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F10 / F11 (2011 - 2016)
The sixth generation of the BMW 5 Series Sedan (F10) was produced from 2011 - 2016 with LCI updates arriving in 2014. In the US BMW offered a hatchback 5 Series Gran Truismo (F07) and the rest of the world also go a Station Wagon/Touring version F11.

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  #1  
Old 10-13-2019, 07:24 PM
poconosms1 poconosms1 is offline
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extended Warranty vs. preventative repair

So I've been doing a lot of research on warranties now that my car hit the 7 year mark. My indie highly recommended getting a warranty - he usually tells people it's not worth it - because of the timing belt issue.

I was speaking to three indie shops and the four known major problems are:

valve cover gasket, which was already replaced.
Oil chain sprocket - not changed
timing chain - not fixed.
Oil Pan gasket

There are so many out there, but the Car Chex seems to be the best at $4,800 paid in full. Route 66 lost their BBB rating, and AA Auto protection has seen a huge increase in customer complaints.

When you read the details, there are so many tricks they use to not cover parts. I especially loved the one that a single incident cannot exceed the NADA value of the car, which a blown timing chain is going to exceed the value of my car - currently around 10k.

I was speaking to one indy and for just under 3k, I can get the oil chain sprocket, timing chain, and oil pan gasket all fixed.

I should should mention that I did have the car inspected and there are no leaks anywhere and was told the car is in mint condition.

I'm thinking that I'm better served by having the preventative work done and saving the 1800, especially since the warranty would only be good for 5/50k

I did attach a comparison - it's brief, but does give some comparisons.
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  #2  
Old 10-13-2019, 07:34 PM
Autoputzer Autoputzer is online now
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On average, extended warranties (or any insurance polies) are a losing proposition. It they weren't the companies would lose money selling them. But, insurance is a necessary evil to protect you against catastrophic losses from which you would never recover: house burning down, needing a heart transplant, causing a traffic accident where a school bus full of lawyers' kids careens off a cliff, etc.).

Getting an early N20/N26 engine upgraded to the new-design parts will cost between $3.5k and $4k at an honest BMW dealership. If you get an indy to do the work, make sure you get the new-design parts, not just new old-design parts. Document everything, because those cars are worth a lot less if they have one if the bad engines, even if they're still running.

BMW's extended warranty on the early N20/N26's are 7/70. So, you're either naked or soon will be, and the Interwebs is full of stories about early N20/N26 engine going ka-blam-o just past 70k miles.
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  #3  
Old 10-13-2019, 07:39 PM
poconosms1 poconosms1 is offline
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In the case of the N20 motor, I believe it's a losing bet for the warranty companies because of the known problems, but they are compensating for the actuarials of the entire population.

It is the upgraded kits, but the price you're quoting is for the timing chain only, not all three.

thanks for the comments.
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Old 10-13-2019, 07:40 PM
poconosms1 poconosms1 is offline
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In the case of the N20 motor, I believe it's a losing bet for the warranty companies because of the known problems, but they are compensating for the actuarials of the entire population.

It is the upgraded kits, but the price you're quoting is for the timing chain only, not all three.

thanks for the comments.
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  #5  
Old 10-14-2019, 07:35 AM
den550 den550 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poconosms1 View Post
...
There are so many out there, but the Car Chex seems to be the best at $4,800 paid in full. Route 66 lost their BBB rating, and AA Auto protection has seen a huge increase in customer complaints.
...
.
Wait - this is the first negative feedback I've heard about Route 66, which I was also eying as an option. Have other members had negative experiences recently? What changed with them?
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  #6  
Old 10-14-2019, 07:41 AM
poconosms1 poconosms1 is offline
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I don't know, I know they lost their BBB rating. I think some complained that they didn't cover all the parts needed to fix an airconditioner unit. covered $800 of a $1100 repair.

More importantly, the NADA limit made it cheaper to just do preventative maintenance for me.
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  #7  
Old 10-14-2019, 08:21 AM
subkg subkg is online now
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I've been covered and still covered till March next year with CNA. Was a bit expensive, given the mileage the car had at the moment 96k, I paid 3600 for 22k miles or 2 yrs. But it was great, pretty much all repairs have been covered, such as oil pan gasket, valve cover gasket, steering boot etc. Total in repairs is about 10k was paid by them.
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  #8  
Old 10-14-2019, 09:18 AM
poconosms1 poconosms1 is offline
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If I had a 2015 or newer, then I think it would be worth it.
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Old 10-14-2019, 09:52 AM
dkotanto dkotanto is offline
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poconsms1, I have Route 66 and I was concerned by your post that Route 66 isn't BBB accredited, so I looked into it:

Route 66 is listed under company "ASC" in BBB and IT IS BBB accredited.

See https://www.bbb.org/us/ar/mountain-h...inc-0935-16648

Alternate Business Name
Route 66 Extended Warranty
ASC Warranty, Inc.
U.S. Plus Warranty
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  #10  
Old 10-14-2019, 10:16 AM
den550 den550 is offline
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for Route 66 and the nada value - this is for a single incident right? so if value of car was $20k, and you had one incident for 13k, it would be covered. And if you somehow had another incident for $15k a week later, it would STILL be covered right?
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  #11  
Old 10-14-2019, 11:17 AM
poconosms1 poconosms1 is offline
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I'm sorry, check again. I read hey were down graded. I misspoke or mistyped.
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  #12  
Old 10-14-2019, 11:18 AM
poconosms1 poconosms1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by den550 View Post
for Route 66 and the nada value - this is for a single incident right? so if value of car was $20k, and you had one incident for 13k, it would be covered. And if you somehow had another incident for $15k a week later, it would STILL be covered right?
Yes. That's why i'm saying it's worth it for 2015 or newer....
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  #13  
Old 10-14-2019, 02:19 PM
den550 den550 is offline
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Originally Posted by poconosms1 View Post
Yes. That's why i'm saying it's worth it for 2015 or newer....
This is based on your belief that a car made in > 2015 would be worth enough that it wouldn't get "totaled" the first time something broke then?
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  #14  
Old 10-14-2019, 02:26 PM
Digtlartst Digtlartst is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poconosms1 View Post
So I've been doing a lot of research on warranties now that my car hit the 7 year mark. My indie highly recommended getting a warranty - he usually tells people it's not worth it - because of the timing belt issue.

I was speaking to three indie shops and the four known major problems are:

valve cover gasket, which was already replaced.
Oil chain sprocket - not changed
timing chain - not fixed.
Oil Pan gasket

There are so many out there, but the Car Chex seems to be the best at $4,800 paid in full. Route 66 lost their BBB rating, and AA Auto protection has seen a huge increase in customer complaints.

When you read the details, there are so many tricks they use to not cover parts. I especially loved the one that a single incident cannot exceed the NADA value of the car, which a blown timing chain is going to exceed the value of my car - currently around 10k.

I was speaking to one indy and for just under 3k, I can get the oil chain sprocket, timing chain, and oil pan gasket all fixed.

I should should mention that I did have the car inspected and there are no leaks anywhere and was told the car is in mint condition.

I'm thinking that I'm better served by having the preventative work done and saving the 1800, especially since the warranty would only be good for 5/50k

I did attach a comparison - it's brief, but does give some comparisons.
I've been doing some research too for my 2014 F10 CPO that expires 12/19.

The "7 years/48k" Route 66 quote in the comparison chart you posted doesn't seem right if your car is 7 years old now with 73k mi.

Route 66 contract date/time starts at signing of the contract regardless of the age of the car. The end mileage is actual total odometer mileage, not mileage from the start of the contract. Since the contract expires whichever occurs first, that 48k mi quote can't be correct for your car that's already got 73k now.

I'd get an actual R66 quote for your car from your local bank or CU.

R66 is BBB A+, by the way.

https://web.route66warranty.com/page/faq

Last edited by Digtlartst; 10-14-2019 at 02:30 PM.
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  #15  
Old 10-14-2019, 02:59 PM
poconosms1 poconosms1 is offline
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It appears R66 is going to lose that rating. We'll have to wait and see.

7 years/48 is from today.

I did get a R66 quote, the 3372 does not cover high end electronics and is limited. R66 that would compe close to car chex plan was over 6k.
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  #16  
Old 10-14-2019, 03:14 PM
Digtlartst Digtlartst is offline
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Strange that your R66 quote doesn't follow their website FAQ terms.

I'd call R66 to ask what electronics are not covered. As of today they're BBB A+ regardless of interweb rumors. I'll double-check that in Dec when I choose a warranty. They've been in business 33 years.

Last edited by Digtlartst; 10-14-2019 at 03:16 PM.
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  #17  
Old 10-15-2019, 09:32 AM
OnlyGerman OnlyGerman is offline
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Is the CarChex backed by Royal?

And this is a no brainer btw...buy a warranty...Even if you can don't utilize the full cost of the warranty over the term, say repairs were only 3k, the rest can be valued at cheap piece of mind.

Last edited by OnlyGerman; 10-15-2019 at 09:33 AM.
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  #18  
Old 10-15-2019, 11:11 AM
poconosms1 poconosms1 is offline
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I did call R66. The less expensive plan only covers basic electronics - door locks, etc... Not the high end electronics such as CA or IDrive. that policy was over 6k.
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  #19  
Old 10-15-2019, 05:31 PM
ralcala1967 ralcala1967 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subkg View Post
I've been covered and still covered till March next year with CNA. Was a bit expensive, given the mileage the car had at the moment 96k, I paid 3600 for 22k miles or 2 yrs. But it was great, pretty much all repairs have been covered, such as oil pan gasket, valve cover gasket, steering boot etc. Total in repairs is about 10k was paid by them.
Dear SUBKG,

Never heard of CNA. Do you have details on where and how to buy the plan?

All the best,
Rafael
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  #20  
Old 10-15-2019, 05:54 PM
tedavis01 tedavis01 is online now
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Warranties are a rip off. I had one and they nickel and dime everything. Save your money and find a good repair shop. When the costs go up the more things they look for to not cover the cost. Just not worth it.
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  #21  
Old 10-15-2019, 06:02 PM
subkg subkg is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ralcala1967 View Post
Dear SUBKG,

Never heard of CNA. Do you have details on where and how to buy the plan?

All the best,
Rafael
https://www.cnanational.com/

I'm not 100% sure, but would assume you can buy it only through a dealer.

Thanks.
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  #22  
Old 10-15-2019, 06:10 PM
dmason dmason is offline
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So, when my 5/100 CPO warranty ran out on my F07 535 in 2015 I got quotes. Between 3500-6000... At that time it had around 77k. Since then I've spent close to 4500 on non-standard repairs and am looking at another 750 for AC compressor now. It would have been a wash for me so far, but buying the warranty up front would have been easier to budget.

I think if the company is reputable it could be worth it.
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  #23  
Old 10-15-2019, 07:08 PM
cgknight cgknight is offline
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I was a Corporate Warranty Manager in the Automotive/Trucking industry for over 15 years. It's not the 'warranty company' or 'manufacturer' who stiffs you. It's the repair facility. I'll tell you why. First, most, I again say 'most' warranty repairs pay less than the same 'Customer Pay' repair. Therefore, it is in the best interest of the repair facility to lean towards customer pay....imho.

How a warranty claim gets approved. The 3 C's: Complaint, Cause, & Correction. Here's an example: Complaint-Oil leak left side of engine. Cause-Checked/Found oil filter housing leaking at mount gasket. Correction: Removed oil filter housing and replaced gasket. Reassembled, Checked/Filled oil to proper level. Cleaned and verified no further leaks at this time. That claim will get paid.

Let's change something. Cause-Checked/Found mount bolts loose and one missing. Informed customer, not warranty. (Will not get paid)

Any shop can make 'almost' any repair a warranty repair if it is within the warranty coverage period. I'm talking from experience. It's all in how you write up the 3 C's. I've seen it, I've done it as Good Will for customers. I've seen where dealerships did it for fleet customers. Technician rewrites his story to cover the warranty audit. This is an FYI moment to inform others regarding warranty claim issues.
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  #24  
Old 10-15-2019, 07:59 PM
Gene Horn Gene Horn is offline
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check the fine print on any agreement

Most extended warranties have these specific provisions:

They can repair with an "equivalent" part. The language allows used parts from scrapped BMW's or after market parts.

The amount of coverage is limited to the then wholesale value of the car at that time and prior repair costs are included. The dollar limitation is cumulative.

You can have the repair made anywhere but most BMW dealers will refuse to use non BMW parts. ( Even if they do, they to not warranty the repair.) Thus, you are forced to use the independents or pay the difference in the price at the dealer.

Normal wear and tear may or may not be covered. When it is, it is not specifically defined. For example, the car may leak oil through the valve seals but a quart used/leaked every 500 miles is not considered excessive and therefore not covered.
The amount of coverage is limited to the then wholesale value of the car at that time and prior repair costs are included. The dollar limitation is cumulative.

You can have the repair made anywhere but most BMW dealers will refuse to use non BMW parts. ( Even if they do, they to not warranty the repair.) Thus, you are forced to use the independents or pay the difference in the price at the dealer.

Normal wear and tear may or may not be covered. When it is, it is not specifically defined. For example, the car may leak oil through the valve seals but a quart used/leaked every 500 miles is not considered excessive and therefore not covered.

Proof of normal maintenance is required even if it has nothing to do with what failed.

The reality is that small dollar repairs may be covered but large motor or transmission failures are a fight.

Good luck.
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  #25  
Old 10-15-2019, 10:43 PM
dkotanto dkotanto is offline
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Great insight. Thanks for sharing


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