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Allright, already. I now believe that the 328i and 335i sedans are coming soon, as well as the 328i/335i coupes. This really undercuts the 5 Series, since there apparently will be no equivalent 528i/535i powerplants paralleling the new ones in the 3 Series.

Despite the fact that the 5 Series is somewhat roomier for both passengers and luggage, its whole level of status and reason for existence are threatened in MY 2007. The 525i will be an obvious slug, and so noticed even by those who are not heavy duty performance enthusiasts. The 335i sedan will obviously have a huge performance advantage over the 530i.

In addition, it does not seem that the Z4 will get the advantage of the 300 hp twin turbo engine, and that would similarly weaken its competitive position. Having said all this, I have a theory, as follows:

a. The 230 hp 328i will be available in huge quantities, and will be a nice improvement over the 325i - it will dominate 3 Series sedan sales.
b. The twin turbo is likely to be in short supply for a while, perhaps a year or more. The great majority of these engines will appear in the E92 coupe. The total production of the 335i sedan will be quite low for that period, so that it really won't be until MY 2008 that the average Joe will be able to find one at his local dealers.

Agreed, opinions are like a##holes - everybody has one. I have mine and I am stuck with it. Feel free to criticize; my skin is thicker than an alligator's.
 

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One could argue the 550 cuts into 7 series sales. Maybe, maybe not. Two different customer bases. The same for the 3 and 5 series.

We should not get tunnel vision when it comes to horsepower. BMW's have never had the most power, or ever been the fastest. That is not why the majority of people buy the cars.
 

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I predict there will be some very nice lease incentives on the 525i and 530i in the coming months. Probably in the November - March timeframe.
 

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Considering that the E90 330i isn't very fast as it is, I can only imagine how incredibly lethargic the E60 525i or 530i cars are. Why bother? Mack trucks will beat you off the line.
 

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I agree with the quote below. You have to remember that some people just appreciate the 5 series (based on additional size, fitting needs, etc.) The 530 is definitely not a slug and the 525 (especially w/ a manual) can get around town just fine. People will still buy them and those really concerned with power may opt for the 550 or wait a year for the 528/535. If I were in the market for a 528, I would rather get some good incentives on the 530i in the winter which will have a slight power advantage to the 528. If I wanted more power, I would either wait a year for the 535 or get a 550.

BMW has used a similar approach in the past and it hasn't killed their market share. As for the Z roadster, they have an M model available for those who want more power.

chuck92103 said:
One could argue the 550 cuts into 7 series sales. Maybe, maybe not. Two different customer bases. The same for the 3 and 5 series.

We should not get tunnel vision when it comes to horsepower. BMW's have never had the most power, or ever been the fastest. That is not why the majority of people buy the cars.
 

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jelliotlevy said:
...Despite the fact that the 5 Series is somewhat roomier for both passengers and luggage, its whole level of status and reason for existence are threatened in MY 2007. The 525i will be an obvious slug, and so noticed even by those who are not heavy duty performance enthusiasts...
I wager that the majority of 5 Series owners, indeed the majority of BMW owners, don't really care about 0-60 times. For the majority of the drivers on the road, the 525i is probably more than fast enough.
 

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jelliotlevy said:
Allright, already. I now believe that the 328i and 335i sedans are coming soon, as well as the 328i/335i coupes. This really undercuts the 5 Series, since there apparently will be no equivalent 528i/535i powerplants paralleling the new ones in the 3 Series.
This has been discussed in a couple different threads, but this is a good topic.

I totally agree that the 328i/335i sedans rip-the-rug from under the 525i/530i sedas.

Even before the announcement of the new 300hp bit-turbo engine, I never understood why people bought a 525i instead of a 330i. (i.e., these are BMW owners we're talking about...). Plus, the 525i is more $$$$$.

At this point, the 550i is the only 5 series model that makes any sense to me. But people will probably continue to buy the 525i/530i.
 

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ed325i said:
I wager that the majority of 5 Series owners, indeed the majority of BMW owners, don't really care about 0-60 times. For the majority of the drivers on the road, the 525i is probably more than fast enough.
I think you're right. The "majority" of 5-series owners want a large sedan with good power and luxury features....they probably looked at Lexus, Acura and MB before deciding on the 5er. They have likely never been to the Bimmerfest website and have never even heard the term "E60". They will enjoy their 230 horses as they drive their real estate clients around in the backseat. Just my opinion.
 

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Nope. I strongly doubt a couple engine lineup changes are going to destroy 5 series sales or provide a tremendous boost to E90 sales in return. They will help the E90 fend off heat from competitors over time, but that's about it. The 5er and 3er have shared engines for years. The same argument could apply to the 330i - it has the same engine as the 530i, and is somewhat smaller and lighter while offering many of the same amenities - why should somebody buy the 530i, then? Or, let's contrast my E46 with my buddy's E39. I have a 2.5L engine, he has a 2.8L, both are 5 speed manuals and both are about equal in terms of acceleration. I even have one luxury feature he doesn't - a CD player! So why bother with his E39 over my E46, which is just as fast, just as good looking, almost as big inside, and cheaper to buy, run, maintain, and insure? Actually, the answer is obvious, and I'd think that the same people who constantly tout the car's "drive" as a primary incentive to buy should understand the difference easily.

Well, for starters, the 5er drives much differently than the 3er. It's not just a slightly larger version of the same car...it has a noticibly different character altogether! The steering is lighter, the throttle is a bit less responsive, turn-in isn't as sharp, there's more body roll. However, the ride is smoother and more forgiving. The 5 also feels noticibly larger from behind the wheel...it sits a bit higher, it has a more commanding presence from behind the wheel. The 5er makes you feel more in control of the road and what's around you, while maintaining some of the planted, athletic feel of the 3er cockpit. Speed bumps or road irregularities which would be a bit unsettling to my 3er are an almost graceful endeavor in the E39. The 3er feels a little bit like a large go-kart after a couple hours driving the 5. All of this applies equally to the E60 - though the only E60 I've driven extensively is the M5, which is a bit more aggressive than usual. ;)

The 5er is also more exclusive. It can be had with a V8, something the 3 series lacks. It's a more elegant, distinguished, and established car - though ever-expanding, the 3 series still has a relatively youthful aura about it. If you don't think any of this is that important, then it's probably difficult for you to understand why so many people would buy a large Lincoln or an SUV.

Oh, and FWIW, the 5ers are apparently supposed to be getting the new engines with the next model year changeover anyhow.
 

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Oh, and furthermore, I'm not expecting any major supply shortages for the 335i, and I'm certainly not expecting the 328i to be a runaway smash hit any more than the 325 was - especially because it's significantly more expensive and you don't get that much in return. I'm sure a number of buyers who looked at the 2006 cars were be scratching their heads when comparing them with the 328. The 335 and 328 are still functionally identical to the cars they replace - they both get a little more power, but raw power isn't typically a high priority for most buyers, so long as the vehicle in question has "enough" to begin with. I do think the 335, once widely available, WILL make up a slightly larger percentage of overall 3 series sales than the 330 did (with the cheaper 328 still making up a significant majority), primarily because a lot of enthusiast drivers - including those who aren't normally a part of the BMW community - are taking an interest in the biturbo engine.

In any case, things should carry on mostly the same way as they did before.
 

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akhbhaat said:
Oh, and FWIW, the 5ers are apparently supposed to be getting the new engines with the next model year changeover anyhow.
Absolutely agree and also have to add that the E90 now soaks up those road irregularites
a tad bit better than the E46 and is much closer to the E39 in that respect.
And yes, the E60 is supposed to receive its face-lift together with the new powerplants.
That ought to liven up sales a bit. :)
 

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Assuming BMW puts the 328 and 335 engines in the 5 series (seems reasonable that they would if history is a guide) then I think the field won't really be changed much. 5 series buyers are just a different type of buyer: less price conscious, more comfort conscious, prestige oriented, and less concerned with the "go-kart" handling of the 3 series. When the E90 330i came out I decided to jump down from the 545 because of my lack of enjoyment of the 5 series ride. That combined with the enhancements in the E90 (new styling, I-Drive, more HP vs E46 330, bluetooth, Logic 7 standard, etc etc) convinced me that I'd be driving a better handling "mini-5 series" for thousands less.

Here's a related thread regarding how BMWs might compete against each other for sales:

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=152175
 

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TD said:
Considering that the E90 330i isn't very fast as it is, I can only imagine how incredibly lethargic the E60 525i or 530i cars are. Why bother? Mack trucks will beat you off the line.
:lmao:

oh, wait, you were serious? :p

The 530i recorded a 0-60 run in 6.9 seconds and the quarter mile in 15.3 seconds (per C&D). That's plenty fast for a mid level luxury sport sedan, in that it is competitive with other cars in its segment (A6 3.2 0-60 in 7.0, Mercedes E320 0-60 7.4, Saab 9-5 Aero 6.7, Acura RL 6.7).
 
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