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The BMW 5-Series (E39 chassis) was introduced in the United States as a 1997 model year car and lasted until the 2004 when the E60 chassis was released. The United States saw several variations including the 525i, 528i, 530i and 540i. -- View the E39 Wiki

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Old 01-20-2014, 04:10 AM
Helgason Helgason is offline
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Question Frustrating rear ABS problem [fixed, new module]

Hey guys.
I was working on my car the other day, had to take off the manifold and replace the valley pan. BMW E39 535 M62 10-96

When I reassemble the car I notice the ABS and ASC lights are on.
I check the ABS/ASC errors with INPA and get error codes on both rear ABS wheel sensors.

4 wheel sensor rear left
5 wheel sensor rear right
30 wheel sensor rear right

I had the computer plugged in and drove the car around while checking the sensor status.
Both the front sensors are working just fine, but no readings are coming from neither rear sensor, just 0 and 0.

I bought new sensors and installed them last week, but no luck.

I located the ABS/ASC module under the glovebox and resistance measured the ABS sensors from the plug, and I seem to get a constant reading, 3 Megaohm on the front sensors, and 3 Kiloohm on the rear sensors.

From what I've read the ABS module is often the problem, but should not be in my case since the 1996 model, it's installed under the glovebox, not in the engine compartment.

I also measured the wire coming from the ABS module to the engine and the reading was good.

Have you got any ideas what to try next? The only thing I can think of is replacing the ABS/ASC module, but it's pretty hard to find since they only came with the M62 V8 cars.


Last edited by Helgason; 02-18-2014 at 10:08 AM. Reason: fixed
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Old 01-20-2014, 05:58 AM
rdl rdl is offline
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Since the faults appeared immediately after your engine work, the first step would be a search for wiring & connectors that may have been disturbed. It seems too large a coincidence that the ABS module or the wheel sensors would chose that exact time to fail, unless they were was damaged during the engine work.

I'm not not familiar with the layout in your engine bay and wiring harness routing. Perhaps others will chime in with specific suggestions.
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Old 01-20-2014, 06:12 AM
Helgason Helgason is offline
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Thanks for the fast reply.

Yes, it's quite a coincidence, but I had a chat with one of the most experienced BMW mechanic around, who has specialised in BMW for about two decades, that he could think of anything that could link those two together.

It's worth mentioning though, when I first assembled the manifold, I mixed up some of the sensor plugs so the car was a bit odd for a while, but I figured that out a few days later.
The sensors that got mixed up were the throttle valve switches, on the throttle house assy and the air mass meter.

The plug is no. 12 on this image, and the ABS/ASC module no. 15.
Could this have damaged the module?



It got mixed up with no. 2 on this image:



Images from:

http://realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?...37&hg=13&fg=15
http://realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?...82&hg=13&fg=15
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Old 01-20-2014, 06:37 AM
rdl rdl is offline
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The inadvertent plug swap doesn't seem an obvious cause of the ABS faults.

The best advice I can offer is that you search the Best Links thread in this forum for ABS/ASC/DSC faults. You will find links to several threads addressing common problems and diagnostic procedures.
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Old 01-20-2014, 08:16 AM
Helgason Helgason is offline
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Yeah, thanks again.
I've been going trough some threads but haven't found any solution yet.

I'm hoping to hear from someone who knows exactly how the systems are wired.
When I switch on the car, the left rear ABS sensor error comes on right away.

When I start driving, the second rear sensor error appears, along with the third error.

I'm starting to think I must have cut some wire when I was reassembling the intake manifold, but I just don't know which wire could **** up only the rear ABS sensors.
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Old 01-20-2014, 08:33 AM
pshovest pshovest is offline
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The ASC on my '98 E36 closes the secondary throttle on startup as part of a self-check sequence. Make sure cable 17 is connected properly and have someone switch ignition on while you check that cable momentarily closes the secondary throttle.
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Old 01-21-2014, 02:25 AM
Helgason Helgason is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pshovest View Post
The ASC on my '98 E36 closes the secondary throttle on startup as part of a self-check sequence. Make sure cable 17 is connected properly and have someone switch ignition on while you check that cable momentarily closes the secondary throttle.
I will check that, thanks for the advice. Is that switch something that might shut down the rear ABS sensors?
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Old 01-21-2014, 04:18 AM
pshovest pshovest is offline
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No, I don't think it will shut down the rear sensors. However, closing the secondary throttle on startup is known functionality of the ASC, and is easy to check. If secondary throttle is not closing, it suggests there is ASC module problem or perhaps a power supply problem. This wouldn't be the first case of wrong connector re-assembly blowing a fuse. Use the on-line WDS to find all of the fuses that supply power to the ASC module. The WDS will also help you troubleshoot wiring issues.

Is your check engine light on also or just ASC/ABS? Have you checked for error codes on the DME (engine) also? Secondary throttle errors may show up as a DME code.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Helgason View Post
I will check that, thanks for the advice. Is that switch something that might shut down the rear ABS sensors?
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Old 01-21-2014, 05:08 AM
Helgason Helgason is offline
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Yeah, I'll try my best trying to locate the fuses. If anyone's got suggestions, please fire away(open with Firefox, add bmw-planet to trusted sites in Configure Java):

http://www.bmw-planet.com/diagrams/r...9old/index.htm

edit: Can't seem to find many ASC fuses, any ideas?
How are fuses identified on the electrical diagrams?

Herer are the engine errors:

Last edited by Helgason; 01-21-2014 at 06:12 AM.
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Old 01-21-2014, 06:31 AM
pshovest pshovest is offline
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[QUOTE=Helgason;8090529]

................How are fuses identified on the electrical diagrams?.........

I can't get the on-line WDS to work at work....but fuses are identified Fx, Fxx, or Fxxx where x is 0-9.
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Old 01-21-2014, 07:21 AM
Helgason Helgason is offline
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[QUOTE=pshovest;8090622]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Helgason View Post

................How are fuses identified on the electrical diagrams?.........

I can't get the on-line WDS to work at work....but fuses are identified Fx, Fxx, or Fxxx where x is 0-9.
I couldn't get it to work either, until I installed Firefox, updated Java, went to Java settings, Security, added http://bmw-planet.com to the "Trusted sites" list, and restarted Firefox.

Here are some random ASC screen shots, if anybody can figure this out:
http://imgur.com/a/qIWhx

The module:
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Old 01-21-2014, 07:39 AM
pshovest pshovest is offline
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It works from home. Without admin rights, can't add much of anything at work.
Upper left corner....fuses F8 and F31. Colored text is a link. Click on F8, F31 or X0015 and it should take you to a location picture.

Last edited by pshovest; 01-21-2014 at 09:28 AM.
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Old 01-21-2014, 08:43 AM
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See also:
- How to diagnose the BMW amber ABS BRAKE DSC/ASC trifecta or bifecta (1) & what are all known options when your ABS control module is bad (1) & Quick99Si's explanation of why the 10-minute wheel speed sensor diode-action quick test doesn't always work, especially on brand new non-OEM wheel speed sensors (1) (2) & explanations by 540iman as to why the fancy diagnostic tools very often (extremely often, like almost all the time) fail to properly diagnose the trifecta or bifecta (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) & where to get the fancy schmancy diagnostic tools for free once you're aware of these limitations (1) & an ABS BRAKE DSC trifecta brake pressure sensor diagnostic DIY (1) & how to test and replace the steering angle sensor (1)
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Old 01-21-2014, 09:50 AM
Helgason Helgason is offline
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Thanks for the replies guys, will check the fuses, but I'm pretty sure I've already done that, doesn't hurt checking them again though.
They are both in the glovebox. Can you think of any other fuses that could affect the ABS module in such a way?



edit: checked the fuses, none of them look like they've blown, tried switching some of them with the same ampere.
Checked 8, 17, 30, 31. F17 is for the M51 engine so there's no fuse there.

Here's a wiring diagram for the fuses, and the relay connected to F30: http://imgur.com/a/jlZOT


Last edited by Helgason; 01-21-2014 at 10:14 AM.
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Old 01-21-2014, 06:29 PM
JimLev JimLev is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Helgason View Post

I couldn't get it to work either, until I installed Firefox, updated Java, went to Java settings, Security, added http://bmw-planet.com to the "Trusted sites" list, and restarted Firefox.
Thanks fot bit of Java info, I was wondering why mine crapped out. I had to add http://www.bmw-planet.com to get it working.

Last edited by JimLev; 01-21-2014 at 06:31 PM.
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Old 01-21-2014, 06:33 PM
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See also:
- One user's attempt to locate, describe, and photograph all fuses and relays in the BMW E39 with a picture of every fuse & relay (1)
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Last edited by bluebee; 03-01-2014 at 07:58 AM.
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Old 01-22-2014, 12:28 PM
Helgason Helgason is offline
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Thanks so much.
I'll be inspecting every fuse I can find and measure.

If that won't solve the problem I'm going to have to have a mechanic figure this out.

I've been driving around without a speedometer for about two months now

I'm also trying to find someone who has this same module lying around, just for testing, hope that I'll find someone soon.

Last edited by Helgason; 01-22-2014 at 12:41 PM.
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Old 01-22-2014, 03:53 PM
Helgason Helgason is offline
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By the way: Is there any way to measure the module, to see if it is the problem?
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Old 01-22-2014, 06:04 PM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Helgason View Post
By the way: Is there any way to measure the module, to see if it is the problem?
Here's how to test the module itself:
- How to physically test & repair the ABS control module (1)

And, here's a quick test for the sensors:
- How to diagnose the BMW amber ABS BRAKE DSC/ASC trifecta or bifecta (1)

Note that the older model E39 is covered in later posts of that same thread.

To see if the seventh aluminum wire has lifted off its gold bondpad, the only tools needed are:
1. DMM
2. Paperclip (with sandpapered ends)
3. Exacto knife
4. Wooden toothpick

Myriad details (with probably 100 pictures) are already in those threads, so, I'll not go into detail yet again here.
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Last edited by bluebee; 03-01-2014 at 03:44 AM.
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Old 01-22-2014, 06:10 PM
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bluebee bluebee is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Helgason View Post
I'm going to have to have a mechanic figure this out
Seems to me this is one repair that you don't need a mechanic for.

The reason I say that is that parts removal (whether it's the wheel speed senors or the ABS control module) are trivial (well, the speed sensors sometimes are stuck).

So, the effort is all in diagnostics.
Luckily for you, we've done all that.
In fact, out of the 350,000 visitors to the canonical ABS trifecta thread, I only know of a single person who failed to solve the problem, and that person only wanted to turn off the lights so that he could sell the car to an unsuspecting buyer.

Lastly, the cost in parts is anywhere from $100 for the speed sensor or for a rebuild, to as high as $450 for a brand new module. Given that mechanics, at least out here, are more than $150 an hour, it doesn't seem worth it since the parts are relatively cheap and the labor is non-existent to replace.

So, most mechanics would just replace the sensors and the module and charge you for the parts and time.

The only tools you need to solve this problem are basic hand tools, and a methodical process, all of which is explained in the canonical thread.

So, it would be a shame, if you punted and went to a mechanic.
Besides, we've already determined that NO DIAGNOSTIC TOOL tests the problem properly, because they're not hooked up properly.
The only diagnostic tool proven to work is a toothpick and paperclips!

So, the mechanic is more likely to get a faulty reading, causing him to replace stuff that isn't broken, than you are.

Good luck. But, please do read the threads listed prior. The first thing you'll learn is to give up on those fancy schmancy diagnostic tools.
They're great, but they can't help you here.

All you need is a DMM, a paperclip, a toothpick, and an exacto knife.
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Last edited by bluebee; 01-22-2014 at 06:13 PM.
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Old 01-23-2014, 11:54 AM
Helgason Helgason is offline
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Yeah, thanks for the pep talk.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pshovest View Post
The ASC on my '98 E36 closes the secondary throttle on startup as part of a self-check sequence. Make sure cable 17 is connected properly and have someone switch ignition on while you check that cable momentarily closes the secondary throttle.
I measured all the fuses that belong to the ASC and ABS and inspected all of the ones I can see, along with those in the engine compartment.
I had my friend switch on the car and the cable does momentarily close the secondary throttle.

Also measured the wires from the module, by connecting the wires at the sensors together, resistance measured, got 0.05 ohm, had my friend unplug the wires at the senors and got OL reading, so both the wires to the rear sensors are working properly.

I'm having a pretty hard time finding how I can test the module, could you guide me in the right direction on that thread?
By the way, most of the cars got the module in the engine compartment, as you probably know, but mine is under the glove box, Bosch 5.0.

Is the next step trying to measure the ABS with the car turned on and the sensors hooked up to a oscilloscope?

Why would you measure the brake pressure sensor, does it have anything to do with it?

Update: Now I only get REAR LEFT error. Cleared the ABS error memory, started the car, and soon as the ABS powers on I get the left speed sensor error, even before I drive.
I still get no readings from the rear sensors, and the front sensors work fine.

I'm starting to suspect the ABS module, because the wires to the sensors are fine, and I tried replacing the rear sensors, just in case.


Could different tire wear cause this problem?
Here is the pinout for my ABS ASC module, if anybody can tell show me a way to see if it's bad:
http://pastebin.com/rbQ29TEP (X1171)

Update 2: According to the module masters, the common problems list does imply that I could need a new module:
http://www.modulemaster.com/en/abs/bosch50.php

Common Problems
Loss of communication with module.
Loss of one or more wheel sensor inputs.
Intermittent functionality.
Water penetration.

Last edited by Helgason; 01-23-2014 at 02:29 PM.
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Old 01-24-2014, 04:16 AM
pshovest pshovest is offline
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Your first post says you got different resistance measurements on front and rear sensors. I believe these are Hall effect sensors so resistance measurement is different when you reverse the DMM leads, but front and rear sensors should read the same.
Use the WDS to find and check all of the brown ground connections on the ASC module. Follow the wiring out to the actual ground connection and check for corrosion.
Did you disturb any of the ground shoes on inner fender behind headlights during engine work?
Did you disconnect the battery when you did the valley pan?
Disconnect the battery overnight and reconnect the next morning.

Problem is too coincidental for me to believe you've got a bad module....but it's possible. Sometimes modules become temperature sensitive, due to bad components or solder joints. Put ASC module in 120F oven for 10 minutes to warm it up, reinstall and check. If it works, put it in freezer and try again.
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Old 01-24-2014, 05:31 AM
Helgason Helgason is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pshovest View Post
Your first post says you got different resistance measurements on front and rear sensors. I believe these are Hall effect sensors so resistance measurement is different when you reverse the DMM leads, but front and rear sensors should read the same.
Use the WDS to find and check all of the brown ground connections on the ASC module. Follow the wiring out to the actual ground connection and check for corrosion.
Did you disturb any of the ground shoes on inner fender behind headlights during engine work?
Did you disconnect the battery when you did the valley pan?
Disconnect the battery overnight and reconnect the next morning.

Problem is too coincidental for me to believe you've got a bad module....but it's possible. Sometimes modules become temperature sensitive, due to bad components or solder joints. Put ASC module in 120F oven for 10 minutes to warm it up, reinstall and check. If it works, put it in freezer and try again.
Thanks for the reply.

I will resistance measure the sensors again this weekend.
I dont believe I disturbed any of the grounding connections, but it's worth the shot checking them out. I didn't come anywhere near the headlights or the main grounding wires on either side.

In fact, I did not disconnect the battery when I did the work on the valley pan, maybe that was a mistake.

Do you believe bad grounding could affect the module in a way that both the rear sensors get no readings, but the front sensors work fine?
I did try replacing the ABS sensors by the way, so it's probably not the sensors.

According to the WDS these are the grounds, I'll try to find where they lead and measure them. I guess the "ground points" are the ones I'm interested in?

28 M Ground Ground point
29 M Ground Ground point

39 M Component ground ASC throttle position sensor DME
53 A Ground control Auxiliary throttle position motor (ADS) DME
55 M Ground Ground point




Last edited by Helgason; 01-24-2014 at 06:05 AM.
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Old 01-24-2014, 11:58 AM
pshovest pshovest is offline
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ASC module has 2 power supplies and 3 grounds. The designer didn't do this because it looked cool.....it was done because there was a need to do it. I have no idea if this will cause your symptoms, but I'm certain a missing power or ground is NOT what the designer intended so I'd check these items before I considered a new module.

Any chance you had new rear wheel bearings installed recently? The wrong bearings can prevent sensors from sending speed signals.

I agree it's not likely a bad sensor issue, because youve swapped them, but a good sensor that doesn't have power or a ground won't work.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Helgason View Post
.........Do you believe bad grounding could affect the module in a way that both the rear sensors get no readings, but the front sensors work fine?
I did try replacing the ABS sensors by the way, so it's probably not the sensors.

Last edited by pshovest; 01-24-2014 at 12:42 PM.
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Old 02-04-2014, 09:37 AM
Helgason Helgason is offline
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I'm going to check the grounds at the passenger seat in the next few days.
I bought a used ASC module, which is suppose to be the same model.

I was wondering if I need to do recoding, as if it were a new module? I have got the USB cable and all of the software.

Here is a video tutorial on the recoding on the Bosch 5.7, do you know if this applies to 5.0 as well?:
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