Car and Driver 2013 BMW 328 vs 2013 Cadillac ATS 2.0T

by Tim Jones on October 3, 2012, 5:01 pm


Car and Driver tests the BMW F30 328i against the Cadillac ATS 2.0t. Can the new caddy dethrone the BMW 3 series from the the front of the entry-level luxury segment?

Make sure you also watch Motor Trends' video review of the BMW 328i vs the Cadillac ATS
BMW-2012-3-Series-F30-Spain 1BMW-2012-3-Series-F30-Spain 2BMW-2012-3-Series-F30-Spain 3BMW-2012-3-Series-F30-Spain 4BMW-2012-3-Series-F30-Spain 5BMW-2012-3-Series-F30-Spain 6BMW-2012-3-Series-F30-Spain 7BMW-2012-3-Series-F30-Spain 8BMW-2012-3-Series-F30-Spain 9BMW-2012-3-Series-F30-Spain 10BMW-2012-3-Series-F30-Spain 11BMW-2012-3-Series-F30-Spain 12


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52 responses to Car and Driver 2013 BMW 328 vs 2013 Cadillac ATS 2.0T

jlukja commented:
October 3, 2012, 6:22 pm

Wow. Better chassis, better steering, more fun, yet it still comes in 2nd? This isn't BMW swatting away another fly, its winning by the hair on its chinny chin chin.
captainaudio commented:
October 3, 2012, 6:28 pm

It appears that Cadillac has come up with a very good car.

CA
Carnook commented:
October 3, 2012, 6:47 pm

I swear these reviewers are testing the cars in comfort mode. I'd be curious to know whether they were in comfort or sport mode.
dtc100 commented:
October 3, 2012, 7:29 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carnook View Post
I swear these reviewers are testing the cars in comfort mode. I'd be curious to know whether they were in comfort or sport mode.
These reviewers all know 3 series like the back of their hands. It is the ATS they are not familiar with. I have to agree with them, while test-driving an ATS V6, I had wished the ATS chassis was in the new 3 series.
Saintor commented:
October 6, 2012, 6:54 pm

I got my C&D... here are interesting figures;

2013 ATS L4 2.0T 272HP / 2013 328i L4 2.0T 240HP / 2006 330i I6 3.0 255HP All manual.

Weight 3477lbs / 3390lbs / 3458lbs
On 1200miles+ 19mpg / 23mpg / 25mpg
0-60mph 6.3s / 5.6s / 5.9s
5-60mph 7.4s / 6.6s / 6.5s

Those ridiculous 2.0T don't perform any better the larger NA engines of yore, not even direct injected neither are they significantly lighter. What a joke.
captainaudio commented:
October 6, 2012, 7:19 pm

What I found interesting was that the C&D reviewer praised the BMW manual transmission as one of the best while the MT reviewer found it to be the weak point of the car.

CA
windsor027 commented:
October 6, 2012, 8:58 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
What I found interesting was that the C&D reviewer praised the BMW manual transmission as one of the best while the MT reviewer found it to be the weak point of the car.

CA
Exactly Captain. That is why I say always drive the car yourself first. I never base my purchase on what a magazine said.
Jamesonsviggen commented:
October 6, 2012, 9:25 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saintor View Post
I got my C&D... here are interesting figures;

2013 ATS L4 2.0T 272HP / 2013 328i L4 2.0T 240HP / 2006 330i I6 3.0 255HP All manual.


On 1200miles+ 19mpg / 23mpg / 25mpg


Those ridiculous 2.0T don't perform any better the larger NA engines of yore, not even direct injected neither are they significantly lighter. What a joke.
Haha, are you serious?

Tons of variables there. Go by EPA or people driving all cars in a similar fashion. Digging up some figure from a magazine for the 330 and making it out that it was the same driving situation as 6 years later, come on.

EPA is deep into the 30's on the N20 and owners are even averaging as high as 40mpg like me.
justinnum1 commented:
October 6, 2012, 9:31 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen View Post
Haha, are you serious?

Tons of variables there. Go by EPA or people driving all cars in a similar fashion. Digging up some figure from a magazine for the 330 and making it out that it was the same driving situation as 6 years later, come on.

EPA is deep into the 30's on the N20 and owners are even averaging as high as 40mpg like me.
Saintor is a well known N20 troll. 8 months ago all he did was bring up the camary v6 and say its better than the N20.

You should never have to see someone's post if they are on your ignore list, even if someone else quotes them. Bug with vBulletin.
Saintor commented:
October 6, 2012, 9:40 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
Saintor is a well known N20 troll. 8 months ago all he did was bring up the camary v6 and say its better than the N20.
Because it is for anybody with a brain and the skill to review objective data. Even better when you consider NVH and engine sound experience.

Quote:
EPA is deep into the 30's on the N20
Not at all. No better than the N55.
Jamesonsviggen commented:
October 6, 2012, 9:45 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saintor View Post
Because it is for anybody with a brain and the skill to review objective data. Even better when you consider NVH and engine sound experience.



Not at all. No better than the N55.
EPA was something like 36, then they rolled it back to 33 or so.

Go check EPA on the '06 330.

Also, go buy real numbers. I go by dyno numbers(I in fact dyno'd mine). You will see Dynojets on Youtube showing 230-250whp and even more tq out of the N20. Again compare that to dyno's of the 330.

Facts are facts.
Saintor commented:
October 6, 2012, 9:48 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen View Post

Facts are facts.

And that is the reason why C&D got better mpg figures for a 2006 330i than a 2012+ 328i, which was derated by EPA. The N20 just sucks and doesn't deserve to be in any BMW. I don't care about dyno test; 5-60 is the same/even better on the 330i.
justinnum1 commented:
October 6, 2012, 9:50 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen View Post
EPA was something like 36, then they rolled it back to 33 or so.

Go check EPA on the '06 330.

Also, go buy real numbers. I go by dyno numbers(I in fact dyno'd mine). You will see Dynojets on Youtube showing 230-250whp and even more tq out of the N20. Again compare that to dyno's of the 330.

Facts are facts.
Why bother? Dude is a huge troll. He was gone for a while, looks like he's back tho
Saintor commented:
October 6, 2012, 9:51 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
F30 328 sport going to be returned soon

F30 335 Msport on the way with performance exhasut
Interesting.

*And proving exactly my point*.
Jamesonsviggen commented:
October 6, 2012, 9:58 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saintor View Post
And that is the reason why C&D got better mpg figures for a 2006 330i than a 2012+ 328i, which was derated by EPA. The N20 just sucks and doesn't deserve to be in any BMW. I don't care about dyno test; 5-60 is the same/even better on the 330i.
C&D tests were different drivers, different years, tons of variables and has no bearing being compared to the N20.

5-60? You found one way where the 330 could be better? Yeah, if I stomp on my car at 5mph there is plenty of wheelspin. It's called tq, something the N20 makes a fair bit more of. How bout looking at 0-60, 0-100, trap speeds, 1/4 mile.

Getting into big boy discussions, I really hope the car in your signature is not the extent of your stable. Otherwise you are fitting into the stereotype of what I have seen at BMW events that I now avoid like the plaque.

I am done, I am thinking your tag as a troll might be correct.
Jamesonsviggen commented:
October 6, 2012, 9:59 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
Why bother? Dude is a huge troll. He was gone for a while, looks like he's back tho
First person on a BMW forum, I have ever had to put on ignore.
Saintor commented:
October 6, 2012, 10:01 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen View Post
First person on a BMW forum, I have ever had to put on ignore.
Too bad because, thanks to me, you would avoid to make mistake like justinnum1 and save a ton of money,
justinnum1 commented:
October 6, 2012, 10:05 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen View Post
First person on a BMW forum, I have ever had to put on ignore.
Yea, i never understand why someone who doesn't own the car, has no intention of getting the car but enjoys coming on this forum and try and talk **** about the engine and or car.

Saintor is the definition of a troll.
Clarissa commented:
October 6, 2012, 10:08 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
Yea, i never understand why someone who doesn't own the car, has no intention of getting the car but enjoys coming on this forum and try and talk **** about the engine and or car.

Saintor is the definition of a troll.
I don't have a car and don't see myself getting one anytime soon. But i'm here because it's a hobby. Criticizing a car shouldn't be a privilege for car owners....
Saintor commented:
October 6, 2012, 10:12 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
Yea, i never understand why someone who doesn't own the car, has no intention of getting the car but enjoys coming on this forum and try and talk **** about the engine and or car.

Saintor is the definition of a troll.

Not really. I am just bringing a truthful view on the subject and this doesn't please you. That's all.

Again, why did you/want to get rid of that N20 if you were *SO PLEASED* with it?

Be honest for a change.
justinnum1 commented:
October 6, 2012, 10:13 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarissa View Post
I don't have a car and don't see myself getting one anytime soon. But i'm here because it's a hobby. Criticizing a car shouldn't be a privilege for car owners....
Are all your posts talking about how terrible the N20 engine is and how it's not a real bmw?

A nice feature of this site is the ignore feature. I never have to read any of Saintors garbage unless someone quotes him.
Saintor commented:
October 6, 2012, 10:17 pm

Why don't you answer the question? Truth hurts, doesnt' it?
Clarissa commented:
October 6, 2012, 10:17 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
Are all your posts talking about how terrible the N20 engine is and how it's not a real bmw?

A nice feature of this site is the ignore feature. I never have to read any of Saintors garbage unless someone quotes him.
No, i have nothing against the N20. I'm new here, so I have yet to find what is what around here. But I expected this place to be less hostile and a lot more friendly...considering we are all here because we like BMWs.
justinnum1 commented:
October 6, 2012, 10:20 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarissa View Post
No, i have nothing against the N20. I'm new here, so I have yet to find what is what around here. But I expected this place to be less hostile and a lot more friendly...considering we are all here because we like BMWs.
This place is pretty good for the most part, more trolls on this site than the other forum tho which is unfortunate.

When you have trolls that don't own an F30 and have no intention to purchase one but they feel the need to come here and post things like(which is pretty much all this guy has to say on these message boards)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saintor View Post
The N20 just sucks and doesn't deserve to be in any BMW.

Bunch of really knowledgeable posters here, what car do you currently own?
dtc100 commented:
October 6, 2012, 10:22 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saintor View Post
Why don't you answer the question? Truth hurts, doesnt' it?
Because his N20 had some defects and he got some credit from BMW so now he can get an N55 for the same money.

Not everyone is that lucky
bayoucity commented:
October 6, 2012, 10:23 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saintor View Post
Not really. I am just bringing a truthful view on the subject and this doesn't please you. That's all.

Again, why did you/want to get rid of that N20 if you were *SO PLEASED* with it?

Be honest for a change.
I believe BMW lemoned his N20 due to steering vibration. Anyway, the new 1.5L 3 cylinders will make its way here soon.

If you are hating 4 banger now, I'm scare to hear what you will be saying about the 3 cylinders.
Clarissa commented:
October 6, 2012, 11:08 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
This place is pretty good for the most part, more trolls on this site than the other forum tho which is unfortunate.

When you have trolls that don't own an F30 and have no intention to purchase one but they feel the need to come here and post things like(which is pretty much all this guy has to say on these message boards)



Bunch of really knowledgeable posters here, what car do you currently own?
Currently, I'm driving my dad' Ford Fusion. I'm 20 and working on my biology degree, so I don't expect to be buying anything anytime soon. But we did have a E90 before the Fusion...it was great.

Regarding the 3 cylinder, I'm keeping an open mind. I was in a BMW test drive event yesterday and the F30 328xi and 335xi just blew me away. Going into the event, I was skeptical about the F30. Electric steering and AWD and all that stuff...but once I got into the cars, it simply reignited my passion for BMW with a flame thrower. BMW can pull off some amazing stuff. I don't think the 3 cylinder engine will be an exeption.
justinnum1 commented:
October 6, 2012, 11:34 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarissa View Post
Currently, I'm driving my dad' Ford Fusion. I'm 20 and working on my biology degree, so I don't expect to be buying anything anytime soon. But we did have a E90 before the Fusion...it was great.

Regarding the 3 cylinder, I'm keeping an open mind. I was in a BMW test drive event yesterday and the F30 328xi and 335xi just blew me away. Going into the event, I was skeptical about the F30. Electric steering and AWD and all that stuff...but once I got into the cars, it simply reignited my passion for BMW with a flame thrower. BMW can pull off some amazing stuff. I don't think the 3 cylinder engine will be an exeption.
Yea, both the N20(4 cylinder) and N55(6 cylinder) are amazing engines.
dtc100 commented:
October 6, 2012, 11:53 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
Yea, both the N20(4 cylinder) and N55(6 cylinder) are amazing engines.
Now finally a troll Justin will not put on ignore. He is not against troll, as long as the troll agrees with him
justinnum1 commented:
October 6, 2012, 11:56 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by dtc100 View Post
Now finally a troll Justin will not put on ignore. He is not against troll, as long as the troll agrees with him
lol at you calling the new user with 4 posts a troll. Stay classy.
dtc100 commented:
October 7, 2012, 12:01 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
lol at you calling the new user with 4 posts a troll. Stay classy.
Just trying to catch up.

Are you really thinking you are here to save BMW from all the trolls?
justinnum1 commented:
October 7, 2012, 12:04 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by dtc100 View Post
Just trying to catch up.

Are you really thinking you are here to save BMW from all the trolls?
Pretty sure you just called the new user a troll try and be classy to new users.

Luckily there are little to no trolls on the other forum, no where near as bad as it is here.
dtc100 commented:
October 7, 2012, 12:15 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarissa View Post
I don't have a car and don't see myself getting one anytime soon. But i'm here because it's a hobby. Criticizing a car shouldn't be a privilege for car owners....
As long as you do not criticize, because otherwise you will be another one of Justin's trolls. Believe me, you don't want to be his troll.
justinnum1 commented:
October 7, 2012, 12:18 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by dtc100 View Post
As long as you do not criticize, you'd be fine with Justin and have a great future here. Welcome!
I knew you had a difficult time grasping things, but i didn't know it was this bad.

If they had a "i don't plan on getting an F30 but i want to talk about why it's a bad car" section on this forum, you would by far have the highest post count.
dtc100 commented:
October 7, 2012, 12:28 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
I knew you had a difficult time grasping things...
You need to know the definition before you start to throw it around like confetti. Someone who has difficult time grasping things, by definition, cannot be a troll.
justinnum1 commented:
October 7, 2012, 12:31 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by dtc100 View Post
You need to know the definition before you start to throw it around like confetti. Someone who has difficult time grasping things, by definition, cannot be a troll.
Your not a troll. You hate the F30 which is pretty obvious, but once in a while(like 1 our of every 10 of your nonsense posts) you post something thats interesting. Unlike saintor who only comes to the f30 forums to trash the N20(he posts 100% nonsense).

I tried to make that simple for you.
dunderhi commented:
October 7, 2012, 12:41 am

I visit the F30 forum every once in a while to see if there's any F30 diesel news and think it's hilarious that hates the N20 too. He's still the only uh... well lets just call him a "member" that's on my ignore list.

The N20 is strong enough for the heavier 528, so I'm not sure what the big deal about it being in the 328.
dtc100 commented:
October 7, 2012, 12:46 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
Your not a troll. You hate the F30 which is pretty obvious, but once in a while(like 1 our of every 10 of your nonsense posts) you post something thats interesting. Unlike saintor who only comes to the f30 forums to trash the N20(he posts 100% nonsense).

I tried to make that simple for you.
Well thank you very much, unfortunately I cannot say I have found one of your posts useful or interesting. The only thing you know is to call others troll. There is rarely anything you post offers any useful information.

You need to make it simpler for me, how about find a new label just for me, so I can understand who I really am?
justinnum1 commented:
October 7, 2012, 12:50 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by dtc100 View Post
Well thank you very much, unfortunately I cannot say I have found one of your posts useful or interesting. The only thing you know is to call others troll. There is rarely anything you post offers any useful information.

You need to make it simpler for me, how about find a new label just for me, so I can understand who I really am?
Someone who wastes so much time in the F30 forum and has no plan of purchasing... i can only think of one.
dtc100 commented:
October 7, 2012, 1:22 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
Someone who wastes so much time in the F30 forum and has no plan of purchasing... i can only think of one.
You need something better, this forty year old virgin has way more interesting life than you.
jlukja commented:
October 7, 2012, 2:59 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saintor View Post
And that is the reason why C&D got better mpg figures for a 2006 330i than a 2012+ 328i, which was derated by EPA. The N20 just sucks and doesn't deserve to be in any BMW. I don't care about dyno test; 5-60 is the same/even better on the 330i.
The EPA changed the way it calculates MPG back in 2008 so you can't use 2006 EPA figures for direct comparison. The "new" way of estimating fuel economy lowered the MPG estimates for most vehicles. You're comparing apples to oranges.
Saintor commented:
October 7, 2012, 8:10 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by jlukja View Post
The EPA changed the way it calculates MPG back in 2008 so you can't use 2006 EPA figures for direct comparison. The "new" way of estimating fuel economy lowered the MPG estimates for most vehicles. You're comparing apples to oranges.
I did not refer to any EPA rating, just real world figures over a long run. So that is not an apples to oranges situation.
Saintor commented:
October 7, 2012, 8:15 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
Someone who wastes so much time in the F30 forum and has no plan of purchasing... i can only think of one.
Where did you get the information that I have no plan to buy a F30? This is totally wrong. You are confused easily. I probably said that I would not get a 328i. However I am considering a 335i when I'll be done with my actual car. Don't worry, I can afford it.

Are you the moron who did put the childish tags to this thread? Be a man!
dtc100 commented:
October 7, 2012, 9:49 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saintor View Post
Where did you get the information that I have no plan to buy a F30? This is totally wrong. You are confused easily. I probably said that I would not get a 328i. However I am considering a 335i when I'll be done with my actual car. Don't worry, I can afford it.

Are you the moron who did put the childish tags to this thread? Be a man!
It's just part of the name calling habit, it should be obvious if you have read the posts.

But since you are very big on straight line accelerations, might want to wait and see if BMW offers a performance kit for the N55.

The ATS has such a well tuned chassis for dancing around corners and on the twisties. But the 2.0T with manual really screwed up on the engine refinement and gearing.
justinnum1 commented:
October 7, 2012, 10:19 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by dtc100 View Post
It's just part of the name calling habit, it should be obvious if you have read the posts.

But since you are very big on straight line accelerations, might want to wait and see if BMW offers a performance kit for the N55.

The ATS has such a well tuned chassis for dancing around corners and on the twisties. But the 2.0T with manual really screwed up on the engine refinement and gearing.
BMW will offer a PPK on the N55, it's coming this winter.
Saintor commented:
October 7, 2012, 10:52 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by dtc100 View Post
It's just part of the name calling habit, it should be obvious if you have read the posts.
Yeah... that's part of his hissy fits. He needs to control his girlie emotions better.
2k11e90 commented:
October 13, 2012, 1:52 am

10 years from now, which one would you rather be driving?
Michael Schott commented:
October 13, 2012, 5:25 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2k11e90 View Post
10 years from now, which one would you rather be driving?
How many people keep high end cars 10 years these days?
2k11e90 commented:
October 13, 2012, 8:15 pm

We do. There are a lot of old BMWs here in CA. But here's my point...today in 2012, I would rather be driving a 2002 BMW than a 2002 Caddy...any day!
Michael Schott commented:
October 13, 2012, 10:06 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2k11e90 View Post
We do. There are a lot of old BMWs here in CA. But here's my point...today in 2012, I would rather be driving a 2002 BMW than a 2002 Caddy...any day!
Good point but an ATS is nothing like what Cadillac produced in 2002. If you are referring to reliability how expensive is it to maintain that 10 year old E46 with 120,000 miles?
2k11e90 commented:
October 14, 2012, 11:30 am

Nope, it's simply saying that you're driving a 10 year old caddy versus a BMW :-)
Chris90 commented:
October 14, 2012, 7:54 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2k11e90 View Post
Nope, it's simply saying that you're driving a 10 year old caddy versus a BMW :-)
10 year old BMWs are almost worthless these days.