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Discussion Starter #1
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Is there a optimum route from munich to bellagio (italy) avioding swiss border since i donot have a swiss visa. I would also prefer a scenic route if it is going to set me by an hour or two would be fine.
 

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bmw_fan said:
Hi

Is there a optimum route from munich to bellagio (italy) avioding swiss border since i donot have a swiss visa. I would also prefer a scenic route if it is going to set me by an hour or two would be fine.
Are you a US citizen with a US passport?

My wife and I went down through Switzerland to get to Bellagio and had more trouble getting into Italy than we did getting into or out of Switzerland. They looked at our passports, inspected the ED registration documentation, and let us pass. The Italian border guards didn't quite know what the ED paperwork was about, but they let us pass anyway. No Swiss visa required.

-MrB
 

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Yeah. There are not many countries that Switzerland requires an entry and exit visa for.

What passport do you hold?


.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
i hold an indian passport, the problem is most of my trip is going to be in italy i will be entering only for border crossing to Swiss. i was checking out route i found one through innsbruck and verone to bellagio.
 

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bmw_fan said:
i hold an indian passport, the problem is most of my trip is going to be in italy i will be entering only for border crossing to Swiss. i was checking out route i found one through innsbruck and verone to bellagio.
You could always go at off hours and/or not autostrade. I don't know details for other places, but I do know that no one was at the custom gate entering italy south of the Grossglocker nor at the north end of lake Como heading into Switzerland (early Sun. morn.)
 

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bmw_fan said:
Hi
Is there a optimum route from munich to bellagio (italy) avioding swiss border since i donot have a swiss visa. I would also prefer a scenic route if it is going to set me by an hour or two would be fine.
You should be able to go through Austra, I'm sure. You may miss views like this though. But then, you may find even better view through Dolomites, perhaps.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Which portion of the route is this view
 

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bmw_fan said:
Which portion of the route is this view
To be honest, I don't remember exactly where it was. A downside of following the nav, I guess. I set it from Munich to Menaggio and just followed it. It's somewhere in Switzerland, probably along A13. After the road climbs steadily, it suddenly plunges down from the top after passing a couple of 3 mile long tunnels. It was the view from the top looking down the valley. I should've wrote down the name of the town...
 

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bmw_fan said:
Which portion of the route is this view
This is the famed "typical Swiss town at the bottom of the Swiss valley with humungeous Swiss Alp mountains on either side too steep for anyone to imagine, let alone climb" view :rofl:

I know it sounds crazy, but almost every mountain valley in Switzerland (and many in Austria) has the privilege of a view like this one. You come around a curve an POW! there it is - breathtaking!

Regarding your route. If you want to go from Munich to Lake Como and avoid Switzerland AND take in a little scenic twisty road driving, BUT not take too much extra time:
  1. Autobahn/Autostrada from Munich to Innsbruck (via Rosenheim) over the Brenner Pass and down to Bolzano.
  2. Take Highway 42 to Edolo (this is in the mountains)
  3. Go west on Hwy 39 to Hwy 39 to the northern tip of Lake Comor
  4. South on Hwy 36 along Lake Como to Lecco and then north on the small roads to Bellagio
If that is too much time, then keep on the Autostrada to Verona, then west to Bergamo to Lecco, etc.

If you want more scenic driving, hop off the Autobahn/Autostrada anywhere you want and drive the two lane road that parallels the faster highway.

Greg
 

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Tanning machine said:
You could always go at off hours and/or not autostrade. I don't know details for other places, but I do know that no one was at the custom gate entering italy south of the Grossglocker nor at the north end of lake Como heading into Switzerland (early Sun. morn.)
I would not risk it, they have random checks on the roads. It seems like nobody is checking but as you drive you may notice people being stopped to check papers. These cars with those plates also draw more attention. Take an alternate route or your trip can be messed up.
 

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Just about two weeks ago I drove from Venice to Bellagio through Verona. I drove through Lecco first, and then I drove down to Como. Both of these were on the roads next to the lake in both cases. The roads there are very narrow -- effectively a single lane for both ways, and you will also see people parking on the side in these narrow lanes as well. Another road I took was from Como to Bellagio through the middle - and this road was much better - it had two lanes for the most part. Moreover, it had less traffic since there weren't many houses around this road compared to the other roads.

In order of ease of driving, I would suggest the road from Como to Bellagio that goes through the middle, then the road from Lecco and finally the one that connects Como to Bellagio next to the lake. Suggest also doing these during daylight.

Bellagio is great. Also, do not forget to take the car ferry across from Bellagio to the other side of the lake. Bellagio overall was the best part of the trip for us - among Munich, Innsbruck, Venice, Bellagio, Lucerne, Zurich.

Thanks,
Razi
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Liverman,
Is This drive very strenous and safe to do. Are there place to stop on this route .
 

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Here's a picture I took in June traveling from Bellagio to Lecco along the lake. It was narrow in places like the picture, but I didn't find it all that bad in an X3. If you are comfortable with knowing the amount of space your vehicle takes up you shouldn't have a problem. If you don't feel comfortable driving close to things I would skip this route.

http://forums.bimmerfest.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52293
 

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bmw_fan said:
Liverman,
Is This drive very strenous and safe to do. Are there place to stop on this route .
The route I outlined takes you from Munich to Bellagio if you are asking about the entire route, then there are loads of places to stop :)

Regarding strenuous and safe. The Autobahn/Autostrada piece to Bolzano is a breeze. The Europabruecke just north of the Brenner always gives me the willies, but I don't like high bridges ;). The road from Bolzano to Lecco is pretty typical two lane mountain road like you might find in the Sierras or the Rockies. It's got at least one mountain pass and a few bits that look like the small intestine, but most of it looks OK. If driving two lane roads in the Sierras or Rockies, especially some of the state highway mountain roads, causes you concern, then you 42-39-38 might not be your cup of tea, either.

I grew up in Texas and the highest thing I ever saw before moving to Germany was a freeway overpass. I learned that when the road got to be more than I could handle, I slowed 'er down a bit, pulled over to let the traffic by and continued on at a pace I was comfortable with.

razi and jwarcd are right - the roads on the Bellagio peninsula are pretty narrow. The inland road would be less tricky because it does not have a hill on one side and the lake on the other :) jwarcd's picture tells you the story.

Don't forget the people and auto ferries that sail in and out of Bellagio - a quick Google turned up this site about Bellagio and that one linked to the ferry schedule (don't be intimidated by the Italian - poke around and you'll see enough English bits to get you by!).

Greg
 

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Here's directions for the Neuschwanstein Castle (which you should go to) down to Belligio. This was by far my favorite driving of the whole trip. Getting to the castle from Munich was easy. Just get directions to B-17 (Romantic Road). PM me if you want maps, etc. We used MS Autoroute and a GPS to track our trip so I have more details if you need them....We did this in March and nothing more then a passport was required. It's a good sized drive for one day. The times quoted were actually to little for the time it took us. We arrived in Belligio at about 6:30. You get to take a car ferry! Awesome!..Awesome!..Awesome!


11:43 AM 0.0 Depart Neuschwanstein Castle [87645, Schwangau, Deutschland, Tel: +49 8362-81035] on Local road(s) (West) 40 m
11:43 AM 0.1 Bear LEFT (South-West) onto Local road(s) 40 m
11:43 AM 0.1 Turn LEFT (East) onto Local road(s) 40 m
11:43 AM 0.1 Turn LEFT (North-East) onto ST2008 [Alpsee-Straße] 0.4 km
11:44 AM 0.5 Turn LEFT (West) onto ST2008 [Parkstraße] 2.4 km
11:46 AM 2.9 Bear LEFT (West) onto B17 0.4 km
11:46 AM 3.3 Turn LEFT (South-West) onto B17 [Schwangauer Straße] 2.1 km
11:49 AM 5.4 Entering Austria
11:49 AM 5.4 Road name changes to L396 [Weisshaus Landesstraße] 2.8 km
11:50 AM 8.2 Turn LEFT (South-East) onto Anschlussstelle Vils 0.2 km
11:51 AM 8.4 Bear RIGHT (South) onto B179 [Fernpass Bundesstraße] 47.2 km
12:23 PM 55.5 Keep RIGHT onto Anschlussstelle Nassereith Süd 0.3 km
12:23 PM 55.8 Keep STRAIGHT onto B189 [Mieminger Bundesstraße] 11.6 km
12:32 PM 67.4 Keep LEFT onto Ramp 90 m
12:33 PM 67.5 Turn RIGHT (South) onto B171 [Bundesstraße] 1.3 km
12:34 PM 68.8 Keep STRAIGHT onto Anschlussstelle Imst-Pitztal 0.8 km
12:35 PM 69.6 *Toll road* Merge onto A12 [E60] 12.6 km
12:41 PM 82.2 Keep RIGHT onto Anschlussstelle Reschen 0.3 km B180 / Reschenpass / Kaunertal / Sankt Moritz / Meran
12:41 PM 82.5 Bear LEFT (South-East) onto B180 [Reschen Bundesstraße] 32.0 km
1:02 PM 114.5 Bear RIGHT (South) onto B184 [Engadiner Bundesstraße] 2.7 km
1:04 PM 117.2 Entering Switzerland
1:04 PM 117.2 Road name changes to 27 77.8 km
2:02 PM 195.1 At roundabout, take the SECOND exit onto 27 [29] 2.1 km
2:04 PM 197.2 At roundabout, take the FIRST exit onto 27 1.1 km
2:05 PM 198.3 Road name changes to Engadinerstrasse 10 m
2:05 PM 198.3 Road name changes to 27 [Engadinerstrasse] 3.6 km
2:08 PM 201.8 At roundabout, take the THIRD exit onto 27 0.6 km
2:09 PM 202.4 At roundabout, take the SECOND exit onto 27 [Via San Gian] 4.2 km
2:12 PM 206.6 At roundabout, take the SECOND exit onto 3 [Stradun Chantunel] 32.8 km
2:38 PM 239.4 At roundabout, take the FIRST exit onto 3 0.2 km
2:38 PM 239.6 Entering Italy
2:38 PM 239.6 Road name changes to SS37 10.0 km
2:48 PM 249.6 Bear LEFT (South) onto SS36 [Strada statale del Lago di Como e dello Spluga] 40.4 km
3:20 PM 290.0 Bear RIGHT (West) onto Ramp 0.2 km
3:21 PM 290.2 Turn RIGHT (North) onto SS36 [Strada statale del Lago di Como e dello Spluga] 2.1 km
3:24 PM 292.3 Turn LEFT (South) onto SP72 [Via XX Settembre] 3.5 km
3:27 PM 295.7 Bear RIGHT (West) onto Local road(s) 0.3 km
3:28 PM 296.0 Turn RIGHT (North-West) onto Local road(s) 0.2 km
3:28 PM 296.2 *Check timetable* Take Varenna-Bellagio (South-West)
3:51 PM 296.2 Take Local road(s) (South-East) 20 m
3:51 PM 296.2 Arrive Strada statale Lariana, 22021 Bellagio CO
End of day
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Thanks , Here is what i planned out , i will be starting from venice to bellagio and spend a day there and then i have to drive that night to innsbruck Austria. :cry:

I was thinking of taking ferry across bellagio and continue on ss38 and ss39 to Bolzano and to innsbruck through A13. :rofl:

i would be starting my drive from bellagio around 3pm so i could get to bolzano before it gets dark. What you people think is the state route very scenic and worth the time. :thumbup:
 

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I did the Munich to Como drive earlier this month in my newly acquired 530xi. Same visa issue, so had to stay within Schengen countries (Germany to Austria to Italy). I took the A95 out of Munich through to Garmisch - a local road from Garmish into Austria and onto A12 going West - from A12 I took the 180 which turns into Strada Statale (SS) 40 on the Italian border. I then took SS38 going towards Trafoi and Bormio and went through the Stelvio Pass into Sondrio and then Como. The entire route is scenic but the Stelvio pass at over 10,000 feet is breathtaking. Its quite a slow drive up the mountain as its S-turns all the way up but I thought it was worth it. :D
 

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bmw_fan said:
Hi

Is there a optimum route from munich to bellagio (italy) avioding swiss border since i donot have a swiss visa. I would also prefer a scenic route if it is going to set me by an hour or two would be fine.
Driving through the intriguing Swiss countryside will cost you an additional 30 or so Euros for the "sticker".
 
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