I have communicated with Honda and Vw on the simple issue of xenon headlights available in 1998 on MB. The reply from VW was because of "marketing objectives" xenons are not available. In other words, if you want xenons buy an Audi. Honda does the same vis a vis Acura. This explains why little 1.4liter boxes in Europe get xenons and not a 2012 $35k US passat. I saw a south African crv with xenons 7-8 years ago and today's us models still don't have them
tim330i commented:
June 27, 2012, 9:51 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by dbs600 View Post
Tim: Any updates on this? Anything official yet? How close is your source and how certain is he?

If it's not coming to the US, what's the deal with this car(?) [It's at the US debut for the LCI in California, has the full TFT instrument cluster, along with a US-spec trunk lid, no rear fog lamps (US-spec) and no rear iDrive controller (US-spec)]:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_obRMLP80rE
No updates, it is confirmed not coming to the US for MY 2013. I was at that event, it was the Gran Coupe (driving review) and F12 M6 Press Drive (M6 driving review) event and they showed us the 7 Series LCI as well. While we were all (journalists) looking the car over, it was specifically mentioned that the TFT display wasn't coming for MY 2013, which I then double checked with BMW in case I misheard them.

BMW 7 series LCI press event
LovinM6 commented:
June 27, 2012, 10:07 am

That would be the end of my 2013 order then! Too bad. If I have to wait for 2014 then the new "S" comes into play. Not a good move on BMW's part...in my humble opinion.
LovinM6 commented:
June 27, 2012, 10:09 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by beamlord View Post
Wonder how can you order a MY13 7er before it's being officially sold yet?
It is for sale. They have production slots and you can order the car. Anyone can. I know it is not on the site yet but the ability to order the car usually comes before the BMW site changes.
beamlord commented:
June 27, 2012, 10:33 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by LovinM6 View Post
It is for sale. They have production slots and you can order the car. Anyone can. I know it is not on the site yet but the ability to order the car usually comes before the BMW site changes.
Im sure all you can order is the allocation slot. And they offer you to store your config. For convenience, of course.
You wouldn't argue that you can buy a BMW earlier than it's sold in Germany, I hope? Well we've placed two orders for 2 MY 2012 (yes, in germany it's actually my2012) and even the manufacturing date for those is not set yet.
LovinM6 commented:
June 27, 2012, 10:40 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by beamlord View Post
Im sure all you can order is the allocation slot. And they offer you to store your config. For convenience, of course.
You wouldn't argue that you can buy a BMW earlier than it's sold in Germany, I hope? Well we've placed two orders for 2 MY 2012 (yes, in germany it's actually my2012) and even the manufacturing date for those is not set yet.
My production slot is for the third week in July. However, if there is no TFT panel which appears to be the case then I won't be keeping that. I also think there is a difference between a production slot and a confirmed build date which only comes shortly before the actual date.
beamlord commented:
June 27, 2012, 4:46 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by LovinM6 View Post
My production slot is for the third week in July. However, if there is no TFT panel which appears to be the case then I won't be keeping that. I also think there is a difference between a production slot and a confirmed build date which only comes shortly before the actual date.
We don't have things like production slots or allocations here, maybe that's why I don't quite understand what you mean by the thid week of July. The MY2012 cars here in Germany have not even been cleared for delivery for the first orders, so I don't think they're produced for the US slots as early as in July.

It's always like that. The f01 was first delivered in Germany, starting with 07/2008, and only from 2009 in the States. Just as e65, and so on. This is why I highly doubt what you have just implied, it would mean US will get my12 facelift before Germany, which has never happened.
Most likely it's your BMW dealer who wants to assure you they get the production slot or something. While all they do is make you place order to fill their allocation beforehand. Good business.
AdamG13 commented:
June 27, 2012, 6:29 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by LovinM6 View Post
My production slot is for the third week in July. However, if there is no TFT panel which appears to be the case then I won't be keeping that. I also think there is a difference between a production slot and a confirmed build date which only comes shortly before the actual date.
McLovin: You're the one with the S-Class 1 year lease right? How did it compare to your 7?
LovinM6 commented:
June 28, 2012, 7:58 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by beamlord View Post
This is why I highly doubt what you have just implied, it would mean US will get my12 facelift before Germany, which has never happened.
Most likely it's your BMW dealer who wants to assure you they get the production slot or something. While all they do is make you place order to fill their allocation beforehand. Good business.
I have ordered new BMW's or MB's cars every year or two for the last 30 years at the beginning of the model year so I can assure you this is how it works in the US. I usually follow the production of my car step by step. Whether or not the production date gets set back this year still remains to be seen but in all the years most of the time they are pretty darn accurate and the car gets produced within days of the production slot.

http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/07/14/ho...d-to-delivery/

How this compares to Germany I have no idea.
LovinM6 commented:
June 28, 2012, 8:08 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamG13 View Post
McLovin: You're the one with the S-Class 1 year lease right? How did it compare to your 7?
Yes. I thought I would just get the S class for a year to hold me over but it really turned out to be a wonderful car. I love my S class and when you get it in the Designo interior and paint it is surely as special as the 7 series.

The car is certainly as good as the 7 series. I think it comes down to personal preference. For me, I think the ride of the S class is much smoother and the 7 series much sportier. The difference in the regular tires vs. the run flats is noticeable.

As far as interiors, the S class is equally as luxurious if not more when you get the Designo vs. the Individual. In my opinion, the S class interior is more current and the 7 series is more classic.

Without the TFT I am very interested in the S class for 2014 because as a new generation car I suspect it will have a lot of new toys. Also, since MB no longer makes the Maybach, the new generation S class is supposed to have 4 different lines included one on the level of the Maybach so it will be interesting to see what comes with that.

I loved my last 7 series and I really thought it would be a done deal for this year but after driving the MB for a year...it is up in the air.
beamlord commented:
June 28, 2012, 8:10 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by LovinM6 View Post
I have ordered new BMW's or MB's cars every year or two for the last 30 years at the beginning of the model year so I can assure you this is how it works in the US. I usually follow the production of my car step by step. Whether or not the production date gets set back this year still remains to be seen but in all the years most of the time they are pretty darn accurate and the car gets produced within days of the production slot.

http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/07/14/ho...d-to-delivery/

How this compares to Germany I have no idea.
You still haven't answered how do you think it's possible that a MY12 car in Germany gets produced later than a MY13 car for the US. Not only has this never happened (in those 30 years and more), it just doesn't make sense. Have you been able to recieve a 2009 f01 in the States as early as in 2008? Or any other model for that matter?
LovinM6 commented:
June 28, 2012, 8:12 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by beamlord View Post
You still haven't answered how do you think it's possible that a MY12 car in Germany gets produced later than a MY13 car for the US. Not only has this never happened (in those 30 years and more), it just doesn't make sense. Have you been able to recieve a 2009 f01 in the States as early as in 2008? Or any other model for that matter?
The reason I have not answered your question is because I have no idea how it works in Germany so I can't compare the two and answer your question. I only know how it happens here in the US. Also, remember, even though the car may be produced in July, the car won't get to the US until sometime in September.

Here is the US you always get the model year car for the next year in the year before. For example, 2013 in 2012. It always works that way.
beamlord commented:
June 28, 2012, 8:20 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by LovinM6 View Post
The reason I have not answered your question is because I have no idea how it works in Germany so I can't compare the two and answer your question. I only know how it happens here in the US. Also, remember, even though the car may be produced in July, the car won't get to the US until sometime in September.

Here is the US you always get the model year car for the next year in the year before. For example, 2013 in 2012. It always works that way.
You mean there are 2008 f01's registered in the US? Or what do you mean you "get the model year"? If people physically had the car in 2008 it would be registered in 2008, right? Yet there aren't any afaik.
The same way as there will not be LCI f01's in the States registered in 2012.
LovinM6 commented:
June 28, 2012, 8:23 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by beamlord View Post
You mean there are 2008 f01's registered in the US? Or what do you mean you "get the model year"? If people physically had the car in 2008 it would be registered in 2008, right? Yet there aren't any afaik.
The same way as there will not be LCI f01's in the States registered in 2012.
No, you physically get a 2013 model year in 2012 and you register the car in 2012. I suspect the difference here is how they are calling the model years vs. the production time. There will surely be LCI's registered in 2012.
beamlord commented:
June 28, 2012, 8:30 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by LovinM6 View Post
No, you physically get a 2013 model year in 2012 and you register the car in 2012. I suspect the difference here is how they are calling the model years vs. the production time. There will surely be LCI's registered in 2012.
Point is simple:


- f01 is MY 2008 in Germany, and MY 2009 in the States.
- LCI is MY 2012 in Germany, and MY 2013 in the States.
- just as there are no 2008 f01's in the States, there won't be any 2012 LCI's.
LovinM6 commented:
June 28, 2012, 8:32 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by beamlord View Post
Point is simple:


- f01 is MY 2008 in Germany, and MY 2009 in the States.
- LCI is MY 2012 in Germany, and MY 2013 in the States.
- just as there are no 2008 f01's in the States, there won't be any 2012 LCI's.
I think this is correct. The timing of when these cars come are close to the same time. While the availability of the cars is pretty close...they just name them differently from a model year point of view. US is all about marketing...Germany is the real deal.
dbs600 commented:
June 28, 2012, 11:18 am

An order is placed at a dealer, routed to corporate, assigned a production slot / week and the info is bounced back to the dealer (NO MATTER WHERE YOU ARE IN THE WORLD). Instead of actual production dates, BMW revolves around production weeks, weeks 1 - 52 of a given year, 52 in a year. If a dealer has an allocation, meaning they were already set to receive a vehicle already assigned to a particular production slot / week AND there is still enough time for the order to be modified, such that the order is not definite (i.e.: the dealer simply knows they will receive a 7 Series assigned to production week 26 in the year 2012, which is the last week of June, 2012), THEN when taking your order, the dealer need not first reach out to corporate before telling you their soonest available production slot for the order would be the last week of June, 2012; as if they knew they would be selling a vehicle and reserved a spot in line for their customer even before one transpired. So, production slots / weeks have NOTHING to do with model years! In the United States, model years are mere gimmick, having no regulation. Manufactures can brand models they sell in 2012 as 2014 model year vehicles for all they care; it's all about marketing and getting a leg up on the competition; how far they can push the envelope of reality. However, Germany is more true in that vehicles are advertised for sale based on their ACTUAL month and year - sometimes season and year - of FINAL production, not their model year, therefore the actual month and year of final production ends up being close to the vehicle's production slot / week, but the former is the start of production for the vehicle and the latter, the model year, is the end of production. Otherwise, there is NO question that when there is a new model debut, you're almost certain to see same delivered and hit German roads before US roads; I'm pretty sure that's even the case with the X5 and Z4, which are built in the US.
Deutsch100 commented:
June 28, 2012, 5:49 pm

I find this thread very interesting! I had this "virtual" instrument cluster in my 2011 Range Rover. I had the car for about 18 months (flawless, 100% trouble free!!). After having virtual instruments, I am so, so, so happy my 2012 7 Series does NOT have this. TRUST ME...the gauges we have in our current 7 Series are much better than digital/virtual needles and readouts. While I never had a problem ever, with the Range Rover's instruments...they are so artificial, especially the RPM digital needle. IMO, the current USA gauges are an amazing blend of virtual and real. I LOVE, LOVE the instrument cluster in the current 7 Series.
beamlord commented:
June 28, 2012, 5:59 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by dbs600 View Post
An order is placed at a dealer, routed to corporate, assigned a production slot / week and the info is bounced back to the dealer (NO MATTER WHERE YOU ARE IN THE WORLD). Instead of actual production dates, BMW revolves around production weeks, weeks 1 - 52 of a given year, 52 in a year. If a dealer has an allocation, meaning they were already set to receive a vehicle already assigned to a particular production slot / week AND there is still enough time for the order to be modified, such that the order is not definite (i.e.: the dealer simply knows they will receive a 7 Series assigned to production week 26 in the year 2012, which is the last week of June, 2012), THEN when taking your order, the dealer need not first reach out to corporate before telling you their soonest available production slot for the order would be the last week of June, 2012; as if they knew they would be selling a vehicle and reserved a spot in line for their customer even before one transpired. So, production slots / weeks have NOTHING to do with model years! In the United States, model years are mere gimmick, having no regulation. Manufactures can brand models they sell in 2012 as 2014 model year vehicles for all they care; it's all about marketing and getting a leg up on the competition; how far they can push the envelope of reality. However, Germany is more true in that vehicles are advertised for sale based on their ACTUAL month and year - sometimes season and year - of FINAL production, not their model year, therefore the actual month and year of final production ends up being close to the vehicle's production slot / week, but the former is the start of production for the vehicle and the latter, the model year, is the end of production. Otherwise, there is NO question that when there is a new model debut, you're almost certain to see same delivered and hit German roads before US roads; I'm pretty sure that's even the case with the X5 and Z4, which are built in the US.
...except that all the domestic orders are processed before any other foreign markets get their production slots. In fact my BMW dealer laughed when I asked him how many "allocations" they get. They don't speak that language. BMW will put as many productions as neccessary when the order comes from BMW Niederlassung Hamburg.
So, anywhere in the world - yes. But not in the domestic market. And it's not an "almost certain" but a definite yes.

To go back ontopic: I have no confirmation of the production date for the LCI's we've ordered a few weeks ago. In fact the first LCI to be available for test-drive will be in the main BMW Niederlassung in Hamburg only in the middle of July. I've reserved a test-drive for August, hope I will have something to report then.
dbs600 commented:
June 28, 2012, 6:00 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deutsch100 View Post
I find this thread very interesting! I had this "virtual" instrument cluster in my 2011 Range Rover. I had the car for about 18 months (flawless, 100% trouble free!!). After having virtual instruments, I am so, so, so happy my 2012 7 Series does NOT have this. TRUST ME...the gauges we have in our current 7 Series are much better than digital/virtual needles and readouts. While I never had a problem ever, with the Range Rover's instruments...they are so artificial, especially the RPM digital needle. IMO, the current USA gauges are an amazing blend of virtual and real. I LOVE, LOVE the instrument cluster in the current 7 Series.
Nice; I've been wondering the same exact thing! While I believe the new 7 Series TFT panel to be far superior to the TFT panel of the Range Rover - and XJ - guess one needs to experience same for himself. Having had numerous loaner vehicles, believe it or not, the "Extended Black Panel Displays" of the F10 5 Series improved SIGNIFICANTLY from the 2011 to 2012 Model Years (sharper, smoother); so I can't wait to see the levels of refinement the - let's just say - 2014 7 Series TFT display will put forth. But yes, where do we draw the line; just like with timepieces, analogue is luxury.
dbs600 commented:
June 28, 2012, 6:13 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by beamlord View Post
BMW will put as many productions as neccessary when the order comes from BMW Niederlassung Hamburg.
Ha; you hit the nail on the head! Didn't mention it, but my order was top-down. So, yes, Germany pushes it through!

It's no wonder they're propping up the entire EU.
II Kings 9:20 commented:
June 28, 2012, 11:52 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by dbs600 View Post
Nice; I've been wondering the same exact thing! While I believe the new 7 Series TFT panel to be far superior to the TFT panel of the Range Rover - and XJ - guess one needs to experience same for himself. Having had numerous loaner vehicles, believe it or not, the "Extended Black Panel Displays" of the F10 5 Series improved SIGNIFICANTLY from the 2011 to 2012 Model Years (sharper, smoother); so I can't wait to see the levels of refinement the - let's just say - 2014 7 Series TFT display will put forth. But yes, where do we draw the line; just like with timepieces, analogue is luxury.
Ahh yes but with TFT digital can be an option for those who like it. While I love analog timepieces, when it comes to gauges, digital is F1, analog is Nascar.

Range Rover and Jaguar TFTs leave a lot to be desired. I like the Cadillac Cue of all the TFTs I have seen. I am sure MB and BMW will step up. Odd that tech heavy Lexus has no TFT or any gauge that one can configure. They were first in 2007 with Bluetooth audio streaming and had rear cameras at least back to 2005. You may know that Infiniti iwas first with rear cameras in 1999 on the MY 2000 Q45. A couple of years later they developed Lane Departure and credit GM with HUD 15+ years ago on Vette and Pontiac and night vision on Cadillacs 8-9 years ago. All of this tech is beginning to trickle down even to the midsize and compact class which is all good.
Deutsch100 commented:
June 29, 2012, 1:41 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by dbs600 View Post
Nice; I've been wondering the same exact thing! While I believe the new 7 Series TFT panel to be far superior to the TFT panel of the Range Rover - and XJ - guess one needs to experience same for himself. Having had numerous loaner vehicles, believe it or not, the "Extended Black Panel Displays" of the F10 5 Series improved SIGNIFICANTLY from the 2011 to 2012 Model Years (sharper, smoother); so I can't wait to see the levels of refinement the - let's just say - 2014 7 Series TFT display will put forth. But yes, where do we draw the line; just like with timepieces, analogue is luxury.
Our 2008 S550 had the TFT for the instrument cluster as well, and watching the fake needles was very annoying. I do not think analog is nascar (as another member stated). Analog is Rolls Royce and Bentley and Porsche.....We've had TFT in 2 high end cars, and what we have (real needles and real gauges) in our 7 Series, G55 and SLS AMG are IMO far superior to some artifical digital TFT screen.

And btw, I do not know if BMW TFT is, or will be better than Range Rover or Jaguar. I think both the Jag and RR were top notch, in terms of what they had. Brilliant graphics and very usable and so precise. Just artificial!
chrischeung commented:
June 29, 2012, 8:05 am

I think we're in a quandry - manufacturers/designers want to have a fresh design, but need to appease purists. They end up pleasing none with compromises.

What's next, a TFT Rolex? You can change the face at the touch of a button.
II Kings 9:20 commented:
June 29, 2012, 8:29 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrischeung View Post
I think we're in a quandry - manufacturers/designers want to have a fresh design, but need to appease purists. They end up pleasing none with compromises.

What's next, a TFT Rolex? You can change the face at the touch of a button.
I agree. To please purists the TFT should be configured to their tastes and to please those who want a video presentation, likewise they set the TFT to their tastes. Long before there was any discussion on TFTs, yours truly presented an idea to Apple called the iGauge which was essentially an ipad screen for the gauges. You want an oil pressure gauge here or temp gauge there just drag and drop. I would love a temp gauge on my '08 750. You want a big central analog tach like a Porsche, so be it. You want to add a small digital speedo in that tach, done. Pinch and zoom, drag and drop, add an app for additional customization. You want pure analog like a mid 80s BMW, done. This idea went nowhere with Apple but you can see the beginnings with cars like the lowly Dodge Dart (Alfa Giulietta). With today's "space age" technology, there is unlimited potential and no reason why consumers can't have fully custom gauges. Cost is not an issue if a $17K Dodge Dart has a configurable TFT. Even on high end cars, configurable TFTs should be reasonable and costs will come down just like laptops and other tech items unlike the $8K carbon ceramic brakes on a Porsche.
dbs600 commented:
June 29, 2012, 10:37 am

I see the cost to produce TFT panels plummeting far below that of an actual mechanical analogue gauge in the not too distant future.
Deutsch100 commented:
June 29, 2012, 5:18 pm

Just remembered...does the current (almost life cycle finished) S -Class still have the virtual speedometer and center instruments, TFT? Our 2008 S550 had this, and while like our 2011 Range Rover...flawless, no problems, but artificial. I also agree in the very near future, TFT will be much, much more cost effective for auto companies than elegant, classic analog gauges
cracker123 commented:
June 29, 2012, 7:46 pm

Does US get the A/C vents in the roof ?
chrischeung commented:
June 29, 2012, 9:32 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deutsch100 View Post
I also agree in the very near future, TFT will be much, much more cost effective for auto companies than elegant, classic analog gauges
Also TFT is 1 display world wide - programmed separately. How many different variations with metric/imperial, languages etc. variations are there with the analog gauges?
LovinM6 commented:
June 30, 2012, 2:08 pm

Well, pulled the trigger yesterday on another new Designo S class with a one year lease.

That will put me into the position to look at the new 2014 S class and compare to the LCI 7 which will hopefully have the TFT by 2014.

I wish i had know this earlier as I just ended up with two one year leases for the last 2 cars now. Not the cheapest way to have gone. UGH
II Kings 9:20 commented:
June 30, 2012, 2:22 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by LovinM6 View Post
Well, pulled the trigger yesterday on another new Designo S class with a one year lease.

That will put me into the position to look at the new 2014 S class and compare to the LCI 7 which will hopefully have the TFT by 2014.

I wish i had know this earlier as I just ended up with two one year leases for the last 2 cars now. Not the cheapest way to have gone. UGH
Nice. You only live once and can't take $$ with you so a short lease is great whilst waiting on the right thing if one can afford it.

When you guys are talking TFT, do you mean a fully customizable unit and not just TFT electronic gauges. In my mind, there is no point in having TFT if I can't configure the cluster to my tastes.
II Kings 9:20 commented:
June 30, 2012, 2:24 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrischeung View Post
Also TFT is 1 display world wide - programmed separately. How many different variations with metric/imperial, languages etc. variations are there with the analog gauges?
That is the beauty of software.
nosnoop commented:
July 16, 2012, 4:53 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deutsch100 View Post
Our 2008 S550 had the TFT for the instrument cluster as well, and watching the fake needles was very annoying. I do not think analog is nascar (as another member stated). Analog is Rolls Royce and Bentley and Porsche.....We've had TFT in 2 high end cars, and what we have (real needles and real gauges) in our 7 Series, G55 and SLS AMG are IMO far superior to some artifical digital TFT screen.
I think the mistake is to simulate analog needles on the TFT screen, because no matter how hard you try, it simply does not look like the real thing.



The potential of TFT screen is to have graphics and digital representation instead of using needles:

LovinM6 commented:
July 24, 2012, 9:36 pm

A little late but here are a few pictures of my 2012 MB S550 Designo. The colors are very comparable to my 7er.



[IMG]
Individual750LI commented:
July 24, 2012, 10:28 pm

Woo la la, my favorite interior color combo, except my favorite exterior is pearl white! Simply stunning man! Btw, how do the Merc's 4.7tt engine feelcompare to 7er's? Does feel faster?
stkpick101 commented:
August 31, 2012, 10:39 pm

I have just picked up my 2013 750LIX M sport. It was a massive disappointment to see the old instrumental cluster in the car. BMW of North America has no answers and all advertisement material including the driver's manual provided refer to the new panel. BMWUSA.com is still showing images of the new instrumental panel on site. I expect them to change it as soon as it becomes available I guess, or .......replace it for all I care.
f01driver commented:
September 1, 2012, 2:05 am

There's some ad for a new Caddy that's airing on TV with a full TFT instrument panel, it look kind of cool but a bit too futuristic and cheesy for my taste.
ericiu commented:
September 1, 2012, 8:23 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by stkpick101 View Post
I have just picked up my 2013 750LIX M sport. It was a massive disappointment to see the old instrumental cluster in the car. BMW of North America has no answers and all advertisement material including the driver's manual provided refer to the new panel. BMWUSA.com is still showing images of the new instrumental panel on site. I expect them to change it as soon as it becomes available I guess, or .......replace it for all I care.
My dealer showed me a memo on the 2013 7 models that they will NOT be getting the TFT display for the 2013 model year. He didn't know off-hand, but when I asked him to research it, he found the document and showed it to me. BMWUSA actually says in the specifications section of the 7 series "digital and analog" instrument cluster... which prompted me to ask dealer for clarification in the first place.

I ordered a non-M sport 750, and so far the 2013s coming to the dealership have not had the style 426 wheel that they're supposed to have. Hopefully that's just the first batch of 2013 750s because I'd like the new wheel they advertise on the website and in the specifications.
Deutsch100 commented:
September 1, 2012, 9:02 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by f01driver View Post
There's some ad for a new Caddy that's airing on TV with a full TFT instrument panel, it look kind of cool but a bit too futuristic and cheesy for my taste.
EXACTLY!!! For those who are getting the 2013 7 Series, DO NOT worry about or be angry that you do not have the TFT panel. The 2009-2012 combined version of "analog" and TFT is the best. These 3 years of 7 Series production, have the most elegant, modern, "cutting edge" and classic BMW look. I had "digital" instruments on my 2008 S550 and all TFT on my 2011 Supercharged Range Rover. While both were excellent, there was for sure a dis-connect, a coldness and the needlees looked and sometimes moved artifically. I am SO, SO happy my 2012 model does not have the TFT. Now...the LED Corona Rings, that's another story
slolife commented:
September 1, 2012, 10:23 am

The new multifunction instrument display is currently optional in Europe for about $800.

The standard one is the same as we get in the US.

Of course, BMWNA may make it standard in the US when it becomes available or part of a package.

For now, it looks like you will eventually be able to get either one.
stkpick101 commented:
September 1, 2012, 12:48 pm

My dealer has not mentioned anything, and as I mentioned earlier, BMW of North America could not comment, other than they will look into it. Whatever package is going to be a part of I already have I hope the cluster is interchangable, so when it comes out, I will be able to have it replaced. Other than the driving performance and navagation, aesthetically the M sport is identical to 2012. Furthermore, it is mentioned that seats have been modified......I'd like to know how, since I can't tell at all.
ericiu commented:
September 1, 2012, 3:19 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deutsch100 View Post
EXACTLY!!! For those who are getting the 2013 7 Series, DO NOT worry about or be angry that you do not have the TFT panel. The 2009-2012 combined version of "analog" and TFT is the best. These 3 years of 7 Series production, have the most elegant, modern, "cutting edge" and classic BMW look. I had "digital" instruments on my 2008 S550 and all TFT on my 2011 Supercharged Range Rover. While both were excellent, there was for sure a dis-connect, a coldness and the needlees looked and sometimes moved artifically. I am SO, SO happy my 2012 model does not have the TFT. Now...the LED Corona Rings, that's another story
I agree. Not really a fan of 100% TFT... wouldn't mind a big digital display in middle like Audi but prefer the looks of gauge needles. The sports mode reminds me of that little turbocharged Honda and its mph read-out on the dash... hardly classy... and I'm pretty sure sports mode is what I will be staying in most of the time.

My 2013 will have the LED headlights I didn't get the M-Sport package (although it is free option for now) because I'm ordering a white car and don't like the graphite look of the rear bumper with M-Sport. I said the same thing on another blog and apparently in Europe, you can customize M-Sport to not have the graphite rear bumper insert and instead get a body color-matched insert... no such luck in the U.S.
filmoreslim commented:
September 2, 2012, 7:03 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by ericiu View Post
I didn't get the M-Sport package (although it is free option for now) because I'm ordering a white car and don't like the graphite look of the rear bumper with M-Sport. I said the same thing on another blog and apparently in Europe, you can customize M-Sport to not have the graphite rear bumper insert and instead get a body color-matched insert... no such luck in the U.S.
I was hoping to get TFT because I like the eco sport functionality. I nixed Alpine white for the same reason you did not like it; however I thought the M Sport without Alpine White vs the chrome on the air intake was the lesser of two evils. My current E61 is Alpine White.
AutoUnion commented:
September 2, 2012, 11:40 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by II Kings 9:20 View Post
Ticks me off that many manufacturers treat the US as an unwanted stepchild. VW and Ford are famous for keeping their best products in Europe. The lack of rear fog lights is typical as if to say that the US does not get fog. Truth be told, US drivers are so clueless they wouldn't use it anyway. My 92 Alfla 164 had rear fog lights on the US model. Name one item on a US model that is not available on the European model? The 85 mph speedometer of the late 70sto mid 80s is not a good example. Ford had a brilliant response to that on the Xr4ti. They put a 140 mph speedometer in and had the numbers read only to 85 with hash marks for the remainder of the numbers to 140.
VW and Audi are horrible about it. I agree completely, but BMW is getting up there. I want a 535d.
AutoUnion commented:
September 2, 2012, 11:40 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by LovinM6 View Post
A little late but here are a few pictures of my 2012 MB S550 Designo. The colors are very comparable to my 7er.



[IMG]
Beautiful Interior!

I can't believe the S Class is looks so good and high quality, even in its LAST year of production