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E39 (1997 - 2003)
The BMW 5-Series (E39 chassis) was introduced in the United States as a 1997 model year car and lasted until the 2004 when the E60 chassis was released. The United States saw several variations including the 525i, 528i, 530i and 540i. -- View the E39 Wiki

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  #51  
Old 08-15-2019, 02:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Bmwe39528i View Post
I I coded out the EWS from the DME so that's taken care of.

do tell....

there is no way to code out ews...

you have a key issue, and have compounded the issue
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  #52  
Old 08-15-2019, 08:55 AM
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theres still the "rolling code" requirement that needs to be satisfied in the DME, as youve no fuel pressure and no spark, it doesnt seem to be. no telling what got popped by connecting the battery cables backwards. have you checked the fuses under the floor in front of the passenger seat? thats your first power distribution point. theres more to taking a jy DME out of a car and putting in it another car and it working than disabling EWS.
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  #53  
Old 08-15-2019, 04:18 PM
Chedley Chedley is offline
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Burning2nd is exactly right...
Assuming you have coded out the EWS from the junk yard DME-which you have not btw-, how is that going to solve the wrong key issue ?
That is your first original problem that you are NOT resolving, but actually compounding.
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  #54  
Old 08-15-2019, 04:33 PM
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you had a very specific issue.. that was actually quite easy to fix..

there was a specific way to correct your issue and you choose to go the other direction...

i have to ask why?
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  #55  
Old 08-15-2019, 06:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burning2nd View Post
you had a very specific issue.. that was acutely quite easy to fix..

there was a specific way to correct your issue and you choose to go the other direction...

i have to ask why?
I like this guy.....
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Alignment here: The Definitive Alignment Thread

OE is Original Equipment aka 'BMW Original Parts' aka 'What you buy at the BMW dealer with a BMW label'

OEM is Original Equipment Manufacturer... EITHER the company that made the OE part or.... A part this is identical to the OE part, but is sold by the OEM under their own label


OEM is not what BMW sells


http://www.bimmerzone.com/category/T...ricks_OEM.html

https://www.turnermotorsport.com/t-OEvsOEM
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  #56  
Old 08-15-2019, 06:10 PM
Bmwe39528i Bmwe39528i is offline
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Well I had no crank condition and nobody knew why. It was suspected it was attributed to EWS module and that's why I wanted to bypass it. I haven't compounded anything.
I fixed the starter connection and the car now cranks.
The only compounding that happened was my mistake of connecting the battery backwards.
I will check the fuses under passenger side carpet. This is the only place where I haven't looked at.
Maybe I didn't grasp the whole key concept completely. I thought that by deleting EWS the car would be able to start with the keys I had.
My understanding was that EWS did not recognize the key and disabled everything else.
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  #57  
Old 08-15-2019, 07:33 PM
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key #1 was recognized, it was your key #5 that wasnt.
check starter was suggested early on in this thread.
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  #58  
Old 08-16-2019, 02:41 AM
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i want to know what this "ews delete" you talk of is?

where did you get this information.. who preformed that work? From my understanding the only way to actually get around ews is with a custom DME

the ews controller handles the weight of the ews system (*electrically) the DME houses the requirement to be satisfied that allows the engine to start..

your ews key fault was the primary reason it was not starting.. (the starter could have just been a technical tap) *from sitting, corrosion
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  #59  
Old 08-16-2019, 02:42 AM
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I like this guy.....
where the hell have you been hide'n?!

i havent seen you in years
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  #60  
Old 08-16-2019, 05:34 AM
Bmwe39528i Bmwe39528i is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mattmar1 View Post
key #1 was recognized, it was your key #5 that wasnt.
check starter was suggested early on in this thread.
Exactly, 1 was recognized, other wasn't.
Every single part was suggested to me and I've been trying it all.
Saying there was a specific issue with my car that was very easy to fix and I went the other way...where did this even come from??
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  #61  
Old 08-16-2019, 05:42 AM
Bmwe39528i Bmwe39528i is offline
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"your ews key fault was the primary reason it was not starting.."

You dont know this.

EWS delete is reprogramming of the DME module. EWS effectively becomes deactivated. Nobody wants to share the information on how to do it but after lots of searching I found how to do it. Super simple. I only know how to do it on MS41.1 but doesnt seem hard for ms42 and 43 though I didnt try
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  #62  
Old 08-16-2019, 06:27 AM
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  #63  
Old 08-16-2019, 07:01 PM
demet demet is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burning2nd View Post
i want to know what this "ews delete" you talk of is?

where did you get this information.. who preformed that work? From my understanding the only way to actually get around ews is with a custom DME

the ews controller handles the weight of the ews system (*electrically) the DME houses the requirement to be satisfied that allows the engine to start..

I just bought a MS43 dme with EWS and SAP deleted (coded out). Plugged my new to me dme in, unplugged the EWS module and jumped the two black wires on the connector. Connected the battery again and the car started right up.
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  #64  
Old 08-16-2019, 09:35 PM
Chedley Chedley is offline
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Well,
basically there is a bit -call it the EWS bit- in the DME prom configuration that you can turn on or off -although that is not trivial how to do it-!! Then you can remove the EWS. And thus -when the EWS bit is off- the DME knows there is no EWS to check with for starting the car or anything. Same for the SAP (secondary air pump): it tells the DME there is no SAP to worry about.

Though what I do no get is how this "EWS delete" solves your initial problem of a wrong or bad key ??
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  #65  
Old 08-18-2019, 03:45 PM
Bmwe39528i Bmwe39528i is offline
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I thought that's the module that checks the key. And if I deleted it, it wouldn't check the key. If I misunderstood it, I dont really wanna start an argument
Are you saying if I ordered a key from the dealer the car would start?
I had two keys and error was only on one of them. I dont know why it wouldn't start with the key that didnt give an error.
I checked all the fuses under passenger side carpet and they're good.
I'm sure a few modules got burned when I connected the battery wrong. For sure door modules and LCM.
The only question now if the DME got damaged as well.
I can't scan for errors anymore and pin 17 on pacman connector has no power.
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  #66  
Old 08-18-2019, 04:00 PM
Chedley Chedley is offline
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No argument here. You got it right: the EWS does check the key, and if it is no good, it will not allow the car to start -crank or not. It is a basic security feature of the BMW. But deleting the EWS does NOT fix a bad or wrong key.
BTW, another feature that is often overlooked, is setting up a passcode. Again the EWS will need you to enter the passcode to start the car, even with a good valid key : Very useful to prevent the kids or the girl friend from stealing the car for a ride..

Anyway, you apparently now have more problems of fried modules, than a bad key or a deleted EWS.
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  #67  
Old 08-21-2019, 05:49 PM
Bmwe39528i Bmwe39528i is offline
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I don't know if we understand each other but deleting the EWS from the DME by coding it out will not check the keys and thus the car would start. EWS is not there anymore, no more security, the EWS is not checking the transponder anymore so the car can start with a key that fits into ignition.
I'm still working on my problem.
I took out the DME and bench tested it. It's perfectly fine. I've been at it for a few days doing all kinds of trouble shooting.
I've checked everything.
When I put the DME back into the car, INPA wont scan it, gives me an error. When I connect it directly outside of the car, it works.
I traced it to no power on pin 17 of the female 20 pin connector under the hood.
Something got burned when I connected the battery wrong, such as that pin 17 on the pacman have no power. That means pin 88 on the DME has no power. Pin 88 is the one for K line diagnostics. Hence I cannot connect with INPA.
Something got burned and doesnt supply power to pin 88 on the DME, which it turn cannot supply power to pin 17 in the round connector.
I will continue looking and I will find and let everyone know what the problem was.
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  #68  
Old 08-21-2019, 06:28 PM
Chedley Chedley is offline
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OK..let's forget INPA for a second -as it connect not to the DME because of no-power on the K-line )
When you put back the DME -with the deleted EWS-, could you start the car with any of your keys? or at least get it cranking ??
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  #69  
Old 08-21-2019, 06:34 PM
Bmwe39528i Bmwe39528i is offline
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Yes it's been cranking for many days now with both keys lol!
Since I fixed the corroded connection on the starter wire.
Cranks with EWS connected or with EWS disconnected and pins 1 and 2 jumped with a fuse.
Unfortunately I put the battery backwards before I found the starter problem, so I will never know for sure if the car would've started had I not connected the battery in reverse lol!
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  #70  
Old 08-21-2019, 06:49 PM
Chedley Chedley is offline
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Probably it would have started... Fix the starter, or get a replacement from the junk yard, and see if you can get the engine running.
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  #71  
Old 08-21-2019, 07:21 PM
Bmwe39528i Bmwe39528i is offline
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I already got the stater from the junk yard and it's when I was about to replace the starter I realized that my starter is fine.
Before replacing it, I shorted it with a screw driver and it was cranking.
Then I couldn't understand how it was possible that the starter would crank when I shorted it with a screwdriver but would not crank when I tried it with a key in ignition.
So I disconnected the positive wire from the starter, it looked corroded. I cleaned it with a wire brush and then checked resistance between pin 1 on EWS plug and that wire going to the starter. Resistance was 0.
So if resistance is 0 it must crank. How is it possible that I was getting 0 volts on pin 1 of the EWS plug if the wire has 12 volts??
I connected the wire back to the starter and tried cranking with a key and it cranked! And now I got 12 volts on pin 1 of EWS plug.
So I figure the wire was simply corroded and that was my no-crank reason. After I cleaned the wire, the car cranks no problem!
So you see how the previous owner and his mechanic misdiagnosed at least part of the problem.
They probably shorted the starter with a screw driver as well and it was cranking so they figured the starter was good.
But they never realized that the positive wire was corroded and that's why there was no connection between the starter and the ignition.
So I dont think I need to replace the starter just yet.
Even assuming the solenoid could be bad, at this point I have no spark, assuming I tested it correctly.
Also I have no fuel pressure in the fuel rail. But if I short the fuel relay, I can hear the pump working.
So obviously the car wont start if fuel is not getting to the injectors. This is not a starter issue.
I removed the cap from the fuel rail after cranking a car for a few seconds and just a couple of dropped got out. No point even connecting a fuel pressure gauge, there is 0 pressure in there. Seriously, there is no fuel in that rail.
Something is cutting the fuel supply.
Maybe the EWS is still defective and my EWS delete didn't work. I'm pretty confident it did, and I tripled checked I did it correctly but you never know, it was my first time doing it.
That's why now that the car is cranking, I wanted to rescan it with INPA to see if it gives me any hint why the car won't start.
OBD scanner wont work either ***x1f61e;
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  #72  
Old 08-21-2019, 11:38 PM
Chedley Chedley is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bmwe39528i View Post
.
That's why now that the car is cranking, I wanted to rescan it with INPA to see if it gives me any hint why the car won't start.
OBD scanner wont work either ***x1f61e;
No, the OBD scanner would not help you, even if it works. You need the BMW specific diagnostic tool such as INPA.

You indicated that you can connect INPA to the DME out of the car. Yes ?
If so, follow these steps :

1. Take out the DME out of the car, connect it to INPA, and delete all the stored error codes.
2. Put it back in the car.
3. Try to crank it and start it with the good right key. Try it a couple times.
4. If It cranks but not start. There WILL be error codes stored in the DME. So,
5. Remove the DME from the car, and read all the error codes you find.

Report back the list of error codes you find.

Of course, I am assuming your car battery is good and fully charged. No point of chasing phantom gremlins caused by a bad or weak battery. And there are quiet a few, believe me..!!
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Last edited by Chedley; 08-21-2019 at 11:42 PM.
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  #73  
Old 08-21-2019, 11:54 PM
Bmwe39528i Bmwe39528i is offline
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Tried it first thing when I removed DME from the car. Scanned it first thing after connecting. There weren't many errors. Tried scanning "shadow" as well.
I guess most errors are from me removing a bunch of stuff and connectors to get to the starter when I was testing it.
When I scanned the DME outside of the car, it gave me a bunch of errors. I think those are for the fact that it cannot find all the other modules which DME would see if it was connected to the car.
I tried clearing the codes and then rescanning, all the codes would come back.
After learning some German I did not find anything that would indicate why there is no start.
This is a tough one...
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  #74  
Old 08-22-2019, 01:10 AM
Chedley Chedley is offline
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Well, those errors are old errors -maybe from the previous owner or mechanic work-, or who knows ?
Please redo the procedure as indicated in the steps I listed above, and then post the list of error codes -just the numbers- no pics needed.

To repeat :
1 -- Remove DME from car, and clear all errors
2-- Put back DME in the car and restart,
3-- Remove DME and read all errors ;these would be the NEW errors-- that is what we need to debug, and that would tell you what went wrong,..

Also, in the INPA error reports you posted above, picture #6 shows error 217, with battery voltage of 11.96 volts....
Buddy, that is a DEAD battery in my book. Recharge it and/or replace it BEFORE attempting anything. That may well be the source of your problems, that you are only compounding now..!!
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Last edited by Chedley; 08-22-2019 at 01:38 AM.
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  #75  
Old 08-22-2019, 06:44 AM
Bmwe39528i Bmwe39528i is offline
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My friend these are not old errors.
I've cleared errors a bunch of times since I got the car when INPA was working.
Like I said, when I removed the DME I scanned it right away.
Then I cleared it and rescanned.
All the errors came back because DME is not connected to the car and doesnt see anything. It's like a brain without a body.
My voltage should be fine, I'm using a charger for this, power is not coming from the battery.
The battery that's in the car, I recharge it every few day and I disconnect it all the time when I'm not working on the car so that it doesnt drain uselessly.
The output of the adapter as measured by multimeter is 12.3 volts. I guess it drops a bit in the DME.
This guy also has only a "hair over" 12 volts. My understanding is it's acceptable for benching DME.


Let me get INPA working on the car again and we'll be able to scan it properly.
It will hopefully show what the problem is...e.g. crankshaft sensor or something

Last edited by Bmwe39528i; 08-22-2019 at 06:57 AM.
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