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E46 (1999 - 2006)
The fourth generation 3 Series (E46 chassis) was introduced in 1999 and set the standard for engineering and performance during it's years of production including being named to Car & Driver's 10 best list every one of those years! ! -- View the E46 Wiki

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Old 02-18-2020, 04:30 PM
rich815 rich815 is offline
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Inexpensive old BMW for teen son, best bet?

Hi all, I've owned 3 BMWs myself, a 1996 325i, 2009 328i Sport and presently a 2014 X3. My son, recently 18 years old, is looking to get a $3500 or lower older manual e46. He's had his eye on a '05 325i with 174k on Facebook posted for sale at around $3k. I got a hold of the last mechanic listed in the CarFax who did a recent oil change and oil pan replacement and although the mechanic liked it and said it was a good car for 174k he did mention it had a slight leak on the thermostat and the bearing on the water pump needed replacing soon as it rattled some, plus front/rear brakes were down to 15%. All that is likely another $2000 of work and maintenance in the next 6 months or so. So he passed on it (but really really wanted it).

My son then saw a 2001 330i on Craigslist with 160k but the ad was over 2 weeks old and I can't imagine any good deals lasting that long. I figure it's likely got some issues and others passed on it by now.

I keep telling him to do better research and to get involved in forums like this, do some meet ups with a local BMW club and wait for something through a reliable source rather than try to find who knows what on Facebook or CL.

Anyone have any other thoughts or advice to share? Suggestions for best most reliable years in the e46 category around this price range? My son is now attending city college (to later transfer to a UC college here in California) and still living at home and he's be using his own money but he'd be using half his savings for this price range and I worry the maintenance cost for an old BMW like this might hit him hard. He's only working part time while attending school too.

My advice to him to get a reliable and cheap older Honda or a Toyota that'd be cheap to maintain for his first car with his limited income and studies falls on deaf ears when he wants a sportier manual BMW like the old man used to drive.

Thanks for any thoughts....
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Old 02-18-2020, 05:11 PM
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Get a 330 over the 325. Not only for more power, but the "leatherette" stuff that comes in many of the 325's doesnt hold up well. A manual is a MUST, which you mentioned. The biggest piece of advice I would give you is if you can't turn your own wrenches (or arent willing to learn) then don't buy an older BMW unless you have deep pockets. You mentioned brakes, a thermostat and water pump and said it was $2000. I almost died. Thats $400ish in parts (pads/rotor kits are $320 or so, water pump is $38 and tstat is $50). All of it is VERY easy to DIY and the e46 is VERY DIY'er friendly. Otherwise, why would anyone pay for $2000 worth of work on a $3000 car? But again, if you can afford it and want to pay someone then go for it.

What I can say is that a properly sorted and mildly modded (suspension mainly) E46 is still one of the best driving and handling cars available today. I drive a LOT of new cars as I travel for work and have a hook up at the rental car company, so I get all kinds of cool new cars. With the exception of some Scat Pack Hemi Chargers they give me, I am NEVER disappointed when I get back in my car after dropping off the rental. And bonus, I personally know of more than 5 BMW;s with the M54 engine (found in all 01 and newer E46's) that have 400k miles + on them and are still daily driven. So they will last forever IF properly taken care of.

I just got an M54 powered E60 for my 16 year old son, but I haven't paid a mechanic in 20 years. Otherwise his millenial butt would be in a Camry!

Good luck and be patient and willing to travel for the right deal. I got an 03 330ci with 168k miles for $3000 2 years ago. But I had to fly from Bham, AL to Philly to get it.
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Old 02-18-2020, 08:54 PM
MoparJim MoparJim is online now
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Can't add much more to what smolk has to say except to emphasize the ability to turn wrenches. I couldn't afford ANY of my cars if I could turn a wrench. My sons drove old cars when they were in college, but they also did their own repairs and we had extra cars just in case along with the room to tear something down (like the weekend engine swap from one car to another so that my son could get back to Cal Poly). Now they both drive stuff much newer than I own, but my younger son will probably be weekend driving his '67 Dart convertible (440/4sp) by the end of summer (he's got a company truck). He just has to get moved into his new house, which is considerably nicer than mine and his bank account is also much nicer than mine.
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Old 02-18-2020, 09:48 PM
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Inexpensive old BMW for teen son, best bet?

Agree with all thatís been said. Particularly about the wrenching. You live in an area of the country where labor rate is the highest so not surprised about the $2k quote. That being said E46s are generally easy cars to work on and there are tons of diy videos on YouTube. Surely your son spends time there. He needs to get his hands dirty. If I still lived in Oakland I could walk him through brakes and water pump in a few hours.

What I will add:

You ask about best years. Iíd say that generally the newer the better but the newest of these cars was already a used car before your son could count to ten. At this point, a well maintained 2002 will be better than a neglected 2006 by a long shot.

Look for private party car. You want to find an owner who can prove the car was maintained and common faults were remedied and hopefully they know a thing or two that are common knowledge here.

Inspect the car beyond how shiny the paint is and how fancy the wheels are and how great the stereo is. Pop the hood and look for no oil where common oil leaks would be, turn the wheel and listen for clunks, brake and do the same, drive over bumps and do the same. Have whatever car passes this test inspected at Bavarian professionals in Berkeley. They are not cheap but they are amazing. Or call them and ask them if one of their customers is selling a car. Not sure if Nat is still there / runs the place but thatís who I would talk to.

Now if your son buys an e46 and comes here to post about how to gain 30-40hp with crackpot upgrades (like an m62 throttle body) because of some locker room style exaggeration heís read on some forum, Iím driving down from Healdsburg to Albany to beat his a$$ myself. Thatís a promise not a threat.


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Old 02-19-2020, 03:24 AM
tttomttt tttomttt is offline
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This is a funny thread. I agree with everyone who answered the OP. Loved my 330xi. Bought it with 79,000 sold it with 249,000 with maybe $4000 invested over 8 years. Ran like it was new. I bought a 05 530i with 49,000 to replace it. This car is fine but it is not my 330. I hope the kid who bought it loves and cherishes it as I did.
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Old 02-19-2020, 06:53 AM
meinbills meinbills is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FredoinSF View Post
Now if your son buys an e46 and comes here to post about how to gain 30-40hp with crackpot upgrades (like an m62 throttle body) because of some locker room style exaggeration heís read on some forum, Iím driving down from Healdsburg to Albany to beat his a$$ myself. Thatís a promise not a threat.
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LOL. Too funny. But then again, I recalled long ago didn't smolck one time had 2 turbo jets added to his e46 and got 1000 hp?
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Old 02-19-2020, 07:13 AM
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Originally Posted by FredoinSF View Post
Now if your son buys an e46 and comes here to post about how to gain 30-40hp with crackpot upgrades (like an m62 throttle body) because of some locker room style exaggeration heís read on some forum, Iím driving down from Healdsburg to Albany to beat his a$$ myself. Thatís a promise not a threat.

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LOL! This is hilarious!

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LOL. Too funny. But then again, I recalled long ago didn't smolck one time had 2 turbo jets added to his e46 and got 1000 hp?
I think I remember that when both my brake lights went out and the ďrocket boostersĒ brake warning lights were illuminated on the dash. Iím sure I posted something ridiculous about it.
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now, go burn your Man Card, and buy yourself a Camry....

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Old 02-19-2020, 07:20 AM
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Old 02-19-2020, 08:03 AM
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"Inexpensive old BMW"? Sounds like impossible at first, but if you look carefully there might be something. My older son is 5yrs old, but they grow quickly. Maybe my biggest concern would be, to not give him too much power, before he learned how to handle rwd in winter.
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Old 02-19-2020, 08:48 AM
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"Inexpensive old BMW"? Sounds like impossible at first, but if you look carefully there might be something. My older son is 5yrs old, but they grow quickly. Maybe my biggest concern would be, to not give him too much power, before he learned how to handle rwd in winter.
When I joined this forum my son was 3, heíll be 16 in a week. It does happen SO fast.

Thankfully he shares my love for E46ís and BMWs and we have completely redone his E60 interior from grey to black and grey two tone. Best times of my life working on cars with him.
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now, go burn your Man Card, and buy yourself a Camry....
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Old 02-19-2020, 09:46 AM
meinbills meinbills is offline
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Smolck, the 330Ci I'm eyeing has 167K miles on it and the ask is $4000. I'm hesitant b/c of the high mileage.
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Old 02-19-2020, 10:40 AM
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Smolck, the 330Ci I'm eyeing has 167K miles on it and the ask is $4000. I'm hesitant b/c of the high mileage.
Why? Thatís low miles as far as Iím concerned. I bought mine with 168k miles and drove it 1000 miles back home. It will need some maintenance but overall, manual cars routinely go 300k miles plus without any major issues.
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now, go burn your Man Card, and buy yourself a Camry....
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Old 02-19-2020, 11:13 AM
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Thanks app for your input and hummus takes on this too. Great info and advice. My son might pop in here too with some questions. Appreciate the kind culture here.
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Old 02-19-2020, 11:14 AM
rich815 rich815 is offline
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Thanks all not thanks app...
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Old 02-19-2020, 11:15 AM
rich815 rich815 is offline
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Hummus?? Humorous. Can't figure out how to edit for some reason. I'll stop now....
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Old 02-19-2020, 11:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meinbills View Post
Smolck, the 330Ci I'm eyeing has 167K miles on it and the ask is $4000. I'm hesitant b/c of the high mileage.
Why? That's low miles as far as I'm concerned. I bought mine with 168k miles and drove it 1000 miles back home. It will need some maintenance but overall, manual cars routinely go 300k miles plus without any major issues.
Then I only owned low mileage cars. My earlier e46 had like 160k miles when I sold it. Dad gave me guideline to only buy cars below 200000km which is like 125000 miles. Well, he drove japanese cars all his life, but anyway he showed me many things about fixing cars when I was still kid.
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Old 02-19-2020, 02:58 PM
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Then I only owned low mileage cars. My earlier e46 had like 160k miles when I sold it. Dad gave me guideline to only buy cars below 200000km which is like 125000 miles. Well, he drove japanese cars all his life, but anyway he showed me many things about fixing cars when I was still kid.
Yep, but the E46 is an exception to the rule, IF you know what youíre getting yourself into.
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Old 02-19-2020, 03:32 PM
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Why? Thatís low miles as far as Iím concerned. I bought mine with 168k miles and drove it 1000 miles back home. It will need some maintenance but overall, manual cars routinely go 300k miles plus without any major issues.
Who are you trying to kid here? I am no smolck. I can't lift the Mjolnir.
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Old 02-19-2020, 08:45 PM
MoparJim MoparJim is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lgr122 View Post
"Inexpensive old BMW"? Sounds like impossible at first, but if you look carefully there might be something. My older son is 5yrs old, but they grow quickly. Maybe my biggest concern would be, to not give him too much power, before he learned how to handle rwd in winter.
Hmmmm, too much power??? And, yes this was backed by a manual transmission...440 cubic inches...yes, my older son was driving this when he turned 16...never did get that car painted...
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Old 02-20-2020, 07:08 AM
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Hmmmm, too much power??? And, yes this was backed by a manual transmission...440 cubic inches...yes, my older son was driving this when he turned 16...never did get that car painted...
Nice, love old Mopars. My uncle had a 1970 Hemi Cuda Convertible with a 426 HEMI and a 4 speed. Very rare and he sold it for a pile of cash. I rode in it once. Here is the story, my aunt and uncle are Kevin and Sandy Faris as referred in the article. Notice in the story the car came his way after an 18 year old kid spun a bearing in the hemi right after purchase.

https://www.hotrod.com/articles/1970...-crazy-custom/
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Old 02-20-2020, 07:36 AM
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My grandfather was Dodge man. Red Dart I only saw in pictures but then came metallic brown Aspen which he had for long time. Garage was bit too small for it, but he kept it in perfect condition. When car was in garage it was possible to get in from one side, other side was almost touching the wall, front bumper was touching the wall every time, and still couldn't quite close garage doors, just almost.

Bit off the original subject, sorry.

Hey, if you can't find good Bmw for your son, try some V8 mopar instead! He will like, I would.
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Old 02-21-2020, 08:13 PM
MoparJim MoparJim is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lgr122 View Post
My grandfather was Dodge man. Red Dart I only saw in pictures but then came metallic brown Aspen which he had for long time. Garage was bit too small for it, but he kept it in perfect condition. When car was in garage it was possible to get in from one side, other side was almost touching the wall, front bumper was touching the wall every time, and still couldn't quite close garage doors, just almost.

Bit off the original subject, sorry.

Hey, if you can't find good Bmw for your son, try some V8 mopar instead! He will like, I would.
It's hard enough to get into my 330Ci convertible in my garage. My wife's GTS convertible is next to it.
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Old 02-21-2020, 08:22 PM
MoparJim MoparJim is online now
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Quote:
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Nice, love old Mopars. My uncle had a 1970 Hemi Cuda Convertible with a 426 HEMI and a 4 speed. Very rare and he sold it for a pile of cash. I rode in it once. Here is the story, my aunt and uncle are Kevin and Sandy Faris as referred in the article. Notice in the story the car came his way after an 18 year old kid spun a bearing in the hemi right after purchase.

https://www.hotrod.com/articles/1970...-crazy-custom/
I've been next to that car in Wade's "garage"...Wade is an extremely nice guy with quite the collection.
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Old 02-22-2020, 02:57 PM
csi_thecouve csi_thecouve is offline
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I came across this thread because I was thinking of selling my 2002 325CI with 157,000 miles due to repairs piling up. I bought the car with 15,000 miles in 2004. As usual, Smolck makes great points. First, no question that these are great driving cars and I genuinely love that part of of my car. I have a fully loaded car with leather seats and it has lasted very well with loving care. But also to Smolck's point, if you are not good with a wrench (or don't have time and inclination to learn) these cars get very expensive very quickly. In this higher mileage range, without being a skilled fixer, I would really only want to buy an E46 that has had a lot of the cooling system fixed. My most recent repair was the cracked radiator and it was $700 to fix. I wish it wasn't so, but that would be at the high end of my skill level as a mechanic and I didn't have time to do it. But every piece of my cooling system has broken at different times (water pump, expansion tank, thermostat, radiator) and they are 100% failure items. At this age as well, engines sure seem very prone to oil leaks. Mine has leaked oil from everywhere and pan gasket has a very slow leak which is way beyond my ability and is a super expensive non DIY repair. I also think things like the DISA vlave are sure to fail in this car (much easier fix). Parts are still plentiful for the DIY'er and they are affordable, but I have not gone 6 months without needing a repair in two years now so it is not a no brainer to purchase IMHO. Still, the performance is great and I don't regret my time with the car.
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Old 02-22-2020, 08:21 PM
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I've been next to that car in Wade's "garage"...Wade is an extremely nice guy with quite the collection.
that is pretty cool. I got to ride in it once, the summer I turned 16, I think that was 1994. Amazing machine for sure. My uncle built his own airplane with the proceeds from this sale. Iíd have kept the car.....
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