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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Got a lot going on with this and could really use some advice.

Last night while taking a slow sweeping right turn my car's dash lit up like an xmas tree. NAV, cluster, HVAC all started to reboot on their own. Turn signals didn't work, wipers were slowly going all by themselves. I pull into a gas station because I needed gas anyway and the car refused to start. We were able to put a new battery in it and clear most codes but it still won't start. Doesn't even try to crank. We tried to jump it and it wouldn't even try to crank either. Upon trying to jump it the first time there was a slight ozone smell in the front seat area that cleared quickly.

After clearing codes and registering the battery all that happens now is the ignition turns on, immediately warns of DSC and 4x4 errors and will not attempt to crank.

Some history...
I dont know how old the battery is. By the looks of the terminals it was pretty old. A week ago the car complained by excessive battery drain but went away after a long drive.

It occasionally would have a very slow crank for the last couple months. Probably 20% of the time. I barely put 10k miles on this thing in a year, mostly highway. It will sit for several days if not a week at a time.

The tranny fluids were replaced about a month ago.


I had it towed to the dealer who has done the basic troubleshooting. They claim that all modules are reporting in correctly and have traced an issue to the starter. It gets power but does nothing and they want to replace it. At $1800 I'm hesitant to start tossing money at them to fix it since this will only get the car started, not troubleshoot anything else. Hell, I can replace it myself for a couple hundred. I have INPA and the whole software pack available but don't really know how to use it.


Has anyone seen anything like this on the E70/71? Did my battery finally die and take the starter motor with it?
 

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02/2012 X5 35d M57Y CPO 99K miles NOKIAN WR G3 12K miles
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I seem to recall several reports of no starts being caused by a failed starter ground strap which is a cheap and quick fix. No time to search to confirm it matches your exact symptoms, but maybe you can do a quick search.

Once you get car started turn the wheel lock to lock a couple of times and the 4x4 error should go away.

Good luck, circle back with resolution.
 

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Nuclear engineer
02/2012 X5 35d M57Y CPO 99K miles NOKIAN WR G3 12K miles
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If the no start is indeed due to a failed ground strap then a temporary ground will entirely eliminate that cause. Clamp a quality jumper cable from ground knob in the engine compartment to the block.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Check for water intrusion from cowl area. Been raining around here.. and if you had pool collected, a long sweeping turn could have relocated the water...
And my cowl is all messed up from heat. Will have to check that out when I get the car back. Planning on having it towed to my house from the dealer.
 

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Definitely odd.

How does a dying starter- over the last few weeks- die and stall the car? Then cause ozone smells?

However, a slow starter then a non-start is a valid starter failure symptom. SO maybe it is indeed bad. Just think you may have more


Keep us posted.


Out of curiosity- did BMW screw you X6M guys with no CCP??
 

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Let me say that the I have replaced the starters in both my N52 engine cars. One is a 2006 model and the other a 2009 model. The starters get weak over time - maybe more precisely the solenoid switch

In any case, $1,800 to replace the starter is nuts. But, replacing the starter isn't a bad thing even if that doesn't turn out to be the ultimate problem.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Definitely odd.

Out of curiosity- did BMW screw you X6M guys with no CCP??
From what I understand many of the CCP items weren't valid on the S63. Some were though and I wish we would have gotten included.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Definitely odd.

Out of curiosity- did BMW screw you X6M guys with no CCP??
From what I understand many of the CCP items weren't valid on the S63. Some were though and I wish we would have gotten included.
 

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From what I understand many of the CCP items weren't valid on the S63. Some were though and I wish we would have gotten included.
Some of the more cynical among us thought that they probably were valid, but given the very small numbers of X6Ms, BMW could ignore it and 'manage' the issues that way....

Replace the starter. I'm thinking you have an FRM and/or alt issue too.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Some of the more cynical among us thought that they probably were valid, but given the very small numbers of X6Ms, BMW could ignore it and 'manage' the issues that way....

Replace the starter. I'm thinking you have an FRM and/or alt issue too.

That was my take on it too but I want to be optimistic :)

Supposedly the FRM is OK but we won't know 100% till it can be started. I hope that if its an electrical issue that it is the FRM because they will replace that under the warranty.

On a side note, anyone know how to code the car to more consistently charge the battery so it doesn't eat them?
 

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If your car is 'eating batteries', I wonder if your alternator is intermittent.


I recall a classic story of intermittent charging, odd behavoiur, then one day 'christmas tree' (but his wasnt on xmas)....he rolled into a gas station. Turns out his alt had been failing, one of the windings was intermittent. Charge sometimes, barely others- so he would run on batt power. Eventually it pulled the batt down enough to kill the batt AND stall the car.

But just pattern matching and guessing here....GL

Edit: Search for 'alternator' and 'winding' in the E70 forum. See what you find.
 

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02/2012 X5 35d M57Y CPO 99K miles NOKIAN WR G3 12K miles
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On a side note, anyone know how to code the car to more consistently charge the battery so it doesn't eat them?
AGM batteries are instantly damaged by the slightest overcharge. The advanced charging system Intelligent Battery Sensor risks chronic battery undercharge damage (sulfation) rather than the certain damage of overcharge. Sulfation can be recovered / repaired to some extent.

A "consistently charg[ed]" battery will be destroyed in short order (hypothetically depending on driving habit within a month). One ampere-hour of overcharge electrolyzes 0.335 grams of electrolyte water to 400 cubic centimeters of oxygen and hydrogen gas that are vented and lost from an already starved plate battery built with the minimum possible electrolyte to achieve rated capacity.

As battery water is lost the electrolyte level goes down reducing the effective plate area and battery capacity. As battery water is lost the acid becomes more concentrated and the battery voltage increases, masking the imminent failure.

Lead-acid Battery Technologies said:
1.9 BATTERY MAINTENANCE AND FAILURE MODES
1.9.1 Maintenance [ ... ] (Page 52) 4. Do not overcharge the battery and maintain the electrolyte level in each individual 2-V cell. The electrolyte level will decrease in each individual 2-V cell as a result of normal operation due to water being evaporated or electrolysis into hydrogen and oxygen. Evaporation is considered a small part of water loss, except in hot and dry climates.

Electrolysis is considered the main factor of water consumption. During overcharge, the water is consumed by electrolysis at a rate of 0.336 mL/Ah over-charge. A 10% overcharge can consume 0.3% of the water content each cycle.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Finally getting back to this. Jacked the passenger side of the car up to get a good look and water spilled from the drivers side fender. Appears that water is pooling somewhere under the cowl but not sure if thats the problem or not. Does anyone have any tips on replacing the starter?
 

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Does your car live outside? Such that over the years, light debris has collected and caused the under-cowl chamber drains to clog, leading to water filling them, submerging the DME and shorting out some electronics??

;)
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Does your car live outside? Such that over the years, light debris has collected and caused the under-cowl chamber drains to clog, leading to water filling them, submerging the DME and shorting out some electronics??

;)
It does and I live in a place with a lot of trees. Would diagnostics detect a short? Dealer software and my own report that all modules are available and report as OK.
 

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It does and I live in a place with a lot of trees. Would diagnostics detect a short? Dealer software and my own report that all modules are available and report as OK.

Have you tried ruling out the bad ground strap connection possibility as suggested by Doug below?
Doug; said:
If the no start is indeed due to a failed ground strap then a temporary ground will entirely eliminate that cause. Clamp a quality jumper cable from ground knob in the engine compartment to the block.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Have you tried ruling out the bad ground strap connection possibility as suggested by Doug below?
Working on that one too. I dont have a jumper cable or really any thick gauge cable to test with. Trying to get my hands on one between working and life.
 
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