Spray paint all over brand new F30 - not sure if I want to just cry or kill someone

by Bimmerfest.com Member - DavidM1975 on June 11, 2013, 2:39 pm
brand new BMW F30 covered in paint

I live in a loft apartment building in Philadelphia. There was recently a dude hired by the building owner to paint steps leading to some apartment doors in the building. He was using a grey spray paint, spraying it all over the place. At some point it crossed my mind that some of that stuff may go over my F30 sitting in the parking lot so I brought it up but the guy said I was completely safe. Today I come out of my apartment, start looking closely and to my despair I discover that indeed there is spray paint all over the car.... already contacted the building owner and went to a car detailing place - they say it "may be possible" to remove it with clay and compound but.... the car is 2 months old. I don't have to tell you guys how I feel about this.... what would you do?!?! Am I going after the building owner to get this resolved? It seems like a logical next step.... I hope somehow I don't have to repaint the whole car...

BMW F30 with spray paint

F30 ruined by spray paint


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102 responses to Spray paint all over brand new F30 - not sure if I want to just cry or kill someone

DavidM1975 commented:
June 11, 2013, 2:42 pm

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E36 Phantom commented:
June 11, 2013, 2:43 pm

It'll buff right out.


No, seriously, I know it's very frustrating, but it will all thoroughly come off with a good polish. Just let the building owner know what needs to be done and that you expect him to remedy it for you.

Finally, an instance where we could use that phrase legitimately!

C:\>Sent from my 386 using MS-DOS__
BlueF30 commented:
June 11, 2013, 2:49 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by E36 Phantom View Post
It'll buff right out.


No, seriously, I know it's very frustrating, but it will all thoroughly come off with a good polish. Just let the building owner know what needs to be done and that you expect him to remedy it for you.

Finally, an instance where we could use that phrase legitimately!

C:\>Sent from my 386 using MS-DOS__

HokieXDriver commented:
June 11, 2013, 3:21 pm

Clay will likely get it out quickly. In the meantime, I would say keep it out of direct sunlight.
kkapdolee commented:
June 11, 2013, 3:22 pm

That sucks...
I hope you get it resolved soon.
tturedraider commented:
June 11, 2013, 3:32 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by E36 Phantom View Post
It'll buff right out.


No, seriously, I know it's very frustrating, but it will all thoroughly come off with a good polish. Just let the building owner know what needs to be done and that you expect him to remedy it for you.

Finally, an instance where we could use that phrase legitimately!

C:\>Sent from my 386 using MS-DOS__
This. Yes, the building owner is without doubt responsible for rectifying the situation.
DavidM1975 commented:
June 11, 2013, 3:39 pm

The building owner replied. Looks the painter is aware of the problem... maybe he was hoping I wouldn't notice?! In any case he is probably going to pay for whatever needs to be done. Thanks for your support guys, I really hope clay and some compound can do the trick!
EstorilF30 commented:
June 11, 2013, 4:08 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
The building owner replied. Looks the painter is aware of the problem... maybe he was hoping I wouldn't notice?! In any case he is probably going to pay for whatever needs to be done. Thanks for your support guys, I really hope clay and some compound can do the trick!
And if it doesn't, fixing it isn't hurting your wallet, so
Alpine300ZHP commented:
June 11, 2013, 4:21 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
The building owner replied. Looks the painter is aware of the problem... maybe he was hoping I wouldn't notice?! In any case he is probably going to pay for whatever needs to be done. Thanks for your support guys, I really hope clay and some compound can do the trick!
It can. Don't worry. But do try to keep it out of sunlight and heat because heat makes the paint bake on the car. Also, try to get it done ASAP. The longer it sits the more it bonds to the surface thus requiring more aggressive correction to get it off. You need to get with fest sponsor Phillip Yiu at Detailer's Domain and have him do the job (New Jersey). He is a true expert for paint correction. A bad detailer will wreck havoc on your black car.

Philip Yiu
Detailer's Domain
E-mail: phil@detailersdomain.com
Tel: 201-233-0003
Member's receive 10% off using "BMW" as a promo code at checkout (Swissvax excluded)
www.detailersdomain.com
DavidM1975 commented:
June 11, 2013, 4:36 pm

Just spoke to Phil on the phone. He says they are 2h away from me - not worth the drive. He's trying to find someone reliable closer to where I live. Seems like a good guy, thanks so much for the referral!
Alpine300ZHP commented:
June 11, 2013, 4:40 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
Just spoke to Phil on the phone. He says they are 2h away from me - not worth the drive. He's trying to find someone reliable closer to where I live. Seems like a good guy, thanks so much for the referral!
I am from Philly so I know he is two hours away, but unless he can give you a trusted referral I would drive the two hours to Phil. He is that good. This is a brand new 335i so I would rather see you drive to him and know it will be perfect as opposed to maybe come out good with someone else.
pony_trekker commented:
June 11, 2013, 4:41 pm

I would have just taken a bat to his hands. Tough to hold a paint brush or spray can with a cast.
DavidM1975 commented:
June 11, 2013, 4:42 pm

I am debating this right now. I can't really afford to lose the entire day on this tomorrow but on the other hand I don't want to wait... I know this needs to get done right away.
tturedraider commented:
June 11, 2013, 5:06 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
I am debating this right now. I can't really afford to lose the entire day on this tomorrow but on the other hand I don't want to wait... I know this needs to get done right away.
In addition to paying for the repair the building owner should reimburse you for any lost wages.
E36 Phantom commented:
June 11, 2013, 5:11 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by tturedraider View Post
In addition to paying for the repair the building owner should reimburse you for any lost wages.
Only within reason. Likely, he'll pay for a day off work just to keep things smooth, but if he wanted to be difficult he could argue (probably successfully) that it only takes an hour for drop off, and an hour for pickup, at the detail shop on the way to work. That the OP is choosing to drive 4hr round trip to go to a special person is not the owners issue. Again, since it's a small amount it's likely he will pay it, but I don't think he'd be required to in court.

C:\>Sent from my 386 using MS-DOS__
Jamesonsviggen commented:
June 11, 2013, 5:30 pm

A proper detail will make it good as new.

I had a guy give me his car to detail when I was a kid. Black car with tons of overspray from white spray paint over every single inch of the car. Claybar did the trick. It always does.
jedbmw commented:
June 11, 2013, 7:47 pm

It will come off with clay bar and some good wax. But, like others posted, the sooner the better!!!

I know when you first saw the paint on your car, you felt like killing the person that did it and throwing up at the same time! OUCH!!!!!! I would have felt the same.

Relax... it WILL come off!

Please keep us posted with a follow up reply.
Pasa-d commented:
June 11, 2013, 8:21 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
Just spoke to Phil on the phone. He says they are 2h away from me - not worth the drive. He's trying to find someone reliable closer to where I live. Seems like a good guy, thanks so much for the referral!
You east coast guys crack me up. 2 hours is like driving to Santa Monica for dinner.

Seriously, leave at 6 a.m, be there when he opens at 8, be back after lunch!
JoeFromPA commented:
June 11, 2013, 8:56 pm

If you want to agonize that much over it go to a pep boys or similar, pick up a jar of clay and spray detailer, and go to town. Give it a quick wash, or rinseless wash, and start up.

Most likely it's going to come off just with clay and you can use clay on a clean car and just buff the excess fluid with a MF towel.

Large contaminant particles like paint should NOT require a polishing to remove unless they are bonded to the clearcoat in a significant way - polishing removes clearcoat (either a little or a lot). Polishing is not done to remove external contaminants.
rippx commented:
June 11, 2013, 9:28 pm

My God I would be furious. As everybody else said, clean the area first, and then make sure you clay it. Only use polish as a second option if the clay doesnt work because polish contains abrasives that thin the clear coat.
Hockeypuck commented:
June 11, 2013, 9:29 pm

If you have viewed any of Phil's work in the Detail area it is a no-brainer.
Db750 commented:
June 11, 2013, 9:51 pm

One thing that hasn't been asked; were you notified that the work was going to be happening?

Myself and my family have a lot of rental property including several apartment buildings were work like this would take place (although I would always avoid spraying paint outdoors). We require tenants to keep us up to date on their email and phone. In an instance like this all I would need to give was 48 hour notice, although I would likely give better just to avoid issues. Most likely I would ask the tenants of one apartment building to park in the lots that belonged to our other buildings. If they failed to comply; too damn bad, but I would be absolutely sure I had done my part to notify everyone of what was going on.

Good luck. I know this must be upsetting, but it will definately come off. If the owner didn't notify the tenants of this type of work I Woukd consider that quite negligent and greatly lacking of any forsight.
Teemo Panda commented:
June 11, 2013, 10:38 pm

I would suggest to go to the dealer and get it done there, but make the landlord pay for it
DavidM1975 commented:
June 11, 2013, 10:49 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Db750 View Post
One thing that hasn't been asked; were you notified that the work was going to be happening?
Not at all. I actually found out about this work being done by stepping into wet paint on my steps when I was trying to leave my apartment to get breakfast one morning.
SWMOChris commented:
June 11, 2013, 10:57 pm

Tough break (again) David, I am looking forward to your novel about the ups and downs of your Bimmer since you got it awhile back. It sounds like it's been interesting at the very least, and I am envious of how well you've seemed to keep your cool throughout, well done, sir!
Db750 commented:
June 11, 2013, 11:03 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
Not at all. I actually found out about this work being done by stepping into wet paint on my steps when I was trying to leave my apartment to get breakfast one morning.
As a landlord and property owner my opinion is that you are completly entitled to everything mentioned in this thread including lost wages. This in nothing short of negligence on your landlords behalf . I am sorry that this has happened to you.

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DavidM1975 commented:
June 11, 2013, 11:07 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by SWMOChris View Post
Tough break (again) David, I am looking forward to your novel about the ups and downs of your Bimmer since you got it awhile back. It sounds like it's been interesting at the very least, and I am envious of how well you've seemed to keep your cool throughout, well done, sir!
Thanks, appreciate the support! It is coming soon. I'm bound to hit 10K next month and I NEED to write a post summarizing the first chapter of Beatrice's life
DavidM1975 commented:
June 11, 2013, 11:15 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Db750 View Post
As a landlord and property owner my opinion is that you are completly entitled to everything mentioned in this thread including lost wages. This in nothing short of negligence on your landlords behalf . I am sorry that this has happened to you.
Thank You sir, that is reassuring. I will try and bill the landlord accordingly although going by the past experiences with him I don't have high expectations. We have an automatic gate leading into the parking lot. The problem with it is it closes after about 45 seconds from the time it is open NO MATTER if there is something still going through or not. Like a mover's truck for example.... or a child... there were a few instances when people's cars got crushed (the gate is strong enough to cause a major dent). As far as I can tell the landlord kept rejecting all claims saying basically that people are idiots and can't use the gate..... well, there are instances where you start moving through the damn thing and something is blocking your car so you HAVE TO stop. We live on a busy street. I'm pretty sure the retarded gate doesn't even meet some standards for this sort of "appliance" but the situation is unlikely to change until an incident serious enough for a lawsuit takes place.
beden1 commented:
June 12, 2013, 12:02 am

I would be super pissed with that overspray. What a complete dumbass thing to do, spraying paint near cars.

You need to find a new place to live.
DavidM1975 commented:
June 12, 2013, 12:07 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by beden1 View Post
You need to find a new place to live.
Trust me, I KNOW!
Db750 commented:
June 12, 2013, 12:08 am

Yeah like Beden said you need to find a new place to live. Sadly, it's much easier said than done, and I think that's one reason landlords get away with bs like this. Either way the place you're living sounds like a law suit waiting to happen with gates that operate like that. What's going to happen when a child gets caught in one?
sayzar commented:
June 12, 2013, 1:23 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
I know how you feel but here what you need to do!!
1.wash the car use the 2 bucket system
2.clay it
3.polish it
4.wax it
after these steps all that over spray paint should be gone.
glennQNYC commented:
June 12, 2013, 2:26 am

I'd bring it to the detailer you get referred to and treat your ride to a nice full detail. Send the bill to the landlord and deduct from your next payment to him.
voip-ninja commented:
June 12, 2013, 9:55 am

Not sure why you're waiting to get this done. If at all possible you should have started having someone work on this the same day that it happened. If you can afford to buy/lease a 335i then I would imagine that getting a day off of your job should not be insurmountable.

I had something similar happen with a company owned car a few years ago. It was parked on the other side of the street next to a neighbor's fence. He was trying to touch up the fence for a party he was having and sprayed the fence (from the opposite side) with oil based stain. I had overspray all over one side of the vehicle.

As soon as I noticed it I immediately pulled it into my driveway to cool it off and went to work on it with a mild soap and a lot of elbow grease.

It all came off easily but if you let it sit there curing onto the clear coat you are only making this worse.
DavidM1975 commented:
June 12, 2013, 10:00 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by voip-ninja View Post
Not sure why you're waiting to get this done. If at all possible you should have started having someone work on this the same day that it happened. If you can afford to buy/lease a 335i then I would imagine that getting a day off of your job should not be insurmountable.
I'm not waiting to get this done - the car is going in today. I can't explain the details of my job to you (because it would take a book) but it's not as easy as you think. Anyway - thanks for your input - again, it's reassuring to hear from people who had a similar problem before and were able to fix it.
beden1 commented:
June 12, 2013, 10:01 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by voip-ninja View Post
Not sure why you're waiting to get this done. If at all possible you should have started having someone work on this the same day that it happened. If you can afford to buy/lease a 335i then I would imagine that getting a day off of your job should not be insurmountable.

I had something similar happen with a company owned car a few years ago. It was parked on the other side of the street next to a neighbor's fence. He was trying to touch up the fence for a party he was having and sprayed the fence (from the opposite side) with oil based stain. I had overspray all over one side of the vehicle.

As soon as I noticed it I immediately pulled it into my driveway to cool it off and went to work on it with a mild soap and a lot of elbow grease.

It all came off easily but if you let it sit there curing onto the clear coat you are only making this worse.
I agree. I also use a spray detailer after every time I wash my cars, something like Meguiar's Ultimate Spray Detailer. This helps to take stuff like paint (even the tough yellow spray paint they line the roads with), bird crap, tar, sap, bugs, hard water spots, etc., off of the surface without causing damage.
BlueF30 commented:
June 12, 2013, 10:04 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by beden1 View Post
I agree. I also use a spray detailer after every time I wash my cars, something like Meguiar's Ultimate Spray Detailer. This helps to take stuff like paint (even the tough yellow spray paint they line the roads with), bird crap, tar, sap, bugs, hard water spots, etc., off of the surface without causing damage.
Prima Hydro is a great detailer, just spray it on as you dry the car. I use it every time I dry the car.
DavidM1975 commented:
June 12, 2013, 10:06 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pasa-d View Post
You east coast guys crack me up. 2 hours is like driving to Santa Monica for dinner.

Seriously, leave at 6 a.m, be there when he opens at 8, be back after lunch!
Hehehe... 2 hours on NJ Turnpike between 6am and 8am.... I wish you knew what you're talking about - that would most likely turn into 4 hours. Especially with the current construction between Philly and Bergen County. Believe me - I LOVE driving (I average 32K miles a year) but this trip is simply more of a PITA than fun.
jjcruiser commented:
June 12, 2013, 12:22 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pasa-d View Post
You east coast guys crack me up. 2 hours is like driving to Santa Monica for dinner.
You cross the 405? I thought it was an impenetrable barrier of space and time....
Technic commented:
June 12, 2013, 12:49 pm

Those paint specks would get off by using BMW Betalink cleaner. One panel at a time.

Those are too many specks, in too many panels, in too much an area, to use clay bar only...
gmblack3 commented:
June 12, 2013, 6:43 pm

If Phil is to far try Nick at Oakes Detail oakesdetail@gmail.com 267-209-0602 in West Chester, PA.
jtuds commented:
June 12, 2013, 7:34 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by sayzar View Post
I know how you feel but here what you need to do!!
1.wash the car use the 2 bucket system
2.clay it
3.polish it
4.wax it
after these steps all that over spray paint should be gone.
I'd say the chances that clay gets dried spray paint off is unlikely.
Mo@BMWRockville commented:
June 12, 2013, 8:08 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpine300ZHP View Post
It can. Don't worry. But do try to keep it out of sunlight and heat because heat makes the paint bake on the car. Also, try to get it done ASAP. The longer it sits the more it bonds to the surface thus requiring more aggressive correction to get it off. You need to get with fest sponsor Phillip Yiu at Detailer's Domain and have him do the job (New Jersey). He is a true expert for paint correction. A bad detailer will wreck havoc on your black car.

Philip Yiu
Detailer's Domain
E-mail: phil@detailersdomain.com
Tel: 201-233-0003
Member's receive 10% off using "BMW" as a promo code at checkout (Swissvax excluded)
www.detailersdomain.com
This! He's awesome!!!
quackbury commented:
June 12, 2013, 8:14 pm

I hope this worked out for you. Because the FIRST thing I would have done is notify my own insurance company, and take it to the drive in claims adjuster. That would give me a documented objective paper trail, and legal recourse if the landlord or painter didn't live up to their promises. (Or even worse, if the detailer stripped off your clear coat or left you with a million swirls).

Your insurance company would coordinate the repairs, make sure they are done properly, stick you in a rental, and subrogate against the landlord's / painter's carriers.

Instead, you fighting this battle on your own, with very little leverage. If you need to get an attorney involved, its going to come out of your own pocket, not Geico's, Allstate's or Flo's.

Good luck.

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PK2348 commented:
June 12, 2013, 9:51 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
Thank You sir, that is reassuring. I will try and bill the landlord accordingly although going by the past experiences with him I don't have high expectations. We have an automatic gate leading into the parking lot. The problem with it is it closes after about 45 seconds from the time it is open NO MATTER if there is something still going through or not. Like a mover's truck for example.... or a child... there were a few instances when people's cars got crushed (the gate is strong enough to cause a major dent). As far as I can tell the landlord kept rejecting all claims saying basically that people are idiots and can't use the gate..... well, there are instances where you start moving through the damn thing and something is blocking your car so you HAVE TO stop. We live on a busy street. I'm pretty sure the retarded gate doesn't even meet some standards for this sort of "appliance" but the situation is unlikely to change until an incident serious enough for a lawsuit takes place.
This is ridiculous. A sensor cable can be fitted to the door that will prevent it from touching anything except the ground. I dealt with a door like that. After the cable was installed, the installer stood right under this heavy metal door and told me to push the down switch. After making sure he was serious i did it. The door stopped about half an inch from the top of his head and rolled back up.
DavidM1975 commented:
June 12, 2013, 10:15 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by PK2348 View Post
This is ridiculous. A sensor cable can be fitted to the door that will prevent it from touching anything except the ground. I dealt with a door like that. After the cable was installed, the installer stood right under this heavy metal door and told me to push the down switch. After making sure he was serious i did it. The door stopped about half an inch from the top of his head and rolled back up.
It's not a vertical gate that you are thinking about. It's a gate leading to a building parking lot that has two wings - they swing open left and right.
Ace88 commented:
June 12, 2013, 10:29 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
The building owner replied. Looks the painter is aware of the problem... maybe he was hoping I wouldn't notice?! In any case he is probably going to pay for whatever needs to be done. Thanks for your support guys, I really hope clay and some compound can do the trick!
Try clay first. Straight lines, never circles. Go to autopia.com for some very professional guidance. Great guys over there that can help you but I am fairly 100% positive that will come off.
PK2348 commented:
June 12, 2013, 10:33 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
It's not a vertical gate that you are thinking about. It's a gate leading to a building parking lot that has two wings - they swing open left and right.
should be even easier in that case, same type of solution, sensors would prevent closing if there is an object between them. it's not expensive either, few hundred dollars. think of a supermarket door
DavidM1975 commented:
June 12, 2013, 10:48 pm

Progress report: I decided to go with a local detailer. After thoroughly discussing the problem they seemed completely confident they were able to take care of it. As far as I can tell they did. I would say they got 95% of the paint off the car and the original paint looks almost like new. There are some swirl marks but honestly I believe one more coat of hand waxing will make them invisible, they are showing only in full sun and I was expecting worse knowing that they would be using a machine tool to polish. They did not use compound anywhere on the body panels, they had to use it on both front and rear bumper as these were the most affected areas. They also had to use razor blades on the windows as there was simply no other way to get the spray paint off.

With all that I am.... 95% happy. There are some grey specks visible at close distance (like 3 inches away from the car) in all crevices like between the rubber and the upper part of the doors, etc. Those are difficult to get into but still I was able to get some of the stuff out myself using bug & tar remover. Some specks are still visible on the chrome frame of the grille and on the grille bars - I'll have another go at those tomorrow or if I can't get it off the car will go back to the detailers with more specific instructions. Some is also left on the plastic parts of the mirrors on both sides. Honestly when I think about it now writing this post I think I am less than 95% happy.... maybe these are details at this point and a lot of people may say I am crazy but the simple truth is these are driving me nuts and the state of my - however you look at it - brand new car car was changed by somebody else's mindless action. Even more so that it was so easy to avoid IF the ****in' painter or the damn landlord had some brains!!! Normally I am not a person that agonizes about stuff like that but I don't feel like letting this one go.

The cost so far was $235. I sent it to the landlord and he said the painter will pay for it. I'll give it a few days, if there is no check I will make it clear to the landlord that I don't care to hear from the painter. This is his responsibility, he gave us no warning and he hired someone who obviously had no idea what the hell they were doing. Maaan is this FRUSTRATING!!!!

BTW my insurance is aware of the situation. I did not make a claim because I wasn't sure if there was a claim to make (because the total cost of taking care of the problem might be lower than my deductible, which is $500) but in case the landlord doesn't cooperate my insurance will have a base to go after his insurance (at least that's what I was told).
DavidM1975 commented:
June 12, 2013, 11:05 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by PK2348 View Post
should be even easier in that case, same type of solution, sensors would prevent closing if there is an object between them. it's not expensive either, few hundred dollars. think of a supermarket door
You know what - great point, thank you! Starting a crusade against the landlord as soon as the current issue is completely resolved!
sunny5280 commented:
June 12, 2013, 11:10 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
This is his responsibility, he gave us no warning and he hired someone who obviously had no idea what the hell they were doing. Maaan is this FRUSTRATING!!!!
You may not have been notified but you were aware the moment you saw him working. Furthermore you recognized the potential for a problem given you discussed it with him.
DavidM1975 commented:
June 12, 2013, 11:15 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny5280 View Post
You may not have been notified but you were aware the moment you saw him working. Furthermore you recognized the potential for a problem given you discussed it with the worker.
You're kidding, right?!? The moment I saw him working was already too late if you want to be dead specific. He went through all the step sets around the building once. As I wrote earlier - I found out about his work by stepping into wet paint on the steps leading out of my apartment.
sunny5280 commented:
June 12, 2013, 11:23 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
You're kidding, right?!? The moment I saw him working was already too late if you want to be dead specific. He went through all the step sets around the building once. As I wrote earlier - I found out about his work by stepping into wet paint on the steps leading out of my apartment.
No, I am not kidding. And that's not how you described it in your initial post. Question: Did you move your car after speaking with him?
saluki commented:
June 12, 2013, 11:26 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Teemo Panda View Post
I would suggest to go to the dealer and get it done there, but make the landlord pay for it
I would rather hire a bum off the street to do detail work on my car than a dealer.
DavidM1975 commented:
June 12, 2013, 11:31 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny5280 View Post
No, I am not kidding. And that's not how you described it in your initial post. Question: Did you move your car after speaking with him?
Dude if you want to be the devil's advocate here, read between the lines and test me - I know this is simply ZERO fault on my side, you can say what you will. I did say a few posts earlier that I found out about him doing the job by stepping into wet paint. Go check. Therefore whether I moved my car or not is irrelevant.

Also - I can post pictures of what the apartment building looks like. The painted steps are far away from where the car was parked - it would simply never occur to me something like this may happen. I actually thought I was being too careful by raising my concerns to the painter - apparently not!! or maybe it was super windy that day - I don't know!!!
DavidM1975 commented:
June 12, 2013, 11:34 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny5280 View Post
No, I am not kidding. And that's not how you described it in your initial post. Question: Did you move your car after speaking with him?

I think you were either sent by my landlord or you are him hiding under a nickname! No more info for you!
sunny5280 commented:
June 12, 2013, 11:41 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
Dude if you want to be the devil's advocate here, read between the lines and test me - I know this is simply ZERO fault on my side, you can say what you will. I did say a few posts earlier that I found out about him doing the job by stepping into wet paint. Go check. Therefore whether I moved my car or not is irrelevant.
I'm not trying to blame you. Merely stating you became aware of the work the moment you saw him and you recognized the potential for issues as evidenced by inquiring about it. You can be pissed at me all you want but the landlord might make this argument. Because of this it's not as clear cut as it first appears.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
Also - I can post pictures of what the apartment building looks like. The painted steps are far away from where the car was parked - it would simply never occur to me something like this may happen. I actually thought I was being too careful by raising my concerns to the painter - apparently not!! or maybe it was super windy that day - I don't know!!!
But it did occur to you. That's why you spoke to the worker. If you didn't feel this would ever occur then why do you expect he would?
DavidM1975 commented:
June 12, 2013, 11:51 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny5280 View Post
If you didn't feel this would ever occur then why do you expect he would?
Because he IS - or at least is SUPPOSED TO BE - a pro at what he does. He should know things need to be covered before you start the job. He should know the paint might travel, he should have maybe used a paint roller or whatever those things are called instead, or something to block the paint from spraying all over the place.

In the same way I am a pro photographer. I can tell you with 100% certainity that if you take a photo right there it will look like **** because there's a huge difference of exposures between the light that is hitting your subject's face and the light that is falling on the background behind them and the camera you are using will definitely not be able to resolve this situation. I can tell you that with the lens you are using you are not going to be able to see the moon in the sky even though it looks so bright and big in real life - in your picture with friends all you will see will be a tiny dot looking more like a star. I can tell you all that and many more things before you press the shutter. That's - partially - why.

...and even if it did not occur to him - he or the landlord are still responsible for damaging the property. Sorry but a simple "I didn't know" will just not make any difference here.
DavidM1975 commented:
June 12, 2013, 11:56 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny5280 View Post
Merely stating you became aware of the work the moment you saw him and you recognized the potential for issues as evidenced by inquiring about it. You can be pissed at me all you want but the landlord might make this argument. Because of this it's not as clear cut as it first appears.
One more time: it was too late. I am not mad at you, we're discussing. I am mad and in slight despair about this whole situation. Actually, thanks for bringing this up - now I will know better what to say in case the landlord brings this up.
tturedraider commented:
June 13, 2013, 12:04 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
One more time: it was too late. I am not mad at you, we're discussing. I am mad and in slight despair about this whole situation. Actually, thanks for bringing this up - now I will know better what to say in case the landlord brings this up.
sunny5280 LIVES on Bimmerfest solely to make ridiculous arguments as to why whatever happened is your responsibility. Check his post history. Don't waste your keystrokes. He will never give an inch.
beden1 commented:
June 13, 2013, 12:38 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
Progress report: I decided to go with a local detailer. After thoroughly discussing the problem they seemed completely confident they were able to take care of it. As far as I can tell they did. I would say they got 95% of the paint off the car and the original paint looks almost like new. There are some swirl marks but honestly I believe one more coat of hand waxing will make them invisible, they are showing only in full sun and I was expecting worse knowing that they would be using a machine tool to polish. They did not use compound anywhere on the body panels, they had to use it on both front and rear bumper as these were the most affected areas. They also had to use razor blades on the windows as there was simply no other way to get the spray paint off.

With all that I am.... 95% happy. There are some grey specks visible at close distance (like 3 inches away from the car) in all crevices like between the rubber and the upper part of the doors, etc. Those are difficult to get into but still I was able to get some of the stuff out myself using bug & tar remover. Some specks are still visible on the chrome frame of the grille and on the grille bars - I'll have another go at those tomorrow or if I can't get it off the car will go back to the detailers with more specific instructions. Some is also left on the plastic parts of the mirrors on both sides. Honestly when I think about it now writing this post I think I am less than 95% happy.... maybe these are details at this point and a lot of people may say I am crazy but the simple truth is these are driving me nuts and the state of my - however you look at it - brand new car car was changed by somebody else's mindless action. Even more so that it was so easy to avoid IF the ****in' painter or the damn landlord had some brains!!! Normally I am not a person that agonizes about stuff like that but I don't feel like letting this one go.

The cost so far was $235. I sent it to the landlord and he said the painter will pay for it. I'll give it a few days, if there is no check I will make it clear to the landlord that I don't care to hear from the painter. This is his responsibility, he gave us no warning and he hired someone who obviously had no idea what the hell they were doing. Maaan is this FRUSTRATING!!!!

BTW my insurance is aware of the situation. I did not make a claim because I wasn't sure if there was a claim to make (because the total cost of taking care of the problem might be lower than my deductible, which is $500) but in case the landlord doesn't cooperate my insurance will have a base to go after his insurance (at least that's what I was told).
The thing is, that your cost to make your new car right may cost much more than the $235 you currently have out-of-pocket. I also don't like the sound of the job that the detailer did for you.

There should be no swirl marks and they should have eliminated all of the paint spots, everywhere on the car, including in the seams.

I would not take it back to that local detailer. Go with a top reputable detailer, because now, they are going to have work to do to correct what the detailer did to your paint.

http://www.karosserie.com/ in King of Prussia is an excellent body shop that specializes in working on high end cars. They did a super job on my daughter's S4.
beden1 commented:
June 13, 2013, 12:52 am

David, before taking the car anywhere, try using a hand sanitizer on the paint spots to see if it safely takes it off. I have one from CVS that is like a gel that I tried on a hardened sap and it took it right off of one of my cars last year. Since then, I've used it on hardened tar, bird stains, hardened crap on wheels etc. and it has taken everything off. It has alcohol in it and has worked much better than tar remover, Goof Off, etc.

The gel type sanitizer does not dissipate that quick and lets you work it longer.
sunny5280 commented:
June 13, 2013, 11:25 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
One more time: it was too late. I am not mad at you, we're discussing. I am mad and in slight despair about this whole situation. Actually, thanks for bringing this up - now I will know better what to say in case the landlord brings this up.
You're welcome. That was the entire point of my response.
sunny5280 commented:
June 13, 2013, 11:28 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by tturedraider View Post
sunny5280 LIVES on Bimmerfest solely to make ridiculous arguments as to why whatever happened is your responsibility. Check his post history. Don't waste your keystrokes. He will never give an inch.
I provide helpful or alternative points of view. I do not provide useless group think...which typically means my responses are unpopular. Being unpopular doen't make them ridiculous. No where did I blame him for this. I presented an argument which the landlord may use against him. The OP was intelligent enough to recognize as much and now he is better prepared.
sunny5280 commented:
June 13, 2013, 11:33 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
Because he IS - or at least is SUPPOSED TO BE - a pro at what he does. He should know things need to be covered before you start the job. He should know the paint might travel, he should have maybe used a paint roller or whatever those things are called instead, or something to block the paint from spraying all over the place.
One doesn't need to be a professional painter to paint stairs. For example I am going to paint the railing on my patio today. I am far from a professional painter.
DavidM1975 commented:
June 13, 2013, 11:50 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny5280 View Post
One doesn't need to be a professional painter to paint stairs. For example I am going to paint the railing on my patio today. I am far from a professional painter.
One doesn't need to be a pro photographer to take a good picture... but I guess when you are taking on a large job like painting a few sets of steps around an apartment building YOU SHOULD know what you're doing - common sense, hello!??!?
sunny5280 commented:
June 13, 2013, 11:56 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
One doesn't need to be a pro photographer to take a good picture... but I guess when you are taking on a large job like painting a few sets of steps around an apartment building YOU SHOULD know what you're doing - common sense, hello!??!?
I know what I am doing despite the fact I'm not a professional painter...painting a railing on my patio doesn't require much skill. I imagine the same goes for painting a few sets of steps at an apartment building.
DavidM1975 commented:
June 13, 2013, 11:58 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny5280 View Post
I know what I am doing despite the fact I'm not a professional painter...painting a railing on my patio doesn't require much skill. I imagine the same goes for painting a few sets of steps at an apartment building.
...and?! where are you going with this? trying to get me ready for another possible reply by the landlord that he didn't have to hire a pro in this situation? Uuum... yes, he did.
sunny5280 commented:
June 13, 2013, 12:14 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
...and?! where are you going with this? trying to get me ready for another possible reply by the landlord that he didn't have to hire a pro in this situation? Uuum... yes, he did.
In a way. It was more along the lines of why do you think the guy who did the work was a professional?

But now that you've stated he should be I have to ask why you feel this way. I suspect the landlord either had his general handyman do the painting or he found someone who would do it cheap (from what you've written it doesn't appear as if your landlord is willing to put out good money for maintenance).

IMO painting stairs, as with my patio railing, doesn't seem like a job that requires paying a premium for a professional. Maybe there's something unique about these stairs which would justify the additonal cost. But of all the apartments I've lived in the general handyman did that kind of work.

And, I'd like to be clear...my arguments are in no way intended to imply the landlord may not be liable for the paint on your car.
beden1 commented:
June 13, 2013, 12:23 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny5280 View Post
In a way. It was more along the lines of why do you think the guy who did the work was a professional?

But now that you've stated he should be I have to ask why you feel this way. I suspect the landlord either had his general handyman do the painting or he found someone who would do it cheap (from what you've written it doesn't appear as if your landlord is willing to put out good money for maintenance).

IMO painting stairs, as with my patio railing, doesn't seem like a job that requires paying a premium for a professional. Maybe there's something unique about these stairs which would justify the additonal cost. But of all the apartments I've lived in the general handyman did that kind of work.

And, I'd like to be clear...my arguments are in no way intended to imply the landlord may not be liable for the paint on your car.
Boring!
sunny5280 commented:
June 13, 2013, 12:24 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by beden1 View Post
Boring!
Then don't read.
tturedraider commented:
June 13, 2013, 12:25 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
...and?! where are you going with this? trying to get me ready for another possible reply by the landlord that he didn't have to hire a pro in this situation? Uuum... yes, he did.
....wasted keystrokes. But, of course, it is your choice. I'm out.
furby076 commented:
June 13, 2013, 1:06 pm

Overspray happened to me once and the body shop took care of it> I spent my entire saturday watching them do this and it's intensive (wash, buffer, machine, wax, etc). It wasn't as good as before.

Things to test: move your hand over the paint...does it feel smooth? Do you feel bumps? Those bumps are the old paint.
Avoid submitting multiple bills...if you sent me multiple bills I would have issue thinking you are trying to scam me. Send one bill. Even show where you attempted to help by doing your own work (to save cost). Lost wages should be included.
DavidM1975 commented:
June 13, 2013, 1:15 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by beden1 View Post
Boring!
At this point I have to agree. Sunny you are adding zero substance here, sorry.
DavidM1975 commented:
June 13, 2013, 1:17 pm

Beden your tip worked, thanks! My grille before and after using some hand sanitizer:



sunny5280 commented:
June 13, 2013, 1:43 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
At this point I have to agree. Sunny you are adding zero substance here, sorry.
To the contrary I am adding substance here. More than tturedraider or beden1 have added in their past few posts. You may not like what I have to say but that doesn't mean it lacks substance. Taking the group stance, while popular, may not be the most helpful information.

If you were to start a crusade against me about paying for this damage these are questions I'd want to know the answers for. Whether you like them or not you better have some good answers for them.

But hey...go with the group hug and sing kum ba yah if that's what you feel is best. It won't address your problem but if it makes you feel better so be it. No skin off my nose.
DavidM1975 commented:
June 13, 2013, 1:50 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny5280 View Post
To the contrary I am adding substance here. More than tturedraider or beden1 have added in their past few posts. You may not like what I have to say but that doesn't mean it lacks substance. Taking the group stance, while popular, may not be the most helpful information.

If you were to start a crusade against me about paying for this damage these are questions I'd want to know the answers for. Whether you like them or not you better have some good answers for them.

But hey...go with the group hug and sing kum ba yah if that's what you feel is best. It won't address your problem but if it makes you feel better so be it. No skin off my nose.
This is becoming an argument on your part just for the sake of the argument. It has nothing to do with going with the group or not. I think you are just typing here because you're bored. Beden was right - you won't give an inch even if you stopped making valid points a while ago. What does it matter whether the painter was a pro or not? The fact is he was hired by the landlord and he/both of them are responsible for damaging my car. I don't really care who covers the bill. Unless you have something of value to add I have just responded to you for the last time.
furby076 commented:
June 13, 2013, 1:52 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny5280 View Post
You may not have been notified but you were aware the moment you saw him working. Furthermore you recognized the potential for a problem given you discussed it with him.
Irrelevant, really. What if the owner was out on travel and never knew about it? It is the workers responsibility to not damage the surroundings. If he can't do his job properly then he should escalate to the property management company. A quick "hey, i can't do this job without potentially damage that car, can you help" would have been sufficient. Property management company would call the owner, and say "please move your car".
sunny5280 commented:
June 13, 2013, 2:01 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
This is becoming an argument on your part just for the sake of the argument.
Just because you don't like what I have to say doesn't make it arguing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
It has nothing to do with going with the group or not.
Sure it doesn. I'm sure if my comments were to align with the group then you wouldn't be accusing me of arguing for the sake of arguing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
I think you are just typing here because you're bored.
Meetings can be dull.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
Beden was right - you won't give an inch even if you stopped making valid points a while ago
Wasn't Beden who made that statement. And no I will not give an inch just to appease the group mentality.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
What does it matter whether the painter was a pro or not?
You tell me...you're the one who brought it up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
The fact is he was hired by the landlord and he/both of them are responsible for damaging my car.
I'm mostly in agreement with this. However there is the possibility the landlord can argue you were aware of the work and decided to leave your car parked where it was despite the fact you expressed concern to the worker. Not saying it will be a successful argument but it is something he may make. And it may lead him to refuse to cover the cost of repair. Which means you would then need to pursue it through the courts. And maybe a judge might buy it. Who knows. But, as I said earlier, it certainly makes the situation less than a slam dunk.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
I don't really care who covers the bill. Unless you have something of value to add I have just responded to you for the last time.
All my posts to you have added something. As does this one.
tturedraider commented:
June 13, 2013, 2:03 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
This is becoming an argument on your part just for the sake of the argument. It has nothing to do with going with the group or not. I think you are just typing here because you're bored. tturedraider was right - you won't give an inch even if you stopped making valid points a while ago. What does it matter whether the painter was a pro or not? The fact is he was hired by the landlord and he/both of them are responsible for damaging my car. I don't really care who covers the bill. Unless you have something of value to add I have just responded to you for the last time.
fixed that for ya
DavidM1975 commented:
June 13, 2013, 2:09 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by tturedraider View Post
fixed that for ya
thanks, sorry!
sunny5280 commented:
June 13, 2013, 2:12 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by furby076 View Post
Irrelevant, really. What if the owner was out on travel and never knew about it?
The point is, as I said in my very first post, he became aware of it. Furthrmore he recognized the potential for damage. Despite this he left his car exposed. Would he have done anything different had he been made aware of it beforehand? Doubtful. Therefore whether he had prior knowledge really becomes a moot point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by furby076 View Post
It is the workers responsibility to not damage the surroundings.
I agree. But I imagine the landloard would try and argue he became aware of it, recognized there might be a problem, and despite this left the vehicle in place. Would that be a successful defense? I don't know...but if I were the OP I'd want to have the answers to these questions ready should they be asked.

Quote:
Originally Posted by furby076 View Post
If he can't do his job properly then he should escalate to the property management company. A quick "hey, i can't do this job without potentially damage that car, can you help" would have been sufficient.
Again I suspect the worker didn't feel there would be any damage. And his conclusion is reinforced by the OP reaching the same conclusion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by furby076 View Post
Property management company would call the owner, and say "please move your car".
And if the OP felt, as he did after speaking to the working, there was unlikely to be any benefit and left it where it was? Then what? Should the landlord have it towed? From what I gather from the OP the work wasn't being performed right next to his vehicle. I got the impression the car was a reasonable distance away from the work being performed. Enough so that two people, the worker and the OP, both reached the conclusion it was safe.
beden1 commented:
June 13, 2013, 4:45 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
Beden your tip worked, thanks! My grille before and after using some hand sanitizer:



It does look like it's working. I'm glad it helped. Maybe a bit more elbow grease and all will be gone. Try using Q-tips on seams, etc. You can let it sit on the area for a few minutes to let it soften up the paint spots. Then go over it with fresh sanitizer.

If there were any paint spots left on the painted surfaces, did it also work there?

I actually used it the first time because my daughter parked under some kind of pine tree that had sap from hell. There were large blobs that had hardened and nothing I used took it off. I had a bottle of the hand sanitizer in my garage to clean my hands of grease, and I decided why not give it a try. It worked like a charm and did not hurt the paint finish.
beden1 commented:
June 13, 2013, 5:04 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny5280 View Post
The point is, as I said in my very first post, he became aware of it. Furthrmore he recognized the potential for damage. Despite this he left his car exposed. Would he have done anything different had he been made aware of it beforehand? Doubtful. Therefore whether he had prior knowledge really becomes a moot point.


I agree. But I imagine the landloard would try and argue he became aware of it, recognized there might be a problem, and despite this left the vehicle in place. Would that be a successful defense? I don't know...but if I were the OP I'd want to have the answers to these questions ready should they be asked.


Again I suspect the worker didn't feel there would be any damage. And his conclusion is reinforced by the OP reaching the same conclusion.



And if the OP felt, as he did after speaking to the working, there was unlikely to be any benefit and left it where it was? Then what? Should the landlord have it towed? From what I gather from the OP the work wasn't being performed right next to his vehicle. I got the impression the car was a reasonable distance away from the work being performed. Enough so that two people, the worker and the OP, both reached the conclusion it was safe.
Where is that "Beating a Dead Horse" smiley thing-a-ma-bob from the message list? I thought it would be most appropriate here!
sunny5280 commented:
June 13, 2013, 6:33 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by beden1 View Post
Where is that "Beating a Dead Horse" smiley thing-a-ma-bob from the message list? I thought it would be most appropriate here!
If you think I'm beating a dead horse what is it you think you're doing by making this post?
beden1 commented:
June 13, 2013, 6:34 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny5280 View Post
If you think I'm beating a dead horse what is it you think you're doing by making this post?
Asking you to consider moving on since you already made your point crystal clear.
sunny5280 commented:
June 13, 2013, 7:00 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by beden1 View Post
Asking you to consider moving on since you already made your point crystal clear.
You do realize the post you quoted was directed towards someone else, was made three hours prior, and no further discussion was made until you decided to make a completely useless comment.

It's ironic you're whining that I'm beating a dead horse and by doing so you're engaging in the very behavior you're criticizing. Further irony is that my comments, while they may not be received positively by some, are at least on topic. Your bitching about them is not and adds nothing.
Technic commented:
June 13, 2013, 8:02 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidM1975 View Post
Beden your tip worked, thanks! My grille before and after using some hand sanitizer:



You need to use BMW Betalink glue cleaner... paint-safe, quick and no need to scrub the specks -scrub = swirls.
PK2348 commented:
June 13, 2013, 9:38 pm

I believe the legal term for what Sunny5280 was suggesting is "contributory negligence". It's a possibility, but somewhat remote in this case.
The painter is a professional, due to the fact that he is painting for a payment, thus it's a profession.
Instead of filing a claim with your insurance company i would file it with the building's insurer or if a painting company was used, they should have general liability policy. You then do not have an issue of a deductible. Construction companies damage cars quite often, i see a lot of claims of this sort being paid by their general liability insurance.
voip-ninja commented:
June 13, 2013, 9:43 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by PK2348 View Post
I believe the legal term for what Sunny5280 was suggesting is "contributory negligence". It's a possibility, but somewhat remote in this case.
The painter is a professional, due to the fact that he is painting for a payment, thus it's a profession.
Instead of filing a claim with your insurance company i would file it with the building's insurer or if a painting company was used, they should have general liability policy. You then do not have an issue of a deductible. Construction companies damage cars quite often, i see a lot of claims of this sort being paid by their general liability insurance.
Everything you are saying is correct, but assumes that the "professional" has liability insurance. There are many contractors out there who operate without liability insurance, taking their chances.
PK2348 commented:
June 13, 2013, 9:51 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by voip-ninja View Post
Everything you are saying is correct, but assumes that the "professional" has liability insurance. There are many contractors out there who operate without liability insurance, taking their chances.
If building owner hires uninsured contractor or fails to validate the insurance, then it's building's insurance company that is on the hook. Real estate is usually insured.
voip-ninja commented:
June 13, 2013, 11:53 pm

True enough, just pointing it out.
DavidM1975 commented:
June 14, 2013, 11:22 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by beden1 View Post
Asking you to consider moving on since you already made your point crystal clear.
I think the only way to deal with cases like Sunny is add to the ignore list. He has moved way past reasonable argument and has clearly demonstrated he will never stop trying to get the last word - even if it makes zero sense. He chooses to ignore all our remarks that kill his points and blindly push forward like a mole. Tough case.
Mo@BMWRockville commented:
June 14, 2013, 1:19 pm

Attachment 381725

That is all.


Sent from BimmerApp mobile app
Elk commented:
June 14, 2013, 8:18 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by beden1 View Post
I had a bottle of the hand sanitizer in my garage to clean my hands of grease, and I decided why not give it a try. It worked like a charm and did not hurt the paint finish.
Nice tip. Thanks.
markab commented:
June 15, 2013, 10:55 pm

same thing happened to me, I found a auto body shop they charged me 150 to wet sand and buffed it out came out good, look as if it came off the show room floor
ndavani commented:
June 15, 2013, 11:17 pm

3M Hand Glaze and it will be like glass. Use a light buffer, or take it to your local detail shop. It will come out.
gokudo_90 commented:
June 17, 2013, 7:54 am

hey david sorry about your car, 2 months ago this happened to 3 of my houses cars, we brought a detailing company and did hard and soft polish and waxing, they were removed easily in our case hope your case is the same

1 Question, is your car imperial blue or tanzanite?
rippx commented:
June 17, 2013, 11:58 am

Quote:
Originally Posted by gokudo_90 View Post
hey david sorry about your car, 2 months ago this happened to 3 of my houses cars, we brought a detailing company and did hard and soft polish and waxing, they were removed easily in our case hope your case is the same

1 Question, is your car imperial blue or tanzanite?
I'm almost 100% certain that car is jet black.
DavidM1975 commented:
June 17, 2013, 2:14 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by rippx View Post
I'm almost 100% certain that car is jet black.
Correct.
Alpine300ZHP commented:
June 17, 2013, 3:50 pm

David, now that you got most of the spray off why not take it to Phil (when you have the time) and let him make it perfect. I was afraid you would not get an optimal outcome because it takes a real expert to make jet black flawless.


Sent from BimmerApp mobile app
furby076 commented:
June 17, 2013, 4:16 pm

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny5280 View Post
The point is, as I said in my very first post, he became aware of it. Furthrmore he recognized the potential for damage. Despite this he left his car exposed. Would he have done anything different had he been made aware of it beforehand? Doubtful. Therefore whether he had prior knowledge really becomes a moot point.
And as the OP told all of us, specifically to you, by the time he became aware of it, it was too late. So that argument is moot.


Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny5280 View Post
I agree. But I imagine the landloard would try and argue he became aware of it, recognized there might be a problem, and despite this left the vehicle in place. Would that be a successful defense? I don't know...but if I were the OP I'd want to have the answers to these questions ready should they be asked.
Not really. Where does it say that if someone is aware of a certain issue that alleviates the other person from liability? I park my car on the street. I am aware someone might side swipe my car. Does that make it so the person who side swipes my car is not responsible? No? Thanks for playing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny5280 View Post
Again I suspect the worker didn't feel there would be any damage. And his conclusion is reinforced by the OP reaching the same conclusion.
Great. He was wrong, he damaged the car, he has to pay. It wasn't malicious or intentional, but motivation is irrelevant.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny5280 View Post
And if the OP felt, as he did after speaking to the working, there was unlikely to be any benefit and left it where it was? Then what? Should the landlord have it towed? From what I gather from the OP the work wasn't being performed right next to his vehicle. I got the impression the car was a reasonable distance away from the work being performed. Enough so that two people, the worker and the OP, both reached the conclusion it was safe.
Without reading the contract the property management company has with the OP we can't determine if the car would be towed. I imagine the company has some clause "when we do work, we give ample notice, and you move your car or we tow it". That's should be standard to help with repairs/maintenance. Either way, irrelevant - the painter damaged the car. The painter is obligated to fix it.

Sorry, but you have yet to provide evidence that supports your argument that the painter/property management company is not responsible.