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Wanted to upgrade to an F30 but not sure now...

29K views 592 replies 57 participants last post by  moviebumm 
#1 · (Edited)
Hi Everyone,

I own a E90 328i with sports/premium pkg and navigation. Last weekend, I got a 328i F30 loaner (sport line) while my car was at the local BMW dealership for a power supply recall. I spent a day driving the F30 loaner and here's my take on it:

- Exterior
1) I liked the new hood design in the front but at times it looked silly/weird from some angles. But overall it is not as bad as I had thought initially.
2) It looked much bigger and has more interior room, which we all know!
3) I didn't like the overall stance of the car when looking from the rear and the tires seemed a little thin/narrower as compared to my BMW E90. The stance didn't look as beefy and strong as my E90. I have a LCI and have LEDs all around and didn't like the fact that F30 didn't have them. To me, it seemed to have gone backwards in terms of the exterior styling/technology a bit.

- Interior
1) I liked the interior overall, however I felt that the material quality has gone down a bit. For example, when I pressed the silver trim on the dash, it made a creaking noise. I noticed this on the doors as well. When I pressed some of the plastics on the door, I noticed the same. The E90 trim doesn't make this noise and the build quality seemed more tight. Also, the design of the dash and the center arm knob/controller didn't flow that well in my opinion. It looked a little too busy with the design and less elegant.
2) The navigation didn't seem too much different compared to my 4 year old E90.
3) The seats seemed comfortable and cushy as compared to my E90.
4) The buttons to adjust the windows/mirrors on the driver side arm rest were at an awkward angle. It was a little annoying to access them at times.
5) The plastic moon roof cover that slides back felt a little flimsy and loose as compared to the E90.
6) Sitting inside, it didn't feel like a small/medium size 3 series, it felt much bigger and had a different feel.
7) The glove box seemed flimsy and looked a bit cheap as well.
8) The stock stereo on my E90 sounded better than the one on the F30.

- Driving experience
1) The F30 felt like a very different car and even my tech adviser agreed to that.
2) I thought the steering on the E90 was much more precise and felt better. The road feel in my E90 is amazing and I like the heaviness that I feel through the steering when going into corners. The F30 felt quite different in this respect. The steering was a little vague at times and I didn't feel confident going around corners. This would be a deal killer for me. I hope BMW can make the steering feel more natural like the E90 in future. The steering on the F30 is precise but the feel is vague so it doesn't give the driver the confidence to go around corners at high speeds. I also own a 2013 Honda Accord and I thought the steering on my Accord felt better than the F30 (better as in less vague), especially the on-center feel. This is just my observation.
3) The 4-banger on the F30 didn't feel as smooth as the Inline-6. However, the torque was amazing and it was very responsive. I also didn't like the way the 4-banger sounded. I thought the Inline-6 sounded much better and felt more smoother/refined overall. That means, I won't be getting a 328i in future and will probably go for the 335i or 340i or whatever! Overall, the F30 was way quicker than the E90 but I wished they had stuck to the Inline-6.
4) I had to press the brake pedal quite a bit to make the F30 come to a complete stop. This could be due to the air pressure on the tires as well but it is something I noticed.
5) The road noise was noticeable on the F30. My E90 has road noise as well but I thought the F30 was more noisy.

I want to upgrade my car soon but I'm going to hold off for now and wait for the LCI F30/BMW 4. I don't dislike the F30 but I feel its is a very different car! It seemed to have grown in size and the drive is a little numb. To me it seems that the 3 is targeted more towards the general audience now. Therefore, I hope that the BMW 4 or the LCI F30 will be more hardcore. Till then, I'm going to hold on to my E90! :thumbup:
 
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#2 ·
you are right on most points, my E90 was in 7th year with close to 100K joyful miles, so i chose to upgrade, my wife is not convinced with F30 yet, F30 is definitely not E90 in driving dynamics, the materials selection is better in high trim level in F30, base model F30 is similar to E90. I find car very comfortable better gas milage and still fun to to drive against competition, still best car in this segment. BMW has to be careful not to go bigger than this car and make it drive like Lexus, i like the room in the back for my kids, they love the extra room as they are growing up.
 
#7 ·
BMW has to be careful not to go bigger than this car
Exactly. A few days ago I was driving behind an old BMW 2002 (the car that apparently inspired the 3 series...it looked great too), and I was amazed at how tiny it was. Cars have been getting bigger and bigger, but the 3 series was never meant to be a big car. At this point it's right on the edge. I would actually prefer if they kept the E90 size, but I can appreciate the extra room as well. But going any bigger would be a mistake.
 
#6 ·
E90 looks old. F30 looks much better.

Steering is better in E90, but I think people are getting a little extreme. Honestly, the gap between the E90 and F30 isn't as big as people are saying. F30 just isn't as bad as people say. If you never drove an E90 before, you wouldn't even notice.

In terms of engine and brakes... Get the 335. Better engine. Better brakes. Problem solved.

Not sure about the wind noise problem. I really haven't noticed that, but of course, I usually have the HK cranked. Although, I do like to listen to the engine a lot when driving. It sounds great. Don't really notice the wind.
 
#12 · (Edited)
E90 looks old. F30 looks much better.
I disagree on this. I like the looks of the F30 and it does look nice. However, the F30 changes are not mind blowing. The E46 to E90 exterior design change was a big leap. It was quite noticeable and a big improvement. I can't entirely say that for the E90 to F30 design change. Although the change is noticeable but seems more subtle than revolutionary. The F30 front/rear doesn't have LEDs and in that respect, I felt that my E90 made the F30 look a bit outdated. Just look at the front LEDs on my E90 (attached pics).

I'm a big BMW fan and I don't mean to undermine the F30. I just wanted BMW to step up in every department and in my opinion they haven't. They seemed to have gone backwards in some areas (like no LED, interior feels a little cheap, I4 vs. I6 engine, softer brake feel etc. etc.). I just hope they can bring back that raw/organic BMW feel back to the newer generations! :thumbup:
 

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#9 ·
Like I said, the tires, the 225 square setup is a bit wussy, and not a fan of the standard pads. The MSport brings 255 rear summer tires and better performing pads, but dustier.

The 335 having "better" brakes is a bit of a misconception. The 335 is 120lbs heavier in the front than the 328 and so the front brakes are about 10% larger. But 328s with the same tires and pads as the 335, there really should be no difference in ability. I drove a 335 Sport on all seasons and the braking was inferior to my 328, again due to tires and pads. Now a 328 with 335 brake hardware, that's an interesting combo.
 
#14 ·
I4 vs i6 is what brought me into a new BMW. The midrange torque, fuel economy, and forced inductions response to tuning were more appealing then the loss of the sixes induction noise. I guess it's about priorities, and If it was my only car I would have chosen the 335. Before the 328 was not on my radar, but more for my wife. The 4 cylinder gave it performance that mirrors the E36 M3 but with high efficiency and more space. So it got my attention.
 
#17 · (Edited)
Turbo charging is what got you into a four cylinder 328i. BMW could have accomplished the same fuel savings and power boost with a smaller displacement turbo I6. They took the easy route and lopped two cylinders off the N55.
 
#19 ·
The problem with the e90 is that it was a "sport sedan" that didn't look like a sport sedan. As Top Gear said it's "3500lbs of car".

I never thought it was a good looking car. In my estimation it sold because of how it drove and the fact that the driving characteristics were enough for most people to overlook the fact that it was not a particularly interesting vehicle to behold.

Interior-wise the f30 might have some cost cutting measures but inside an e90 you never actually felt like you were in a luxury car. Again, I think BMW sold that car on drivetrain and handling.

The f30, compared to the A4, C class, IS, and ATS fits in as a proper luxury car. Perhaps it has lost some steering feel but it still out-handles its competitors (maybe ties the ATS) and it is now their equal in terms of luxury.

Of course, this is subjective. But in the world of entry level luxury sedans, if the e90's looks were a 6, the f30 is an 8. If the e90's interior was a 5, the f30 is a 9. And if the e90's handling/performance was a 10, the f30 is an 8. Cumulatively, that would give the f30 an edge...for me of course.

I really don't understand the complaints about the loss of steering feel. Sure, you may not like it, but look at how much more the vehicle offers. Do the improvements not outweigh a marginal loss in steering feel? And if feel is that much of a priority, so much so that it outweighs luxury, technological and practicality improvements, why have a 4 door sedan in the first place?
 
#20 · (Edited)
And if feel is that much of a priority, so much so that it outweighs luxury, technological and practicality improvements, why have a 4 door sedan in the first place?
Hmmm not sure if I completely agree with you. I love BMW but at the same time I am not over-emotional about the brand. Luxury wise, I think it is not much different as compared to the LCI E90, let me give you some examples: My E90 stock stereo sounds better than the F30, the interior quality felt better, I like the clean elegant navigation on the dash as compared to the screen sticking out, the leather quality in my E90 felt better as well, the dash trim felt more tighter, including the glove box. So in terms of luxury, I would think the E90 is better built and feels more solid. I didn't see anything special in the F30 that made it more "luxurious" than the LCI E90.

Exterior-wise, there are no LEDs in the front/rear lighting of the F30. I'm not sure how you can say that the F30 is better in that respect. Of course, some of the F30 exterior lines are more cleaner, especially the bumper but the lack of LEDs make the F30 a little outdated.
 
#24 ·
BMW is making 4 door versions of the M135i. Reviews of the M135i be enthusiast magazines are amazing. I'm waiting for that car, since I don't like the E90 styling.
 
#31 ·
Or, if you want a current 4-door replacement for an E90 but don't like the larger size or reduced steering feel of the F30, you could always consider an X1. That's the way I decided to go after a lot of hemming and hawing.
 
#32 · (Edited)
Thanks guys for the interesting responses! I personally don't think that BMW took the easy way out in designing the 4-cylinder. However, I think they did wanted to change the drive feel of the car. Maybe they wanted to experiment with their audience a bit? or maybe they hired a design chief with a different design philosophy, who knows!

It is also possible that BMW is trying to get the Lexus, Acura and Infiniti crowd by softening the BMW feel. However, in my opinion I'm not sure if their efforts are going to work. Most of the people buy Japanese luxury cars because they not only care about the performance but reliability and costs of maintenance as well. That means even if BMW drives like one of those cars, their owners might still not go for the BMW since it is more costly to maintain and in the long run can have reliability issues as well. So maybe some of the Japanese luxury car owners might be attracted to the newer BMW but overall it might not make much of difference since some of the BMW crowd might also move to other brands like Audi/VW or Benz.

On a side note, the ///M sport package Estoril Blue and Mineral White F30 looks awesome! I saw both these colors in person and I thought they were striking! Loved the black as well!
 
#33 ·
I drive car that's nearly identical to OP and I have to agree with OP on every point.

New car grew in size, to the point where it's bigger than 5 series from decade ago. Lack of LEDs is bothering me as well. Honda Accord did the same thing few year ago, they released one model year with rear-LED lighting and then switched back to incandescent.

You would think that going to F30 from E90 is a sure thing, but not anymore. Now I almost have to convince myself to get msport F30.

As for design, I like E90 more, no questions. It's a nice little package that still looks classy and sporty. F30 on the other hand is a mixed bag, you have same frame that is trying to appeal to different target audiences (luxury, sport, no-line), as a result it's not really good at any.

And yes, OP is correct that BMW is going after lexus and accura buyers and in process abandoning hardcore fans of the brand.

PS

Wait for 2 series or get 1 series is not a solution. Solution is - move to a competing brand and let BMW chase Lexus crowd.
 
#34 · (Edited)
I drive car that's nearly identical to OP and I have to agree with OP on every point.

New car grew in size, to the point where it's bigger than 5 series from decade ago. Lack of LEDs is bothering me as well. Honda Accord did the same thing few year ago, they released one model year with rear-LED lighting and then switched back to incandescent.

You would think that going to F30 from E90 is a sure thing, but not anymore. Now I almost have to convince myself to get msport F30.

As for design, I like E90 more, no questions. It's a nice little package that still looks classy and sporty. F30 on the other hand is a mixed bag, you have same frame that is trying to appeal to different target audiences (luxury, sport, no-line), as a result it's not really good at any.

And yes, OP is correct that BMW is going after lexus and accura buyers and in process abandoning hardcore fans of the brand.

PS

Wait for 2 series or get 1 series is not a solution. Solution is - move to a competing brand and let BMW chase Lexus crowd.
Agreed! I think the LCI E90 can hold up to the current F30 (to a certain extent). The Pre-LCI E90 looks a bit dated compared to the F30 but the LCI E90 package is definitely sophisticated and was a significant upgrade. The LEDs do make a big difference in the looks as well... I do plan to wait for the LCI F30 / BMW 4 models and then decide. I love BMW and I'm trying my best to stick to this brand.. Even though I like the 2013 Audi S4, for some reason I can't see myself owning it! :thumbup:
 
#36 ·
I always wanted a BMW and finally was able to make the leap at the end of January. I test drove an F30 sport. Then I test drove another. They both left me feeling like they had lots of gadgets but weren't as fun to drive as I expected. Then I drove an X1 first with the N20 them with the N55. Finally I drove two E90s one with the N52 and one with the N55. It was love at first site. LOVE the steering and handling. I also prefer the front of the car. I don't care for the F30 headlights blending into the kidney grilles. Just my personal preference. My next car I'll have to accept some of these things if I stick with BMW, but for now I couldn't be happier with the choice I made E90 with the N55.
 
#39 ·
Just to offer an outside perspective: the f30 is very slightly smaller than the e39 5-series in the U.S. from 97-03.

I drive a 2001 m5. It is a 4024 pound sedan about on size with an f30. When it was built, it was the fastest production sedan in the world (top speed, quarter mile, etc.). It uses recirculating ball steering and weighs 2-tons, yet saying this car isn't a "sports sedan" would get laughed at.

Yet here we are with people in this thread arguing whether a 300hp f30 is a "sports sedan". C'mon people.

It's a compromise car. It's not a track car, it's not a luxury cruiser. It's a blend of all things. And it's quite sporty in many trims and is a sedan.

...

I never strongly considered the e90. The exterior was decent to me but the interior was incredibly bland. Yes, some of the color variations spiced it up - but the design itself was so-so. But also, because as a sedan, it would not comfortably fit a rear-facing child seat. The back seat was cramped.

Now the f30 beautifully fits a child seat. It's interior is much nicer (to me) - not in materials per se, but in design. Yes the glovebox and surrounding area is cheap. There's a few other cost cuts that are obvious. But the overall design and feel is finally a place I want to be over and over again.

I have no idea if I'm going to pick up an f30 in Europe, buy one here, lease one, or buy a 2012 CPO. Just wanted to share my perspectives coming from the aforementioned 4,024 pound obese BMW sedan which happens to be very fast and perform amazing track duty.
 
#41 ·
Just to offer an outside perspective: the f30 is very slightly smaller than the e39 5-series in the U.S. from 97-03.

I drive a 2001 m5. It is a 4024 pound sedan about on size with an f30. When it was built, it was the fastest production sedan in the world (top speed, quarter mile, etc.). It uses recirculating ball steering and weighs 2-tons, yet saying this car isn't a "sports sedan" would get laughed at.

Yet here we are with people in this thread arguing whether a 300hp f30 is a "sports sedan". C'mon people.

It's a compromise car. It's not a track car, it's not a luxury cruiser. It's a blend of all things. And it's quite sporty in many trims and is a sedan.

...

I never strongly considered the e90. The exterior was decent to me but the interior was incredibly bland. Yes, some of the color variations spiced it up - but the design itself was so-so. But also, because as a sedan, it would not comfortably fit a rear-facing child seat. The back seat was cramped.

Now the f30 beautifully fits a child seat. It's interior is much nicer (to me) - not in materials per se, but in design. Yes the glovebox and surrounding area is cheap. There's a few other cost cuts that are obvious. But the overall design and feel is finally a place I want to be over and over again.

I have no idea if I'm going to pick up an f30 in Europe, buy one here, lease one, or buy a 2012 CPO. Just wanted to share my perspectives coming from the aforementioned 4,024 pound obese BMW sedan which happens to be very fast and perform amazing track duty.
How's the F30 back seat compare to the E39 M5? I've always loved those, and with a 2nd kid in the oven, the E46's small back seat is becoming an issue.
 
#40 · (Edited)
If they put LED's in the headlights and tail lights they would have nothing to change for the LCI other than bumpers. :)

IMO the F30 sedan is the best looking interior and exterior 3 series ever by BMW. The e92 is the best looking coupe 3, and when the 4 comes it will take that place. I will certainly own either an M4 (me) or 435i (trophy wife).

Having said that the 4 cylinder is not on option even for my wife. It does not sound good IMO, it "wimps out" in certain areas, and it does not encourage enthusiastic driving. For instance I like to go on drives with my friends on weekends, and a 328 just wouldn't do it for me.

I can certainly understand others reasons for getting one as it is a zippy little thing around town and gets good gas milage if that's something you care about.:)
 
#42 ·
If they put LED's in the headlights and tail lights they would have nothing to change for the LCI other than bumpers. :)
)
I never did get this. What's an LCI? :)

Also, what did you do to that picture of yours?
 
#49 ·
Nuff baby seat talk, not trying to be rude here, but it's a sports sedan we're talking about.

My wife learned pretty fast in early days of E90 ownership that cupholders in car are not to be used at any time. I would not want to put my baby on the back seat of E90 with sport package, the ride is extremely jarring even with DWS tires. Front sport seats mitigate the harsh suspension, but rear seats are the same as in stock car and are pretty much useless, unless you live in Florida.

With that said, all the comments about baby seats and softer suspension just further reinforce the notion that BMW is going after different audience these days.
 
#50 ·
Nuff baby seat talk, not trying to be rude here, but it's a sports sedan we're talking about.

My wife learned pretty fast in early days of E90 ownership that cupholders in car are not to be used at any time. I would not want to put my baby on the back seat of E90 with sport package, the ride is extremely jarring even with DWS tires. Front sport seats mitigate the harsh suspension, but rear seats are the same as in stock car and are pretty much useless, unless you live in Florida.

With that said, all the comments about baby seats and softer suspension just further reinforce the notion that BMW is going after different audience these days.
+1111:rofl: I'm sure there's a Pampers or Desitin forum where that nonsense belongs, but it's sure as hell not here.:)
 
#67 · (Edited)
What silliness.

These are sedans, 4 doors. The comfort and space of the rear seat is a concern. If it wasn't why not just by the e92/f32 coupe?

I do not use my car for kids, but I have my geriatric parents or in laws often in the back. I actively did not buy two door or cramped cars that I would have loved for that reason.

Some of you on this 3=Sports Sedan high horse are delusonal. The 3 series is a sedan first, it has sporty qualities and can be optioned more into a Sports Sedan, but it is a SEDAN first and for most and practicality is one of the primary concerns.
 
#68 ·
i think a lot of this back and forth has to do with the fact that the F30 was the only "new" and "hot" entry level BMW for the past couple years, so everyone who had an old E90 got one, instead of the LCI E92, to stay fresh. I also had an option of getting an F30 back in 2011 but opted for my LCI E92 instead. The problem is that you cant have both. If you wanted something sporty you should have gone with the E92. Pretty simple IMO.
 
#69 ·
Today is a great day for BJ. He has finally convinced the whole forum that the F30 is not a sport sedan. :rofl:

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I317 using Bimmer App
 
#72 · (Edited)
The E90 is not a Sports Sedan either, sorry. It's a Sporty Sedan, maybe lol. E90 M3, CTS-V, C63 AMG, Sports Sedans.

The E36/4 and E46/4, I think those are the last of the BMW 3 series as Sports Sedans.
 
#70 · (Edited)
This is not a fair comparison: the loaner you were given was a barebones, no line, vehicle. I will agree - with this set up, interior materials are not up to BMW standard. It most likely had the plastic aluminum trim, leatherette, 17 inch rims. None of which are particularly terrible on their own, but all together in unison will create a exterior/interior perception of a cheaper vehicle than your well equipped e90.

For a more accurate comparison, take a sport/luxury line with premium package, tech package, etc.

This had been my initial impression as well. As for issues with the 4 banger/handling, I can only recommend getting a 335 and dhp.
 
#107 · (Edited)
This is not a fair comparison: the loaner you were given was a barebones, no line, vehicle. I will agree - with this set up, interior materials are not up to BMW standard. It most likely had the plastic aluminum trim, leatherette, 17 inch rims. None of which are particularly terrible on their own, but all together in unison will create a exterior/interior perception of a cheaper vehicle than your well equipped e90.

For a more accurate comparison, take a sport/luxury line with premium package, tech package, etc.

This had been my initial impression as well. As for issues with the 4 banger/handling, I can only recommend getting a 335 and dhp.
Please read my post again, the loaner I was given was a sport line and had the sport seats etc... Also, FYI, prior to driving the loaner, I test drove the ///M sport 335i as well... This is something I didn't mention before, I also didn't like the ///M sport steering wheel, looked very alien and the silver plastic trim on it was creaking as well (this was a brand new ///M sport 335i with only 10 or so miles on it). The road noise was more noticeable in that car.... Like I said, I don't dislike the F30, its just that its a very different car in both good and bad ways...
 
#77 ·
Sounds good to me.

I would not mind if they took the BRZ, stretched it a bit, and put in a 2.0L boxer turbo with 300hp. Considering the weight is about 2700lbs now, they could still come in at about 3000. It's the best handling car for the money and a classic SPORTS CAR. Would that not make a great Sports Sedan?

I have not seen a BMW with an impressively low curb weight in multiple decades. Even my E36/7 is rather overweight for such a tiny car. You would not believe how much a 1M Coupe dwarfs an E36/8 Coupe.
 
#80 ·
I've sat in the back of E36, E46 and E90 (and F30) sedans.

The first three all have the same rear legroom. The F30 has a little more.
 
#81 ·
I always imagined BMW as a SPORTS car that ran off the race track and started to drive on the public roads. Over the years it changed more and more and these days it's a luxury car that is pretending to be a sports sedan. I am still in denial about it and it's hard for me to "get it". But I think with F30 I can finally accept it and move on.
 
#89 ·
Bingo.

When I was in an E46 I was single and in my 30's.

Now in my F30 I am married with 4 kids and in my 40's.

People change. Thankfully the 3 Series changes with us. Eventually we look in our mirrors at our receding hairlines, expanding waistlines, wrinkling eyes, and aching backs and say "Gee, I'm not a kid out scoping high school girls anymore" and then just as we are about to cry we think about our bank accounts and we start to smile.

BJ
 
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