Head 2 Head BMW Alpina B7 VS Audi S8 - Which is the ultimate land yacht?
tags:
matte paint head 2 head bmw video bmw news bmw forum bmw audi vs bmw audi s8 alpina b7 alpina 7 series forum
have you guys seen this? It figures that after three S8's I am now swithing to the B7 (arrives in 2 weeks). Still, performance aside, the new Audi looks boring compared to the Alpina.
Quote:
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On this week's episode of Head 2 Head, senior features editor Jonny Lieberman is pitting two luxury tuner limousines, the BMW 7 Series-based Alpina B7 and Audi S8, against one another to see which of the new performance-tuned German luxury flagships is best. Lieberman starts out by comparing the B7 and the S8 on the track. While on paper 4.4-liter twin-turbo V8's 540 hp and 538 lb-ft of torque of the B7 far outclasses the 512 hp and 479 lb-ft the all-wheel drive S8's 4.0-liter twin-turbo V-8 produces, the Audi destroyed the Alpina in a straight line, needing 3.5 second to hit 60 mph from a standstill, as opposed to the B7's 4.3 second run. |
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October 26, 2012, 8:44 am
I completely agree with your assessment that the B7 is the more attractive of the 2 cars (and would be my choice), but I can't get over by how much the S8 appears to devour the B7. Yikes!!!!
October 26, 2012, 8:45 am
What do you expect from a company that also owns Porsche, Lamborghini and Bugatti? They want less performance?
More things to come - just say they make a future Audi sedan based off a next-gen Panamera platform. Audi's not shy about platform sharing.
October 26, 2012, 5:58 pm
The S8 is very blah but my god the performance numbers are incredible. I suspect BMW will come out with a M version because every other luxury manufacture is pumping up the performance numbers on their flagship cars.
October 26, 2012, 8:16 pm
What was up with the B7's lack of power? Its dyno #'s were very low. Either there test care had issues or BMW/Alpina are fudging really bad on rated power numbers.
October 26, 2012, 8:46 pm
I'm not sure what is "blah" about the Audi's performance. The RS4 I traded in for the 750 will run circles around the 750 or B7 any day all day long. Just an immensely more fun car to drive. Reliability is a different conversation, otherwise I'd still be driving it.
October 26, 2012, 10:14 pm
I meant to say the exterior styling is blah, not performance numbers.
October 26, 2012, 10:20 pm
October 26, 2012, 10:24 pm
Oh sure my bad
October 27, 2012, 11:19 am
thing I dont understand is if Motortrend was able to figure one afternoon about the S8 power.......how is it possible that Audi's development team had no idea, and if so why would they grossly understate the power?..how is that an intelligent marketing plan?....just raises some strange questions.
October 27, 2012, 11:34 am
The S8 might get extra boost as ringer car just for the press. On the other hand, Alpina need to step up with better dyno to match factory spec.
October 27, 2012, 11:41 am
I watched this a few times. A couple of observations from a 2013 F02 750Li xDrive owner:
not sure why they did not compare a SWB xDrive B7. Probably pulls another 5% off drag times
My car has no throttle response lag whatsoever in sport & sport+ mode
The S8 has launch control...might be something for B7 or M Sport Pkge in the future and certainly drastically affects acceleration times.
Given the advancements of N63B44Tu engine, I'm not sure how Alpina can squeeze that much more out of it
I wonder how the S8 and B7 brakes perform...mine began to get hot after one lap on the Nürburgring
The interior and the exterior of the S8 scream "Buick" to me. Especially the interior, it just looks cheap.
I may test drive one for kicks, it wouldbe interesting to spin one around Nordschleife.
I'd be interested to find out what alpbmw thinks?
October 27, 2012, 1:45 pm
weight is about the same as a panamera turbo s.....stock should be less horsepower than a panny turbo s, yet this s8 is higher.....IF a normal s8 is achieving these numbers and its 60k cheaper of a car with the same drag numbers......then yeah impressive value.
October 27, 2012, 4:30 pm
Alpina pretty much does what BMW advertised it would do.
On the other hand Audi 3.5 to 60, 11.8 118mph on 1/4 mi, thats in the same league as a 911 Turbo, or a GTR. Only full size sedan I know that can pull that is a S65.
I like to see an S8 off the showroom floor post those numbers.
October 27, 2012, 5:23 pm
I was interested in the S8 but really wanted LWB so it was pretty much out from the start (I never drove one, maybe I should have?). I don't mind Audi's exterior styling, but do find the interior of the BMW superior.
I was really surprised to see the dyno numbers. Either the S8 was a tuned up press car or the Alpina had issues - or both. I can't wait for some more B7 tests/reviews to come out. I also can't wait for my darn car to arrive stateside...
October 27, 2012, 5:44 pm
I've seen another test on Youtube of the S8 and the guy testing it was only able to get a time of 4.5secs so I think 3.5 for the average driver is near impossible, you're probably looking at the low to mid 4's.
October 27, 2012, 5:46 pm
the 2013 B7 (SWB xDrive) is actually only $20k more than the S8 ($135k vs $115k). I priced them both out since I had to decide which one to order (I went with the B7 after three S8's in a row). However, the cost of a lease is exactlty the same because the residual of the B7 (60%) is far higher than the S8 (45%). Those are for 12k miles. My B7 is on the ship and headed to NJ as we speak. I am dissapointed in the Motortrend review but the Alpina is so much hotter looking.
October 27, 2012, 6:24 pm
Interesting color on the B7. Didn't know there was a flat blue option.
October 27, 2012, 6:31 pm
yes, that matte finish is awesome. I wish I knew that was an option when I ordered mine (I got the Alpina Blue with black/ivory interior). The matte look is very hot right now. I was in Beverly Hills a few weeks ago and I saw several Porsches and Bentleys with a charcoal matte finish and the grilles and wheels in black.
October 27, 2012, 6:35 pm
You can request to get a matte paint job on any BMW model, I think the cost is around $20k+ or you can always go down the vinyl route which would cost around a few thousand dollars.
October 27, 2012, 6:43 pm
20k! LOL. 135k is enough for now! But it does look good.
October 27, 2012, 6:45 pm
I've been seeing lots of matte silver C-class coupes around here lately. Just saw one that was chrome! I don't know if it was paint or some kind of metallic wrap.
October 27, 2012, 6:51 pm
I don't see anything like that here in New England. But just having the B7 and especially in the alpina blue will be something special. I have only seen one or two B7s here in 20 years. I just hope it is not going to look too dorky on 18" winter wheels during the winter months.
October 27, 2012, 7:27 pm
Both cars are extremely rare and exclusive.
October 27, 2012, 8:31 pm
October 27, 2012, 11:10 pm
Matte paint is any paint minus clear coat...any color you like...my Dingolfing tour guide and I were having a chuckle that people pay extra for that.
October 28, 2012, 1:41 am
Any frozen (matt) color is consider as "Individual" from BMW and cost should be around $5K, SA need to check with factory direct when placing order due to limited schedule run. Production efficiency of any "Individual" configuration is much lower (like 7 to 1) than standard, therefore, the premium is mainly to compensate production rate cost rather material cost.
October 28, 2012, 8:56 am
October 28, 2012, 10:14 am
Do a wrap on whatever paint you have and it's protected, and you don't have to worry about permanent damage. I think that's the only way to go. Also, if you get tired of it, it can be removed to reveal your natural color.
October 28, 2012, 10:50 am
October 28, 2012, 12:28 pm
October 28, 2012, 12:33 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZUzv...layer_embedded
BUT, can't just polish/buff scratches at home as it will need to handle by the paint shop.
Warp is a option and avg shop charge around $2.5~3K. However, to match factory quality top warp installer charge up to $7~8K to have perfect edge finish plus cover most of trunk and inside door jamb but after all that still can't do the engine bay. So $5K for factory matt finish is pretty reasonable IMO.
October 28, 2012, 4:49 pm
by wrap do you mean the polyseel? That is something I am considering getting when I take delivery (for both paint and upholstery).
October 28, 2012, 5:54 pm
A little disappointed in the dyno numbers for BMW. I personally do not care for the styling of the Audi. I am very impressed with the Audi’s performance numbers, especially considering the size of the car.
October 28, 2012, 6:15 pm
http://www.northwestautosalon.com/fu...ps-in-seattle/
http://www.northwestautosalon.com/ve...wraps_gallery/
It'll run you 4-6k depending on type of vehicle and how extensively the wrap is applied (e.g. door jams etc).
October 28, 2012, 7:53 pm
Talked to someone with a flat black lambo once and he said he was against wrapping it because it only last a year or so before you have to redo it.
Passing through brentwood today I saw a S550 with a Designo badge that was matte white. Had some kind of metallic element in the paint that made it stand out a bit more than some of the flat whites I've seen here and there.
October 28, 2012, 11:31 pm
I've got a metallic wrap on my 750i. I've had it for a year, and it's been pretty easy to maintain. I don't go into auto car washes, just wash at home. Don't use wax, but that wouldn't help the wrap look anyways. I paid $3,750 for mine, they did the tint as well. All lines are straight, and everything matches well. I've loved having a metallic wrap, as it sets you apart from the 100+ 7 series that I seem to see everyday in LA. I would probably do it again, the time it takes to do one is a pain though.
More pics here: http://www.momentum-motors.com/web/u...09---/3048036/
October 29, 2012, 9:39 am
very cool.
October 29, 2012, 5:26 pm
Has anyone here driven the latest S8? And the B7? In a test drive. Any conclusions on the validity of the MotorTrend test?
Personally, I'm very surprised by the HP figures achieved, since my understanding is that BMW usually underquotes. However, I would also be surprised if MotorTrend or K&N somehow botched the testing, where the car went into a "safe" mode, the car wasn't in Sport where it releases all the ponies etc. There doesn't seem to be a logical explanation as to the discrepancy.
I'm not disappointed, more surprised. I'm a firm believer in the fact that better competitor cars leads to better BMWs.
October 29, 2012, 7:06 pm
More pics here: http://www.momentum-motors.com/web/u...09---/3048036/
October 30, 2012, 2:32 am
October 30, 2012, 2:49 am
Personally, I'm very surprised by the HP figures achieved, since my understanding is that BMW usually underquotes. However, I would also be surprised if MotorTrend or K&N somehow botched the testing, where the car went into a "safe" mode, the car wasn't in Sport where it releases all the ponies etc. There doesn't seem to be a logical explanation as to the discrepancy.
I'm not disappointed, more surprised. I'm a firm believer in the fact that better competitor cars leads to better BMWs.
The S8 most likely a ringer, base on 4641 lbs and trap speed of 118.3 flywheel HP is around 599....that is almost 80HP more than factory spec. Little extra boost is always fun
October 30, 2012, 8:57 am
I also am now wondering if Audi is severly underquoting power. Which is fine, as long as production cars are delivered that way. So if someone can provide some insight from any personal test drives comparing the two.
October 30, 2012, 9:53 am
The S8 most likely a ringer, base on 4641 lbs and trap speed of 118.3 flywheel HP is around 599....that is almost 80HP more than factory spec. Little extra boost is always fun
October 30, 2012, 11:11 am
I think the RWD car is probably sportier than the xDrive, so the ideal car for the test would have been the SWB RWD B7. The Audi only comes in SWB AWD (unless they made the LWB an option/available for the latest version).
October 30, 2012, 3:28 pm
I think the RWD car is probably sportier than the xDrive, so the ideal car for the test would have been the SWB RWD B7. The Audi only comes in SWB AWD (unless they made the LWB an option/available for the latest version).
October 30, 2012, 4:25 pm
Let me comment as someone who has wasted productive hours mulling the issue. I would argue that BMW don't make their sportiest cars, like the M3 and M5 cars in AWD.
Most people agree that AWD is heavier and offers less steering feel, turn in, generally speaking. What is often in debate is real world performance (or even track performance), since an AWD car can usually be driven faster by the untrained, but some argue in the hands of a professional, RWD can be faster. Regardless of speed, the majority of testers say that RWD cars offer more enjoyment since they tend to have better feedback. In slippery or adverse conditions, AWD is the clear winner.
Complicating the matter is that there is rarely 2 cars that are the same that are identical other than being AWD or RWD - usually there is something different in the engine, suspension, ride height etc. For example, the Porsche 911 Turbo does come in RWD, but as the GT2, which is a performance special and only indirectly comparable to the AWD Turbo.
October 30, 2012, 7:14 pm
The next E63 will come in as 4wd only.
October 30, 2012, 7:56 pm
And the 2014 e63 will supposedly get from 0-60 in just 3.4 seconds. Unreal.
October 30, 2012, 8:13 pm
IMO RWD is much more fun and driver can push the limit higher compare with AWD. AWD most of time can enter corner little faster (pending on size of corner) but most of time RWD will exit more quickly which result in similar or better lap time. During endurance race AWD will always have faster tire/brake wear (which means more pit stop) due to entering corner with higher speed. Top speed wise, usually AWD lost more power due to distribution and as result it require more power to achieve the same high speed (80mph+) acceleration as RWD. There is a reason why Lamborghini start to offer RWD car nowadays like the Aventador LP700-2, Gallardo LP570-2, etc plus Ferrari F12 offer RWD only. Those buyers want to experience the car at maximal potential which only RWD can offer. Also, AWD can give the driver a sense of false security which can be danger. Of course, there are car that is AWD and fun to drive like the GT-R, Carrera 4S, and etc but in general RWD rule the track.
If 0-60, 1/4 mile is your thing then go all out on AWD. If intent to enjoy corner, high speed acceleration then RWD is your friend. Basically, pending on target goal just need to choose your tool wisely.
October 30, 2012, 8:23 pm
I also am now wondering if Audi is severly underquoting power. Which is fine, as long as production cars are delivered that way. So if someone can provide some insight from any personal test drives comparing the two.
It would be nice the production car come with this flash, if not just need to call ABT for it
October 30, 2012, 9:31 pm
I should have my 2013 B7 in two weeks (currently on the ship headed to NJ). I will report in on how it drives vs my last three S8's. The B7 will be SWB AWD in Alpina Blue with ivory/black interior. Can't wait. I suspect the S8 will drive/handle better but the B7 is million times better looking.
October 30, 2012, 10:39 pm
Definitely stands out much more as well. I've lived in both MIA and LA which are cities loaded with luxury cars, and have never seen more than a couple of Alpinas.
October 30, 2012, 11:25 pm
October 30, 2012, 11:40 pm
Sat in the S8 and honestly it is one of the finest interiors I have ever seen - almost on par with Bentley. I think it is a beautiful car in/out and I would love to own one. I did test drive the s6. What a great car as well.
October 30, 2012, 11:47 pm
I might be bias because I have the S5 but I do like the A5/S5/RS5and the R8 in terms of exterior styling, the rest of the Audi's are way too boring.
October 31, 2012, 12:17 am
I agree that the fun factor makes RWD a better choice. However, from a pure drag race perspective, AWD is just better performance. I'm not trying to argue with anyone, however, when Motor Trend rolls out an obvious Audi cheater car and tests it against a rwd B7 (for which we know to be slower than xdrive)...something's not right.
The highest performance Porsche sold in the US right now now is the 911 Turbo S which utilizes AWD 60/40 rear wheel bias. (Only available in AWD).
As far as the weight argument, the weight spec difference in the F01 is an additional 35 kg for xDrive which is why the acceleration numbers are better for the xDrive.
Sure, RWD is more fun but if you want pure acceleration performance from a standstill, AWD is where it's at.
October 31, 2012, 12:34 am
Most people agree that AWD is heavier and offers less steering feel, turn in, generally speaking. What is often in debate is real world performance (or even track performance), since an AWD car can usually be driven faster by the untrained, but some argue in the hands of a professional, RWD can be faster. Regardless of speed, the majority of testers say that RWD cars offer more enjoyment since they tend to have better feedback. In slippery or adverse conditions, AWD is the clear winner.
Complicating the matter is that there is rarely 2 cars that are the same that are identical other than being AWD or RWD - usually there is something different in the engine, suspension, ride height etc. For example, the Porsche 911 Turbo does come in RWD, but as the GT2, which is a performance special and only indirectly comparable to the AWD Turbo.
October 31, 2012, 1:06 am
October 31, 2012, 9:30 am
The car feels smaller due to the sport differential. In a turn it puts more power to the outside wheels. They turn faster, and rotate the car. Camber is not excessive in order to minimize tire wear.
October 31, 2012, 10:17 am
Doesn't the B7 have a limited slip diff as well? I admit to not knowing if so. One detraction of the B7 is the weight - to make it produce the power it does, they beefed up a lot of the components, added coolers etc. Likely to the detriment of response. So if Audi didn't do similarly, or less so, that may make the car more fragile in the long term, to the benefit of performance. Nothing to back that up - just a thought.
October 31, 2012, 10:52 am
The B7 does not have a limited slip diff. It adds weight, but is likely worth the extra pounds. The Audi is 4610lbs due to 100% aluminum chassis/frame. If it were built on a steel based system, it would be over 5000lbs. Audi is thinking of discontinuing the aluminum system in the next generation. Maybe due to costs?
October 31, 2012, 11:21 am
I might be bias because I have the S5 but I do like the A5/S5/RS5and the R8 in terms of exterior styling, the rest of the Audi's are way too boring.
I looked at Audi A8's before picking the BMW and I walked away for a couple of reasons. One, the twin turbo V8 was not available yet, only the V6 (a no-go for me) and second, the exterior styling.
Especially in silver, this thing is one big plain box with a monstrosity of a grill.
For me, the Audi 5 series or R8 are the only ones worth looking at.
October 31, 2012, 4:02 pm
November 1, 2012, 12:28 pm
http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/...sales/1672995/
Speaking of market share.....(exerps from todays news)
Audi continued to be one of the fastest-growing premium brands in the U.S.
It was a record October for the brand and marked 22 months of sales gains in the U.S.
Sales of A8 flagship were up 54.7% it said, driven in part by the introduction of the S8 high-performance version.
The redone A6 was up 36.6% for the month and is up 96.8% year-to-date.
So it appears the struggling with market share is working to make things better. How are the 750s selling vs. last year?
November 1, 2012, 2:34 pm
November 2, 2012, 2:40 am
Speaking of market share.....(exerps from todays news)
Audi continued to be one of the fastest-growing premium brands in the U.S.
It was a record October for the brand and marked 22 months of sales gains in the U.S.
Sales of A8 flagship were up 54.7% it said, driven in part by the introduction of the S8 high-performance version.
The redone A6 was up 36.6% for the month and is up 96.8% year-to-date.
So it appears the struggling with market share is working to make things better. How are the 750s selling vs. last year?
on the 7s major drop in Oct YTY but so far YTD is about the same, two more months so we will see. I know people are holding off b/c of new S class, maybe some alreay jump ship over to Audi.
November 2, 2012, 9:19 am
the good news is that the residuals have climbed significantly, perhaps as an attempt to bring sales back. I am getting 60% vs Audi at 45%. That completely makes up for the price difference between the B7 and S8.
November 3, 2012, 7:22 pm
With a 60% residual for B7 maybe I lease trade my 750li
November 5, 2012, 11:49 am
November 5, 2012, 9:11 pm
http://www.youtube.com/v/khYHWhku-0E?
November 5, 2012, 10:02 pm
http://www.youtube.com/v/khYHWhku-0E?
The BMW matte paint does have a clear coat, it's just less shiny to put it simply. You just cannot buff or wax the car, as those will flatten the clear coat, making it more shiny, which defeats the purpose of the matte finish.
After watching that video, I'd seriously consider getting a matte car. I have a CR Spotless water system, and that would be pretty easy to keep clean.
November 6, 2012, 2:03 am
The BMW matte paint does have a clear coat, it's just less shiny to put it simply. You just cannot buff or wax the car, as those will flatten the clear coat, making it more shiny, which defeats the purpose of the matte finish.
After watching that video, I'd seriously consider getting a matte car. I have a CR Spotless water system, and that would be pretty easy to keep clean.
November 6, 2012, 2:42 am
Audi ranked almost last on ConsumerReports and JDPower dependability list. The S8 looks like it has down syndrome to be honest. Idc how fast it is, I would go Alpina not only cause I am a BMW enthusiast but I've owned and been around Audi and hate their way of everything. I bet you those numbers are inflated and BS. I would still put my money on that B7. Your telling me the S8 is as fast as a Z06? Don't think so.
November 7, 2012, 12:32 pm
somehow I have a "feeling" that consumers reports would be thrown aside if bmw ranked last.......come on man...you'd buy the bimmer anyway?
Have some self respect and stop grasping at straws. Sometimes its ok to for the bad guys to be better. I accept ones opinion on feel/looks ect....but the rest is denial.
November 7, 2012, 11:20 pm
I m hearing RINGER when I hear a car that lists 520 flywheel hp and delivers 479 wheel hp .....through an all wheel drive system no less...the drivetrain loss makes this all the more suspect..
Does anyone question the logic of a full size awd 4400 lb sedan outperforming the rest of the Audi lineup?
ECU tunes are simple with turbocharged motors to provide winners and elevate the image of a brand..
I dont drive a BMW or an audi and I think they are both wonderful luxury sports sedans...
Still 479 wheel hp doesn't add up ..
The 600 lb heavier Bentley with a warmed over tt V8 does zero to 60 mph in 4.5 seconds and does the quarter mile in 12.5 seconds @ 111 mph..(,ptprweek video show)
600 lbs is heavier but not so drastic that the acceleration times would be so different..
I'm surprised the porsche panamera turbo is slower than this S8 as well..Again surprising...
November 8, 2012, 9:52 am
while your chasing down ringers....take a peek at M5 rated 560chp....laying down 530whp on a dyno....get back to us with the same enthusiasm please. The bmw crowd understand forced induction cars being under rated....only the ones looking in from afar are questioning this. I believe the M5 is hugely under rated, 530 vs s8s 480....thats 50 more, and its 400cc bigger...all is well.
Panamera turbo is 4400lbs, and has less hp than both these cars.
http://f10.m5post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=762953
November 9, 2012, 8:56 am
November 16, 2012, 10:13 am
I have a 2013 B7 and a 2009 R8. Both give a 4.2 0-60 time, but are completely different in every way except how long it takes to get to 60 MPH.
November 19, 2012, 3:59 am
have you guys seen this? It figures that after three S8's I am now swithing to the B7 (arrives in 2 weeks). Still, performance aside, the new Audi looks boring compared to the Alpina.
http://wot.motortrend.com/super-seda...ad-281025.html
November 21, 2012, 5:59 pm
Luckily a different independant reviewer found the identical results. Carlos drove the S8 and B7, then made independant reviews. Jonny L did a review of B7, vs. S8.
Matt Farah found the same findings, car and drivers results are incoming very soon.
To summarize the general take. B7 is a beter version of the 750i, although feeling very heavy, it eivers a pleasant comfortable drive. S8 is an axe murderer in the straights, and holds its own in the turns, feeling smaller than it is, but at the expense of a steering fel that doesn't give feedback to the tires limits of traction.
Once cost is factored in, the S8 delivers the goods, and the B7 offers an alternative for some buyers valuing loks, or perhaps exclusiveness, or brand loyalty, or a mix of things, since it does perform admiraby too in the big picture of large sport lux.
Similar read from Ron
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...bmw_alpina_b7/
November 22, 2012, 3:16 am
Very tempting to order an S8 but if it doesn't reach 60 in 3.5sec can Audi take it back? I doubted since the spec claim 4sec. I guess by then the option would be to call ABT for a ECU tune.
November 22, 2012, 4:37 pm
November 22, 2012, 4:39 pm
The four rings represent the 1932 merging of four previously independent car companies Audi, DKW, Horch and Wanderer. They called themselves AutoUnion, until they brought back the Audi name.
Hardly copying the 3 pointed star or the roundel.
November 22, 2012, 4:45 pm
Audi is the most reliable Euro brand and top-non Japanese brand (according to CR)
CR
JDpower
November 22, 2012, 5:40 pm
Audi always had great products like RS4, RS6 sedan/avant, Q7 V12 TDI, etc but never reach the US market. Audi's challenges is matter of bussiness model not product.
November 22, 2012, 9:50 pm
The four rings represent the 1932 merging of four previously independent car companies Audi, DKW, Horch and Wanderer. They called themselves AutoUnion, until they brought back the Audi name.
Hardly copying the 3 pointed star or the roundel.
November 23, 2012, 10:06 am
Try sketching a logo with four squares, or triangles or whatever. Circles are more aesthetically pleasing...that's just a truism of basic design. Simplicity is another design hallmark of an effective logo. You could reasonably speculate that the four rings were also meant to suggest four wheels (not AWD, as many who never heard of AutoUnion assume ... just wheels). The four rings logo is an excellent design, full stop. It neither imitates nor is easily confused with any of its competittors, which is critically important for a trademark.
A great many auto marques worldwide are based on circles or ovals: Ford, Toyota, Infiniti, Mercedes-Benz, BMW, Subaru, Buick, SAAB, VW, Opel, Alfa Romeo ... this is just off the top of my head. BMW no more invented the concept of a roundel than the internal combustion "motor" (their middle name).
November 24, 2012, 2:18 pm
I was really stunned B7 being out performed by an S8, how could this happen. Had to come bck to accept reality. But never did like the audi they never looked pretty and/or elegant.
November 24, 2012, 2:23 pm
Try sketching a logo with four squares, or triangles or whatever. Circles are more aesthetically pleasing...that's just a truism of basic design. Simplicity is another design hallmark of an effective logo. You could reasonably speculate that the four rings were also meant to suggest four wheels (not AWD, as many who never heard of AutoUnion assume ... just wheels). The four rings logo is an excellent design, full stop. It neither imitates nor is easily confused with any of its competittors, which is critically important for a trademark.