Another BMW 328i and Cadillac ATS head to head: This time AWD
If you're looking for a comfortable, luxurious, and prestigious car, the BMW has the edge, but if you're looking for a personal driving machine, the ATS leaps out in front. For my money and for my requirements, I'd be buying the BMW. It's still a sport sedan even though it never made me smile like the ATS did. But somehow I ended up with a wife and three kids, and I absolutely need the added utility and space the BMW offers.
http://www.autos.ca/car-comparisons/...ts-2-0t-awd/5/
Not too surprising. I am hoping BMW makes some changes, at least for the sport trims.
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February 27, 2013, 2:31 pm
Testing AWD models in Canada and all he could come up with is one three sentence paragraph and not the slightest bit of actual performance or technical comparison.
February 27, 2013, 2:38 pm
February 27, 2013, 2:40 pm
February 27, 2013, 2:43 pm
...there are 5 pages in the review, just in case if anyone is wondering.
February 27, 2013, 2:44 pm
Fluff. No substance to really speak of.
February 27, 2013, 2:45 pm
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February 27, 2013, 2:51 pm
The xdrive automatically means the wafty base suspension. When going up against an ATS or E90, its not a great way of starting off in the f30s favor.
February 27, 2013, 2:52 pm
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February 27, 2013, 3:32 pm
February 27, 2013, 3:37 pm
February 27, 2013, 3:50 pm
February 27, 2013, 4:18 pm
This is sad that anyone would come to this conclusion about any BMW versus a Cadillac of all cars: "if you’re looking for a comfortable, luxurious, and prestigious car, the BMW has the edge, but if you’re looking for a personal driving machine, the ATS leaps out in front".
I know, I know - the writer does not know what he's talking about; the writer clearly does not know anything about cars; who is this guy?; and, I'm a troll, even though I'm on my 6th BMW.
February 27, 2013, 4:32 pm
I agree BMW suffers from having a more utilitarian view and application of AWD. Of course, BMW views performance dynamics as meaning RWD. BMW "suffers" from having a more utilitarian view and application of many things and has a long history of putting more emphasis on function over form. BMW interiors are a pretty good example of this. I believe it is pretty well accepted they are the most spartan and Teutonic of any of their competitors.
As the world population continues its decline toward a more and more fearful existence those views seem to be pressing in on BMW. It seems more and more people are afraid of RWD, and even merely having FWD. We must have AWD in order to maximize every scintilla of safety we can possibly perceive. Then there's the turn from ever having to do anything that might possibly get your hands dirty (to which, admittedly, BMW adds with its included maintenance program) by doing something like putting on winter tires.
Actual fun is on the verge of being completely replaced by virtual fun. I've said here in the past that "BMW people" are more the type who prefer being involved with doing things for themselves and "Mercedes people" are more the type to prefer having other people do things for them. I've gotten quite a lot of agreement with that, even from Mercedes people. It seems to me today's BMW buyers are showing more characteristics of yesterday's Merc buyers.
February 27, 2013, 4:33 pm
In Jamestown, the people who refused to drink the kool-air were called trolls.
February 27, 2013, 4:36 pm
.....Then there's the turn from ever having to do anything that might possibly get your hands dirty (to which, admittedly, BMW adds with its included maintenance program) by doing something like putting on winter tires.
Actual fun is on the verge of being completely replaced by virtual fun....
February 27, 2013, 5:20 pm
February 27, 2013, 5:26 pm
I know, I know - the writer does not know what he's talking about; the writer clearly does not know anything about cars; who is this guy?; and, I'm a troll, even though I'm on my 6th BMW.
February 27, 2013, 5:48 pm
I know, I know - the writer does not know what he's talking about; the writer clearly does not know anything about cars; who is this guy?; and, I'm a troll, even though I'm on my 6th BMW.
February 27, 2013, 6:31 pm
Gasp... * 55K$ * + txs ---> 64K$C .... about 1000$/mo on a lease, typical BMW Canada style.
February 27, 2013, 8:02 pm
I guess I'm in denial.
The CTSV is a great car and it deserves to get better ratings as compared to the E60 M5. But, the 3 Series has been BMW's wheel house car.
February 27, 2013, 8:23 pm
I guess I'm in denial.
The CTSV is a great car and it deserves to get better ratings as compared to the E60 M5. But, the 3 Series has been BMW's wheel house car.
In most head to heads, the 3 series is still coming out on top of the ATS, though its close. So I don't think it's that bleak. I myself no, If I did not get my car I would have had an ATS as I find the Brembos and LSD aapealling when BMW keeps things like an LSD out of all non M cars.
February 27, 2013, 8:33 pm
How can I get this to store in my BMW?
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February 27, 2013, 9:22 pm
February 28, 2013, 11:39 am
If you are getting a dedicated car for yourself, I agree no need to care what the wife says, as they usually don't ask for our opinion buying their stuff.
February 28, 2013, 11:56 am
Mrs. Audio always has input on car purchases and I would never buy a car that she didn't like. If it was totally up to her we would be driving an Aston Martin Rapide or a Bentley Continental Coupe.
CA
February 28, 2013, 2:09 pm
When xDrive was first becoming available on the F30, one new owner said he could not tell a difference between AWD and RWD F30's on public roads.
I am beginning to think the AWD vs RWD question for BMW sedans is not a one size fits all:
- People could tell the difference between RWD and AWD E90's, and AWD sat a bit higher than non sport RWD
- Not clear if those differences exist between AWD and RWD on the F30, and AWD does not sit higher than a non sport RWD
- A Car & Drive article when AWD was first offered on the 7 series said the 7 handled better with AWD
- That same C&D article said AWD on the E60 5 series brought undesirable understeeer
- The F10 5 series started offering an optional suspension with AWD, and I don't recall many claims of a difference in driving feel compared to RWD
Bruce
March 1, 2013, 11:24 am
The February numbers are out for a few brands:
C Class 7,302.
3 Series 6,973.
G 4,529.
ATS 3,382.
A4 3,089 (A4/A5 4,262).
TL 2,216.
IS 1,532.
Others should follow.
April 5, 2013, 5:16 pm
This issue has come up before, but I definitely agree with 408racer that the elimination of the oil dipstick was one of the stupidest things BMW ever did. Hooking everything up to a computer is not always a good idea. There have been any number of comments posted on this and other boards about the oil sensor not always being accurate, so that it is easily possible to overfill the crankcase. I tested this on my E90 and found that when I changed my oil, I could put in less than six quarts (not even the seven recommneded) and the computer read "full". Dipsticks are cheap and reliable. BMW ought to bring them back. And for those arguing that many buyers don't check their oil - right - and they probably don't scroll through their maintenance function on iDrive either. Give us a dipstick.
April 9, 2013, 11:51 am
Have not visited the Cadillac ATS forums for awhile, decided to take a peek. What struck me was, there are many young ATS drivers there comparing their aftermarket tunes for their 2.0Ts, and over here mostly older drivers discussing fuel economy and comfort. Sign of time I suppose.
April 9, 2013, 12:30 pm
April 9, 2013, 12:35 pm
Attachment 370505
April 9, 2013, 1:17 pm
We saw a black ATS at the zoo this weekend, and my wife’s comment was “How come all the Cadillac drivers look like wife beaters?”
Car looked great actually, very low and wide, looks much better in black.
April 9, 2013, 2:38 pm
I test drove the ATS. And the XTS and CTS.
Great car, but I liked the 3 series better. Not a huge gap, but a gap nonetheless.
April 9, 2013, 3:18 pm
April 11, 2013, 12:10 am
I test drove the ATS 3 weeks ago. The 3 Series blows it away. Sure the Cadillac has come a long way, but I don't understand how anyone would think it handles better than a 3. It doesn't feel the road better, nor corner better and certainly it doesn't reach the fun to drive factor.
I also have trouble getting over the fact that Cadillac's traditionally attract the 70+ year old crowd. My local Cadillac dealer is run by a bunch of stereotypical New Jersey unprofessionals- think Sopranos wash outs. Terrible dealer.
Coming from Japanese cars I have to say that the 3 series xdrive is a blast to drive. Adding DHP to the driving experience keeps me smiling. Since I live in the northeast mountains I won't buy a non-AWD vehicle. For you folks that don't get snow you absolutely should buy RWD cars- they're even more fun to drive.
April 11, 2013, 5:43 pm
I also have trouble getting over the fact that Cadillac's traditionally attract the 70+ year old crowd. My local Cadillac dealer is run by a bunch of stereotypical New Jersey unprofessionals- think Sopranos wash outs. Terrible dealer.
Coming from Japanese cars I have to say that the 3 series xdrive is a blast to drive. Adding DHP to the driving experience keeps me smiling. Since I live in the northeast mountains I won't buy a non-AWD vehicle. For you folks that don't get snow you absolutely should buy RWD cars- they're even more fun to drive.
The 3.6 v6 was a ton of fun, a must if one chooses ATS IMHO.
April 12, 2013, 2:04 am
I think many people do not understand HOW TO USE the electronic dipstick so they think it sucks. You have to drive the car and let the oil warm up. Then you park it on a level surface and reset the system so it takes a fresh reading. Its like so many of you are stuck in the 80s or 90s or something. Technology is our friend. Embrace it.
This is the same whiney comparisons I hear all the time from people who want to row their own gears. Sure its fun and nostalgic, but I love the F1 factor and precise rev matched gear changes of SMG and DCT. And when you are tired after a long day or work or stuck in traffic, you put it in auto mode and sit back and enjoy the music or conversation. It doesn't make you any less of an enthusiast. But yet you hear all these "purist" say how they need a stick or the car isn't sporty enough. Give me a break.
April 12, 2013, 9:13 am
I think many people do not understand HOW TO USE the electronic dipstick so they think it sucks. You have to drive the car and let the oil warm up. Then you park it on a level surface and reset the system so it takes a fresh reading. Its like so many of you are stuck in the 80s or 90s or something. Technology is our friend. Embrace it.
This is the same whiney comparisons I hear all the time from people who want to row their own gears. Sure its fun and nostalgic, but I love the F1 factor and precise rev matched gear changes of SMG and DCT. And when you are tired after a long day or work or stuck in traffic, you put it in auto mode and sit back and enjoy the music or conversation. It doesn't make you any less of an enthusiast. But yet you hear all these "purist" say how they need a stick or the car isn't sporty enough. Give me a break.
Sent from my MB525 using Bimmer App
April 12, 2013, 10:00 am
I think many people do not understand HOW TO USE the electronic dipstick so they think it sucks. You have to drive the car and let the oil warm up. Then you park it on a level surface and reset the system so it takes a fresh reading. Its like so many of you are stuck in the 80s or 90s or something. Technology is our friend. Embrace it.
This is the same whiney comparisons I hear all the time from people who want to row their own gears. Sure its fun and nostalgic, but I love the F1 factor and precise rev matched gear changes of SMG and DCT. And when you are tired after a long day or work or stuck in traffic, you put it in auto mode and sit back and enjoy the music or conversation. It doesn't make you any less of an enthusiast. But yet you hear all these "purist" say how they need a stick or the car isn't sporty enough. Give me a break.
April 12, 2013, 10:42 am
April 12, 2013, 11:40 am
April 12, 2013, 6:46 pm
April 12, 2013, 7:10 pm
April 12, 2013, 7:20 pm
Attachment 370505
This effectively stock Model 61 Cadillac was entered in the 1950 24 Hours of LeMans by noted American sportsman Briggs Cunnigham.
It was driven by Miles and Sam Collier to a 10th place finish.
The Effectively Stock Cadillac in the 1950 Le Mans Race
CA
April 12, 2013, 7:21 pm
You prefer an AT variant. Perfectly fine.
Others prefer an MT. Perfectly fine.
To assert that all will prefer an AT (regardless of the variant) if one has "truly experienced it" is utterly ridiculous. Many of us have owned and driven both - and prefer a manual. Many also prefer the AT. Neither is right or wrong; it is a subjective preference.
No matter how many times I experience a totally clean, efficient, simple to use, programmable, remote controlled gas "fireplace," I still vastly prefer the aesthetics of a real wood fireplace. I appreciate you prefer gas.
April 12, 2013, 7:32 pm
You prefer an AT variant. Perfectly fine.
Others prefer an MT. Perfectly fine.
To assert that all will prefer an AT (regardless of the variant) if one has "truly experienced it" is utterly ridiculous. Many of us have owned and driven both - and prefer a manual. Many also prefer the AT. Neither is right or wrong; it is a subjective preference.
No matter how many times I experience a totally clean, efficient, simple to use, programmable, remote controlled gas "fireplace," I still vastly prefer the aesthetics of a real wood fireplace. I appreciate you prefer gas.
Now, SMG/DCT can act like an auto tranny, but in no way can you compare their performance to one. I have heard good things about the new 8spd autobox but I won't comment until I get a chance to try one out at length.
April 12, 2013, 7:56 pm
Now, SMG/DCT can act like an auto tranny, but in no way can you compare their performance to one. I have heard good things about the new 8spd autobox but I won't comment until I get a chance to try one out at length.
Thanks,
CA
April 12, 2013, 8:13 pm
Now, SMG/DCT can act like an auto tranny, but in no way can you compare their performance to one. I have heard good things about the new 8spd autobox but I won't comment until I get a chance to try one out at length.
I've driven a DCT in a GTI, I thought it was great, but would rather still shift for myself.
April 12, 2013, 8:40 pm
April 12, 2013, 9:11 pm
I've driven a DCT in a GTI, I thought it was great, but would rather still shift for myself.
CA
April 12, 2013, 10:24 pm
Thanks,
CA
Now I remember why I stopped posting on this forum...I love Jon Shafer and the event, but geesh...this is like the newb forum for all the first time BMW owners. Yay, I just got my first BMW, let me go post on Bimmerfest.com
And to whoever made the comment about SMG, more ignorance, half truths, and here-say. I won't even waste my effort in educating people who don't have the capacity or appreciation for it. Just do a search or something.
Unsubscribing lol
April 12, 2013, 10:51 pm
I've been driving my 335is again for the past 6+ weeks and I sorely miss my other sports car with a MT. As nice as my 335is is, I miss shifting gears the most. I've been thinking about it for a while now, and I'm at the point that if I had to choose between a Porsche Carrera GTS with a PDK (DCT) or a BMW 335is with a manual transmission, I'd take the 335is with a manual transmission.
I bought the 335is as a compromise car that my wife would also enjoy to drive and that's why I opted for the DCT. She absolutely loves the 335is and I'm very glad she does. But, I'm also glad that I did not compromise when I bought the Porsche, and I got one with a manual transmission like I've had in all of my previous sports cars.
I've also driven BMWs with SMG transmissions, and since you like auto trannies so much, do yourself a favor by driving a BMW with a DCT. Afterwards, you will know to not classify the DCT and SMG in the same category.
April 13, 2013, 6:38 am
CA
April 13, 2013, 6:40 am
Now I remember why I stopped posting on this forum...I love Jon Shafer and the event, but geesh...this is like the newb forum for all the first time BMW owners. Yay, I just got my first BMW, let me go post on Bimmerfest.com
And to whoever made the comment about SMG, more ignorance, half truths, and here-say. I won't even waste my effort in educating people who don't have the capacity or appreciation for it. Just do a search or something.
Unsubscribing lol
April 13, 2013, 11:01 am
While I can heel/toe into a hot corner on the track, and enjoy this a great deal, I do not pretend I can do better than a modern AT overall in quickness and overall smoothness. For racing, an AT is the obviously superior choice. (Do not fool yourself BMW's SMG is a akin to an F1 transmission however.)
Contemporary ATs are efficient. So is a gas fireplace.
April 13, 2013, 12:52 pm
Now I remember why I stopped posting on this forum...I love Jon Shafer and the event, but geesh...this is like the newb forum for all the first time BMW owners. Yay, I just got my first BMW, let me go post on Bimmerfest.com
And to whoever made the comment about SMG, more ignorance, half truths, and here-say. I won't even waste my effort in educating people who don't have the capacity or appreciation for it. Just do a search or something.
Unsubscribing lol
April 13, 2013, 4:14 pm
2. I guess you missed Lewis Hamilton's comment when he bought Pagani Zonda MT? He said (Yes, yes, tongue in cheek ... bla bla) "Since my company car is an automatic I wanted a manual transmission to have fun on weekends." I guess you know better than Lewis
April 13, 2013, 4:16 pm
April 13, 2013, 6:39 pm
http://www.imaginelifestyles.com/lux...lewis-hamilton
After Kimi (untouchable at first spot), I started liking this guy more and more lately.
April 13, 2013, 7:48 pm
http://www.imaginelifestyles.com/lux...lewis-hamilton
After Kimi (untouchable at first spot), I started liking this guy more and more lately.
April 13, 2013, 9:08 pm
CA
April 13, 2013, 10:05 pm
+1
Truly accomplished track/ race drivers are interested in going fast. Heel and toe is merely a tool with no more thrill attached than putting on safety gear. They can do this in their sleep. If an AT tranny can do it better (it can) they are first in line to get one.
April 14, 2013, 8:21 am
Truly accomplished track/ race drivers are interested in going fast. Heel and toe is merely a tool with no more thrill attached than putting on safety gear. They can do this in their sleep. If an AT tranny can do it better (it can) they are first in line to get one.
April 14, 2013, 8:23 am
CA
April 14, 2013, 8:29 am
CA
April 14, 2013, 2:12 pm
April 14, 2013, 3:26 pm