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Suspension Feeling Loss - Should we Petition

65K views 329 replies 64 participants last post by  RobertaZ 
#1 · (Edited)
Hi All,

So for those of you who owned an e90 and now own an f30, you know that the f30 has lost that love and feeling. The love I am talking about is the suspension. Even those who have DHP the complaint is the suspension is more loose than the e90 (which didn't have the concept of DHP).

I have an X-drive, and in the e90 the road handling was tight - never a complaint. In the f30, it feels loose (like an Altima) and almost dangerous.

What is BMW known for, amongst other cars in it's class (Audi, Lexus, Benz)? It's the suspension. Any car can go fast, any car can go quick, and any car luxurious. BMW is not known for being technologically innovative and tends to follow others. So if the suspension of the 3 series is the same as the other cars, why buy a BMW over those cars? Where is the competative edge? We could spend a lot of time discussing that, and the purpose of this thread is not to do so.

The question, especially since I have never done something like this before, should we start a petition to submit to BMW to make DHP standard, and bring the suspension back to what it was in the e90 (for all models)? For those concerned about the feeling when you ride over rough road, we have many festors who have fixed it by simply updating the shocks and tires (e.g., CaptainAudio). So this is not exactly a hard fix. Essentially, the pendulum swung the other way, and it's killing one of BMWs main competative advantages.

So, should we get a petition going? If we get 1000 signatures, or more, BMW might just listen and fix it (probably during LCI).

Best

PETITION

Petition

http://www.gopetition.com/petitions/bmw-suspension.html
 
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#2 ·
Hi All,

So for those of you who owned an e90 and now own an f30, you know that the f30 has lost that love and feeling. The love I am talking about is the suspension. Even those who have DHP the complaint is the suspension is more loose than the e90 (which didn't have the concept of DHP).

I have an X-drive, and in the e90 the road handling was tight - never a complaint. In the f30, it feels loose (like an Altima) and almost dangerous.

What is BMW known for, amongst other cars in it's class (Audi, Lexus, Benz)? It's the suspension. Any car can go fast, any car can go quick, and any car luxurious. BMW is not known for being technologically innovative and tends to follow others. So if the suspension of the 3 series is the same as the other cars, why buy a BMW over those cars? Where is the competative edge? We could spend a lot of time discussing that, and the purpose of this thread is not to do so.

The question, especially since I have never done something like this before, should we start a petition to submit to BMW to make DHP standard, and bring the suspension back to what it was in the e90 (for all models)? For those concerned about the feeling when you ride over rough road, we have many festors who have fixed it by simply updating the shocks and tires (e.g., CaptainAudio). So this is not exactly a hard fix. Essentially, the pendulum swung the other way, and it's killing one of BMWs main competative advantages.

So, should we get a petition going? If we get 1000 signatures, or more, BMW might just listen and fix it (probably during LCI).

Best
I am in - I currently have an E90 LCI 2011 335d and feel the same!

I test drove a F30 328d (I love diesel) and found it soft, disconnected, and swaying around turns. It doesn't have that solid turn into torque feel anymore. The steering is awful - muted and disconnected from the road.

I then test drove a X1 s28i and it was more awful - no feel no connection no nothing - felt like a 80's Caddy or your grandpa's Buick....
 
#3 ·
I have an X-drive, and in the e90 the road handling was tight - never a complaint. In the f30, it feels loose (like an Altima) and almost dangerous.
While the suspension does for sure feel softer than it should, especially on the xDrive models, its a long way from feeling "dangerous."

It's also a long way from feeling like an Altima (which I had the displeasure of driving as a rental just last week).

I agree that there are some concerns about the nuances of the F30, but it still remains an excellent car, and remains significantly better than most of its competition.

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#7 ·
Key words: those who owned an e90 and now own an f30. In BMW's eyes, we are ok with the softer suspension if we bought the car and they've made their money. Why would they bother going back to a stiffer suspension when we "approved" of the current suspension by purchasing the car? So they can hear us complain about it being too stiff? I get the main point of the OP but come on....


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#11 · (Edited)
Key words: those who owned an e90 and now own an f30. In BMW's eyes, we are ok with the softer suspension if we bought the car and they've made their money. Why would they bother going back to a stiffer suspension when we "approved" of the current suspension by purchasing the car? So they can hear us complain about it being too stiff? I get the main point of the OP but come on....

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A properly tuned suspension does not have to be overly stiff to handle well or to minimize body roll. A properly tuned suspension should be firm but not harsh, should not have excessive body lean when cornering and should be able to handle poor road surfaces without becoming unsettled.

It seems that BMW over compensated for the overly harsh E9x sports suspension (which as i discovered could be easily fixed) and went too far on the other direction with the F30. I suspect that the F30 body roll issue could also be easily fixed without giving up the good qualities of the suspension.

Good handling and decent ride quality do not have to be mutually exclusive.

IMO if you spent your hard earned money on a car and have issues you should make your voice heard.

CA

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#9 ·
Anyone who thought that an E9x with sport suspension and Bridgestone RFTs was soft is more likely to have previously owned a Conestoga Wagon than an E46.

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#13 ·
Exactly

A good suspension is firm, but not overly harsh, and has enough compliance to keep the contact patches on the road (they are called contact patches for a reason) and not upset the car when road imperfections were encountered. The E9x sport suspension would bottom out, damage tires and rims (Pothole Explosions) and bounce around on road imperfections. This had apparently been corrected on the F30 which is from all indications an excellent car. Now BMW needs to address the body roll issue which I suspect is not a big deal to correct. Koni FSD dampers will probably do it if and when they become available for the F30. it will be interesting to see of the 4 series has the same issue.

CA

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#16 ·
If you don't like the way the F30 feels instead of signing a petition why don't you..... Buy something else? I promise there's life outside BMW lol. If you absolutely positively HAVE to drive a BMW check out the 1/2 series. I think BMW did a great job with the F30, but if you don't like the way it feels there are plenty of options out there.
 
#18 ·
Exactly - life's short - go drive something that makes you happy....

I have driven my 328xi Sport-line daily driver almost 2K miles since purchase. The car would not be my choice to autocross, but it was my first choice as an excellent means of spirited transportation. I appreciate the lissome performance and very balanced compliant suspension. On the same road that destroyed no less than 3 tires and rims on my former e93 335i MT - my 328xi negotiates confidently, safely, and quickly. I often drive from DC to West Virginia and I can confront challenging conditions. Through fast tight sweepers and switch-backs the car just sticks.....really quite competent, if not confidence inspiring. In the real world, my 328xi is fast, compliant, comfy, economical, and fun - I am impressed.

BTW the only serious criticism of the car I have are the less than confidence inspiring standard lights but I readily remedied that situation with Phillips X-treme Power H7s for low/high beams and Osram H-7 all-season fogs.
 
#20 ·
I'm sure they'll jump on it...as they have with the RF tire issue which is a contributing factor to their low JD Powers satisfaction survey results (IQS Survey). :rolleyes: Munich doesn't care...they march to the tune of their own drummer...owner opinions be damned.
 
#22 ·
Hi All,

So for those of you who owned an e90 and now own an f30, you know that the f30 has lost that love and feeling. The love I am talking about is the suspension. Even those who have DHP the complaint is the suspension is more loose than the e90 (which didn't have the concept of DHP).

I have an X-drive, and in the e90 the road handling was tight - never a complaint. In the f30, it feels loose (like an Altima) and almost dangerous.

What is BMW known for, amongst other cars in it's class (Audi, Lexus, Benz)? It's the suspension. Any car can go fast, any car can go quick, and any car luxurious. BMW is not known for being technologically innovative and tends to follow others. So if the suspension of the 3 series is the same as the other cars, why buy a BMW over those cars? Where is the competative edge? We could spend a lot of time discussing that, and the purpose of this thread is not to do so.

The question, especially since I have never done something like this before, should we start a petition to submit to BMW to make DHP standard, and bring the suspension back to what it was in the e90 (for all models)? For those concerned about the feeling when you ride over rough road, we have many festors who have fixed it by simply updating the shocks and tires (e.g., CaptainAudio). So this is not exactly a hard fix. Essentially, the pendulum swung the other way, and it's killing one of BMWs main competative advantages.

So, should we get a petition going? If we get 1000 signatures, or more, BMW might just listen and fix it (probably during LCI).

Best
I think it's just an incorrect choice of words, but altima is nowhere near an f30 even in comfort mode - I say that as altima is my other car. I also have dhp and xdrive. The only difference and that too very minor would be my tires - I have regular summer performance tires, not runflats.

But, im in for the petition for suspension. Its already too good, if it can be better, im in! :thumbup:

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#23 · (Edited)
I agree that for many if not most buyers if body roll is the price to pay for the elimination of the pothole explosion, bent rim and shredded tire issue it is a valid trade off.

My point has always been that it is easily possible to have the best of both worlds and there does not need to be a trade off. I am confident that reducing body roll would not be difficult and that as long as the ride and handling aren't compromised and are possibly even improved nobody is going to complain.

I don't agree that BMW doesn't care. I have spoken to people from BMW North America and have attended events where they solicited owners opinions of their cars. They were very aware of the fact that many people had issues with the harsh E9x suspension.

As I stated earlier the F30 is from all indications an excellent car and in many ways better than the E90. That does not mean that there is no room for improvement or that owners should not express their concerns to BMW.

CA


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#27 · (Edited)
I once read a quote from Bill Gates that went something like "It is hard to convince a company that is making a lot of money that they are in a crisis"

Now I don't by any stretch believe that BMW is in crisis but the so called "Status" market can be very fickle as the rise and fall of brands like Lincoln, Cadillac and even Lexus has demonstrated.

I think BMW is very interested in upholding their image as the luxury brand with the best driving dynamics and their support of racing and of tracks like Lime Rock backs this view up.

BMW has traditionally built what I would characterize as GT cars rather than hard core sports cars. GT cars combine comfort and a certain amount of practicality and luxury with good driving dynamics. BMW has excelled at that for years.

I suspect that the LCI F30 will address the body roll issue. Since there is no advantage to body roll and it can be easily corrected I don't see why they would not.

CA




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#28 ·
I once read a quote from Bill Gates that went something like "It is hard to convince a company that is making a lot of money that they are in a crisis"

Now I don't by any stretch believe that BMW is in crisis but the so called "Status" market can be very fickle as the rise and fall of brands like Lincoln, Cadillac and even Lexus has demonstrated.

I think BMW is very interested in upholding their image as the luxury brand with the best driving dynamics and their support of racing and of tracks like Lime Rock backs this view up.

BMW has traditionally built what I would characterize as GT cars rather than hard core sports cars. GT cars combine comfort and a certain amount of practicality and luxury with good driving dynamics.

I suspect that the LCI F30 will address the body roll issue. Since there is no advantage to body roll and it can be easily corrected I don't see why they would not.

CA

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I wouldn't say there's been any "fall" of the Lexus brand. They aimed at their "niche" market and did quite well...continuing to chip away at the German brands. Cadillac? Even I'm surprised at their success with their high performance entries (if they'd only get rid of that ugly emblem/logo)...but I'm shocked that two of my BMW CCA driving instructor friends now own one (at least one M5 was sacrificed). Go figure.

Lincoln?
 
#39 ·
As the saying goes "the squeaky wheel gets the oil".
Each one of us, whatever our concern is, need to tell BMW customer service that we are not happy with one or more of the following:
1. Suspension--no feeling
2. Steering--too light, not very responsive
3. 35% of 3 series parts made from outside Germany
4. High price of base and options
5. Quality issues--drivetrain malfunction, iDrive reboot, ASS, etc.
6. More standard items--halogen lights, alarm, sunroof, etc.
7. Availability of more MT on the lot
 
#43 ·
. . .
Each one of us, whatever our concern is, need to tell BMW customer service that we are not happy with one or more of the following:
. . .
With a list this extensive, BMW will just wonder why you bought one of their cars.

(BTW, most of us are sophisticated enough to appreciate global manufacturing and are insufficiently xenophobic to demand all German parts.)
 
#40 · (Edited)
Hi All,

So for those of you who owned an e90 and now own an f30, you know that the f30 has lost that love and feeling. The love I am talking about is the suspension. Even those who have DHP the complaint is the suspension is more loose than the e90 (which didn't have the concept of DHP).

I have an X-drive, and in the e90 the road handling was tight - never a complaint. In the f30, it feels loose (like an Altima) and almost dangerous.

What is BMW known for, amongst other cars in it's class (Audi, Lexus, Benz)? It's the suspension. Any car can go fast, any car can go quick, and any car luxurious. BMW is not known for being technologically innovative and tends to follow others. So if the suspension of the 3 series is the same as the other cars, why buy a BMW over those cars? Where is the competative edge? We could spend a lot of time discussing that, and the purpose of this thread is not to do so.

The question, especially since I have never done something like this before, should we start a petition to submit to BMW to make DHP standard, and bring the suspension back to what it was in the e90 (for all models)? For those concerned about the feeling when you ride over rough road, we have many festors who have fixed it by simply updating the shocks and tires (e.g., CaptainAudio). So this is not exactly a hard fix. Essentially, the pendulum swung the other way, and it's killing one of BMWs main competative advantages.

So, should we get a petition going? If we get 1000 signatures, or more, BMW might just listen and fix it (probably during LCI).

Best
BMW has already addressed this. Regrettably, you chose the softest variant of the F30 suspension:

1. M-Performance Suspension
2. Sport Line Suspension
3. Adaptive M-Suspension
4. Comfort Supension
5. XDrive Suspension

The XDrive Suspension without DHP is the softest and loosest of the bunch. In order for BMW to offer the 3 Series to a very wide audience, people expecting to pay $30,000 to $60,000 for the same car, BMW had to allow for a very wide assortment of options and packages.

It is not a 'petition' that is needed. Rather an understanding that when you take a car designed to be a best-in-class luxury sport sedan at $50,000 and strip it down you're going to lose a lot. In the old days, the tight suspension and legendary handling were standard equipment; now you have to pay for it. Strip the GPS and the leather, no worries. Strip the Sport line, strip the DHP, don't opt for the M-Performance, it's on the buyer, not the manufacturer.

BJ
 
#100 ·
BMW has already addressed this. Regrettably, you chose the softest variant of the F30 suspension:
No they haven't BJ. They have actually softened up the suspension from the previous gen. To remind you, I came from a non-m-sport with x-drive. My suspension is much softer now then it was before.
Also, M-sport + X-drive (two most expensive packages) = softest suspension unless you get an additional.

Again - what is available today is worse off then what was available yesterday. They should fix this, and a way to fix it is to offer DHP as standard to all vehicles. Even then, DHP on is not the same as e9x
The XDrive Suspension without DHP is the softest and loosest of the bunch. In order for BMW to offer the 3 Series to a very wide audience, people expecting to pay $30,000 to $60,000 for the same car, BMW had to allow for a very wide assortment of options and packages.
Who is getting a BMW at $30,000? Even with incentives, and ED you cannot get this card for $30,000, let alone an m-sport

It is not a 'petition' that is needed. Rather an understanding that when you take a car designed to be a best-in-class luxury sport sedan at $50,000 and strip it down you're going to lose a lot. In the old days, the tight suspension and legendary handling were standard equipment; now you have to pay for it. Strip the GPS and the leather, no worries. Strip the Sport line, strip the DHP, don't opt for the M-Performance, it's on the buyer, not the manufacturer.

BJ
There it is, luxury sport-sedan...it used to be sport luxury vehicle. The ruined the steering/suspension to make it an option. They took a step backward and said "pay to get what you had". It seriously makes me consider, what should I do when the lease is up in 3 years.
 
#41 ·
Hi All,

So for those of you who owned an e90 and now own an f30, you know that the f30 has lost that love and feeling. The love I am talking about is the suspension. Even those who have DHP the complaint is the suspension is more loose than the e90 (which didn't have the concept of DHP).

I have an X-drive, and in the e90 the road handling was tight - never a complaint. In the f30, it feels loose (like an Altima) and almost dangerous.

What is BMW known for, amongst other cars in it's class (Audi, Lexus, Benz)? It's the suspension. Any car can go fast, any car can go quick, and any car luxurious. BMW is not known for being technologically innovative and tends to follow others. So if the suspension of the 3 series is the same as the other cars, why buy a BMW over those cars? Where is the competative edge? We could spend a lot of time discussing that, and the purpose of this thread is not to do so.

The question, especially since I have never done something like this before, should we start a petition to submit to BMW to make DHP standard, and bring the suspension back to what it was in the e90 (for all models)? For those concerned about the feeling when you ride over rough road, we have many festors who have fixed it by simply updating the shocks and tires (e.g., CaptainAudio). So this is not exactly a hard fix. Essentially, the pendulum swung the other way, and it's killing one of BMWs main competative advantages.

So, should we get a petition going? If we get 1000 signatures, or more, BMW might just listen and fix it (probably during LCI).

Best
I sent a request to EAS for Bilsteins. That should fix my problem. LOL
 
#47 ·
Pretty soon, if not already, it won't matter. Many BMW owners have never driven an E46/E39, much less an E36 or an E30. As time progresses, that will only get to be more so. As a result, the "points of reference" to those kings of ride/handling balance will become irrelevant. Heck, last year we sold our '01 530i for a Volvo XC60 and '02 M5 for a Chevy Volt. The steering feedback, ride and handling all took a nose dive with the new cars as compared to the old, BUT slowly I've forgotten a bit as time progresses and the delta bothers me less. My son did come home from college last week and I got to drive his E36 M3 around and was reminded...I was also reminded of how crude that car is compared even to the E39s (much less our new 2012 models).

The only thing that will alter BMW's path is sales figures, and for this item to become relevant, one of their competition (Audi/Lexus/Mercedes/Cadillac/Volvo/etc/) will have to suddenly get it (and everything else) "right" to begin to sway the enthusiast community (which, in turn, can slooooowly sway general public opinion). As of today, it doesn't appear anyone else as done that. Audi, with their Quattro obsession often feels FWD biased...Volvo is similar and less polished overall. Cadillac looks to have nailed the handling with the ATS, but appears to have fallen short everywhere else - a one trick pony. The latest IS350 is getting good reviews and they'll no doubt sell a ton, but the styling is polarizing and there is still an element of basic Toyota in those cars (always has been, and probably always will be). Mercedes SHOULD be the likely contender, but for whatever reason they don't seem to hit the mark in any one area. That leaves BMW. Faltering in this area? Sure. More right than wrong though? It appears so. Anyone else doing any better? Not that I can tell.
 
#48 · (Edited)
Hi All,

So for those of you who owned an e90 and now own an f30, you know that the f30 has lost that love and feeling. The love I am talking about is the suspension. Even those who have DHP the complaint is the suspension is more loose than the e90 (which didn't have the concept of DHP).

I have an X-drive, and in the e90 the road handling was tight - never a complaint. In the f30, it feels loose (like an Altima) and almost dangerous.

What is BMW known for, amongst other cars in it's class (Audi, Lexus, Benz)? It's the suspension. Any car can go fast, any car can go quick, and any car luxurious. BMW is not known for being technologically innovative and tends to follow others. So if the suspension of the 3 series is the same as the other cars, why buy a BMW over those cars? Where is the competative edge? We could spend a lot of time discussing that, and the purpose of this thread is not to do so.

The question, especially since I have never done something like this before, should we start a petition to submit to BMW to make DHP standard, and bring the suspension back to what it was in the e90 (for all models)? For those concerned about the feeling when you ride over rough road, we have many festors who have fixed it by simply updating the shocks and tires (e.g., CaptainAudio). So this is not exactly a hard fix. Essentially, the pendulum swung the other way, and it's killing one of BMWs main competative advantages.

So, should we get a petition going? If we get 1000 signatures, or more, BMW might just listen and fix it (probably during LCI).

Best
Good luck with that! Here's to hoping an F30 ZHP/335is package is in the works for the last 3-5 years of life for the F30.

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#54 ·
My experience with the E90 and the F30

I apologize about any grammatical errors in advance. It's been a long day I was about to go to bed but I came across this thread and just had to respond.

As the former owner owner of a 2009 E90 328xi and a current owner of a 2013 F30 328xi I can tell you the the E90 and the F30 feel completely different, mostly for the better.

My E90 was a wonderful refined machine. It felt planted and confident in the corners, the brakes solid, the steering the perfect weight and consistent. However the E90 had its faults. I live in north east Ohio so I get my share of crappy roads with all of their bumps, cracks, and massive potholes. The problem with the E90 is that when you come across bumpy roads, every bump is heard as a solid thud though the car. Every pothole is met with unforgiving harshness that caused three off my wheels to bend.

My F30 on the other hand has the same solid feel through the corners, all be it with a bit more body roll than my E90 did, but it feels great none the less. The F30 feels more nimble and it should, it's significantly lighter! The F30 is much much much more forgiving over rough roads than its predecessor and feels that the luxury car that it should be. It's a nice feeling to not worry if I broke a suspension component every time it hit a bump. I love the increased horsepower and torque of the new turbo four banger.

All in all as an owner of both cars I can say I much prefer the F30 over the E90. There's room for improvement on the new car, but in my opinion it's a far superior product to the E90. Lastly I'd like to say to everybody that's been complaining about the F3X not living up to the E9X benchmark, you didn't have to purchase a F3X if you didn't like it. Nobody made you purchase a car you didn't like. You could have just as easily purchased the E9X of your dreams and saved a ton of money doing it too. Both cars are awesome, choose the one you want and enjoy it. Just one mans opinion.
 
#55 ·
I apologize about any grammatical errors in advance. It's been a long day I was about to go to bed but I came across this thread and just had to respond.

As the former owner owner of a 2009 E90 328xi and a current owner of a 2013 F30 328xi I can tell you the the E90 and the F30 feel completely different, mostly for the better.

My E90 was a wonderful refined machine. It felt planted and confident in the corners, the brakes solid, the steering the perfect weight and consistent. However the E90 had its faults. I live in north east Ohio so I get my share of crappy roads with all of their bumps, cracks, and massive potholes. The problem with the E90 is that when you come across bumpy roads, every bump is heard as a solid thud though the car. Every pothole is met with unforgiving harshness that caused three off my wheels to bend.

My F30 on the other hand has the same solid feel through the corners, all be it with a bit more body roll than my E90 did, but it feels great none the less. The F30 feels more nimble and it should, it's significantly lighter! The F30 is much much much more forgiving over rough roads than its predecessor and feels that the luxury car that it should be. It's a nice feeling to not worry if I broke a suspension component every time it hit a bump. I love the increased horsepower and torque of the new turbo four banger.

All in all as an owner of both cars I can say I much prefer the F30 over the E90. There's room for improvement on the new car, but in my opinion it's a far superior product to the E90. Lastly I'd like to say to everybody that's been complaining about the F3X not living up to the E9X benchmark, you didn't have to purchase a F3X if you didn't like it. Nobody made you purchase a car you didn't like. You could have just as easily purchased the E9X of your dreams and saved a ton of money doing it too. Both cars are awesome, choose the one you want and enjoy it. Just one mans opinion.
Just out of curiosity...where are the "areas for improvement" in your opinion? Don't be shy.

:dunno:
 
#61 · (Edited)
I've had the privilege of driving this canyon since I was 16 years old--both motorcycles and cars. The F30 feels very good in these twisties, and the only significant nit is the runflats as compared to Michelin Sports. But even that isn't a deal breaker.

Haven't had the new 335i with DHP in there yet, but I'm sure it will be awesome as well.
 

Attachments

#62 ·
I have commented many times on similar threads. I had a 2007 E90 328i sport. When I got it, i felt it was almost undrivable with the run flats. I mean commuting in DC with the crappy roads for the first 3 weeks was just about unbearable. I got regular tires and the car became much better. Fast forward to my current F30. i think the problem (and here i can't comment on the X-drive F30s as I have never test drove one) is for those of you that didn't get the sportline or didn't get DHP. When I put mine in sport (which is 99% of the time) the car is awesome. Totally planted, crazy fast, zero body role that I can feel and I have full confidence in it to stay the line. it does even better when you drive at speed. What I am trying to say is maybe BMW with the different lines is trying to create different characteristics. The X-drive, even with the DHP might be too soft for some of you guys, especially if you compare it to the E90 X-drive. That I can't argue, never having owned a X-drive 3-series. Hell I can't even comment if the DHP system on the X-drive cars has different settings (maybe if one knows for sure they can comment).

But no way anyone can drive a Sportline F30 with DHP especially on "Sport" or "Sport +" settings and come up with comments like it has body role, its soft or worse it drives like an Altima.
 
#68 ·
...i think the problem (and here i can't comment on the X-drive F30s as I have never test drove one) is for those of you that didn't get the sportline or didn't get DHP.
...
But no way anyone can drive a Sportline F30 with DHP especially on "Sport" or "Sport +" settings and come up with comments like it has body role, its soft or worse it drives like an Altima.
I agree with what you're saying. Furthermore, I'm very happy with the car (an xDrive) because it has far better than adequate handling and performance while still being a very comfortable daily driver.

I think the issue with what you're saying, and what a lot of hardcore BMW owners are lamenting, is that the new car requires sport line and DHP to be what they want it to be. In other words, the new ad campaign could be "The F30 3-series - BMW optional."

Personally, I like the fact that the car is capable of being multiple things to multiple drivers depending on build specs.
 
#67 ·
I just made the move from an E60 545 sport package to an F10 xDrive with DHP. I will admit that the old car felt like a weapon while the new one in Sport mode, merely feels tight.

But - I believe that for every person who bemoans the "softening" of the F10 and F30, there is more than one person who was turned off by how harsh the rides of the E-series cars were. This is the simple math we are dealing with.
 
#69 ·
^ sounds right. And the reality is that for every person lamenting the softening of the current generation of BMWs, there is more than one person (in BMW's calculation) who would not have considered an E-chassis car because they were too harsh.
 
#75 ·
Good lord have we not beat this subject to death enough? I'll say a few things and I
ll try to keep it as short as possible but this subject irks the hell out of me.

First ive owned many BMW's before buying the F30. 2 E30's, 1 E34, 1 E46, 1 E90, 1 E60 and one F30. All of them great cars in their own regards. both E30's were AMAZING drivers cars, definantly 2 of the funnest cars ive ever owned. E34 was a boat but it had tons of torque and handled great. E46 was a 325xi sport, it handled well, looked good, was reliable, and comfortable. E90 was my first modern BMW. Got it CPO a couple years old off a lease. Nimble, taught steering, great engine noise, refined. E60 (still have this one) is the best, most reliable, sexiest :) BMW ive owned. A great road trip car, great dynamics, just the right options, sport suspension, great steering. All around perfect dual-use car. Then came the F30 (for my wife 320i sport).

Secondly, I concur with most everyones assumption/review of the F30... for about the first week of ownership. After that it just grows on you. You certainly cant judge this car just off a test drive or even a weekend loaner. Short and sweet of it? a properly equipped F30 (M suspension, Msteering wheel ect) makes it feel almost identical to the E46, im not joking. for those of you whom have owned a F30 and a E46 will know what im talking about. Honestly the F30 should have been the E46's replacement...

My First drive of a bottom bottom base no option 320i wasnt good. Low on power, sloppy in the turns, wind noise over 90mph and that God awful strange noise at over 130mph. I got home after a 3 hour trip and told my wife "i'm glad its yours is all im gonna say". Mind you this was a loaner while waiting for our order to be delivered. When we picked up my wifes car a month later we couldnt have been happier. 2013 black on black 320i sport. every option excpet sunroof and comfort access (not worth 3100 in my opinion). After owning it for a few months now I really really like it. The power is more than sufficent. The optional M suspension on the 320i is A MUST!! it handles amazingly, albeit a bit disconnected. What i mean by that is you may not feel the excitement or fun you did in older BMW's in the twisties but when you look down at your speedo through sharp turns you are pleasantly surprised. I've said this before but I'm sure a 320i with sport pkg would smoke my E60 530i on a track easily. Of course not a drag stip, but a track, definantly.

I've always felt those who hate the F30's so much either dont own one or any other modern bmw for that matter. Fact of the matter is F30s, from the 320i to the 335i, are selling at record paces. BMW has never sold so many cars in as short a period of time as they have since launching the F30/F10. They literally cant build them as fast as they're selling. That being said... a BS petition signed by non-confirmed F30 owners or anyone for that matter wont do anything. BMW wouldnt even bat an eye at it... it wouldnt even make it past a dealership General Manager. BMW north america is one of BMW's largest markets, over half i believe. HOWEVER, it is not their only market. BMW will not change they way they build cars becasue a few 30-40 somethings on some internet forum are bitching about steering feel. many people think BMW made an exception for north america by allowing M5's be sold with manual trannys. In europe its DSG only. yes BMW made a bit of an exception but that was for 2 reasons. more sales in thier biggest market and the fact that the US has very low speed limits. the only reason manuals are not offered in germany (for M5's) is becasue of heat at extremely high speeds for a long period of time. In the states this wouldnt be a problem, but for "Hans" on the autobahn, clutches and manual tranny run quite hot. anyway if your curious about that just google it. my whole point was for those of you (mostly jealous E90 owners) stop bashing the F30 dynamics... PLEASE.
 
#78 ·
I've always felt those who hate the F30's so much either dont own one or any other modern bmw for that matter. Fact of the matter is F30s, from the 320i to the 335i, are selling at record paces. BMW has never sold so many cars in as short a period of time as they have since launching the F30/F10. They literally cant build them as fast as they're selling. That being said... a BS petition signed by non-confirmed F30 owners or anyone for that matter wont do anything. BMW wouldnt even bat an eye at it... it wouldnt even make it past a dealership General Manager. BMW north america is one of BMW's largest markets, over half i believe. HOWEVER, it is not their only market. BMW will not change they way they build cars becasue a few 30-40 somethings on some internet forum are bitching about steering feel. many people think BMW made an exception for north america by allowing M5's be sold with manual trannys. In europe its DSG only. yes BMW made a bit of an exception but that was for 2 reasons. more sales in thier biggest market and the fact that the US has very low speed limits. the only reason manuals are not offered in germany (for M5's) is becasue of heat at extremely high speeds for a long period of time. In the states this wouldnt be a problem, but for "Hans" on the autobahn, clutches and manual tranny run quite hot. anyway if your curious about that just google it. my whole point was for those of you (mostly jealous E90 owners) stop bashing the F30 dynamics... PLEASE.
It's my understanding, due to customer feedback, BMW did change the steering feel of the E46 model. Perhaps they would be willing to do so for the F30.
 
#81 ·
good point. but the E46 steering was changed to be lighter (soccer moms and teeny boppers were complaining). it was however still much stiffer than todays standard. my point was you get use to the F30 steering quickly, at least i did anyway. stiffening it up would not change how the car feels or handles... it would just be stiffer. i doubt they would change the complete design of the electric steering. maybe a "code" or some way-somehow providing less assistance would be in order. but switching back to hydralic i think is out of the question.
 
#87 ·
How many times are we gonna beat the same subject in to the ground. Has anything new been said? The same people that like the F30 still do and the same people that dislike to hate the F30 still do.

Furby, I assume you got to test drive an xDrive F30 before you bought yours and did your ED, correct? Also, you are a frequent contributing member of this forum so I can't imagine the way the xDrive handles caught you off guard. As there are numerous threads that talk about it being the softest suspension of all of the F30's no matter the line.

Can't wait for the 20th thread that talks about the same thing again and again and again...
 
#89 ·
How many times are we gonna beat the same subject in to the ground. Has anything new been said? The same people that like the F30 still do and the same people that dislike to hate the F30 still do.

Furby, I assume you got to test drive an xDrive F30 before you bought yours and did your ED, correct? Also, you are a frequent contributing member of this forum so I can't imagine the way the xDrive handles caught you off guard. As there are numerous threads that talk about it being the softest suspension of all of the F30's no matter the line.

Can't wait for the 20th thread that talks about the same thing again and again and again...
Let's talk about the Bangle Butt :rofl:
 
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