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  #1  
Old 10-21-2019, 01:43 PM
Natural Stoner Natural Stoner is offline
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X5D delete finally happening, need stable, reliable tune.

Here's my 2012 X5D with 170k miles on it. I've been driving with my DPF warning going off after driving for 10 minutes for a few months now.

I have all of the parts (I think). I have the Buzzkin pipe kit with cat, new EGR kit, swirl flaps, and a new thermostat. (All from A-Rod.)

I thought I might be competent enough to do it myself, but out of interest of time (and saving myself frustration), I'm taking it to my guy who's in his 60's and been a mechanic since he was a teenager. He's a master of his craft and I'm confident in his abilities. He also has a lift, and I don't.

So, what I'm going to need to do while he does the work is take out the computer and send it in for tune.

I'm looking for a nice, stable, reliable, drive-able, high way tune, that I won't have issues with. I'd like to get better MPG out of it, but don't need any fancy fast tune. It doesn't have to be a totally stock tune either, but not looking for a fast race tune. (Mostly because it would be a lot more expensive and potentially not as reliable/stable.)

I know there's more than a few options out there, so I wanted to post here and get any tips and recommendations you guys have.

Also, if anyone has a link for any how-to to take the computer out, that would also be appreciated.

Thanks, guys.

By the way, my state doesn't do emissions testing BS.
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  #2  
Old 10-21-2019, 05:54 PM
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which tune are you going with?
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  #3  
Old 10-21-2019, 05:57 PM
Natural Stoner Natural Stoner is offline
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I can't decide between the BRR you suggested or the DUDMD.
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Old 10-23-2019, 04:42 PM
fnsane fnsane is offline
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I'm right behind you, please advise who and where you got your parts and where can I find info on tunes?

Fnsane
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Old 10-23-2019, 06:45 PM
Kostyan Kostyan is offline
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Wanted to do it but changed my mind. Buzzkit 1100 + tune 800ish + quoted labor 800ish = 3500 could not justify and I have less miles on mine.
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Old 10-24-2019, 11:37 AM
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800 for labour is fair. You have to drop the subframe to get the DPF out. Unless you take a hacksaw to it which can cut down the removal time
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  #7  
Old 10-24-2019, 12:12 PM
Closem Joe Closem Joe is online now
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Looks like your a "handy dandy" Stoner!
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Old 10-24-2019, 03:33 PM
Natural Stoner Natural Stoner is offline
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Originally Posted by fnsane View Post
I'm right behind you, please advise who and where you got your parts and where can I find info on tunes?

Fnsane
I got all my parts from A-Rod at tunemyeuro.

I haven't decided on a tune yet. My guy is working right now. I had to run to the dealer (for $19) to get the gasket that is pictured here in this video at the 8:20 mark:



I also needed the CCV hose he talks about in this video (If you go to the dealer, you have to buy the entire housing for $290! but you can get just the CCV hose only from tunemyeuro for $18, so I ordered it):



Just to be safe, I also ordered the intake gasket kit for only $24 and extra vacuum line hose for $24, just in case. Honestly, I should have assumed that I needed the CCV hose when I ordered all my parts. It might have saved me some time, but my mechanic has plenty to do while it's on the way. He hasn't started uninstalling the DPF yet. But, he can just get it on the lift and work on the DPF in the mean time. He doesn't need the CCV hose until reassembly anyway. Pretty sure my X5D only had one owner before me (bought it with 91k miles on it, almost all highway), but I just talked to my mechanic and he said that a bolt is stripped out on the back of the engine to get the intake off (he's doing my swirl flaps too and it makes doing the EGR easier), mostly likely due to some idiot using an air ratchet and stripped it out. There's all kinds of fun surprises you'll probably find when doing this job! [obvious sarcasm]

I recommend getting all these extra gaskets and hoses up front, since there's a high probability you'll need them anyway, unless yours is really low mileage. Even if you don't need them, I would replace them anyway while doing the job to avoid having to do them in the near future.

I should have taken pictures of the progress so far, but totally forgot.
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Old 10-24-2019, 03:50 PM
Natural Stoner Natural Stoner is offline
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Originally Posted by Kostyan View Post
Wanted to do it but changed my mind. Buzzkit 1100 + tune 800ish + quoted labor 800ish = 3500 could not justify and I have less miles on mine.
Sorry if I break your heart, but that's pretty reasonable actually (sunny_j is totally correct and speaks from experience).

Yes, if you're low miles, you don't need to do it yet. But, I'm sitting at 170k miles right now. I've put almost 80k miles on it in 3-4 years. Luckily, I'm going to get a new job where I don't have to drive for work.

It's definitely expensive, but the improved MPG (saves $), less wear and tear/lifespan increase (you should know the emissions BS parts causes slow and gradual engine damage over time), no longer needing diesel exhaust fluid (saves $), and as a bonus, more power is totally worth it to me. Especially since my DPF warning went off a few months ago. I see no point in replacing it, which would be just as or more expensive.

Plus, I've known this was coming, I've been saving money. I knew and was prepared to get this done before I even bought my X5D when I was researching it. I test drove both gas and diesel X5's before I bought. Diesel X5 is significantly better. A gas X5 is significantly slower and way less acceleration.
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Old 10-25-2019, 11:34 AM
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Dmitiriy at DUDMD seems to be very present and available for support with his tunes which is great. Personally I am not a fan of how his tunes smoke but this is a common thing, most tunes smoke. An example on the other end of the spectrum is JR 2.8 is a very "clean" looking tune which I like but not a fan of the price tag. Coming from the N54 world where you can get a JB4 for $350 and includes a bunch of maps, tuning options, additional features, and continues support via BMS with firmware updates and improvements it's a little odd paying $1,XXX for an off the shelf tune. With my old E39 M5 I was paying prices like that for custom tunes.

BRR has a lot of positive feedback floating around him as a person and tuner, people praise his intimate knowledge of the M57 and power/driveability of his tune. I reached out to him and inquired about seeing some data logs and he refused to share them which I find a bit odd. For those are not familiar, data logs simply show the hard data on what is going on with the motor, again referencing the N54 world logs are obligatory in verifying the validity of a tuner. The first thing anyone does when they have a new tune is prove it's worth by showing what the motor is doing. Without data logs it's all he-said she-said and you are pigeon-holed into taking someones word on the performance of the tune. Dyno graphs are great info to have but the data logs are the real date that show how we power is made and more importantly, that the motor is running within safe parameters.

In general I view data logs as an opportunity for a tuner to show off their work and highlight their ability to increase power while keeping the motor safe and as a potential customer I think it's reasonable to ask to see this information as due diligence while shopping for a tune, spending hundreds or thousands of dollars on a one-time tune without knowing the how/what/why effects the tune will have on your motor is a bit irresponsible as a discerning enthusiast. When data logs are requested from a tuner and denied, it's not only odd but a bit worrisome.

To be clear my intent isn't to bad mount BRR. His tuning services are still at the top of my list as I continue to shop for my X5D tuner but holding data logs close to your check makes me question ANY tuner. We will see if other tuners oblige my curiosity.

Evan
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  #11  
Old 10-25-2019, 02:12 PM
Blown540 Blown540 is offline
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My X5 35d Tuner and very very happy!!!!

I have 2 2010 BMW X5 35ds (and both very high mileage, over 125,000 miles each) and both have the "tunemyeuro" by AARodriguez Pats Package and Tune from Dallas, GA and their phone number is 678-535-7172. And I have the Stage 2.8 tunes in both cars and they are daily drivers and the fuel mileage is up about 1.5 mpg at Interstate speeds, but power feels double too.

I hardly ever say that other mechanic work is better than our Race Car shop, but due to his experience and work everyday on the X5s, had them do both and may have another on the way soon too. I hope this helps, Jim in TN
Call/Text 931-580-8804 if I can help with more info or prices---
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Old 10-28-2019, 12:55 PM
Natural Stoner Natural Stoner is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ucsbwsr View Post
Dmitiriy at DUDMD seems to be very present and available for support with his tunes which is great. Personally I am not a fan of how his tunes smoke but this is a common thing, most tunes smoke. An example on the other end of the spectrum is JR 2.8 is a very "clean" looking tune which I like but not a fan of the price tag. Coming from the N54 world where you can get a JB4 for $350 and includes a bunch of maps, tuning options, additional features, and continues support via BMS with firmware updates and improvements it's a little odd paying $1,XXX for an off the shelf tune. With my old E39 M5 I was paying prices like that for custom tunes.

BRR has a lot of positive feedback floating around him as a person and tuner, people praise his intimate knowledge of the M57 and power/driveability of his tune. I reached out to him and inquired about seeing some data logs and he refused to share them which I find a bit odd. For those are not familiar, data logs simply show the hard data on what is going on with the motor, again referencing the N54 world logs are obligatory in verifying the validity of a tuner. The first thing anyone does when they have a new tune is prove it's worth by showing what the motor is doing. Without data logs it's all he-said she-said and you are pigeon-holed into taking someones word on the performance of the tune. Dyno graphs are great info to have but the data logs are the real date that show how we power is made and more importantly, that the motor is running within safe parameters.

In general I view data logs as an opportunity for a tuner to show off their work and highlight their ability to increase power while keeping the motor safe and as a potential customer I think it's reasonable to ask to see this information as due diligence while shopping for a tune, spending hundreds or thousands of dollars on a one-time tune without knowing the how/what/why effects the tune will have on your motor is a bit irresponsible as a discerning enthusiast. When data logs are requested from a tuner and denied, it's not only odd but a bit worrisome.

To be clear my intent isn't to bad mount BRR. His tuning services are still at the top of my list as I continue to shop for my X5D tuner but holding data logs close to your check makes me question ANY tuner. We will see if other tuners oblige my curiosity.
I appreciate your input and more explained thoughts on the subject.

I think I'm potentially totally wrong, but would there be a practical reason he would not want to give data out about his BRR tune? Such as, then maybe it could be copied? And I would think if you put together a great tune, you sure wouldn't anyone to just go and steal and reproduce it.

My concern would be that it (BRR or any tune) causes any damage to the engine, of course.

I'm sure not getting any closer to making a decision. If anything I'm less certain now, ha.

Since there's a website for DUDMD you can see the options and some explanations. Stage 1/2 and launch control. Is there anyone who has it or knows more about the "launch control" option? Is it worth it?

Let's say I'm not too worried about cost, is the launch control option worth it? And since it's *only* $100 difference, would the Stage 2 be "worth it?"

Maybe someone could school me on what Stage tune is better for reliability/MPG/driveability and easier on the engine/less likely to be damaged.
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Old 10-29-2019, 09:55 AM
Thecastle Thecastle is offline
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Never heard of the DUDMD tune. There have been a bunch of new companies in the last year making a tune. With that said, if "reliability" is your concern, the only 2 tunes with a long track record are JR tuning and BPC. I can speak from experience that JR tuning ran without any issues on my 335d for 3 years and 45K miles.
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Old 10-29-2019, 10:46 AM
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ucsbwsr ucsbwsr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Natural Stoner View Post
I appreciate your input and more explained thoughts on the subject.

I think I'm potentially totally wrong, but would there be a practical reason he would not want to give data out about his BRR tune? Such as, then maybe it could be copied? And I would think if you put together a great tune, you sure wouldn't anyone to just go and steal and reproduce it.

My concern would be that it (BRR or any tune) causes any damage to the engine, of course.

I'm sure not getting any closer to making a decision. If anything I'm less certain now, ha.

Since there's a website for DUDMD you can see the options and some explanations. Stage 1/2 and launch control. Is there anyone who has it or knows more about the "launch control" option? Is it worth it?

Let's say I'm not too worried about cost, is the launch control option worth it? And since it's *only* $100 difference, would the Stage 2 be "worth it?"

Maybe someone could school me on what Stage tune is better for reliability/MPG/driveability and easier on the engine/less likely to be damaged.
Data logs are a measurement of what the engine is doing and the result of the tuning parameters used so one would not be able to copy a tuners work via a log since you don't know exactly what they did originally in the sequence of cause-and-effect. In general the M57 community has a bunch of blind faith with tunes which, to each their own but in my eyes these tuners are not offering a warranty if my motor blows and although catastrophic engine failures are not common, they certainly do happen and improper tuning is the culprit more often than not.

Regarding launch control, value is subjective but I assume that is intended more for the 335d owners, with the AWD on the X5 you have lots of grip to work with so personally I wouldn't bother but I also have Michelin PSS tires at all 4 corners.

One would assume lower stages offer increased reliability since the hardware isn't stressed as much. The 2.5"+ and 2.8 tunes you see (also BRR's tune) which put down ~350whp and 550wtq are turbo limited, so says the tuners. That being said the M57 turbos seem to be pretty reliable in general so not a huge concern but everything has a finite lifespan so less stress should equal more lifespan. However, proper tuning is more important. For example, maxing out the turbo in it's normal efficiency range is one thing and if you have a wonky tune the turbo could be under more stress from improper pressures which could cause a premature failure even if it's not making as much power as a turbo maxed out in a healthy manner. Hope that makes sense.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Thecastle View Post
Never heard of the DUDMD tune. There have been a bunch of new companies in the last year making a tune. With that said, if "reliability" is your concern, the only 2 tunes with a long track record are JR tuning and BPC. I can speak from experience that JR tuning ran without any issues on my 335d for 3 years and 45K miles.
DUDMD has been around for a bit, I think he started with the M62 engine but has been doing diesels for a while, he owns and tunes both M57 and N57.

BPC has been around for a bit as well but there are some horror stories floating around with them and their presence on the forums and FB has subsided drastically in the past couple years so best to re-research where they stand in the community.

JR seems to be the most established and from what I can tell is highly regarded.

Another reputable tuner that has been around a long time and tunes tons of diesels, not just BMWs, is Malone.

As a recap these are the M57 tuners which you see the most in the BMW world:

JR
Malone
DUDMD
BRR
BPC
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Old 10-29-2019, 03:36 PM
Natural Stoner Natural Stoner is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ucsbwsr View Post
Data logs are a measurement of what the engine is doing and the result of the tuning parameters used so one would not be able to copy a tuners work via a log since you don't know exactly what they did originally in the sequence of cause-and-effect. In general the M57 community has a bunch of blind faith with tunes which, to each their own but in my eyes these tuners are not offering a warranty if my motor blows and although catastrophic engine failures are not common, they certainly do happen and improper tuning is the culprit more often than not.

Regarding launch control, value is subjective but I assume that is intended more for the 335d owners, with the AWD on the X5 you have lots of grip to work with so personally I wouldn't bother but I also have Michelin PSS tires at all 4 corners.

One would assume lower stages offer increased reliability since the hardware isn't stressed as much. The 2.5"+ and 2.8 tunes you see (also BRR's tune) which put down ~350whp and 550wtq are turbo limited, so says the tuners. That being said the M57 turbos seem to be pretty reliable in general so not a huge concern but everything has a finite lifespan so less stress should equal more lifespan. However, proper tuning is more important. For example, maxing out the turbo in it's normal efficiency range is one thing and if you have a wonky tune the turbo could be under more stress from improper pressures which could cause a premature failure even if it's not making as much power as a turbo maxed out in a healthy manner. Hope that makes sense.

DUDMD has been around for a bit, I think he started with the M62 engine but has been doing diesels for a while, he owns and tunes both M57 and N57.

BPC has been around for a bit as well but there are some horror stories floating around with them and their presence on the forums and FB has subsided drastically in the past couple years so best to re-research where they stand in the community.

JR seems to be the most established and from what I can tell is highly regarded.

Another reputable tuner that has been around a long time and tunes tons of diesels, not just BMWs, is Malone.

As a recap these are the M57 tuners which you see the most in the BMW world:

JR
Malone
DUDMD
BRR
BPC
That helps. I would probably go with a milder Stage 1 tune then. It's not for taking to the drag strip. You and others have said the stock turbos seem pretty robust, but I don't have any desire to stress them out or any other hardware more than they need to be.

This video of a BRR tune on an X5D just got posted 3 days ago and has the dyno chart at the end. Tell me what you think since you said you couldn't get any data out of him.


Last edited by Natural Stoner; 10-29-2019 at 03:37 PM.
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Old 10-29-2019, 03:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Natural Stoner View Post
This video of a BRR tune on an X5D just got posted 3 days ago and has the dyno chart at the end. Tell me what you think since you said you couldn't get any data out of him.
I have seen that video and about 5 other dyno graphs of BRR tunes. The curve looks nice and that is the power I would be hoping to get with a tune as well, ~350whp ~550wtq.
Personally I want to see what the motor is doing when it's making that power.
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Old 10-29-2019, 04:22 PM
Natural Stoner Natural Stoner is offline
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Originally Posted by ucsbwsr View Post
I have seen that video and about 5 other dyno graphs of BRR tunes. The curve looks nice and that is the power I would be hoping to get with a tune as well, ~350whp ~550wtq.
Personally I want to see what the motor is doing when it's making that power.
They sure seem pretty pleased with themselves at the end of the video.

I see what you mean about the "what" that you would like to know.

I know sunny_j has the BRR tune, but I don't know for how long.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny_j View Post
which tune are you going with?
Hey, you out there?

Check out that only 3 day old video I just posted above on the X5D on the dyno.

I wanted to ask you how long you've had your BRR tune, how's it working out, and what kinds of options there are?

I'm thinking about going with them and if a mild, reliable (Stage 1?) tune is an option. Which would be nice especially if they're not quite as expensive as many others.
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Old 10-30-2019, 08:20 AM
NW-99SS NW-99SS is offline
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I won't be running a tune in our M57 without also running an EGT.
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Old 10-30-2019, 08:27 AM
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I won't be running a tune in our M57 without also running an EGT.
What do you mean by this?

EGT = Exhaust Gas Temperature
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Old 10-30-2019, 01:31 PM
Blown540 Blown540 is offline
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AGAIN-- the JR tune has gotten me about 25,000 miles since the first of 2019 and I liked it so well that I bought another E70 and have it installed also at the 2.8 level tune. And fuel mileage is very good, and power is excellent, but it is so much smoother through the gears and drives better than my M3 - I would not change because of NO problems, but NOT knocking anyone elses tunes either, just KNOW mine is GOOD! THANKS, Jim in TN
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Old 10-30-2019, 02:54 PM
NW-99SS NW-99SS is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ucsbwsr View Post
What do you mean by this?

EGT = Exhaust Gas Temperature
Correct, and EGTs are a telling sign of combustion/engine load/ etc...more often than not, the EGTs will spike on a diesel before catastrophic failure.
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Old 11-06-2019, 09:46 PM
vwztips vwztips is offline
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Mein Auto: 2011 X5 35D
I have a 2011 X5 35d with 162k. I bought it with all the deletes (except EGR which I did) performed by previous owner at 135k miles. Tune was by the shop who did the deletes. Asked them who provided it and they said they did. This was their first X5. They typically do Dodges, Chevys and Fords. I thought the tune was aggressive to me and it liked to smoke at idle more than I liked.

This is my wife's DD. I got a stage 1.5 tune from Malone. It's fine. Seems to smoke less. We have put 20k on the car, 5000 since the tune.

I would also HIGHLY recommend Darkside Tuning in England. They will ship you an Alientech loader which you keep. Mike who used to own and run TDTuning here in the states is now over their tuning department and he is great to work with and very responsive. I have used him on over 35 VW TDI tunes. His tunes are always low on smoke and have great power.

I have a couple of other issues with and oil leak that I am going to post and would like some input on that if you guys have any.
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  #23  
Old 11-12-2019, 11:50 AM
Natural Stoner Natural Stoner is offline
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Location: Minnesota
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 37
Mein Auto: 2012 X5 35d
My mechanic's nightmare job is almost over. He wasn't thrilled about the DPF, that's for sure. He said the instructions with A-Rod's pipes say to unplug a 10 Amp (I think) fuse. Does anyone know anything about this? I haven't read anything in my hours and hours of research about needing to get rid of any fuses.

He should be done today with the top and bottom, so I'll need to take the DDE out. I think I'm going to go with the BRR tune. I've been in contact with them, and more reasonably priced.

Just need to ask, the DDE is in the back, passenger side, under the hood, correct? Hopefully, I can get it sent in to them today. It's taken way too long waiting a week for extra parts (gaskets and a hose), and then my mechanic was sick for a week after getting a flu shot.
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  #24  
Old 11-12-2019, 01:02 PM
sunny_j's Avatar
sunny_j sunny_j is offline
bmw addiction
Location: Vancouver, Britsh Columbia
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,077
Mein Auto: X5d
you only remove the 10amp fuse with JR tunes. JR never figured out how to code out the DEF pump
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2012 X5d | White on Black | Sports Package | EGR/DPF/SCR Delete | BRR Tune | DWR TCU Tune | 10.25" Android 8.1 Screen

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  #25  
Old 11-12-2019, 01:19 PM
Natural Stoner Natural Stoner is offline
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Location: Minnesota
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 37
Mein Auto: 2012 X5 35d
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunny_j View Post
you only remove the 10amp fuse with JR tunes. JR never figured out how to code out the DEF pump
LOL! Okay, thanks! Ryan said pull no fuses either.

I will have to tell my mechanic to disregard A-Rod's instructions on that. He, also called to ask me what coolant I wanted to put back into it.

I bet he lost it all. I guess I get a free coolant flush out of the deal!

Thanks for the fast reply Sunny!
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