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E60 / E61 (2004 - 2010)
BMW 5-Series E60 Sedan was first seen in the Unites States in the fall of 2003 with a 2004 Model Year designation. The E61 wagon followed shortly there after. The E60/E61 5 series is now available as a 528i, 528xi, 535i, 535xi, 550i and a 535xi sports wagon! -- View the E60 Wiki

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  #1  
Old 02-22-2014, 07:41 PM
greengeco greengeco is offline
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Need help to diagnose a faulty water pump 2006 E60

Here is the symptom. Was driving and passing, then overheating yellow warning light, 10 sec later red warning light that says to pull over and shut down.....overheating.
I bought a diagnosis tool (bavarian technic). It seems to me to be an obvious water pump issue. The Bavarian technic tool says the waterpump entered low power mode, then shows the power was redueced to 50%, then it says the electrical cooling pump switch: off. It shows there are 13+ volts, but the pump draws 0 amps. My question is, does this sound like a bad waterpump or a different issue like fuse, relay, thermostat, or computer? Just dont want to change my waterpump ($400) and find out it wasnt bad to begin with. My vehicle is a 2006 525i. Radiator fluid is full.

2E81:
2E81 elctrical cooling pump:, speed deviation
Error will not cause a warning light
Error is not currently present
Test conditions have been completed
Short circuit or signal interruption

Freeze Frame Information
Event 1Odometer 175848kms 109266miles
cooling fluid temperature OBD 97.00 C
water pump voltage 13.40 V
water pump revolution 176.00 -
water pump revolution nominal/acutal difference 74.00 -

Event 2Odometer 175880kms 109286miles
cooling fluid temperature OBD 96.00 C
water pump voltage 14.40 V
water pump revolution 0.00 -
water pump revolution nominal/acutal difference 250.00 -

Event 3Odometer 176968kms 109962miles
cooling fluid temperature OBD 103.00 C
water pump voltage 14.20 V
water pump revolution 0.00 -
water pump revolution nominal/acutal difference 221.00 -
2E83:
2E83 elctrical cooling pump, low-power mode
Error will not cause a warning light
Error is not currently present
Test conditions have been completed
Signal or value below threshold

Freeze Frame Information
Event 1Odometer 176968kms 109962miles
cooling fluid temperature OBD 84.00 C
water pump voltage 0.00 V
water pump temperature electronics -50.00 C
water pump power reduced 50.00 %

Event 2Odometer 176976kms 109967miles
cooling fluid temperature OBD 81.00 C
water pump voltage 0.00 V
water pump temperature electronics -50.00 C
water pump power reduced 50.00 %

Event 3Odometer 176976kms 109967miles
cooling fluid temperature OBD 120.00 C
water pump voltage 0.00 V
water pump temperature electronics -50.00 C
water pump power reduced 50.00 %


2E82:
2E82 elctrical cooling pump: switch off
Error will not cause a warning light
Error is not currently present
Test conditions have been completed
Timeout

Freeze Frame Information
Event 1Odometer 176976kms 109967miles
cooling fluid temperature OBD 114.00 C
water pump voltage 13.70 V
water pump temperature electronics 52.00 C
water pump actual current consumption 0.00 A


2E85:
2E85 elctrical cooling pump, communication
Error will not cause a warning light
Error is not currently present
Test conditions have been completed

Freeze Frame Information
Event 1Odometer 176976kms 109967miles
Engine speed 768.00 rpm
cooling fluid temperature OBD 82.00 C
Voltage terminal 87 13.41 V

Event 2Odometer 176976kms 109967miles
Engine speed 800.00 rpm
cooling fluid temperature OBD 95.00 C
Voltage terminal 87 13.91 V

Event 3Odometer 176976kms 109967miles
Engine speed 0.00 rpm
cooling fluid temperature OBD 87.00 C
Voltage terminal 87 11.88 V

Last edited by greengeco; 02-22-2014 at 07:43 PM.
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  #2  
Old 02-22-2014, 11:40 PM
wcr3d wcr3d is offline
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If you search you'll find your water pump died the typical N52 death. Usually preceeded by a screaming fan. If you didn't know this is an electric water pump. Just an FYI, change the thermostat while you are in there.
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Old 02-23-2014, 01:19 AM
greengeco greengeco is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wcr3d View Post
If you search you'll find your water pump died the typical N52 death. Usually preceeded by a screaming fan. If you didn't know this is an electric water pump. Just an FYI, change the thermostat while you are in there.
Yea, screaming fan too! I suspected its the waterpump. Just wanted to make sure there wasnt a relay, fuse or something simple and cheap. It just seemed weird that the log showed a 50% cut in power to the waterpump. Thanks for the two cents. Ill definitely be changing the thermostat as well.
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Old 02-23-2014, 05:30 AM
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banglenot banglenot is offline
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Originally Posted by greengeco View Post
Yea, screaming fan too! I suspected its the waterpump. Just wanted to make sure there wasnt a relay, fuse or something simple and cheap. It just seemed weird that the log showed a 50% cut in power to the waterpump. Thanks for the two cents. Ill definitely be changing the thermostat as well.
Its the pump, and good news that you saw the warning codes. Most folks end up with a tow.

Assuming a DIY, be real careful of the harness-side electrical connector. A forum member shorted his during the pump replacement, had to flatbed it to the dealer to (eventually) replace a blown 50A fuse.

Overall, it's a very straightforward replacement. Took me about two hours, would be shorter if I had access to a lift. Look up the electronic bleeding process as a finish to your repair. Also, good time to flush the coolant.

By the way, does BT have a code list available?
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Last edited by banglenot; 02-23-2014 at 05:33 AM.
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Old 02-23-2014, 06:50 AM
DJtoad DJtoad is offline
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Originally Posted by banglenot View Post
Assuming a DIY, be real careful of the harness-side electrical connector. A forum member shorted his during the pump replacement, had to flatbed it to the dealer to (eventually) replace a blown 50A fuse.
Hey, I'm famous!
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  #6  
Old 02-23-2014, 01:02 PM
greengeco greengeco is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by banglenot View Post
Its the pump, and good news that you saw the warning codes. Most folks end up with a tow.

Assuming a DIY, be real careful of the harness-side electrical connector. A forum member shorted his during the pump replacement, had to flatbed it to the dealer to (eventually) replace a blown 50A fuse.

Overall, it's a very straightforward replacement. Took me about two hours, would be shorter if I had access to a lift. Look up the electronic bleeding process as a finish to your repair. Also, good time to flush the coolant.

By the way, does BT have a code list available?
Thanks for the reply. Yes this will be a diy. I have no idea what the "electric bleeding process," is but sounds like it is common enough for me to do a search and find out. +1 on the coolant change, and thermostat. Good looking out on the harness. Ill make sure not to be famous as well. Ill do some more research for a code list. Im still learning the bt software.
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Old 02-23-2014, 01:27 PM
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Well, I never would have thought it was possible, but hey....
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  #8  
Old 03-07-2014, 09:58 AM
greengeco greengeco is offline
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I just want to make sure, Is the electrical bleed process where you light up the dash lights with the key, put the heater on hot at lowest fan setting, then floor the throttle for 10 sec?
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Old 03-07-2014, 10:54 AM
DJtoad DJtoad is offline
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Yep....
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Old 03-07-2014, 11:03 AM
greengeco greengeco is offline
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Yep....
Thanks, just making sure
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  #11  
Old 03-04-2015, 04:29 PM
hf1 hf1 is offline
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Sorry to dig out this old thread but had the "engine overheating stop engine" message pop up on the highway, on a trip way out of state, today (2006 530xiT, 150k miles). Got towed to the nearest BMW dealer. Service advisor says electric coolant pump needs replacing. $700ish for the pump and 8-9hrs labor for a $2100 total (!). We're stranded out of state and I don't mind overpaying a bit (the pump is x2 market price) but claiming 9hrs labor for what seems like a 2hr job is bordering on the obscene. Any suggestions on what to say to the service guy tomorrow when the car is supposed to be ready? Any way to see their shop manual with labor time listed per job? Thanks much!
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Old 03-04-2015, 05:18 PM
Jtbgonesailing Jtbgonesailing is offline
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Ask him if he is going to kiss you. When he responds, tell him, well you F----- me, so now kiss me... Sorry. I got stranded in Nashville 4 years ago with the starter going out. Same treatment! When they have you over the barrel, they take full advantage of it and then some. I talked to BMWUSA to no avail.

Sorry....
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Old 03-04-2015, 06:23 PM
hf1 hf1 is offline
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I figured, not much could be done. Given the situation, I'd be surprised if they didn't show me a $10k bill tomorrow.
I welcome any other suggestions on how to make this less painful or to at least avoid any organ damage.
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Old 03-04-2015, 07:34 PM
hf1 hf1 is offline
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Btw, that's Braman in West Palm Beach, FL.
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Old 03-04-2015, 08:55 PM
Caesonia Caesonia is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hf1 View Post
Sorry to dig out this old thread but had the "engine overheating stop engine" message pop up on the highway, on a trip way out of state, today (2006 530xiT, 150k miles). Got towed to the nearest BMW dealer. Service advisor says electric coolant pump needs replacing. $700ish for the pump and 8-9hrs labor for a $2100 total (!). We're stranded out of state and I don't mind overpaying a bit (the pump is x2 market price) but claiming 9hrs labor for what seems like a 2hr job is bordering on the obscene. Any suggestions on what to say to the service guy tomorrow when the car is supposed to be ready? Any way to see their shop manual with labor time listed per job? Thanks much!
Call a few other bmw dealers and get their estimate or call somewhere else. Sorry for the bad luck.
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Old 03-05-2015, 04:16 AM
hf1 hf1 is offline
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Originally Posted by Caesonia View Post
Call a few other bmw dealers and get their estimate or call somewhere else. Sorry for the bad luck.
Too late now -- car has been with them since yesterday and Braman are the only BMW dealers in 50m radius anyway. Plus, the car is not in a driving condition (stranded there).

Any idea how I can get the page from a shop manual stating the labor hours for replacing the pump? If anyone has it and could scan it or take a pic from it, that would be really helpful when I face them later today. Thanks much in advance!
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Old 03-05-2015, 05:05 AM
l1tech l1tech is offline
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Book time for the water pump is 2.9 hours. Book time for the thermostat is 2 hours. If both are done at the same time then it should be 2.9 hours. Are you sure that is all they are doing is the water pump?
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Old 03-05-2015, 05:44 AM
hf1 hf1 is offline
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Originally Posted by l1tech View Post
Book time for the water pump is 2.9 hours. Book time for the thermostat is 2 hours. If both are done at the same time then it should be 2.9 hours. Are you sure that is all they are doing is the water pump?
Thanks much! Yes, the estimate was just for the pump replacement. When I commented that 8-9hrs labor for pump replacement seemed way too much ("Will you be dropping the engine? LOL!") he replied that the pump was way inside and a lot of dismantling must take place in order to reach it. So, yes, I'm almost certain the guy was full of it.

Any chance you can take a pic with your phone of the source where you got this labor hrs info, and attach it here or PM me? Thx again for everyone's help. This forum is great!

EDIT: I should be going there in a few hours, btw.

Last edited by hf1; 03-05-2015 at 05:55 AM.
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Old 03-05-2015, 06:17 AM
HPIA4v2 HPIA4v2 is offline
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I'd replaced both pump n thermostat at >100k miles.
labor is already covered

looking at the data your WP stop turning at 109962mile mark then temp rises to 103C.

Last edited by HPIA4v2; 03-05-2015 at 06:20 AM.
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Old 03-05-2015, 06:41 AM
l1tech l1tech is offline
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here you go
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Old 03-05-2015, 06:49 AM
pcy pcy is offline
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I see OP's car is a Xi Wagon.
On 4-wheel drive car (Xi), it's little more time consuming because of lack of space.
I don't know if the wagon has more components [than 4 wheel drive car] in the way where the electric water pump is.
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Old 03-05-2015, 07:31 AM
hf1 hf1 is offline
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Originally Posted by pcy View Post
I see OP's car is a Xi Wagon.
On 4-wheel drive car (Xi), it's little more time consuming because of lack of space.
I don't know if the wagon has more components [than 4 wheel drive car] in the way where the electric water pump is.
I don't see how being a wagon should matter. 530xi engine bay should be the same for sedan and wagon, no? The screen shot for the labor hrs (2.9) is for a 2006 530xi.
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Old 03-05-2015, 07:31 AM
hf1 hf1 is offline
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here you go
Thanks a million!
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Old 03-05-2015, 08:01 AM
HPIA4v2 HPIA4v2 is offline
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the xfer case and front diff may make getting access to WP/thermo a bit tighter on XI cars not because of wagon.

Last time I look even on my car, the active anti-roll systems blocks the direct path to WP, otherwise it's a piece of cake to replace WP/thermo.
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Old 03-05-2015, 08:22 AM
hf1 hf1 is offline
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Just spoke with the SA. Adamant on 7hrs for pump AND 2hrs for thermostat for a total of 9hrs. PLUS the overheating apparently damaged the "compensator" and the radiator (small leak) so they suggest that they replace those too. I have 1200 miles left to get home so not willing to risk it by saying no.

Too embarrassed and pissed off to tell you the total $ estimate. This car has been very good to us over all these miles but I'll be trading it in after we get home and I'm done with BMW. The new ones (3-series wagons) are 4cyl crap anyway. The loaner is a 2015 328i.

Last edited by hf1; 03-05-2015 at 08:24 AM.
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