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E39 (1997 - 2003)
The BMW 5-Series (E39 chassis) was introduced in the United States as a 1997 model year car and lasted until the 2004 when the E60 chassis was released. The United States saw several variations including the 525i, 528i, 530i and 540i. -- View the E39 Wiki

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  #1  
Old 05-19-2019, 01:45 PM
Kekaksen Kekaksen is offline
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Location: Norway
 
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Mein Auto: 2002 E39 520D
Speaker upgrade

I have thought about upgrading the speakers in my E39 NON DSP for some time as i find the mids a litle lack-luster. I have made some measurements and figured that the dimentions of the existing speaker and mounting is as follows:

Diagonal mounting holes 140mm/~5.5"
Perpendicular mounting holes 99mm/~3.89"
Exisiting speaker depth 62mm/~2.44

The speaker im thinking of is the Ground Zero GZTF 13, but the product page says mounting holes 117,5mm/~4,62", and also the impedance of this speaker is 3ohm's instead of the stock 4 ohm speaker

Do any of you think either of these things are going to become a problem? Or have you done something allong the lines of this?

Thanks in advance
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  #2  
Old 05-19-2019, 02:02 PM
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mattmar1 mattmar1 is offline
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bavsound sells an e39 speaker kit that people who have bought are very happy with.
https://www.jandtdistributing.com/pr...nt=18390522369
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  #3  
Old 05-19-2019, 02:52 PM
528iAut 528iAut is offline
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The speakers you found are too small.
If you can find DLS R5A go with these, they have good bass for their size.
Is there an amplifier in your cars trunk, if not this should be your first priority!
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  #4  
Old 05-19-2019, 04:29 PM
JimLev JimLev is online now
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Looks like they will fit, here are the spec.
3 ohms would be OK.
https://www.bassjunkies.com/ground-z...-speakers.html
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  #5  
Old 05-20-2019, 07:57 AM
Kekaksen Kekaksen is offline
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Location: Norway
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mattmar1 View Post
bavsound sells an e39 speaker kit that people who have bought are very happy with.
https://www.jandtdistributing.com/pr...nt=18390522369
I had not planned to use thet much cash on a "temporairy" car, i have a friend whose selling a pair of the beforementioned GZTF13 for about 40usd, but thanks for the advice!

Quote:
Originally Posted by 528iAut View Post
The speakers you found are too small.
If you can find DLS R5A go with these, they have good bass for their size.
Is there an amplifier in your cars trunk, if not this should be your first priority!
How come you mean the speakers are to small? I have made measurements with a caliper and i think it should fit? Anyways, im also planning to get hold of an aftermarket amp in the near future so that dosent bother me much
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  #6  
Old 05-20-2019, 12:23 PM
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DennisCooper! DennisCooper! is offline
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Hi,

This topic has been discussed multiple thousands of times over all the BMW forums, do take some time to search around to get more knowledge.

The first thing to ask you is if you are intending to keep the OEM audio system that's in the car and only upgrade the speakers? if so, then the only speakers that are impedance matched, physical mounting depth & fitment holes specific and developed to make the 'best' of the oem amplification stage/module are the BSW's that are referenced above. As you've mentioned you don't wish to spend that much and the car is temporary, then there's no other speaker upgrade off the shelf for you. If you just install speakers that are the conventional 4 ohms, then you will get sound output, but it won't be correct and also there'll be a marginal if that, improvement in sound. If you get an aftermarket amplifier and connect it to the OEM audio via speaker level inputs, then that will power and play aftermarket speakers very well, however, in the front doors, I'd say to do away with the OEM plastic enclosure as it's optimised for the basic OEM speaker drivers. Instead, put in a much more solid baffle and mount the 4ohm aftermarket speakers to it and they'll play even better. I also use the DLS R5A speakers and they're utterly fantastic for a 5.25 inch driver. Harder to find nowadays but I do believe DLS have representatives around Europe still.

Cheers, Dennis!
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  #7  
Old 05-20-2019, 02:49 PM
maroonca maroonca is offline
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Speaker Choice

The general upgrade path is: 1) replace the 5-1/4”s in the doors and tweeters in the sails. 2) Add an amp 3) Add a sub. After that, there’s a number of options, from processors to after market head units. Everybody has their “after that” faves, but in general, there’s consensus on the first three.

Most folks find that each of these steps results in markedly better audio.

And the car is great to work on: the wiring (twisted pair) is top-notch, speaker positions are great, the sound of the head unit is good (although feature-wise it’s pretty dated), and all the main connections are in the trunk- and easy. Best of all, it sounds so awful when stock, anything you do is a dramatic improvement!

You may have a couple problems with the speakers you’re looking at. The first is physical: according to an old JimLev post, max allowable depth for 5.25” door speakers is 2.375”. The ones you’re looking at are 2.44”. Solvable, but…

The second is frequency response. And here you hit why the amp is so weird and awful. The speakers you’re looking at are co-ax. IE: designed to make sounds from the mid-basses and up. Presumably you’re spending the money on co-axes to get a combined full range audio better than that of the speakers in the car. But the BMW amp does all the signal EQ, crossover, and processing internally. End result is it only sends a mid bass frequency response signal to the 5.25” mid basses. There won’t (shouldn’t?) be any high midrange there. Or upper frequencies. You’re gonna be stuck listening to the stock speakers for those ranges. And the stock 1.5” high mids are OK (up to moderate volumes) but not the tweeters. They're awful.

So why spend the money on co-axes if the included tweeters are just gonna be decorative? You might be better off finding a separate midbass/ tweeter combo and replacing the tweeters in the car, too. IE: following the usual upgrade path.
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  #8  
Old 06-24-2019, 01:43 PM
Bmwe39528i Bmwe39528i is offline
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Has anyone else tried BAVAUTO stage 1 for e39?
The reviews look good but seems they are not specific to this model
https://www.bavsound.com/Reviews/Stage-One
My car is DPS so after doing some research it looks pretty complicated to upgrade the sound system.
All I want is decent sound and bluetooth to listen from my phone.
I found a nice stock looking unit, unfortunately it doesn't have bluetooth
https://www.ecstuning.com/b-vdo-part...d7416u-or~con/
I'm thinking of going with Grom BT3 for bluetooth and keeping the car look stock.
I was wondering if BAVSOUND offers enough of an improvement to be worth the upgrade? Would appreciate any feedback!
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  #9  
Old 06-24-2019, 06:11 PM
Santaclaus4 Santaclaus4 is offline
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I just ordered the Bavsound speakers. I'll let you know how they sound when I get them.
For Bluetooth, you might give this a try: https://www.bluebus.dev/#
I think it's still in development but getting close to release.
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  #10  
Old 06-25-2019, 01:07 PM
Bmwe39528i Bmwe39528i is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Santaclaus4 View Post
I just ordered the Bavsound speakers. I'll let you know how they sound when I get them.
For Bluetooth, you might give this a try: https://www.bluebus.dev/#
I think it's still in development but getting close to release.
Thanks! I would really like to see if they offer noticeable improvement. They seem to be the most easy to install, price effective upgrade for DSP system.
The link you shared is very interesting!
Unfortunately I feel like the developer left out a lot of information. After going through the website, it's not exactly clear where this thing connects. Behind the radio, in the trunk?
I emailed to ask how it's different from GROM, and he said it integrates with the vehicle better in all aspects, which doesnt actually tell me anything. The price is about the same, however Grom has stood the test of time and offers very good customer service and technical support.
I guess we'll wait and see, it will probably take a few more month for this module to start shipping.
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  #11  
Old 06-25-2019, 01:36 PM
528iAut 528iAut is offline
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A search for bmw e39 bavsound brings up lots of info and reviews....
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  #12  
Old 06-25-2019, 07:13 PM
Santaclaus4 Santaclaus4 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bmwe39528i View Post
Thanks! I would really like to see if they offer noticeable improvement. They seem to be the most easy to install, price effective upgrade for DSP system.
The link you shared is very interesting!
Unfortunately I feel like the developer left out a lot of information. After going through the website, it's not exactly clear where this thing connects. Behind the radio, in the trunk?
I emailed to ask how it's different from GROM, and he said it integrates with the vehicle better in all aspects, which doesnt actually tell me anything. The price is about the same, however Grom has stood the test of time and offers very good customer service and technical support.
I guess we'll wait and see, it will probably take a few more month for this module to start shipping.
The developer is a member on the forums.

https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...or-older-BMW-s
This thread will have a little more information. He goes by: t3ddftw
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  #13  
Old 06-26-2019, 05:58 AM
Bmwe39528i Bmwe39528i is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 528iAut View Post
A search for bmw e39 bavsound brings up lots of info and reviews....
Yes it does but there are not that many reviews and I would like to see more. Half the people are saying they saw a huge improvement and the other half are saying it barely made any difference.
Trying to decide if bavsound upgrade is decent enough or if the whole dsp system needs to be upgraded
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  #14  
Old 06-26-2019, 10:54 AM
Santaclaus4 Santaclaus4 is offline
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My speakers will be here next week. I'll let you know if I notice a difference.
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  #15  
Old 06-26-2019, 02:44 PM
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Edgy36-39 Edgy36-39 is offline
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Can't say in the E39. But some years back I bought Bavsound mids for my E36 M3 at the time. The improvement was noticeable, and I"m no hardcore audiophile.
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  #16  
Old 06-27-2019, 04:17 PM
maroonca maroonca is offline
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Nearly any 5.25s system with separate tweeters and crossovers will be a big improvement.
Yes, they're worth it. Yes, you will notice it.

The BavAuto system? My take- and this just my personal opinion- is that it depends. The strengths of the BavAuto system is that you can send your SO (male or female) out into the garage with a BavAuto kit, a few tools, and their great how-to materials and that 3-4 hours later, and w/o much stress, they'll be done. And i suspect- without any personal knowledge- that if they get get stuck, they can call BavAuto, and get hand held to solve them.

And your car will sound much better.

OTTH, with a bit of research, and a bit more work, you could probably get to the same place a fair bit cheaper.

So you gotta decide.

As for the whole "Should I upgrade the whole DSP system?" question, my answer is: do the front door speakers first. They gotta go anyway. And do it with components that will last, no matter what you decide.

Then listen. If you're happy, you're happy. If not, well, the path is well trodden.
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  #17  
Old 06-27-2019, 05:24 PM
maroonca maroonca is offline
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Oh, and GROM. Sorry- I missed this.

Anyway, I got one. My verdict is: mixed. Pluses: Easy install- stuffs in behind you mid. I wanted steering wheel controls- and got them. I also got USB input, which is higher quality than the 'audio out->in jack' so, good.

OTTH, I also wanted the USB stick input, FLAC playback, and being able to advance through playlist/albums, rather than just songs. No-go.

Bluetooth? Dunno. By all accounts it's la quality hit, so I wasn't interested.

And, last: Overall difficulty of DSP upgrade? In many ways, easier than trying to tweak the stock BMW stuff to sound good.
But you gotta be prepared to cut wires, and selectively junk parts of the BMW system.
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  #18  
Old 06-27-2019, 07:16 PM
Bmwe39528i Bmwe39528i is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Santaclaus4 View Post
My speakers will be here next week. I'll let you know if I notice a difference.
Thanks I appreciate your help. Is this the set you bought? https://www.bavsound.com/Product/sta...39-sedan-wagon


Quote:
Originally Posted by maroonca View Post
Nearly any 5.25s system with separate tweeters and crossovers will be a big improvement.
Yes, they're worth it. Yes, you will notice it.

The BavAuto system? My take- and this just my personal opinion- is that it depends. The strengths of the BavAuto system is that you can send your SO (male or female) out into the garage with a BavAuto kit, a few tools, and their great how-to materials and that 3-4 hours later, and w/o much stress, they'll be done. And i suspect- without any personal knowledge- that if they get get stuck, they can call BavAuto, and get hand held to solve them.

And your car will sound much better.

OTTH, with a bit of research, and a bit more work, you could probably get to the same place a fair bit cheaper.

So you gotta decide.

As for the whole "Should I upgrade the whole DSP system?" question, my answer is: do the front door speakers first. They gotta go anyway. And do it with components that will last, no matter what you decide.

Then listen. If you're happy, you're happy. If not, well, the path is well trodden.
Thank you for the explanation, I like your way of thinking
I pretty much know nothing about audio so I don't mind following the Bavsound tutorial and paying a bit more. At least I know what their speakers will work well in my DSP system.
Honestly I'm not an audiophile and even the sound system in my car right now seems fine, I can't say that it bothers me the way it sounds. Bavsound would probably be enough for me instead of spending countless hours and learning about the audio systems, what components to buy and how to put everything together. I would rather spend this time on other projects.
From what you're saying GROM should work well enough for me, I find Bluetooth quality is fine. Honestly before I bought this car I had Lincoln zephyr and used an FM transmitter to play my music. As long as there was no radio interference, I was happy. And if I played directly from a CD, I couldn't tell the difference. I also don't like the hassle of putting music on the USB stick and constantly downloading and updating tracks. Otherwise the music gets repetitive. So I just play it from YouTube and this way I can listen to anything I want anytime.
I think I will go with GROM or maybe I'll wait a bit until Bluebus module is released. Maybe it will have some advantages over GROM. While I'm waiting I decided to order a cassette auxiliary adapter. Will see how that sounds
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  #19  
Old 06-28-2019, 10:17 AM
maroonca maroonca is offline
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The Bavsound system sounds perfect for you.

And I do think you'll hear a significant difference when it's in.
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  #20  
Old 06-28-2019, 10:38 AM
Santaclaus4 Santaclaus4 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bmwe39528i View Post
Thanks I appreciate your help. Is this the set you bought? https://www.bavsound.com/Product/sta...39-sedan-wagon
Yep, that's exactly the set I purchased.
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  #21  
Old 06-28-2019, 07:09 PM
Santaclaus4 Santaclaus4 is offline
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Forgot to mention. Bavsound has a promo code for their anniversary. It got me a $59 discount.
The code is: 15YEARS
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  #22  
Old 07-08-2019, 05:15 AM
Santaclaus4 Santaclaus4 is offline
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I installed the Bavsound speakers today. I'd say this upgrade definitely worth the money. It took me quite a while longer to install than I thought. I resealed the door liners "while I was in there" and had to remove the front passenger door card 4 times due to installer errors (mine) which included swapping the window sense wire and a speaker wire. No speaker and no window auto-up.
Huey Lewis & the News sounded pretty good on my test drive. I wonder if these speakers are more efficient than stock because it seemed like I could turn the volume louder without distortion.
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Last edited by Santaclaus4; 07-08-2019 at 05:12 PM.
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  #23  
Old 07-08-2019, 04:11 PM
jp5touring jp5touring is offline
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I have BavSound in my Touring along with a Dynavin N7. Been over a year and very happy with the results. I purchased everything on Black Friday so got a pretty decent deal. I would recommend, not the cheapest but everything is plug n play. I'm old and don't need to make my ears bleed anymore. Been their done that, but its capable to do that.
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  #24  
Old 07-08-2019, 05:22 PM
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seemyad seemyad is offline
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Bavsound + subwoofer (with amp) makes a huge difference. If you also upgrade the head unit the experience will be like night and day. You won't win any competitions, but you will enjoy the richness.

Also, unless things have changed, bluetooth compresses the file thereby reducing fidelity. Always direct connect when feasible and/or convenient. Apple music tracks and most streaming services are also compressed. Spotify has (or had) the second best music streaming quality. TIDAL streams HD and you will hear the difference. I compared several songs between Apple, Spotify, Tunein, and TIDAL a few years ago. I have not made direct comparisons lately.
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  #25  
Old 07-09-2019, 03:09 AM
Bmwe39528i Bmwe39528i is offline
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Glad you feel the difference after your install!
Bavsound it is then! I'd upgrade sub and amp but on dps system it looks like it cant be done easily.
As for head unit, there is not an option thay really works...to keep the stock look.
I dont want some funny looking flashy display in an almost classic car ***x1f642;
Dynavin 7 looks good but it only has local support in the states.
I think I'm gonna wait to see what this guy comes up with https://www.bluebus.dev/
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