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F22 / F23 2 Series (2014 - Current)
The 2 Series coupe is the replacement for the E82/E88 1 series coupe. Production starts in November 2013 on the 228i (N20) and M235i (N55) coupes. Look for them in dealerships in February 2014. The convertible F23 2 series will follow in the fall of 2014.

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  #51  
Old 06-26-2019, 07:50 PM
yanks1 yanks1 is offline
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Thx for the long answer; sounds like ur telling me to stick to OEM system; itís ok but not great. Like a little more richness & punch. Not the end all, have excellent systems at home
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  #52  
Old 06-26-2019, 09:26 PM
CCTech CCTech is online now
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Originally Posted by yanks1 View Post
I am not changing out the front speakers, too concerned about door panels getting scratched. Will add 3 way speakers in rear to add improve vocals with mini tweeter. I assume they are 5.25Ē speakers back there??
If you have a reputable shop work on your vehicle and they scratch a door panel they will replace it. This really shouldn't be an issue at even a half decent shop. The front door speakers are the most important if you care about anything other then sub bass quality.
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  #53  
Old 06-26-2019, 10:19 PM
CCTech CCTech is online now
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Originally Posted by yanks1 View Post
Thx for the long answer; sounds like ur telling me to stick to OEM system; it's ok but not great. Like a little more richness & punch. Not the end all, have excellent systems at home
Trying to help answer your original post...

I'd probably try the Bavsound amp (or similar). I think it's $800, has a four year warranty, a 100 day trial period and it's a 45 minute direct swap install for a novice that only requires working in the trunk where you can't scratch any interior panels. I haven't experienced the product myself but it seems to be highly regarded on the forums as an upgrade path and on paper should improve the stock system with a more robust amp and DSP functionality. Although imo it should be a $400-$600 product not an $800 one.

If you want something truly high end but are on a budget (self imposed or otherwise) I'd find yourself a good shop and have them layout an upgradable system path that is in order of best bang for the buck addressing your major wants first.

Now to address some of the rest of this thread and theory...

Better electronics with half decent speakers are almost always going to produce a better result than awesome speakers with sub-par electronics and yes, even the HK amp is sub par if you're looking for true sound. Any OEM system is always an exercise in value engineering and commodity volume.

If you replace the factory speakers only your factory amp will likely have to work differently than it was designed to run them to a performance level that you desire, causing it to produce distortion (which may be inaudible) and wear out your speakers prematurely. The amp is matched specifically to those speakers. Some of the direct replacement speakers marketed to BMW owners claim that your will get higher, cleaner output with the factory amp because their sensitivity ratings are higher (easier for the amp to drive). I can't speak to these products as I've not heard the setups in person but technically if ALL else was held EXACTLY equal the output from a more sensitive speaker would be greater than that of a less sensitive speaker.

If you are only willing to replace one or the other I'd agree with the poster that said to replace the amp. Not only will you be getting a more robust amp but you will be getting a real customizable DSP. This will do more to increase the overall listening experience.

As for replacing the speakers in the rear and not the front I have three comments.

1) Get over the potential scratching of the door cards. You've made it clear that you are not working on the car yourself. If a shop scratches your car, anywhere, they're liable and will have to have it fixed for you. If you don't trust the shop your talking with then go find a different shop that you do trust. A good car audio shop will be better and more careful with your panels than a dealer. It's what they do all day every day. I managed a shop when I was younger doing 5-10 installs a day. Mistakes happened every now and again but I never had to repair or replace a customer's door panel. [ replace the front speakers ]

2) The whole point of an audio system is to reproduce the artist and producer's intent as faithfully as possible. The last thing you want to do is replace only the rear speakers. The car is one of the hardest environments to really make sound amazing. Background noise, horrible speaker placement, reflective glass and obstructions everywhere causing multiple delays and reflections, the list goes on and on its just a nightmare. When you go to a live performance do you stand backwards and face away from the stage? Of course not. Do you think the producer critically listens to and plans out his master with the speakers behind him? Not for stereo music!
When you design any audio system you want it to create a sound-stage in front of you like the producer designed the recording to do. In all honesty the best "music reproduction systems in cars generally disconnect all rear speakers (aside from subs located in the trunk if required) and focus on building an excellent front sound-stage. There was a time that surround sound was exciting in cars, but until we have fully level 5 autonomous vehicles and are talking about watching movies it's really not practical as most multi channel music is dead. [ replace the front speakers ]

3) If you only replace some speakers and leave the others playing in the system at the same level, any improvement gained from your new speakers will be muddied over by the sound that you were originally unhappy with coming from the speakers that you did not upgrade. [ replace the front speakers ]

If you really want to understand how your vehicle's audio system works do more research. It took my about 8 hours to wrap my head around 99% of BMW's audio systems and how to interface with and improve them. If not, just go to a reputable shop and ask for good, better, best options with upgrade paths for the future. Then pick one and trust your decision. No legitimate shop would recommend for you to replace just your rear speakers if you said that you wanted better sound in the drivers seat.

Just the ramblings of a twenty plus year veteran of the custom electronics industry. If you want to pick my brain at all just ask. Good luck with the project and try to enjoy the process not stress over it!

Last edited by CCTech; 06-26-2019 at 10:42 PM.
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  #54  
Old 06-27-2019, 01:53 PM
imtjm imtjm is offline
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you have the same issue replacing just the front speakers as you do replacing the rear speakers or just spoeakers. moreover, front speaker placement is balanced out by your sound from the rears reflecting and bouncing, etc, so unless you are going to turn your fader completely to the front cutting of the rears, getting just fronts isn't gonna do anything and will sound bad as well. the car is simply a hostile environment for music reproduction. Actually, for stereos you aren't actually trying to reproduce anything: the goal is to have your hardware and music environment get out of the way of the source material. You can't reproduce anything unless you are recording a recording. Besides you can have the best stereo sytem specifically tuned to the vehicle's interiors, but it is still going to be defeated by road noise and other ambient noises, no matter how much dynamat, sound proof glass, etc you may use. I personally think spending big bucks on a car system is a wasted money venture, although I did spend for the HK system, and I use to be a huge car audio nut ball spending beaucoup bucks on a system that may have sounded kick arse stationary and look good opening up the trunk, etc, but I look back and just shake my head. I've never distorted out my speakers with the BMW HK system, so I find that they've done a fair job in balancing out hardware. With music compression, radio, satellite radio, etc., driving along with all the ambient noises of traffic and the road just defeats most gains you would otherwise hear stationary closed off from everything else. We don't drive vehicles in that stationary environment, so it makes zero sense to me. I also believe that people think loud equals music fidelity, which it does not. And having spent endless hours debating with other audio heads/audiophiles who claim to hear nuanced differences in a gauge of copper, it's just a silly hobby.
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  #55  
Old 06-27-2019, 08:01 PM
CCTech CCTech is online now
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Originally Posted by imtjm View Post
you have the same issue replacing just the front speakers as you do replacing the rear speakers or just spoeakers. moreover, front speaker placement is balanced out by your sound from the rears reflecting and bouncing, etc, so unless you are going to turn your fader completely to the front cutting of the rears, getting just fronts isn't gonna do anything and will sound bad as well. the car is simply a hostile environment for music reproduction. Actually, for stereos you aren't actually trying to reproduce anything: the goal is to have your hardware and music environment get out of the way of the source material. You can't reproduce anything unless you are recording a recording. Besides you can have the best stereo sytem specifically tuned to the vehicle's interiors, but it is still going to be defeated by road noise and other ambient noises, no matter how much dynamat, sound proof glass, etc you may use. I personally think spending big bucks on a car system is a wasted money venture, although I did spend for the HK system, and I use to be a huge car audio nut ball spending beaucoup bucks on a system that may have sounded kick arse stationary and look good opening up the trunk, etc, but I look back and just shake my head. I've never distorted out my speakers with the BMW HK system, so I find that they've done a fair job in balancing out hardware. With music compression, radio, satellite radio, etc., driving along with all the ambient noises of traffic and the road just defeats most gains you would otherwise hear stationary closed off from everything else. We don't drive vehicles in that stationary environment, so it makes zero sense to me. I also believe that people think loud equals music fidelity, which it does not. And having spent endless hours debating with other audio heads/audiophiles who claim to hear nuanced differences in a gauge of copper, it's just a silly hobby.
Thank you for restating points that have already been made but with errors both in practice and theory all while giving zero assistance to the original poster for the third time in this thread.

Last edited by CCTech; 06-28-2019 at 07:18 AM.
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  #56  
Old 09-12-2019, 11:47 AM
Gorangers Gorangers is offline
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Have a 2015 228i. Bought it used and it has the base system.

I'm a bit of an audio nut with my home 2 channel systems so was hoping for a decent sounding stereo.

I think the base stereo sounds fine for what it is. Difficult to have hi fidelity in an automobile in my opinion.

I've heard Mcintosh and Mark Levinson systems that sound better, but they are pretty pricey.

I'll save my hi fidelity listening to my home gear.
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  #57  
Old 09-17-2019, 08:47 PM
yanks1 yanks1 is offline
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Thanks again for the comments

I agree a vehicle is dreadful set-up for quality music. I have 2 VG set-ups in my home; primary one is 5.1.4 set-up with Revel Speakers and other is 5.1 with Polk LSiM speakers. Also have 2 channel ATI amp to use main set-up for music in 2.1 mode.

That said; Iíll stick to the base OEM BMW system & rough it.. itís at least average so why blow $$ on only mild improvement
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